A question for flat earth people

[Chinchilla]

What do you think? To my mind the basic principle is about taking the time to look at each passage, book, part of the bible in its own context. Anyone can do it. I think it’s a mistake just to pick it up, read it, and assume that whatever you (or anyone else) happens to think is the only ‘correct’ interpretation.

Yea I totally agree , so all through Scriptures stars and angels are used to descibe the same being so why do you think otherwise ?

 

[Tom 1]

Yea I totally agree , so all through Scriptures stars and angels are used to descibe the same being so why do you think otherwise ?

What is it you agree with?

In the example you gave I can’t think of any reason why the image of a star falling should be taken literally, as in an actual star crashing into the earth. If you have other examples and want a response to those feel free but it could get a bit tiresome.

 

[Chinchilla]

In the example you gave I can’t think of any reason why the image of a star falling should be taken literally, as in an actual star crashing into the earth. If you have other examples and want a response to those feel free but it could get a bit tiresome.

I quoted other example in the same post , did the star hovering above house burn everybody alive or was it angel ?

 

[Tom 1]

I quoted other example in the same post , did the star hovering above house burn everybody alive or was it angel ?

Oh right, missed that. For the purposes of the narrative I assume it’s supposed to mean a star moving through the heavens, as in visible in the sky, not directly above the house giving everyone a factor 5000 day. Whether or not it is meant to be taken literally or is just a representation of some sort of astronomical event, I don’t know. From everything I’ve read on it writers in the ancient world were more interested in conveying meaning than literal description.

 

[Chinchilla]

Oh right, missed that. For the purposes of the narrative I assume it’s supposed to mean a star moving through the heavens, as in visible in the sky, not directly above the house giving everyone a factor 5000 day. Whether or not it is meant to be taken literally or is just a representation of some sort of astronomical event, I don’t know. From everything I’ve read on it writers in the ancient world were more interested in conveying meaning than literal description.

It clearly says it hover above house , and that it moved, start aren't moving supposed to heliocentrism but ok.

So it does not fit the narrative of Science that's why you are rejecting the simple truth .
Why do you believe that a person can rise from the dead contradicting scientific method but star can't be an angel ?

Why cherry pick ?
Were all of Jesus miracles also allegorical and poetry ?

 

[Tom 1]

It clearly says it hover above house , and that it moved, start aren't moving supposed to heliocentrism but ok.

So it does not fit the narrative of Science that's why you are rejecting the simple truth .
Why do you believe that a person can rise from the dead contradicting scientific method but star can't be an angel ?

Why cherry pick ?
Were all of Jesus miracles also allegorical and poetry ?

I don’t think the text is saying the star was floating in the air and they followed it. In verse one it says they saw the star ‘as it rose’ then followed its direction as it moved to its destination over Bethlehem. Is this an actual descriptive account? Unlikely, the author is relating something he heard about second hand as part of a narrative whose first importance is meaning, meaning that would resonate with the intended readers.
Like I said in my other post I think to get a satisfying understanding it’s necessary to look at different passages on their own merits, read commentary on it and make your own mind up. Overgeneralising or being dogmatic doesn’t produce much in my experience.

 

[A_Thinker]

See... you are thinking in your globe trained mind... Until the globe.. there was no need to have anything "hold us down". Not until we started spinning on an earth where people on one side were upside down to those on the other side... this posed a problem. Gravity fixed it.

Wrong ....

Gravity keeps you from floating up into a tree. Has nothing to do with a spinning globe.

 

[Chinchilla]

I don’t think the text is saying the star was floating in the air and they followed it. In verse one it says they saw the star ‘as it rose’ then followed its direction as it moved to its destination over Bethlehem. Is this an actual descriptive account? Unlikely, the author is relating something he heard about second hand as part of a narrative whose first importance is meaning, meaning that would resonate with the intended readers.
Like I said in my other post I think to get a satisfying understanding it’s necessary to look at different passages on their own merits, read around on it and make your own mind up. Overgeneralising or being dogmatic about it doesn’t produce much in my experience.

But still stars don't move so how can it move ?
Ok let's forget stars because you don't seem to get the point .

Joshua 10:13 King James Version (KJV)
13 And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day.



How can sun stand still ?

 

[A_Thinker]

Maybe because it's heavier than the air molecules around it? IDK... I'm just saying that a bird comes nowhere close to an "escape velocity" yet flies super high.

The language of "heavier" implies gravity.

 

[Tom 1]

But still stars don't move so how can it move ?
Ok let's forget stars because you don't seem to get the point .

Joshua 10:13 King James Version (KJV)
13 And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day.



How can sun stand still ?

The author didn’t know that. My guess is that he’s explaining some sort of astronomical event in a way that he and his readers would understand, in the terminology of the day.

 

[Chinchilla]

The author didn’t know that. My guess is that he’s explaining some sort of astronomical event in a way that he and his readers would understand, in the terminology of the day.

so because this passage does not fit in your scientism religion it has to be false ?
but people don't rise from the dead and it does not fit scientism aswell , why reject the first and believe the second ?

Luke 24:25-27 King James Version (KJV)
25 Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:

 

[Tom 1]

But still stars don't move so how can it move ?
Ok let's forget stars because you don't seem to get the point .

Joshua 10:13 King James Version (KJV)
13 And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day.



How can sun stand still ?

Hold on I missed your post edit. I’m slowly working through the bible with reference to the historical contexts and I’m still in Genesis (!), haven’t got to this one yet. I did read something about how this could be possible if the earth gradually slowed instead of suddenly stopping, but I have no idea if that is feasible or not. Also, I read some other stories from around the world of a ‘long day’, but I don’t know how well those match up. If you’re still on here when I get to Joshua I might have a better answer . My basic assumption for much of the bible is that meaning takes precedent, so that’s what I look for first.
The reference to the book of Jasher might mean that the author of Joshua took that record to be literal/accurate, and used it as a source.

 

[Paul of Eugene OR]

I have no reason to believe that it will have any ability to check playing cards. I have no idea why you would suggest it..
What I am talking about is biological of some sort. Works on eggs... according to my mother... who is a a dear Christian woman and has no reason to lie and only mentioned it when we were all doing it on our pregnant or previously pregnant wives, at the time.

And, definitely works on pregnant and previously pregnant women.

So... have at er... with the playing cards but don't condemn my posts because this doesn't work on inanimate pieces of cardboard.

Oh I'm sure there has been no attempt to deceive here.

 

[A_Thinker]

How can sun stand still ?

God performed a miracle ...

 

[Tom 1]

It clearly says it hover above house , and that it moved, start aren't moving supposed to heliocentrism but ok.

Nb some stars do move, I think, in relation to each other and at the centre of their own systems they have a sort of mini orbit, moving in response to the gravitational fields of the planets or other stars. I seem to remember reading Sol moves slightly.
In the Matthew narrative however whatever is being described, whether an actual event or not, any movement involves both the movement of the earth and the heavenly body described as a star, e.g like a comet or something of that sort.

 

[Tom 1]

so because this passage does not fit in your scientism religion it has to be false ?
but people don't rise from the dead and it does not fit scientism aswell , why reject the first and believe the second ?

Luke 24:25-27 King James Version (KJV)
25 Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:

I don’t think you’re reading my posts.

 

[Paul of Eugene OR]

Space, as it is presented, is an almost perfect vacuum. The difference in pressure created by my vacuum is not even close to the difference in pressure between our atmosphere and a perfect vacuum.....

Point is... you have a perfect vacuum shoulder to shoulder with our atmosphere..... in high atmosphere where gravity is diminished.... and it doesn't suck it all away.

You can spin it all you want... but, even when my vacuum is full and doesn't have much draw... it will pick up a feather.

I persoanlly have a problem with the fact that our atmosphere is not sucked away. It doesn't make sense.

I know, the egg heads could draw some elaborate equations on a chalk board, that only them and four others would understand, and conclude from the cryptic scribbles that it "must work". But, I'm not buying any of it.

You agree the math works out when you say "egg heads could draw some elaborate equations on a chalk board that only them and four others would understand". Then you say you're not buying it. After you admit you wouldn't understand it.

Well, that explains your point of view completely. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Tom 1]

so because this passage does not fit in your scientism religion it has to be false ?
but people don't rise from the dead and it does not fit scientism aswell , why reject the first and believe the second ?

Luke 24:25-27 King James Version (KJV)
25 Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:

Looking at the text to try and figure out what is meant isn’t ‘scientism’, if you want to call it something you could call it literary analysis. If you take an analytic approach it becomes clear over time how different parts of the bible are meant to be taken in different ways.

 

[Chinchilla]

God performed a miracle ...

Did he stop sun and moon or earth ?

 

[A_Thinker]

Did he stop sun and moon or earth ?

He didn't explain how He did it ...