Adam and Evolution: A Reconciliation

[EpiscipalMe]

And my faith does not rely on leaning on my own understanding , Starting with Genesis 1 and saying ''God you must be mistaken'' ? No, coming from being a staunch Atheist and firm believer in evolution to born-again Christian, Jesus has added concrete to his Word in me . I cannot and will not go back to where you are . And don't feel sorry for me because I've seen and experienced the power of God as it is written .. What do you have besides a man made excuse to nullify God's Truth .. You've loaded yourself down with man-made baggage, now what ?

I don't feel sorry for you. I accept you as a brother/sister in Christ. I only ask that you do the same for me.

In no way do I nullify God's truth. God's ultimate truth is that he created the universe and everything in it. I believe this with all my heart. I do not need a literal translation for this truth to be known to me.

 

[KWCrazy]

Even Augustine didn't take Genesis 1 literally.

Who shall we believe; Jesus who was there; who walked and spoke with Adam; who called the Scriptures "Every word that came from the mouth of God"; who said if we didn't believe Moses we wouldn't believe Him; who quoted Genesis referencing Adam and Eve; who personally confirmed the Great Flood, or Augustine who did none of these?

In fact he gave a scathing critique of those who reject scientific knowledge on the basis of scripture, arguing that those people did much to hinder the gospel and by causing unbelievers to see christians as ignorant.

Knowledge or scientific belief?
What does science say about:
Floating ax heads
The resurrection of someone after 3 days of decay
Walking on water
Calming a storm with a word
Feeding 5,000 with a few loaves and fish and having more left than when you started
Getting water from a stone
Suspending time for an entire day?

Of the 333 miracles in the Bible, NONE agree with scientific "knowledge."
So is the belief in the word of God ignorant to you? We know what science claims. He just believe in a higher authority that supersedes natural law.

Im confident that if many of the greatest minds of Christian antiquity were alive today, they'd overwhelmingly reject yec and land within the spectrum of OEC and EC.

The greatest Christian mind ever was Christ. I'll believe Him. You reject what you want to reject.

 

[bangmegafan]

@OP

Can you explain soul in terms of theory of evolution?

 

[ALoveDivine]

Can you explain soul in terms of theory of evolution?

No. As I stated in my original post, I believe the soul was miraculously created by God and infused into the two elect hom sapiens, making them human, and hence legitimately the first two humans, also making them spiritual beings and fitting subjects for God's covenant.

I also believe that a real eternal soul is created and infused into each and every human born since Adam and Eve at the moment of conception.

 

[EpiscipalMe]

@OP

Can you explain soul in terms of theory of evolution?

No need for evolution to explain the soul. The soul is of God.

 

[4x4toy]

My cross is no bigger than yours I bet.

As I said earlier, my faith was strengthened when the Holy Spirit showed me that allegorical interpretation is acceptable to God. Therefore, this is of God.

If creationism strengthens your faith, then it is also of God.

No need to use this debate to divide the Body of Christ. This would be the work of satan.

How did Jesus defeat Satan in the desert ? Each time Jesus replied ''it is written'' . You say it is written but it can't be as written .. ..

 

[ALoveDivine]

You say it is written but it can't be as written

Does God have fingers? In Exodus it says God wrote on tablets of stone with his own finger. So is God incorporeal or does God literally have fingers? Is belief in the incorporeality of God a rejection of the plain teaching of scripture?

If we have good reason (like mountains of evidence) to not interpret a passage literally, and if we admit that scripture repeatedly employs figurative language, why cling with such tenacity to a literal interpretation of the controversial passages? I cant see why yec people dont believe God has fingers or that the sky is a solid dome with water above it, or that the earth is flat and held up by pillars, given their hermenutic.

 

[EpiscipalMe]

How did Jesus defeat Satan in the desert ? Each time Jesus replied ''it is written'' . You say it is written but it can't be as written .. ..

Matthew 4

Jesus quotes truths from Jewish scripture, none of which came from the creation story.

The lessons can be true even if the story is not literally true. It doesn't diminish my faith at all. I am saddened that you think it does and use this to judge me less of a Christian.

 

[4x4toy]

Matthew 4

Jesus quotes truths from Jewish scripture, none of which came from the creation story.

The lessons can be true even if the story is not literally true. It doesn't diminish my faith at all. I am saddened that you think it does and use this to judge me less of a Christian.

Ha, I'm not your judge, you will be judged by the Word .

 

[KWCrazy]

And, I do not doubt scripture, just man's interpretation of it.

Explain to me how we should interpret these words, carved by the finger of God onto stone tablets; "For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy."

Apparently, God doesn't believe in evolution either.

 

[ALoveDivine]

carved by the finger of God

Does God have fingers?

 

[4x4toy]

Does God have fingers?

Did he use them ?

 

[ALoveDivine]

Did he use them ?

You completely dogged the question. Is God incorporeal or does he literally have fingers?

Moreover, do the birds and the stars occupy the same firmament? Is the water above this firmament? Strict literalism entails believing that birds and stars occupy the same space and that water is above both of them. Any mental gymnastics employed to get arround that involves assuming the use of figurative language.

 

[4x4toy]

You completely dogged the question. Is God incorporeal or does he literally have fingers?

Moreover, do the birds and the stars occupy the same firmament? Is the water above this firmament? Strict literalism entails believing that birds and stars occupy the same space and that water is above both of them.

All the answers are in the Word as it is written . Why don't you believe it ? Get that swallowed first then God can give you some more ..

 

[ALoveDivine]

All the answers are in the Word as it is written . Why don't you believe it ? Get that swallowed first then God can give you some more ..

So you DO believe God has fingers? Funny how you refuse to plainly answer the questions.

Shall we try again?

1. Does God have fingers?

2. Are the stars lights affixed to a solid dome firmament, above which is water?

 

[EpiscipalMe]

Ha, I'm not your judge, you will be judged by the Word .

Explain to me how we should interpret these words, carved by the finger of God onto stone tablets; "For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy."

Apparently, God doesn't believe in evolution either.

I am perfectly comfortable that God will judge each of us by our love and belief in Him and his Son Jesus Christ. We will also be judged by how we treat others.

I am confident that God will judge evolutionists and creationists equally as it is the lessons the stories teach, not the details that are important.

As for what God believes, I do not presume to know that. I only know what the Holy Spirit has shown me through my study of scripture.

 

[EpiscipalMe]

You completely dogged the question. Is God incorporeal or does he literally have fingers?

Moreover, do the birds and the stars occupy the same firmament? Is the water above this firmament? Strict literalism entails believing that birds and stars occupy the same space and that water is above both of them. Any mental gymnastics employed to get arround that involves assuming the use of figurative language.

Strict literalism also requires one to explain the inconsistencies between Genesis 1 and Genesis 2. Which came first, people or plants?

 

[KWCrazy]

2 Peter 3:8
This verse suggests a day to God is like 1000 years. This doesn't necessarily mean that a day to God is always exactly 1000 years.

Sorry, it doesn't.
It says that a day is like a thousand years and a thousand years is like a day.
It means that God is timeless. He is eternal. Time is a physical constraint on physical beings in a physical world.

 

[ALoveDivine]

Lets be real here people. The acient Israelite cosmology depicted in the early chapters of Genesis was primitive and inaccurate. It pictured the earth as a flat disk floating on water with a solid dome above it to which lights (sun, moon, stars) were fixed. The rainwater was above this dome, which is why the sky is blue, and the "windows of heaven" opened to allow rain to fall.

Why did God not contradict this cosmology in the creation accounts? Because he had no intention of giving a science lesson to his original audience, the ancient Israelites. His intention was to make clear that he and he alone was creator, to make the point that the heavenly bodies were created things not dieties to be worshipped, and to provide an analogical model for a divinely ordained human work-rest pattern culminating in the Sabbath.

Insistence on young-earth creationism has the effect of concincing intelligent, educated people that Christianity is not intellectually viable. Reason never beings anyone to Christ, but we ought not to put up unnecessary intellectual barriers.

 

[KWCrazy]

I don't understand why creationists insist that a belief in evolution is contradictory to a belief in God's Word.

Because God's word states that God made made on the sixth day of creation, and that by man's rebellion sin and death came into the world.

I believe Genesis is an allegory written for a primitive society.

Christ didn't believe it that way. He said if you didn't believe Moses you would never believe Him either.