All things

[BNR32FAN]

He is the cause of sin. For his glory (the highest good). People are the author of sin. Wanting to sin more than not.

Yeah we’ll if you can figure out a way to make man love you without sinning I’d sure be interested in hearing it.

 

[Dave L]

Yeah we’ll if you can figure out a way to make man love you without sinning I’d sure be interested in hearing it.

“And the LORD thy God will circumcise thine heart, and the heart of thy seed, to love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.” Deuteronomy 30:6 (KJV 1900)

 

[Swag365]

Did He decree the cross?

Can't answer. The question is too vague.

 

[Hammster]

Can't answer. The question is too vague.

I’ll help. Yes.

 

[fhansen]

That’s not the topic of the OP. It’s about giving thanks for all things.

Kind of hard to give thanks under the conditions as you frame them . I understand that we're to give thanks in all things, and to understand that the rain falls and the sun rises on the good and bad alike. Life, on this planet, isn't necessarily fair. But we shouldn't expect heaven to include suffering even though the same argument, for God's sovereignty, could presumably still be used to defend suffering and evil even there. But in any case I would not expect the victims of severe abuse to be thankful; they may well use it for a valid enough reason to question God's benevolence, in fact.

Did I say that God put evil desires in their hearts? No. No I didn’t.

Ok. But to want the evil is still qualitatively different from allowing it.

 

[BNR32FAN]

“And the LORD thy God will circumcise thine heart, and the heart of thy seed, to love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.” Deuteronomy 30:6 (KJV 1900)

Yeah was that a guarantee that they would love and obey Him? Let’s continue reading a bit brother. You posted verse 6 here’s what was said just 3 verses later in the same chapter.

“Then the LORD your God will prosper you abundantly in all the work of your hand, in the offspring of your body and in the offspring of your cattle and in the produce of your ground, for the LORD will again rejoice over you for good, just as He rejoiced over your fathers; IF you obey the LORD your God to keep His commandments and His statutes which are written in this book of the law, IF you turn to the LORD your God with all your heart and soul.”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭30:9-10‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

Now does being given a circumcised heart guarantee that they will love and obey Him? No it doesn’t it simply means they can. You are the master at cherry picking verses my friend. Next time take more time to read the chapter and get the full message instead of rushing to post a verse that you think supports your position.

 

[Dave L]

Yeah was that a guarantee that they would love and obey Him? Let’s continue reading a bit brother.

“Then the LORD your God will prosper you abundantly in all the work of your hand, in the offspring of your body and in the offspring of your cattle and in the produce of your ground, for the LORD will again rejoice over you for good, just as He rejoiced over your fathers; IF you obey the LORD your God to keep His commandments and His statutes which are written in this book of the law, IF you turn to the LORD your God with all your heart and soul.”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭30:9-10‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

Now does being given a circumcised heart guarantee that they will love and obey Him? No it doesn’t it simply means they can. You are the master at cherry picking verses my friend. Next time take more time to read the chapter and get the full message instead of rushing to post a verse that you think supports your position.

The heart circumcised by God is the same as the New Birth. Only the born again will obey. It's not works, it's a sign of being born again.

 

[BNR32FAN]

The heart circumcised by God is the same as the New Birth. Only the born again will obey. It's not works, it's a sign of being born again.

Amen, yet we are still able to grieve the Holy Spirit right? So like I said if you can figure out a way to make man love God without sinning I’d be very interested to hear it.

 

[Dave L]

Amen, yet we are still able to grieve the Holy Spirit right?

It happens.

 

[BNR32FAN]

It happens.

why does this happen to those who are born again?

 

[fhansen]

Yeah was that a guarantee that they would love and obey Him? Let’s continue reading a bit brother. You posted verse 6 here’s what was said just 3 verses later in the same chapter.

“Then the LORD your God will prosper you abundantly in all the work of your hand, in the offspring of your body and in the offspring of your cattle and in the produce of your ground, for the LORD will again rejoice over you for good, just as He rejoiced over your fathers; IF you obey the LORD your God to keep His commandments and His statutes which are written in this book of the law, IF you turn to the LORD your God with all your heart and soul.”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭30:9-10‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

Now does being given a circumcised heart guarantee that they will love and obey Him? No it doesn’t it simply means they can. You are the master at cherry picking verses my friend. Next time take more time to read the chapter and get the full message instead of rushing to post a verse that you think supports your position.

If we were to love as God desires, fulfilling the greatest commandments, which is probably only fully possible in the next life, then our purpose and perfection, our righteousness, would be fully attained and all sin would be excluded because love opposes and excludes sin and fulfills the law by its nature. Obedience would then flow naturally, of its own accord. If Adam could've possessed that love in Eden then he would never have disobeyed. Instead he, presumably, took the long way home.

For now we struggle, not yet fully given over to love of God above all else.

 

[Hammster]

Kind of hard to give thanks under the conditions as you frame them . I understand that we're to give thanks in all things, and to understand that the rain falls and the sun rises on the good and bad alike. Life, on the is planet, isn't necessarily fair. But we shouldn't expect heaven to include suffering even though the same argument, for God's sovereignty, could presumably still be used to defend suffering and evil even there. But in any case I would not expect the victims of severe abuse to be thankful; they may well use it for a valid enough reason to question God's benevolence, in fact.

So let’s say that someone comes to you who has been abused. Would you tell them that God was off duty that day?

 

[Cormack]

Would you tell them that God was off duty that day?

Tell them God was on duty commanding and authoring the entire wicked affair, that’ll be a real comfort.

But when they call to mind that the devil, and the whole train of the ungodly, are, in all directions, held in by the hand of God as with a bridle, so that they can neither conceive any mischief, nor plan what they have conceived, nor how much soever they may have planned, move a single finger to perpetrate, unless in so far as [God] permits, nay, unless in so far as he commands; that they are not only bound by his fetters, but are even forced to do him service,—when the godly think of all these things they have ample sources of consolation.​

John Calvin on God forcing and commanding the whole train of the ungodly to do their wicked deeds, Satan included. Permission isn’t decreeing, commanding etc.

The non Calvinist rejects these ideas because they appear to be an attack upon the holiness of God described in the Bible and made known through His son.

Anybody who’s comfortable to write their God is “the author of sin,” “forcing” the entire host of the ungodly to work their evils (in his “service,”) you’re absolutely welcome to that.

 

[fhansen]

So let’s say that someone comes to you who has been abused. Would you tell them that God was off duty that day?

Would you tell them God wanted this to happen to you?

 

[Hammster]

Tell them God was on duty commanding and authoring the entire wicked affair, that’ll be a real comfort.

But when they call to mind that the devil, and the whole train of the ungodly, are, in all directions, held in by the hand of God as with a bridle, so that they can neither conceive any mischief, nor plan what they have conceived, nor how much soever they may have planned, move a single finger to perpetrate, unless in so far as [God] permits, nay, unless in so far as he commands; that they are not only bound by his fetters, but are even forced to do him service,—when the godly think of all these things they have ample sources of consolation.​

John Calvin on God forcing and commanding the whole train of the ungodly to do their wicked deeds, Satan included. Permission isn’t decreeing, commanding etc.

The non Calvinist rejects these ideas because they appear to be an attack upon the holiness of God described in the Bible and made known through His son.

Anybody who’s comfortable to write their God is “the author of sin,” “forcing” the entire host of the ungodly to work their evils (in his “service,”) you’re absolutely welcome to that.

Non sequitur.

 

[Hammster]

Would you tell them God wanted this to happen to you?

I didn’t ask what I would say.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

I don’t see the part where he’s not thankful.

He's not thanking God for the affliction like the apostles in acts and expressing ill will.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Not that I understand the point you are trying to make here, but no, it does not say he slept, but rested. One use of the word, "rest", in context here, is that he merely halted his activity. Nor does it imply he "did not feel the need to supervise."

But I'm glad you used that verbiage, because it helps me identify your POV. It is anthropomorphism that sees God's eminence, his pervasive existence, his "in whom we live and move and have our being", as mere supervision.

I recall a king whom God gave a long leash just to "see what was in his heart"

The Genesis pattern seems to be in harmony with how God acts in the rest of Scripture.

He tends to only get obviously involved when things are being established, then in quiet ways in the inbetween periods.

 

[fhansen]

I didn’t ask what I would say.

I know-I did. So obviously I would not say that God wanted this happen to you, whether He was on-duty or not. So what's your answer?

 

[Swag365]

It was a reply to you. That’s why I quoted you.

OK in your question who is "He"? God the Father, the Son, or the Holy Spirit, or Larry from accounting? What aspect of the cross are you specifically referring to? That a piece of wood was formed into a cross? And when you say decreed I need to know whether you are using the planet Earth definition that we can find in the dictionary, or the HammsterLand definition used only by the inhabitants of HammsterLand. The original question is too vague. When you ask and answer such a vaguely worded question, only you know what you mean. The rest of the universe has no idea what you mean. That is why you are having a conversation with yourself.