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About Jesus, I need help.

Discussion in 'Non-denominational' started by Hishandmaiden, Feb 17, 2002.

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  1. camaro540

    camaro540 Regular Member

    318
    +0
    Messianic
    Mandy, I agree with you to an extent. But there comes
    a time when deeper learning and understanding should lead
    you to more insite, and truth to our Fathers word.

    The thing that makes me nervous is when people say:
    Nope, thats it, I choose not to learn anymore, my
    pastor is right.....

    At that point, people have given up learning from the Almighty,
    and started trusting in mens doctrines. Thats exactly what satan
    wants, and thats whats happening today.

    I'm not saying that everyone who calls the Lord "Jesus" is going
    to loose the Kingdom, I don't know they're hearts, only Father
    does. But we are suppose to thirst after truth, and if we do, then
    we will have a drive to go as far as we can to get to the truth.
    This is what pleases our Father, the Creater, the Almighty.

    Just as a husband or wife loves to be desired by they're spouse,
    so our Father loves to be desired by His creation, to seek Him, to
    look for Him, to knock at the door..... This is what keeps us out
    of satans reach.

    Patrick
     
  2. zamar

    zamar Member

    184
    +0
    Patrick,
    Why do you act as if satan were so great and mighty? If we are believers and children of God then the greater one (The Holy Spirit) lives in us.

    Light and darkness cannot co-exist. We may choose to sin but that doesn't mean that we are weak and lost , hoping that little satan doesn't get us.

    God is Great, the devil is defeated and Jesus is on the throne.

    Z
     
  3. camaro540

    camaro540 Regular Member

    318
    +0
    Messianic
    Z

    I never said satan was great and mighty, he is a deciever!!
    It is deception that I am speaking of.

    Patrick
     
  4. rwc109

    rwc109 Active Member

    902
    +5
    Engaged
    Dear dissenter
    My only objection to the much-used name 'Jesus' is because it has been revealed in this very workshop that it is a Roman pagan deiberate corruptuion, it isn't just a bad translation, it is deliberate mis-representation to placate Zeus-worshippers...this does not seem acceptable to me, but it is entirely up to each of us what we decide is important....I would be happy with any uncorrupted translation personally...I don't see that it has to do with salvation as ,as I have said, that is to do with the Purpose implicit in the name,,,,and the purpose of Yeshua is saviour......it is not so different from the surnaming we use where Mr Smith actually had an ancestor who was a blacksmith for instance.
    Thus the important thing for salvation is that we recognise our saviour and I hope none have any problem with that , so there is just ,for me, the question of respect in the name we use, knowing that it is corrupted deliberately by pagan influences is enough to stop me using the name 'Jesus; for my saviour, you choose freely what you do, no dissension whatever. :D
     
  5. Egoinos

    Egoinos New Member

    35
    +0
    rwc,
    The authors of the NT were Roman pagans? They deliberately misrepresented God by calling his son "Iesous" to placate Zeus-worshippers?
    :eek: :confused:
     
  6. rwc109

    rwc109 Active Member

    902
    +5
    Engaged
    Dealy beloved egoinus
    I think you know that your words are nothing like what I said. See the previous discussion on this post.
     
  7. Hishandmaiden

    Hishandmaiden The Humble Servant Supporter

    +193
    Christian
    Private
    Hmm.... I think even though the name of Jesus is corrupted by Roman pagans, I do not think he will mind us calling him that. I find it odd to call him Yeshua for I was so used to calling him Jesus. Beside, God looks at the hearts of men.
    You know, if you really want to pursue the true words of God, you need to know Hebrews and Greeks. But then, as all words of God are true, translated or not, we are saved from learning multiple languages.
    Furthermore, I had seen people healed by pastors who called on the name of Jesus.
     
  8. Mandy

    Mandy Well-Known Member

    +7
    The name Jesus was not corrupted and you are right God looks at our hearts, so even if it was corrupted He knows we are talking to and about our Saviour.
     
  9. Day

    Day New Member

    35
    +0
    Great question!

    Genesis 32:29

    The pagans also wore wreaths on their heads when they went out to make sacrifices to their gods. The fact that the Roman soldiers crowned "I am Saviour" with a [wreath] of thorns illustrates the power of the Son of Man -- that is the sacrificial lamb, who without blemish (sin-free) took away the sins of the WORLD (pagan gentiles included) for those who call on his name--

    Please see (ROM 10:8-13; John 3:18)

    God's name has always been associated with his presence.

    The Lord our God tells us that wherever he chooses to dwell: THERE he shall put his name

    He has never put his Name on man made things, but rather He puts his Name on his only begotten Son and on those who believe in the Name of the Son.

    REV 14:1 "Then I looked, and behold, a Lamb standing on mount Zion, and with Him one hundred and forty-four thousand, having His Father's name written on their foreheads.

    REV 19:13 "He was clothed with a robe dipped in blood and His NAME is called the Word of God.

    The Word of God is Jesus.

    REV 3:8 "I know your works. See, I have set before you an open door, and no one can shut it; for you have a little strength, have kept My word, and have not denied My NAME."

    Without faith in the NAME (presence of God in you who are the Holy Temple) Fullness of God in the image Jesus the Man and Fullness of Jesus in you -- without faith it is impossible to please God.

    Our faith is in his Son and his Name.

    II COR 13:5 "Examine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Do you not know yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you?--unless indeed you are disqualified.

    Eph 4:4-6 "There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called in one hope of your calling; One Lord, one faith, one baptism;One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all."

    "If we love one another God abides in us..." (1 JON 4:12)

    "He who has the Son has life. He who does not have the Son of God does not have life. These things I have written to you who believe in the NAME of the Son of God."

    John 17:6 Jesus speaks: "I have manifested Your NAME to the men whom you have given Me out of the world. They were Yours, You gave them to Me, and they have kept Your Word.
     
  10. Egoinos

    Egoinos New Member

    35
    +0
    rwc,
    I read the posts, but I didn't see anything particularly convincing that "Jesus" is a deliberate corruption to placate the Zeus-worshippers. My point was that "iesous" is the name the NT writers used of Jesus (or Yeshua) which would lead me to believe that they saw nothing wrong in not using the hebrew form of his name, but rather using a greek form. This being so, I don;t see why anyone should wish to call him Yeshua to the exclusion of Jesus.
     
  11. tericl2

    tericl2 A Work in Progress

    741
    +6
    Christian
    Camaro,

    You wouldn't happen to be part of the "Oneness" religion would you? Your arguments sound very much like theirs. Identical in fact.

    Whether you are or not I am posting this link so that those here that don't know about "oneness" can read the statement of faith.

    Oneness - Statement of Faith

    Check the "tenets of truth" at the bottom of the linked page.
     
  12. tericl2

    tericl2 A Work in Progress

    741
    +6
    Christian
    Forget the question about the "Oneness".

    Are you involved in the Sacred Name Movement? For everyone's info I am posting a link concerning this group also.

    Jesus = Zeus?? NOT

    Check out the whole site.
     
  13. camaro540

    camaro540 Regular Member

    318
    +0
    Messianic
    Shalom everyone

    Look, I have been called many things, but it's got nothing
    to do with me. This is all about our Creator. I admit that
    pagen ways are hard to break, I've been there and done that.
    This simply started out as a "what is His name" type of thread,
    and I simply gave answers to questions.

    If you where to look at my profile, you'd see that I simply a
    believer..... Nothing more, nothing less.

    Why people have to put labels on things I can never figure out.
    I will share the first ten laws that every one should know:

    1) To know that G-d exists (Ex. 20:2; Deut. 5:6)
    2) Not to entertain the idea that there is any god but the Eternal
    (Ex. 20:3)
    3) Not to blaspheme (Ex. 22:27; in Christian texts, Ex. 22:28), the
    penalty for which is death (Lev. 24:16)
    4) To hallow G-d's name (Lev. 22:32)
    5) Not to profane G-d's name (Lev. 22:32)
    6) To know that G-d is One, a complete Unity (Deut. 6:4)
    7) To love G-d (Deut. 6:5)
    8) To fear Him reverently (Deut. 6:13; 10:20)
    9) Not to put the word of G-d to the test (Deut. 6:16)
    10) To imitate His good and upright ways (Deut. 28:9)

    If people have to divide The Almighty into 3 different parts to try and understand Him, then thats they're buisness, but I simply choose to just let Him be as Mighty as He is, without question.

    The only other thing that I will say is that all the Apostles where
    Jews. They would have called Him by His Jewish name, that being
    Yeshua. If they were to come to the world today, they would still
    call Him Yeshua, and not Jesus. I simply prefer to call on the Name
    that His Apostles, believers, and followers at the time would have
    called on. Yeshua

    If you want to call on the name of Jesus, then do, your okay in my
    book.... But, my book isn't worth the paper it's wrote on, is it?.....

    Patrick
     
  14. Hishandmaiden

    Hishandmaiden The Humble Servant Supporter

    +193
    Christian
    Private
    So, I suppose we should all stick with our beliefs and respect one another.
     
  15. camaro540

    camaro540 Regular Member

    318
    +0
    Messianic
    I have a question for everyone?

    Lets say, I decided to call Jesus/Yeshua, Mr. Toaster Oven?
    And lets say I put out my own version of the Holy Scriptures,
    and changed all references to fit how I could understand, and
    comprehend the Word of G-d.

    Okay, now we have the son "Mr. Toaster Oven", so I have to
    explane G-d to you, well I choose to call Him "The Higher Power".
    In order for "Mr. Toaster Oven" to exist, he has to be pluged
    into this "Higher Power". Now, "Mr. Toaster Oven" is full of this
    "Higher Power", which I will call "The Holy Electricity".

    This version of the scriptures wouldn't be out long, and I'd have a
    HUGH following of my version, because I would be opening the
    door to a mass of people that could better comprehend this
    translation.

    But it wouldn't take long for a bunch of people in this, and many
    other forums to be screaming " IT'S BLASPHAMY!!, DON'T READ IT,
    YOU'LL GO TO HELL!!!!" ha ha

    Okay, people would have to except these new believers to the
    faith. Why? Well, just because they chose to translate the name
    (Yeshua/Jesus) to "Mr. Toaster Oven" wouldn't be grounds for
    condemming them... As many have said already in this thread,
    G-d (they're Higher Power) knows our hearts, and then that
    alone makes it okay to call the only begotten Son of G-d
    "Mr. Toaster Oven".

    HHHhmmm....... I may have to put out a translation of my own,
    to open the doors for others...... HHHhmmm.........

    That would be okay, wouldn't it?
    Think now...........

    Patrick
     
  16. Hishandmaiden

    Hishandmaiden The Humble Servant Supporter

    +193
    Christian
    Private
    ..................
    No comment.
     
  17. Mandy

    Mandy Well-Known Member

    +7
    Utter nonsense. Jesus is the Messiah's name translated into english. Did Zeus die for the sins of the world?
     
  18. Optimus_P

    Optimus_P Super Umpa Lumpa

    585
    +1
    thats how i see it.

    They might not agree w/ us but dosent mean we should stop loveing them as human.

    Those who clame other faiths and other gods will all go befor the Judge of judges, the only God, which just happens to be my God.
     
  19. filosofer

    filosofer Senior Veteran

    +287
    Lutheran
    I must say, I'm amused by this discussion.

    Camaro, questions for you.

    Are you consistent in your identifying the name of God? Doesn't seem so.

    Where have you learned about the Hebrew and the Greek and the issue of translation and transliteration?
     
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