Anglican Schism Postponed

[higgs2]

http://frjakestopstheworld.blogspot.com/2008/06/schism-has-been-postponed.html

 

[JasonV]

...So the leaders of GAFCON are attempting to dress up strategic failure as the dawning of a new phase of their march toward victory, hoping that the media will bite.....It could make the next few years "more of the same," which is unfortunate, although the longer this is prolonged, the fewer Anglicans who will be left that agree with their take on things. In twenty years, not too many folks will still be listening to rhetoric that is so obviously the last gasp of a dying world view.

So has the separatist movement "passed its peak" and is "now going nowhere" as one commentator observed?

 

[ContraMundum]

It's a non issue. Separation happened ages ago. There is already a spiritual, material divorce, and already Anglicans who have left the Canterbury Communion.

 

[Phinehas2]

One notes the way the majority are referred to as the 'separatist movement'

 

[TomUK]

An interesting choice of sources to link to. Don't know whether you could have linked to more biased site if you tried.

 

[Colabomb]

agreed ridiculously biased

 

[higgs2]

I agree, Tom, it is very biased. It's an opinion piece. I threw it out there for discussion. I apologize if you were offended by the source, I didn't intend to be hostile.

 

[higgs2]

Here's an article from Time. I realize some won't like this source either, but it's not an opinion piece at least. http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1817878,00.html

 

[JasonV]

One notes the way the majority are referred to as the 'separatist movement'

Majority of what?

 

[Albion]

As ContraMundum noted, the separation has already occurred. There merely is not going to be an alternate worldwide organization paralleling the Anglican Communion.

But that doesn't mean that the "Anglican Communion" will ever again be a Communion. It will not ever again be anything more than a loose association of provinces holding differing theologies--provinces which are not, in fact, in communion with each other.

 

[JasonV]

Well we could always rename it the Anglican Confederacy.

 

[Aymn27]

As ContraMundum noted, the separation has already occurred. There merely is not going to be an alternate worldwide organization paralleling the Anglican Communion.

But that doesn't mean that the "Anglican Communion" will ever again be a Communion. It will not ever again be anything more than a loose association of provinces holding differing theologies--provinces which are not, in fact, in communion with each other.

Hmm...not sure I agree...are you saying that - for instance - orthodox evangelicals and orthodox catholics will be associated but not in communion? I believe the biggest obstacle will be bishop's egos and not theology...

 

[Albion]

Hmm...not sure I agree...are you saying that - for instance - orthodox evangelicals and orthodox catholics will be associated but not in communion? I believe the biggest obstacle will be bishop's egos and not theology...

What I was saying is that some of the "Global South" provinces, those representing most of the membership in the Anglican Communion, have already broken communion with TEC and, I believe, some other provinces, while remaining in the Anglican Communion.

That means at least two things: 1) The Anglican Communion is now not a Communion at all, just a loose and powerless association of churches with a similar history, and 2) the talk of anyone leaving--or, for that matter, being expelled from--the "Communion" is yesterday's guesswork. None of that will happen.

TEC won't be expelled and Nigeria, for one example, won't be leaving for some new AC-type Communion. The Anglican Communion will go on but not at all as it was until recently.

As for "orthodox evangelicals and orthodox catholics" being associated but not in communion, I am not sure what you are getting at. The sides in the current dispute are not drawn in that way.

 

[Phinehas2]

This is a good point, Albion. But if it isnt a communion then Lambeth is a waste of time. The reality is many Anglican churches in the UK are now more closely associated with like minded churches of other ministries and denominations than they are with their own diocese and bishop. The last time our bishop turned up all the youth were taken to another church, and a good thing too.

I think this is right. The liberals are in a wordly mindset of man made tradition. Unity in Christ is in the same mind and heart. Hebrews 8, 10, Acts 4:32, Romans 8, Philipians 4, which is one of the central themes of John 14-17.

 

[karen freeinchristman]

The reality is many Anglican churches in the UK are now more closely associated with like minded churches of other ministries and denominations than they are with their own diocese and bishop.

Not my experience at all.

 

[Phinehas2]

Dear karenfreeinchristman,
Well wouldnt that experience depend on the church and the Bishop?
If Christians can't work out their differences in love within a church or fellowship, how are they going to be able to love people in the world, and how can the church demonstrate loving one another as a sign of being His disciples? On the other hand if the heart and mind of a fellowship are so far apart in the first place, how can there be unity? I think it is to the latter we have come in the Anglican Communion.

 

[karen freeinchristman]

Dear karenfreeinchristman,
Well wouldnt that experience depend on the church and the Bishop?
If Christians can't work out their differences in love within a church or fellowship, how are they going to be able to love people in the world, and how can the church demonstrate loving one another as a sign of being His disciples? On the other hand if the heart and mind of a fellowship are so far apart in the first place, how can there be unity? I think it is to the latter we have come in the Anglican Communion.

It is not that I disagree with you, Phinehas, and I think your questions above are very good questions. But I am less cynical about all of this, and more hopeful. I'm going to trust in God that the Church will find the answer. It may not be in my lifetime, though, so all I can do is to play my part endeavouring to answer God's call, to be obedient to his will for my life, and to do as I've said before - preach the gospel in word and deed. Oh, and work on dying to self. Trust in the Lord. Love God and love one another. Bind the brokenhearted. Set the captives free. Judge not, lest ye shall be judged.

 

[Albion]

This is a good point, Albion. But if it isnt a communion then Lambeth is a waste of time.

Yes or No, depending upon what we'd hope to have it accomplish. If merely discussing issues of mutual concern is worth the meeting, then OK. But if anyone thinks this Lambeth can accomplish anything other than that, he'll be disappointed.

 

[ebia]

Not my experience at all.

Nor mine.

 

[ebia]

It is not that I disagree with you, Phinehas, and I think your questions above are very good questions. But I am less cynical about all of this, and more hopeful. I'm going to trust in God that the Church will find the answer. It may not be in my lifetime, though, so all I can do is to play my part endeavouring to answer God's call, to be obedient to his will for my life, and to do as I've said before - preach the gospel in word and deed. Oh, and work on dying to self. Trust in the Lord. Love God and love one another. Bind the brokenhearted. Set the captives free. Judge not, lest ye shall be judged.

What's the quote (from somebody else) that Tom Wright uses to the question "are you optimistic about the future of the Church?": something like "I am neither optimistic nor pesimistic - Jesus Christ is risen".