Abolishing the law of commandments

[fhansen]

The basic difference regarding the old and new covenant is that now the law "and whatever other commandment there may be" is fulfilled by loving our neighbor

Yes, and loving God, if we’re to fulfill the first three commandments. And, again, how is this even possible? Answer: by communion with Him, the Source of all love, goodness, righteousness, justice. “Apart from Me you can do nothing.” John 15:5

Again, with the old covenant fallen man didn’t yet know God; reconciliation had not taken place:

“Now this is eternal life: that they know you,the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.” John 17:3

Again, the most basic difference between the old and new covenants is union with God, Whom we now rely on instead of on ourselves. We fell and died with Adam, who denied God by denying His authority. We rise with Christ as God now becomes our God again. This knowledge is to begin now, and is partial now, to be fully completed in the next life:

“For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.” 1 Cor 13:12

Man was absolutely made for communion with God. That’s what we’re here to learn, so we can get on board with Him.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

The law existed before Sinai but it was given at Sinai for the sole purpose of revealing Sin..

Proof please ..

 

[fhansen]

It can sum up in this one command "Love your neighbour as yourself"..

This Love is in the Son..

So the 10 commandments fulfilled by this: " to believe in the name of the Son and to Love your neighbour" 1John

Yes! And so fulfill them we must. So the church can rightly teach, quoting a 16th century believer in this case,
“At the evening of life we shall be judged on our love.”

That love, that authentic expression of true righteousness, comes only from Him. And so to the extent that we fulfill the greatest commandments our justice, and our telos, would be complete, and sin/lawlessness would be totally excluded.

 

[pasifika]

Proof please ..

Romans 3:20, Galatians 3:19

 

[pasifika]

Yes! And so fulfill them we must. So the church can rightly teach, quoting a 16th century believer in this case,
“At the evening of life we shall be judged on our love.”

That love, that authentic expression of true righteousness, comes only from Him. To the extent that we fulfill the greatest commandments our justice, and our telos, would be complete, and sin/lawlessness would be totally excluded.

But we cannot obtain this Love through the 10 commandments but by "believing in the Son" (through the Gospel)...

"Letter kills"
"Spirit gives life"

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Romans 3:20, Galatians 3:19

Law is transgression against God, but the 10 are not. If Jesus promotes it then how can you claim it to be abolished? Compare the 9 laws of the Spirit and all that's missing from what Jesus claims to be the 2 laws and your left with the Lord of the Sabbath. Law was added because of transgressions Gal 3:19 Justification/propitiation came thru Christ, not given by angels.

 

[pasifika]

Law is transgression against God, but the 10 are not. If Jesus promotes it then how can you claim it to be abolished? Compare the 9 laws of the Spirit and all that's missing from what Jesus claims to be the 2 laws and your left with the Lord of the Sabbath.

Sin is transgression against God Not law..

Where did Jesus mentioned that we must follow the 10 commandments?

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Sin is transgression against God Not law..

Where did Jesus mentioned that we must follow the 10 commandments?

Break down the 10 minus the Lord of Sabbath and you have God and neighbour.

Law was added because of transgression ,,, can we assume it was because of sin?

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Sin, aka lawlessness, still earns us death under the New Covenant. The curse of the law is simply that it's right, correct, and good, but we cannot possibly fulfill it...on our own. To be under grace means to be with God now: and that union is the basic difference between the old and new covenants.

"I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
No longer will they teach their neighbor,
or say to one another, ‘Know the Lord,’
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest,”
declares the Lord." Jer 31:33-34

"Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.” Matt 19:26

"Apart from Me you can do nothing." John 15:5

"I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." Phil 4:13

Isn't that basically what I just said???

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Sin is transgression against God Not law..

Where did Jesus mentioned that we must follow the 10 commandments?

Who wrote the law??? Love God...1st 5 and love your neighbor...last 5. That BTW, is also Torah... Luke 18:18-20 ... Matthew 5:17-19

“Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven”

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

It can sum up in this one command "Love your neighbour as yourself"..

That is Torah

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Hello, if you say you follow the 10commandments of the old covenant then you must also observed all commandments given under that covenant including animal sacrifices, abstain from certain foods etc because it's part of the covenant (old covenant) it cannot mix with the new covenant law, commandments etc .

That is false. You can not follow all the commandments, no one can. There is no Temple so you can't perform animal sacrifices. If you are a man, you can not follow laws that only pertain only to women...

 

[fhansen]

Isn't that basically what I just said???

If so I don't mean to argue. I meant to clarify my point, which is that sin still earns us death under the new covenant. Faith does not excuse us from the obligation to be righteous but rather finally affords us the authentic means to achieve it, through Christ.

 

[fhansen]

But we cannot obtain this Love through the 10 commandments but by "believing in the Son" (through the Gospel)...

"Letter kills"
"Spirit gives life"

Yes, as I've been saying. But, achieve it we must if we're to attain to the purpose God has for man. That love is both a gift of grace, and a human choice to accept, embrace, and express or act upon that gift. The ten commandments are then fulfilled regardless of whether or not we've ever heard them.

But hearing them is still good, to remind us that we're failing to love when we break them. Love isn't perfected overnight-and won't be fully perfected in this life. But that's the road we must be on, the "journey to perfection" as it's been called, as we're being transformed into God's own image.

"But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God, the benefit you reap leads to holiness, and the result is eternal life. For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord." Rom 6:22-23

 

[Hawkins]

The angels have been tried and the disobedient angels have been expelled from heaven.
The angels are no longer on trial.

No, you are wrong again. Angels are chained in Abyss waiting for the Final Judgment to come. The same as human souls remain in Hades waiting for the same Judgment to come. It is only after the Final Judgment that they will be thrown to the Lake of Fire.

Matthew 25:41 (NIV2011)
Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.


This is consistent with the Pharisaic concept as explained by Josephus to the Greek.

An Extract Out of Josephus’ Discourse to the Greeks Concerning Hades:
In this region there is a certain place set apart, as a lake of unquenchable fire, whereinto we suppose no one hath hitherto been cast; but it is prepared for a day afore-determined by God, in which one righteous sentence shall deservedly be passed upon all men; when the unjust, and those that have been disobedient to God, and have given honor to such idols as have been the vain operations of the hands of men as to God himself, shall be adjudged to this everlasting punishment, as having been the causes of defilement;

 

[Clare73]

Yes, but do you understand why, and how this works?

Indeed!
We now work out (put into practice) what God has worked in us both to will and to do (Philippians 2:13).

And why wouldn't the born again do so, when God works it in them to do so?

 

[Clare73]

Yes because it cannot justify us. Only God can do so. So man must return to God, and remain in Him.

The born again are justified (declared righteous once and for all with God imputing the righteousness of Jesus Christ to them) by faith (Romans 1:17, Romans 3:20-24, Romans 3:28), just as the guilt of the first Adam was imputed to them (Romans 5:18).

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

I would say that the CURSE was abolished on the cross... Galatians 3:13 ...when it says we are not UNDER the law, it means we are not subject to its curse/judgement any longer...it does not mean you are free to break it...murder is still a sin and transgresses the law...

"Cursed is every one that hangs on a tree" it is said in the verse you mentioned. It is alluding to,

Deuteronomy 21:23 his body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but thou shalt surely bury him the same day; for he that is hanged is accursed of God; that thou defile not thy land which Jehovah thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.​

This is indeed a part of the law, it relates to a specific kind of execution (hanging) and by a careful use of words to it is made applicable to crucifixion on a wooden cross. But which kind of law is it that Christians are not under?

Galatians 3:13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us; for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:​

I do not mean to quibble, I know that what I've written looks like it is quibbling about words while missing the bigger picture that redemption presents.

Some say Christians are free from the ceremonial and civil law but not from the moral law is that how Christians are to understand the passage in the first post in the light of other passages?

 

[Clare73]

Yes, and loving God, if we’re to fulfill the first three commandments. And, again,
how is this even possible?

In the very way which Scripture states: It is God who works in the born again both to will and to do. (Philipipians 2:13)

 

[Clare73]

No, you are wrong again. Angels are chained in Abyss

And no longer on trial to determine their destiny.

waiting for the Final Judgment to come. The same as human souls remain in Hades waiting for the same Judgment to come. It is only after the Final Judgment that they will be thrown to the Lake of Fire.

Scripture presents Satan as restrained now, but still able to go about as a roaring lion seeking those whom he may devour (1 Peter 5:8; Job 1:7).