Adam and Eve in Heaven?

[rnmomof7]

God, in His sovereignty, ordains whatsoever comes to pass (if He did not, He would not be sovereign). This doesn't mean that He CAUSES whatsoever comes to pass, but He does "allow" many things to happen that are otherwise opposed to His will for us.

"Sin" is certainly one of those things that He "ordains" but does not "cause", yes

God ordained the Fall (in the sense that He knew it was going to happen/allowed it to happen), but He didn't cause it, or force our first parents to sin against Him, they chose to do that for themselves. Had He done so, He would have become the undoubted, "Author of evil".

On the other hand, "Hyper-Calvinism" does teach that God caused the Fall. However, Hyper-Calvinism (which took our name as part of their own) is NOT Calvinism/Reformed theology, nor is it an off-shoot/branch of Calvinism or Reformed theology. Hyper-Calvinism is, at best, heresy.

Yours and His,
David

Did God ordain the crucifixion? If the fall had not been the will of God it would not have occurred.. He ordained the fall just as He ordained the remedy

All things are ordained for His glory..God was glorified by the fall..men got to see His Justice and His mercy .

 

[St_Worm2]

Did God ordain the crucifixion? If the fall had not been the will of God it would not have occurred.. He ordained the fall just as He ordained the remedy

All things are ordained for His glory..God was glorified by the fall..men got to see His Justice and His mercy .

Hi Momof7 (and a nurse too?), as I've already said, God ordains whatsoever comes to pass (but His ordination includes ALLOWING things to happen that are in direct opposition to His will for us, like our choice to sin). He ordained the Cross out of necessity, but if you believe God caused/forced our first parents to sin, and/or that He causes us to sin today, then you also believe that He will judge and punish the reprobate in the eternal fires of the second death for something that He 'made' them do (which would still make Him sovereign, but He could not be considered, loving or just).

Perhaps I am misunderstanding you in part or in all of this If so, please help me understand what you are actually saying.

Thanks!

Yours in Christ,
David

 

[JCFantasy23]

Good question. I've also wondered if Adam and Eve ever repented of their disobedience.

I'd think they likely did once they realized the error of their ways. They seemed to immediately feel shame afterwards and I'm sure missed their personal walks with God before their fall. I would spend my entire life missing that and wanting it back.

 

[rnmomof7]

Yep ..retired RN...

Let us look at the purpose of creation... ... it was all for the glory of God.... now let us look at creation.. 1st can we agree that Satan can do nothing without the permission of God? He is a tool in the hand of God .
If God did not intend for the fall we would need to ask why then did He place the temptation in the center of the garden? Why then did He have Satan tempt Eve?
If God did not intend the fall to occur He could have easily prevented it ...

The fact is the fall was an absolute necessity for full revelation of the attributes of God to be seen and glorified.. without the fall His Justice, His wrath , His righteousness, His mercy , Trinity, jealousy etc would not have been seen to be glorified.

Did God FORCE Adam to sin no but like the men that crucified Christ it was ordained and men are held responsible. Adam was made in such a way that he would desire to be a god and would break Gods covenant with him .

God "works all things after the counsel of his will" (Ephesians 1:11).

This "all things" includes the fall of sparrows (Matthew 10:29), the rolling of dice (Proverbs 16:33), the slaughter of his people (Psalm 44:11), the decisions of kings (Proverbs 21:1), the failing of sight (Exodus 4:11), the sickness of children (2 Samuel 12:15), the loss and gain of money (1 Samuel 2:7), the suffering of saints (1 Peter 4:19), the completion of travel plans (James 4:15), the persecution of Christians (Hebrews 12:4-7), the repentance of souls (2 Timothy 2:25), the gift of faith (Philippians 1:29), the pursuit of holiness (Philippians 3:12-13), the growth of believers (Hebrews 6:3), the giving of life and the taking in death (1 Samuel 2:6), and the crucifixion of his Son (Acts 4:27-28). (Piper)