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AI understands the Sabbath and Col 2:16

SabbathBlessings

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When it comes to changing the Sabbath “from morning to morning,” I don’t agree. There have been thousands of rabbis, both Messianic and non-Messianic, who have studied the scriptures, and none of them, as far as I know, have come up with that idea.
Yes, you're right. The Sabbath didn't change It was ordained at Creation by God Exo 20:11 Gen 2:1-3 it can't change. Your point is one of the reasons I think God has protected Israel. You can trace the Sabbath back to the days of Jesus (and Creation) . The sign He is our Creator and Sanctifier.

Man does not have the right to change what is in God's Word or God's Sabbath. We are not to add to or take from God's commandments Deut4:2 Mat5:18 We were told in the last days many would make themselves teachers. 2 Tim 4:3-4. Even though this poster says he is SDA, this is not an SDA teachings.

This is what SDA's believe regarding God's Sabbath. Its one of our fundamental beliefs one accepts when they become an SDA.

The gracious Creator, after the six days of Creation, rested on the seventh day and instituted the Sabbath for all people as a memorial of Creation.

The fourth commandment of God’s unchangeable law requires the observance of this seventh-day Sabbath as the day of rest, worship, and ministry in harmony with the teaching and practice of Jesus, the Lord of the Sabbath.

The Sabbath is a day of delightful communion with God and one another. It is a symbol of our redemption in Christ, a sign of our sanctification, a token of our allegiance, and a foretaste of our eternal future in God’s kingdom.

The Sabbath is God’s perpetual sign of His eternal covenant between Him and His people. Joyful observance of this holy time from evening to evening, sunset to sunset, is a celebration of God’s creative and redemptive acts.

(Gen. 2:1-3; Exod. 20:8-11; 31:13-17; Lev. 23:32; Deut. 5:12-15; Isa. 56:5, 6; 58:13, 14; Ezek. 20:12, 20; Matt. 12:1-12; Mark 1:32; Luke 4:16; Heb. 4:1-11.)


Happy Sabbath!
 
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Jerry N.

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Yes, you're right. The Sabbath didn't change It was ordained at Creation by God Exo 20:11 Gen 2:1-3 it can't change. Your point is one of the reasons I think God has protected Israel. You can trace the Sabbath back to the days of Jesus (and Creation) . The sign He is our Creator and Sanctifier.

Man does not have the right to change what is in God's Word or God's Sabbath. We are not to add to or take from God's commandments Deut4:2 Mat5:18 We were told in the last days many would make themselves teachers. 2 Tim 4:3-4. Even though this poster says he is SDA, this is not an SDA teachings.

This is what SDA's believe regarding God's Sabbath. Its one of our fundamental beliefs one accepts when they become an SDA.

The gracious Creator, after the six days of Creation, rested on the seventh day and instituted the Sabbath for all people as a memorial of Creation.

The fourth commandment of God’s unchangeable law requires the observance of this seventh-day Sabbath as the day of rest, worship, and ministry in harmony with the teaching and practice of Jesus, the Lord of the Sabbath.

The Sabbath is a day of delightful communion with God and one another. It is a symbol of our redemption in Christ, a sign of our sanctification, a token of our allegiance, and a foretaste of our eternal future in God’s kingdom.

The Sabbath is God’s perpetual sign of His eternal covenant between Him and His people. Joyful observance of this holy time from evening to evening, sunset to sunset, is a celebration of God’s creative and redemptive acts.

(Gen. 2:1-3; Exod. 20:8-11; 31:13-17; Lev. 23:32; Deut. 5:12-15; Isa. 56:5, 6; 58:13, 14; Ezek. 20:12, 20; Matt. 12:1-12; Mark 1:32; Luke 4:16; Heb. 4:1-11.)


Happy Sabbath!
Shabbat Shalom!
 
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guevaraj

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it is an interesting idea that could open ways of study.
Brother, it is a fact, as shown in the following passage, where they are given two portions of manna the day before, because there will be no manna tomorrow.

On the sixth day, they gathered twice as much as usual—four quarts for each person instead of two. Then all the leaders of the community came and asked Moses for an explanation. He told them, “This is what the LORD commanded: Tomorrow will be a day of complete rest, a holy Sabbath day set apart for the LORD. So bake or boil as much as you want today, and set aside what is left for tomorrow.” So they put some aside until morning, just as Moses had commanded. And in the morning the leftover food was wholesome and good, without maggots or odor. Moses said, “Eat this food today, for today is a Sabbath day dedicated to the LORD. There will be no food on the ground today. (Exodus 16:22-25 NLT)​

Importantly, the bad news, that there will be no quail tomorrow if the next day begins in the evening, is not mentioned, because they will eat quail in the evening before manna is the first thing they will not eat the next day. The omission of the quail clearly shows the days of the week that begin in the morning.
quail.png

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Brother, it is a fact, as shown in the following passage, where they are given two portions of manna the day before, because there will be no manna tomorrow.

On the sixth day, they gathered twice as much as usual—four quarts for each person instead of two. Then all the leaders of the community came and asked Moses for an explanation. He told them, “This is what the LORD commanded: Tomorrow will be a day of complete rest, a holy Sabbath day set apart for the LORD. So bake or boil as much as you want today, and set aside what is left for tomorrow.” So they put some aside until morning, just as Moses had commanded. And in the morning the leftover food was wholesome and good, without maggots or odor. Moses said, “Eat this food today, for today is a Sabbath day dedicated to the LORD. There will be no food on the ground today. (Exodus 16:22-25 NLT)​

Importantly, the bad news, that there will be no quail tomorrow if the next day begins in the evening, is not mentioned, because they will eat quail in the evening before manna is the first thing they will not eat the next day. The omission of the quail clearly shows the days of the week that begin in the morning.
View attachment 371768
United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
I understand what you mean, but people don’t eat much from sundown till morning, The idea that there is little to eat till morning does not mean that the sabbath hasn’t started in the evening.
 
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guevaraj

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I understand what you mean, but people don’t eat much from sundown till morning, The idea that there is little to eat till morning does not mean that the sabbath hasn’t started in the evening.
Brother, all the biblical evidence shows that the days of the week begin in the morning and not in the evening, like the Sabbath falls in Jerusalem. Here is another passage from a non-Sabbath day of the week showing that what God called "day" precedes what God called "night" on a weekday, where the previous "night" is the previous weekday and the following "night" is part of the current weekday.

The next morning/day the older daughter said to her younger sister, “I had sex with our father last night. Let’s get him drunk with wine again tonight, and you go in and have sex with him. That way we will preserve our family line through our father.” (Genesis 19:34 NLT fixed)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Jerry N.

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Brother, all the biblical evidence shows that the days of the week begin in the morning and not in the evening, like the Sabbath falls in Jerusalem. Here is another passage from a non-Sabbath day of the week showing that what God called "day" precedes what God called "night" on a weekday, where the previous "night" is the previous weekday and the following "night" is part of the current weekday.

The next morning/day the older daughter said to her younger sister, “I had sex with our father last night. Let’s get him drunk with wine again tonight, and you go in and have sex with him. That way we will preserve our family line through our father.” (Genesis 19:34 NLT fixed)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
Part of the etymology of the word “day” in English: Meaning originally, in English, "the daylight hours;" it expanded to mean "the 24-hour period" in late Anglo-Saxon times. The day formerly began at sunset, hence Old English Wodnesniht was what we would call "Tuesday night.” (underline added)
Day - Etymology, Origin & Meaning

The Hebrew word יום (yom, Strong's #3117) means a "day," but not specifically a twenty-four hour period, but instead more generically like in "a day that something occurs." An example would be "a day of the month" (Genesis 8:4), "in that day Yahweh made a covenant" (Genesis 15:18) and "until the day" (Genesis 19:37). This word can also refer to the light part of the day in contrast to night (see Genesis 1:5 and Exodus 13:21), but the related word יומם (yomam, Strong's #3119) specifically means "daytime" as in Job 5:14. This word can be used for a time, age or season, but that is only when this word is in the plural form, which is ימים (yamim), and in my opinion should simply be translated as "days" and not time, age or season, as this can lead to incorrect interpretations of the text. The word היום (hayom) is the word יום (yom) with the prefix ה (ha) added and it literally means "the day," but we would translate it as "today." (underline added)
Hebrew Word Definition: Day | AHRC

I think I’ll stick to tradition, but it has been an interesting discussion.
 
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guevaraj

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I think I’ll stick to tradition, but it has been an interesting discussion.
Brother, Hebrews tells us that Judaism's perspective on the days of the week since Joshua is flawed, due to the earlier Sabbath given in Jerusalem.

Now if Joshua had succeeded in giving them this rest, God would not have spoken about another day of rest still to come. (Hebrews 4:8 NLT)​

When does the day end in the following passage?

The meat of the peace offering of thanksgiving must be eaten on the same day it is offered. None of it may be saved for the next morning. (Leviticus 7:15 NLT)​

Hebrews reveals that Judaism's perspective on the days of the week since Joshua is a human tradition and not the biblical teaching on the days of the week from the beginning. Can you see that the days end in the "morning" in the above passage? That the day ends in the "morning" in the above passage means that they begin in the "morning," as revealed in the story of the manna, when God prevented Israel from entering the Sabbath by forcing them to keep the true seventh day of the week, which is half a day too late to enter the Sabbath near Jerusalem.

God’s promise of entering his rest still stands, so we ought to tremble with fear that some of you might fail to experience it. For this good news—that God has prepared this rest—has been announced to us just as it was to them. But it did them no good because they didn’t share the faith of those who listened to God. For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” But in the other passage God said, “They will never enter my place of rest.” So God’s rest is there for people to enter, but those who first heard this good news failed to enter because they disobeyed God. So God set another time for entering his rest, and that time is today. GOD ANNOUNCED THIS THROUGH DAVID MUCH LATER in the words already quoted: “Today when you hear his voice, don’t harden your hearts.” Now IF JOSHUA HAD SUCCEEDED IN GIVING THEM THIS REST, GOD WOULD NOT HAVE SPOKEN ABOUT ANOTHER DAY of rest still to come. So there is a special rest still waiting for the people of God. For all who have entered into God’s rest have rested from their labors, just as God did after creating the world. So let us do our best to enter that rest. But if we disobey God, as the people of Israel did, we will fall. (Hebrews 4:1-11 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Jerry N.

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Brother, Hebrews tells us that Judaism's perspective on the days of the week since Joshua is flawed, due to the earlier Sabbath given in Jerusalem.

Now if Joshua had succeeded in giving them this rest, God would not have spoken about another day of rest still to come. (Hebrews 4:8 NLT)​

When does the day end in the following passage?

The meat of the peace offering of thanksgiving must be eaten on the same day it is offered. None of it may be saved for the next morning. (Leviticus 7:15 NLT)​

Hebrews reveals that Judaism's perspective on the days of the week since Joshua is a human tradition and not the biblical teaching on the days of the week from the beginning. Can you see that the days end in the "morning" in the above passage? That the day ends in the "morning" in the above passage means that they begin in the "morning," as revealed in the story of the manna, when God prevented Israel from entering the Sabbath by forcing them to keep the true seventh day of the week, which is half a day too late to enter the Sabbath near Jerusalem.

God’s promise of entering his rest still stands, so we ought to tremble with fear that some of you might fail to experience it. For this good news—that God has prepared this rest—has been announced to us just as it was to them. But it did them no good because they didn’t share the faith of those who listened to God. For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” But in the other passage God said, “They will never enter my place of rest.” So God’s rest is there for people to enter, but those who first heard this good news failed to enter because they disobeyed God. So God set another time for entering his rest, and that time is today. GOD ANNOUNCED THIS THROUGH DAVID MUCH LATER in the words already quoted: “Today when you hear his voice, don’t harden your hearts.” Now IF JOSHUA HAD SUCCEEDED IN GIVING THEM THIS REST, GOD WOULD NOT HAVE SPOKEN ABOUT ANOTHER DAY of rest still to come. So there is a special rest still waiting for the people of God. For all who have entered into God’s rest have rested from their labors, just as God did after creating the world. So let us do our best to enter that rest. But if we disobey God, as the people of Israel did, we will fall. (Hebrews 4:1-11 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
I’m a little confused about what you are trying to convince me of. I have partially entered the rest of salvation through the sacrifice of Christ, since I have accepted Him as my savior. I hope that I will fully enter His rest in the resurrection. In the meantime, I have chosen to try to keep the Sabbath, because it is a commandment of God and good for my spiritual growth. Traditionally, it is from sundown on Friday to sundown on Saturday, so that is what I choose to do. I believe it is an eternal commandment and is good for humanity. Whether it is necessary or not is up for debate, but it doesn’t matter, since I chose to keep it the best I can. Are you saying that it should be morning to morning? If so, how would it affect my keeping of the commandment?
 
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guevaraj

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Are you saying that it should be morning to morning? If so, how would it affect my keeping of the commandment?
Brother, the Sabbath in Jerusalem falls from evening to evening, but that is half a day before the seventh day of the week. God used this fact to prevent Israel, by means of an "oath", from entering the Sabbath, forcing them to keep the true seventh day of the week for the 40 years with manna mentioned in Hebrews chapter 4.

361381_ff7aae7ab7169d40699276fc6f90eac7.png


Hebrews tells us that Judaism correctly keeps the Sabbath in Jerusalem by direct instruction from God without understanding it fully, but keeps the Sabbath wrong here in the United States, where it falls on a different time earlier than the seventh day as it does in Jerusalem. The true biblical Sabbath announces that God has been with us from the beginning by having established the counting of days with the week and that God controls His word by consistently giving us the days of the week from the beginning when humans have it wrong. Humans have misinterpreted this for 3,000 years since Joshua, who confused the earlier Sabbath in Jerusalem, from evening to evening, with a new seventh day of the week, when God has not changed the days of the week since creation, being from morning to morning. I learned this from Genesis, where God creates during the first part of the light and stops creating during the second part of the "night" since the first day of the week. I learned two things from Genesis: first, that from "evening" to "morning" is only half a day, and second, that the days of the week are from "morning" to "morning", where the first "evening" falls in the middle of the first day. The first day is from light to light again in the "morning" and the following days are from "morning" to the next "morning".

Then God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. And God saw that the light was good. Then he separated the light from the darkness. God called the light “day” and the darkness “night.” And evening passed and MORNING came, marking the first day. (Genesis 1:3-5 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Jerry N.

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Brother, the Sabbath in Jerusalem falls from evening to evening, but that is half a day before the seventh day of the week. God used this fact to prevent Israel, by means of an "oath", from entering the Sabbath, forcing them to keep the true seventh day of the week for the 40 years with manna mentioned in Hebrews chapter 4.

361381_ff7aae7ab7169d40699276fc6f90eac7.png


Hebrews tells us that Judaism correctly keeps the Sabbath in Jerusalem by direct instruction from God without understanding it fully, but keeps the Sabbath wrong here in the United States, where it falls on a different time earlier than the seventh day as it does in Jerusalem. The true biblical Sabbath announces that God has been with us from the beginning by having established the counting of days with the week and that God controls His word by consistently giving us the days of the week from the beginning when humans have it wrong. Humans have misinterpreted this for 3,000 years since Joshua, who confused the earlier Sabbath in Jerusalem, from evening to evening, with a new seventh day of the week, when God has not changed the days of the week since creation, being from morning to morning. I learned this from Genesis, where God creates during the first part of the light and stops creating during the second part of the "night" since the first day of the week. I learned two things from Genesis: first, that from "evening" to "morning" is only half a day, and second, that the days of the week are from "morning" to "morning", where the first "evening" falls in the middle of the first day. The first day is from light to light again in the "morning" and the following days are from "morning" to the next "morning".

Then God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. And God saw that the light was good. Then he separated the light from the darkness. God called the light “day” and the darkness “night.” And evening passed and MORNING came, marking the first day. (Genesis 1:3-5 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
The word for “day” in Genesis 3:5 is י֔וֹם, which means “the warm hours” in this context, so it is not a 24 hour day but sunrise to sunset. However, the 24 hour day starts at sunset the previous day in our calendar. I should also point out that the time in Jerusalem is only one hour ahead of the time here in Poland. I still don’t see what you are proposing practically. Are you trying to say that the whole world should celebrate the Sabbath at the same time as Israel?
 
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guevaraj

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I still don’t see what you are proposing practically. Are you trying to say that the whole world should celebrate the Sabbath at the same time as Israel?
Brother, yes! When God set apart the seventh day of creation by sanctifying it, He fixed the Sabbath at the place of creation on earth. Therefore, the Sabbath proves that God is the creator, having been with us from the beginning, having established the count of days in all of us with the week when He taught the count of days to Adam and Eve, who passed it on to all of us, and that God is in control of His word, because while all the prophets since Joshua have given us the correct view of the days of the week in their writings, their human tradition misinterpreted the earlier Sabbath in Jerusalem since Joshua. None of these confirmed prophets of God were able to alter God's word to fit Judaism's erroneous view of the beginning of the day, which is correct to this day in God's word given by over 38 prophets after Joshua, who have given us the correct view of the weekdays consistently from the beginning. Jesus calls us in the New Covenant book of Hebrews to correct Joshua's erroneous view of the Sabbath in the following passage.

Now if Joshua had succeeded in giving them this rest, God would not have spoken about another day of rest still to come. (Hebrews 4:8 NLT)​

This correction confirms that God was with us from the beginning by consistently telling us when the days of the week begin before Joshua as later than the Sabbath given in Jerusalem, a fact that God used to prevent Israel from entering the Sabbath during the 40 years with manna as an "oath" punishment for their disobedience in forcing them to keep the true seventh day of the week during the 40 years with manna, which is too late to enter the Sabbath by half a day.

God’s promise of entering his rest still stands, so we ought to tremble with fear that some of you might fail to experience it. For this good news—that God has prepared this rest—has been announced to us just as it was to them. But it did them no good because they didn’t share the faith of those who listened to God. For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” But in the other passage God said, “They will never enter my place of rest.” So God’s rest is there for people to enter, but those who first heard this good news failed to enter because they disobeyed God. So God set another time for entering his rest, and that time is today. GOD ANNOUNCED THIS THROUGH DAVID MUCH LATER in the words already quoted: “Today when you hear his voice, don’t harden your hearts.” Now IF JOSHUA HAD SUCCEEDED IN GIVING THEM THIS REST, GOD WOULD NOT HAVE SPOKEN ABOUT ANOTHER DAY of rest still to come. So there is a special rest still waiting for the people of God. For all who have entered into God’s rest have rested from their labors, just as God did after creating the world. So let us do our best to enter that rest. But if we disobey God, as the people of Israel did, we will fall. (Hebrews 4:1-11 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Brother, yes! When God set apart the seventh day of creation by sanctifying it, He fixed the Sabbath at the place of creation on earth. Therefore, the Sabbath proves that God is the creator, having been with us from the beginning, having established the count of days in all of us with the week when He taught the count of days to Adam and Eve, who passed it on to all of us, and that God is in control of His word, because while all the prophets since Joshua have given us the correct view of the days of the week in their writings, their human tradition misinterpreted the earlier Sabbath in Jerusalem since Joshua. None of these confirmed prophets of God were able to alter God's word to fit Judaism's erroneous view of the beginning of the day, which is correct to this day in God's word given by over 38 prophets after Joshua, who have given us the correct view of the weekdays consistently from the beginning. Jesus calls us in the New Covenant book of Hebrews to correct Joshua's erroneous view of the Sabbath in the following passage.

Now if Joshua had succeeded in giving them this rest, God would not have spoken about another day of rest still to come. (Hebrews 4:8 NLT)​

This correction confirms that God was with us from the beginning by consistently telling us when the days of the week begin before Joshua as later than the Sabbath given in Jerusalem, a fact that God used to prevent Israel from entering the Sabbath during the 40 years with manna as an "oath" punishment for their disobedience in forcing them to keep the true seventh day of the week during the 40 years with manna, which is too late to enter the Sabbath by half a day.

God’s promise of entering his rest still stands, so we ought to tremble with fear that some of you might fail to experience it. For this good news—that God has prepared this rest—has been announced to us just as it was to them. But it did them no good because they didn’t share the faith of those who listened to God. For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” But in the other passage God said, “They will never enter my place of rest.” So God’s rest is there for people to enter, but those who first heard this good news failed to enter because they disobeyed God. So God set another time for entering his rest, and that time is today. GOD ANNOUNCED THIS THROUGH DAVID MUCH LATER in the words already quoted: “Today when you hear his voice, don’t harden your hearts.” Now IF JOSHUA HAD SUCCEEDED IN GIVING THEM THIS REST, GOD WOULD NOT HAVE SPOKEN ABOUT ANOTHER DAY of rest still to come. So there is a special rest still waiting for the people of God. For all who have entered into God’s rest have rested from their labors, just as God did after creating the world. So let us do our best to enter that rest. But if we disobey God, as the people of Israel did, we will fall. (Hebrews 4:1-11 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
I understand, but the Sabbath is tied to the rising and falling of the sun. It is also tied to Israel, but it doesn’t follow that the rising and falling of the sun can’t vary from that of Israel. One has to choose if the movements of the sun or the time in Israel is more important. Since the sun was created before Israel and “In Genesis 1:14, on the fourth day of creation, God declares, “Let there be lights in the firmament of the heavens to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs and seasons, and for days and years” (NKJV). In this way, God established the celestial bodies (sun, moon, and stars) to “be for signs and seasons.” This phrase is theologically, prophetically, and practically significant.”
What does “let them be for signs and seasons” mean in Genesis 1:14? | GotQuestions.org It seems to me that the movement of the sun takes priority.
 
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guevaraj

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the Sabbath is tied to the rising and falling of the sun.
Brother, the days of the week are tied to the rising and falling of the sun, but not so the Sabbath everywhere according to Hebrews chapter 4, revealing a Sabbath that is a memorial in time to our Creator, remembering the place of creation in Eden, where God taught us to count the days with the week.

361381_ff7aae7ab7169d40699276fc6f90eac7.png


This is the message of Hebrews chapter 4: humans have not fully understood the Sabbath since Joshua.

Now if Joshua had succeeded in giving them this rest, God would not have spoken about another day of rest still to come. (Hebrews 4:8 NLT)​

The Sabbath revealed by God preventing Israel from entering the Sabbath during the 40 years of manna, forcing them to observe the true seventh day of the week near Jerusalem, where the seventh day of the week is too late to enter the Sabbath, since the Sabbath falls in Jerusalem half a day before the seventh day of the week.

God’s promise of entering his rest still stands, so we ought to tremble with fear that some of you might fail to experience it. For this good news—that God has prepared this rest—has been announced to us just as it was to them. But it did them no good because they didn’t share the faith of those who listened to God. For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” But in the other passage God said, “They will never enter my place of rest.” So God’s rest is there for people to enter, but those who first heard this good news failed to enter because they disobeyed God. So God set another time for entering his rest, and that time is today. GOD ANNOUNCED THIS THROUGH DAVID MUCH LATER in the words already quoted: “Today when you hear his voice, don’t harden your hearts.” Now IF JOSHUA HAD SUCCEEDED IN GIVING THEM THIS REST, GOD WOULD NOT HAVE SPOKEN ABOUT ANOTHER DAY of rest still to come. So there is a special rest still waiting for the people of God. For all who have entered into God’s rest have rested from their labors, just as God did after creating the world. So let us do our best to enter that rest. But if we disobey God, as the people of Israel did, we will fall. (Hebrews 4:1-11 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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SabbathBlessings

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"The AI gave me a response that I wanted to hear".

When I use ChatGPT it always tells me how smart and handsome I am. So it must be true.

-CryptoLutheran
Lol. I agree with this sentiment, just because something or someone says so, doesn't make it true, why we are told to test everything from Scriptures.

I was impressed though when asked to only go by the Bible only, how it understood the differences between the annual sabbaths in the law of Moses compared to the weekly Sabbath in God's commandments. One started before the fall and is part of God's perfect plan Exo 20:11 the others started after sin.

Its conclusion was the same as mine that I have been posting for years after careful and prayerful study of the Bible on these differences I believe Paul made so clear, that sadly not many takes the time to look beyond the surface.

From my own personal Bible study, which I found to have the same conclusion as when asking AI when using Bible only.


Regarding 2:16 we will be looking at context and how it works in harmony with other Scriptures.

First, we can't isolate Col 2:16 without looking at the immediate context if we truly want to understand what Paul is speaking about.

Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
This verse sets up the following verses and gives us a lot more context.
Paul is giving us the context as to what he is speaking about
  1. handwritten
  2. ordinances
  3. against and contrary to us
1. Was the Sabbath commandment "handwritten"?

Lets look at what the Bible says
Exo 31:18 And when He had made an end of speaking with him on Mount Sinai, He gave Moses two tablets of the Testimony, tablets of stone, written with the finger of God.

Context doesn't fit- the Ten Commandments including the Sabbath commandment was written by the finger of God not "handwritten"

2. ordinances

Lets look at the Testimony of God
Right in the Ten Commandments God wrote this about the Ten Commandments:
Exo 20:6 Exo 20:6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.

Context doesn't fit

3. Is the Sabbath commandment against and contrary to us

Lets look at what Jesus said:
Mat 2:28 The Sabbath was made for man
The Sabbath was made for man, what God makes for man is not against man. The Sabbath is blessed and sanctified by God, its not the definition of contrary and against

Context doesn't fit

So looking at the immediate context shows clearly Paul is not speaking of the Sabbath commandment. Nor does Paul have the authority to change God's written and spoken Testimony Exo 31:18 the words of the covenant Exo 34:28 that God promised He would not alter Psa 89:34 they went from written on tables of stone to written on tablets of the heart 2 Cor 3:3 Heb 8:10 because God keeps His promises.

Right here is enough to know Paul is not referring to the Sabbath commandment, but there's more

This is what Paul is quoting the law he is referring to is from

Deu 31:24 And it came to pass, when Moses had made an end of writing the words of this law in a book, until they were finished,
Deu 31:25 That Moses commanded the Levites, which bare the ark of the covenant of the LORD, saying,
Deu 31:26 Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.

The laws that were beside the ark of the Covenant handwritten by Moses, there as a witness against, the context of Col 2:14


But lets look at this verse closer

Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
The Greek word for sabbath here is plural not singular. So its not speaking of "The" Sabbath day "The holy day of the Lord" as already seen in the context.

Paul is quoting Ezekiel all of the sacrifices and offerings.

Eze 45:17 And it shall be the prince's part to give burnt offerings, and meat offerings, and drink offerings, in the feasts, and in the new moons, and in the sabbaths, in all solemnities of the house of Israel: he shall prepare the sin offering, and the meat offering, and the burnt offering, and the peace offerings, to make reconciliation for the house of Israel.

What was predicted would end when Jesus came?

Dan 9:27 Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week; But in the middle of the week He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate, Even until the consummation, which is determined, Is poured out on the desolate."

So this is not about any of the Ten Commandments but about the food and drink offerings, feast days that some were also sabbath(s) that were handwritten by Moses placed besides the ark of the covenant that came after the fall of man. The Sabbath started at Creation before sin Exo 20:11 so can't be a "shadow" of anything as it is part of God's perfect plan before sin took over and a need for a plan of salvation.

Why if you look at the next verse it clearly shows what it is referring to which works in perfect harmony with the context

Col 2:17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ.

Heb 10:1 For the law, having a shadow of the good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with these same sacrifices, which they offer continually year by year, make those who approach perfect.
Heb 10:2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? For the worshipers, once purified, would have had no more consciousness of sins.
Heb 10:3 But in those sacrifices there is a reminder of sins every year. (contrary and against)
Heb 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and goats could take away sins.
Heb 10:5 Therefore, when He came into the world, He said: "SACRIFICE AND OFFERING YOU DID NOT DESIRE, BUT A BODY YOU HAVE PREPARED FOR ME.
Heb 10:6 IN BURNT OFFERINGS AND SACRIFICES FOR SIN YOU HAD NO PLEASURE.
Heb 10:7 THEN I SAID, 'BEHOLD, I HAVE COME—IN THE VOLUME OF THE BOOK IT IS WRITTEN OF ME—TO DO YOUR WILL, O GOD.' "
Heb 10:8 Previously saying, "SACRIFICE AND OFFERING, BURNT OFFERINGS, AND OFFERINGS FOR SIN YOU DID NOT DESIRE, NOR HAD PLEASURE IN THEM" (which are offered according to the law),
Heb 10:9 then He said, "BEHOLD, I HAVE COME TO DO YOUR WILL, O GOD." He takes away the first that He may establish the second.

Exo 12:17 43 So the Lord said to Moses and Aaron: This is the ordinance of the Passover:
1Co 5:7 Therefore purge out the old leaven, that you may be a new lump, since you truly are unleavened. For indeed Christ, our Passover, was sacrificed for us.

There is so much more evidence I could provide like comparing what Jesus said which in using Col 2:14-16 against the Sabbath commandment contradicts His teachings. Hopefully this will be looked at in prayer as I know this is a popular teaching, but the context does not fit the Sabbath commandment written by the finger of God that is part of God's holy and eternal law Mat 5:18-19 Isa 66:23
 
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Jerry N.

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Brother, the days of the week are tied to the rising and falling of the sun, but not so the Sabbath everywhere according to Hebrews chapter 4, revealing a Sabbath that is a memorial in time to our Creator, remembering the place of creation in Eden, where God taught us to count the days with the week.

361381_ff7aae7ab7169d40699276fc6f90eac7.png


This is the message of Hebrews chapter 4: humans have not fully understood the Sabbath since Joshua.

Now if Joshua had succeeded in giving them this rest, God would not have spoken about another day of rest still to come. (Hebrews 4:8 NLT)​

The Sabbath revealed by God preventing Israel from entering the Sabbath during the 40 years of manna, forcing them to observe the true seventh day of the week near Jerusalem, where the seventh day of the week is too late to enter the Sabbath, since the Sabbath falls in Jerusalem half a day before the seventh day of the week.

God’s promise of entering his rest still stands, so we ought to tremble with fear that some of you might fail to experience it. For this good news—that God has prepared this rest—has been announced to us just as it was to them. But it did them no good because they didn’t share the faith of those who listened to God. For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” But in the other passage God said, “They will never enter my place of rest.” So God’s rest is there for people to enter, but those who first heard this good news failed to enter because they disobeyed God. So God set another time for entering his rest, and that time is today. GOD ANNOUNCED THIS THROUGH DAVID MUCH LATER in the words already quoted: “Today when you hear his voice, don’t harden your hearts.” Now IF JOSHUA HAD SUCCEEDED IN GIVING THEM THIS REST, GOD WOULD NOT HAVE SPOKEN ABOUT ANOTHER DAY of rest still to come. So there is a special rest still waiting for the people of God. For all who have entered into God’s rest have rested from their labors, just as God did after creating the world. So let us do our best to enter that rest. But if we disobey God, as the people of Israel did, we will fall. (Hebrews 4:1-11 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
Thanks for the post, but we will have to agree to disagree.
 
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guevaraj

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Thanks for the post, but we will have to agree to disagree.
Brother, if you could explain why you disagree, that would help me understand the opposition to the following message from Hebrews.

Now if Joshua had succeeded in giving them this rest, God would not have spoken about another day of rest still to come. (Hebrews 4:8 NLT)​

It seemed to me that what made you hear the message from Hebrews above was when I asked you when the day ends in the following passage as clearly ending in the "morning."

The meat of the peace offering of thanksgiving must be eaten on the same day it is offered. None of it may be saved for the next morning. (Leviticus 7:15 NLT)​

With its connection to what is revealed in the story of the manna with the quail in the "evening."

quail-png.371768


Mainly, that the bad news that there will be no quail tomorrow if the next day begins in the "evening" is not mentioned in the following passage, because they will eat quail in the "evening" before manna is the first thing they will not eat the next day. The omission of the quail clearly shows that the days of the week begin in the "morning" and not in the "evening," as has been assumed since Joshua because of the Sabbath given in Jerusalem preceding by half a day the seventh day of the week.

On the sixth day, they gathered twice as much as usual—four quarts for each person instead of two. Then all the leaders of the community came and asked Moses for an explanation. He told them, “This is what the LORD commanded: Tomorrow will be a day of complete rest, a holy Sabbath day set apart for the LORD. So bake or boil as much as you want today, and set aside what is left for tomorrow.” So they put some aside until morning, just as Moses had commanded. And in the morning the leftover food was wholesome and good, without maggots or odor. Moses said, “Eat this food today, for today is a Sabbath day dedicated to the LORD. There will be no food on the ground today. (Exodus 16:22-25 NLT)​

The story of manna reveals how God prevented Israel from entering the Sabbath during the 40 manna years mentioned in Hebrews when God forced them to keep the true seventh day of the week from morning to morning, which is half a day late to enter the Sabbath near Jerusalem.

God’s promise of entering his rest still stands, so we ought to tremble with fear that some of you might fail to experience it. For this good news—that God has prepared this rest—has been announced to us just as it was to them. But it did them no good because they didn’t share the faith of those who listened to God. For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” But in the other passage God said, “They will never enter my place of rest.” So God’s rest is there for people to enter, but those who first heard this good news failed to enter because they disobeyed God. So God set another time for entering his rest, and that time is today. GOD ANNOUNCED THIS THROUGH DAVID MUCH LATER in the words already quoted: “Today when you hear his voice, don’t harden your hearts.” Now IF JOSHUA HAD SUCCEEDED IN GIVING THEM THIS REST, GOD WOULD NOT HAVE SPOKEN ABOUT ANOTHER DAY of rest still to come. So there is a special rest still waiting for the people of God. For all who have entered into God’s rest have rested from their labors, just as God did after creating the world. So let us do our best to enter that rest. But if we disobey God, as the people of Israel did, we will fall. (Hebrews 4:1-11 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Jerry N.

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Brother, if you could explain why you disagree, that would help me understand the opposition to the following message from Hebrews.

Now if Joshua had succeeded in giving them this rest, God would not have spoken about another day of rest still to come. (Hebrews 4:8 NLT)​

It seemed to me that what made you hear the message from Hebrews above was when I asked you when the day ends in the following passage as clearly ending in the "morning."

The meat of the peace offering of thanksgiving must be eaten on the same day it is offered. None of it may be saved for the next morning. (Leviticus 7:15 NLT)​

With its connection to what is revealed in the story of the manna with the quail in the "evening."

quail-png.371768


Mainly, that the bad news that there will be no quail tomorrow if the next day begins in the "evening" is not mentioned in the following passage, because they will eat quail in the "evening" before manna is the first thing they will not eat the next day. The omission of the quail clearly shows that the days of the week begin in the "morning" and not in the "evening," as has been assumed since Joshua because of the Sabbath given in Jerusalem preceding by half a day the seventh day of the week.

On the sixth day, they gathered twice as much as usual—four quarts for each person instead of two. Then all the leaders of the community came and asked Moses for an explanation. He told them, “This is what the LORD commanded: Tomorrow will be a day of complete rest, a holy Sabbath day set apart for the LORD. So bake or boil as much as you want today, and set aside what is left for tomorrow.” So they put some aside until morning, just as Moses had commanded. And in the morning the leftover food was wholesome and good, without maggots or odor. Moses said, “Eat this food today, for today is a Sabbath day dedicated to the LORD. There will be no food on the ground today. (Exodus 16:22-25 NLT)​

The story of manna reveals how God prevented Israel from entering the Sabbath during the 40 manna years mentioned in Hebrews when God forced them to keep the true seventh day of the week from morning to morning, which is half a day late to enter the Sabbath near Jerusalem.

God’s promise of entering his rest still stands, so we ought to tremble with fear that some of you might fail to experience it. For this good news—that God has prepared this rest—has been announced to us just as it was to them. But it did them no good because they didn’t share the faith of those who listened to God. For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” But in the other passage God said, “They will never enter my place of rest.” So God’s rest is there for people to enter, but those who first heard this good news failed to enter because they disobeyed God. So God set another time for entering his rest, and that time is today. GOD ANNOUNCED THIS THROUGH DAVID MUCH LATER in the words already quoted: “Today when you hear his voice, don’t harden your hearts.” Now IF JOSHUA HAD SUCCEEDED IN GIVING THEM THIS REST, GOD WOULD NOT HAVE SPOKEN ABOUT ANOTHER DAY of rest still to come. So there is a special rest still waiting for the people of God. For all who have entered into God’s rest have rested from their labors, just as God did after creating the world. So let us do our best to enter that rest. But if we disobey God, as the people of Israel did, we will fall. (Hebrews 4:1-11 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
I mean no disrespect to you, but I don’t see how not eating much or working in the evening has much to do with when the Sabbath starts. When the sun goes down, I have already had my supper and I don’t work on the farm in the dark, so not doing work the next morning is really when I practice the Sabbath work restrictions in earnest. That doesn’t mean the Sabbath hasn’t started at sundown, but it does mean that I have to take a more definitive effort to rest the following day. It is a bit like fasting. If I start fasting for Yom Kippur, I don’t notice it until the morning when I have to do without breakfast. I’m not intending to change my celebration to the Sabbath, but your ideas have been interesting. I just find the repetition uninspiring. May the peace of God be with you.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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I mean no disrespect to you, but I don’t see how not eating much or working in the evening has much to do with when the Sabbath starts. When the sun goes down, I have already had my supper and I don’t work on the farm in the dark, so not doing work the next morning is really when I practice the Sabbath work restrictions in earnest. That doesn’t mean the Sabbath hasn’t started at sundown, but it does mean that I have to take a more definitive effort to rest the following day. It is a bit like fasting. If I start fasting for Yom Kippur, I don’t notice it until the morning when I have to do without breakfast. I’m not intending to change my celebration to the Sabbath, but your ideas have been interesting. I just find the repetition uninspiring. May the peace of God be with you.
Thats right. :)

The Sabbath is about a relationship with Jesus and can be celebrated in our own time zone regardless where one is in the world. There was nothing mentioned about time zones in Scriptures and we are clearly told not to add what's not there. I can see why it would be convenient for people to say the Sabbath starts in the time zone when I am sleeping, instead of following in the example of Jesus Luke4:16 and apostles Acts 13:42 Acts 13:44 Acts 18:4 based on what God said Lev 23:3

God bless.
 
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