ABUSIVE husband...

[joyousliving]

This will be my last post in this thread.

I will pray for this woman and her family. I will pray for her local church family to support her as well.

It is ABSURD to think that we are not sometimes called to share in Christ's suffering. The bible is clear that all of the apostles suffered. It is clear that the early church suffered under persecution.

God is not who you think He is. He is who He is and He has revealed Himself in His word.

I am not saying that this woman or any Christian ought to go out and seek opportunities to suffer abuse. But when as Christians we find that we are in a situation where our faith in Him is causing us to suffer trials it is truly an opportunity to share in the suffering of Christ.

Please give me verses that support your notion that God doesn't want anyone to suffer. God isn't the author of our suffering, but He does allow it for His glory.

 

[snoochface]

We are told many times in God's word that we WILL suffer for Christ. To say that God does not want us to be unhappy or does not want us to suffer goes directly against what his word tells us.

Philippians 1:29
For it has been granted to you on behalf of Christ not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for him

2 Thess 1:5
All this is evidence that God's judgment is right, and as a result you will be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which you are suffering.

2 Tim 1:8
So do not be ashamed to testify about our Lord, or ashamed of me his prisoner. But join with me in suffering for the gospel, by the power of God

There are many verses that say similar things.

Further, Paul advocated not getting married at all. To say it would be a waste of a life to not re-marry after a divorce goes against what the Bible says about marriage. Many people are not called to marriage at all, and their lives are certainly not wasted.

1 Corinthians 7:8-11
But I say to the unmarried and to widows that it is good for them if they remain even as I. But if they do not have self-control, let them marry; for it is better to marry than to burn with passion. But to the married I give instructions, not I, but the Lord, that the wife should not leave her husband (but if she does leave, she must remain unmarried, or else be reconciled to her husband), and that the husband should not divorce his wife.

Any argument to the contrary is us - men, humans - interjecting what we believe is right in our minds, what seems right, what feels right, what we think about God -- instead of what we know about God from his word, instead of following his word. His will for us may seem counter-intuitive at times but it is always, always, always the correct way to live.

I will pray for the original poster and her husband.

 

[Theogonia]

Interestingly, it doesn't say what the husband can do if he gets divorced, only the wife.

That's because women didn't have the rights of men back then.

Now, God will allow us to suffer to shape us, but he's not going to call us into a lifetime of suffering. He expects us to wake up and fix what's wrong with our lives.

In this case, she made a bad decision, and he's allowing her to suffer for it so she might wake up and get out of this bad situation.

Lastly, why are you holding Paul's teaching over God's?

 

[snoochface]

Paul's teaching IS FROM God. The Bible is God's word, no matter who put pen to paper. The fact that you don't believe that is the reason why you and I disagree on so very many Biblical truths.

I have not seen you post even one verse from scripture to support what you have said in this thread.

 

[Theogonia]

I don't think posting scripture is neccesary. I feel what's right in my gut.

And yes, Paul was close to God, but he was only a human, like you and me. He made mistakes just like you and me.

I don't believe God was putting the words in his mouth or something like that.

Of course I know the bible is God's word. I never said anything else.

And like I said, the women had a different position back then. They were more like property, and didn't have rights.

Like I said, the fact that it doesn't say what the husband can do if he gets divorced is interesting.

 

[Flipper]

God hates violence - don't have to quote scripture, it's pretty well understood.

God hates divorce - scripture is pretty clear on that too.

However, the Biblical legalists here seem to forget that physical and sexual abuse isn't just unbiblical, it's also illegal, yes, even if it's done by your spouse too. I don't think there is anything in the Bible that says that we are supposed to hang out with criminals commiting crimes upon ourselves. Romans 13 kind of gives us reason to follow our own country's laws. I would first get out of there, and second, press charges.

God also gave us His Grace through the death of His Son. If someone who escaped an abusive marriage divorced the abuser, and married a gentle, kind, God worshipping soul, I'm not going to point fingers and say anything - I'd rather point fingers at the scum who was doing the abusing. Leave it up to God, as to whether or not Grace applies - though I would like to think it did. The person who has been abused has gone through enough, to not need to get it again from people who have never gone through it themselves.

 

[Theogonia]

Good one.

Also, even if God hates divorce, he never says it's a sin.

Obviously it's wrong if you just get tired of the person, but for good reason I don't think he'll condemn you for it.

 

[AngelDove1]

oops sorry 2x

 

[AngelDove1]

God hates violence - don't have to quote scripture, it's pretty well understood.

God hates divorce - scripture is pretty clear on that too.

However, the Biblical legalists here seem to forget that physical and sexual abuse isn't just unbiblical, it's also illegal, yes, even if it's done by your spouse too. I don't think there is anything in the Bible that says that we are supposed to hang out with criminals commiting crimes upon ourselves. Romans 13 kind of gives us reason to follow our own country's laws. I would first get out of there, and second, press charges.

God also gave us His Grace through the death of His Son. If someone who escaped an abusive marriage divorced the abuser, and married a gentle, kind, God worshipping soul, I'm not going to point fingers and say anything - I'd rather point fingers at the scum who was doing the abusing. Leave it up to God, as to whether or not Grace applies - though I would like to think it did. The person who has been abused has gone through enough, to not need to get it again from people who have never gone through it themselves.

 

[Sketcher]

Good one.

Also, even if God hates divorce, he never says it's a sin.

If God says not to do something, (1 Cor 7:10-11) how is it not a sin?

If He calls remarraige with someone else adultery, how is that not a sin?

 

[Sketcher]

The person who has been abused has gone through enough, to not need to get it again from people who have never gone through it themselves.

Yeah and suppose they find out that at the end of their lives that was wrong. More pain is ahead for them.

 

[Sketcher]

Quote.. twistedsketch...

{God hates abuse, but He also hates divorce.}

Quote... Godlilgurlalways...
{But that is only for those joined together and married by the plan of God.}


In agreement with Godsgurlalways .....

There is no Biblical reason to believe that people who marry have not been joined together and married by God - unless one or both of them is divorced, as Jesus taught. Read Matthew 19 again.

 

[Sketcher]

Praise report! I will say though that since i started this thread, likely due to those who are soo kindly praying for us, the Lord seems to be softening my DH's heart to try a little...i pray the Lord brings him to his knees, and he seeks the Lord' mercy and grace, for it is only HE that can deliver him from these cruel behaviors.amen

That's great, let's keep praying!

 

[Theogonia]

But the question arises whether the marriage vows have been broken if there's abuse.

God is talking to people who have a healthy marriage.

 

[Theogonia]

Also if there is abuse, I doubt God brought them together because he would have known what would happen.

 

[AngelDove1]

Also if there is abuse, I doubt God brought them together because he would have known what would happen.

there is some truth to that ScottyL,
sometimes God permitts things to happen to us.
Like Job and other biblical stories.

Builds our character,if we learn from it,
it makes us stronger.And brings us closer to God.

 

[Theogonia]

Right.

He allows us to make mistakes so we learn from them.

 

[Sketcher]

But the question arises whether the marriage vows have been broken if there's abuse.

The "marital unfaithfulness" Jesus alluded to is strictly "porneia" - sexual infidelity. That's what the original language says, and that's strictly what that word means. Other "serious" reasons would have been known of (such as killing your children behind your back) but were not listed. That's worth a thought.

God is talking to people who have a healthy marriage.

None of God's commands for marraiges apply only to healthy ones. In fact, His advice is the advice to take if your marraige is sick, so that He can do His part and heal the relationship.

Also if there is abuse, I doubt God brought them together because he would have known what would happen.

I don't believe that because it doesn't match up with the recurring theme of Him calling people into painful missions - Jesus to the cross, Paul to Jerusalem, Jeremiah to preach, etc. Or consider Ruth - should she have not married her first husband because God knew he was going to die so early? Or Hannah - assuming she was the legitimate wife to begin with, should she have not married Elkanah, even though through him Samuel was brought into the world? Or Abigail - Did God not join her to Nabal, even though he was no good?

 

[AngelDove1]

exactly ...
And if we don't pass the test the 1st time,guess what?
we go round that mountain 1 more time,
maybe even several times more.

Right.

He allows us to make mistakes so we learn from them.

 

[Flipper]

Yeah and suppose they find out that at the end of their lives that was wrong. More pain is ahead for them.

If just that sin is going to condem someone to Hell, then we are ALL going because no one is sinless.

That's why we have the Grace of God.