A new CF, an old vision

[wmc1982]

I agree on the warnings.... sort of..... posts should get deleted if they are really bad (not like it is now where they delete everything all the time probably even this post), and people should be warned for true rule violation.... but the things that people get warnings over here sometimes are just SOOOO absurd and tame.... I think warnings should be for serious true offenses .... less based on the particular moderator's personal opinion about your intentions because of a rule thats generically called "flaming" .... just about any post could be called flaming based on a person's point of view and it gets way out of hand. This might be solved by the new rules, so maybe there is nothing to fear.

Mods have always been pretty lenient. You had to do/say something pretty out of line to get points. A warning meant nothing, so no one should base that on anything, they were just reminders.

 

[dignitized]

We Ewirn never in my wildest dreams did i think you would sell out this big.. good riddance

Sorry to see you go before you've even given things a chance.

 

[GreenMunchkin]

Jesus never condoned sin - but then neither did he spurn the company of sinners.

Dude, who has said anything that would necessitate your saying that? No-one is saying otherwise, are they?

 

[intricatic]

Well, I can vouch for one thing: I'll be leaving. I don't see these changes as being positive by any stretch of the imagination. I see this entirely as caving into the postmodern trends of society, and it really upsets me to see this happen to such a wonderful site.

 

[dignitized]

Dude, who has said anything that would necessitate your saying that? No-one is saying otherwise, are they?

If I misunderstood - I apologize.

 

[openup4christ]

I think that if CF is to be governed by members we should have a CF wide vote to see if we really want this change.

 

[dignitized]

Well, I can vouch for one thing: I'll be leaving. I don't see these changes as being positive by any stretch of the imagination. I see this entirely as caving into the postmodern trends of society, and it really upsets me to see this happen to such a wonderful site.

What's not positive?

 

[wmc1982]

If Christian forums is to be run by members can we vote to have it back how it used to be??

No, just like we can't vote Erwin out. In reality, it's his website, and we accepted the fact that it could change or close at anytime when we joined.

 

[openup4christ]

No, just like we can't vote Erwin out. In reality, it's his website, and we accepted the fact that it could change or close at anytime when we joined.

I know you cant vote erwin out nor do i want to. I was just making a point.

 

[EdmundBlackadderTheThird]

Erwin,

First of all I want to thank you for the realization that CF needed drastic change. As you know this is my first post here in a long time and I am only posting because of the changes. I applaud the direction you are taking CF. I have some concerns though and I think that they valid. I know I will likely be shouted down by some who come from my side of the fence but that is not important right now.

I think you will quickly see that a consensus run site is harder to manage than you can imagine. Simple polls will lead to a tyranny of the majority and that is not good. You will find, as I have, that the business of trying to find consensus when the argument is even two sided is daunting but when four, five, or six viewpoints are presented it makes consensus next to impossible. This is the biggest problem you will face with the proposed changes. It will be hard to keep the site from being run by a tyranny of the majority whoever that may be at any given time. I will wait until the dust has settled a bit more and possibly make a suggestion that could help in that matter but I think that right now the static to noise ratio would drown it out.

Contrary to what many think the open forums will work wonderfully. You are right about the church aspect on that. Anyone can walk into a church and the church doesn't hold special services where the public isn't welcome (at least no church that I have ever attended) but that is where the analogy to the church ends. For the naysayers on this: You are sorely mistaken. Never once are we told to hide ourselves and our conversations from the world. Paul went to people and spoke on their level. He invited debate. He quoted their pagan philosophers. He was out there getting dirty. If you are so scared of the world then the problem isn't CF becoming open it is your own fear and you need to address that issue.

I, much like Bear, would like to see how an adherence to any creed chosen at any time makes one suitable to moderate a website. It just doesn't make sense. In the capacity Erwin describes the staff are not leaders but servants of the community. It is the way it should be. Those who seek to be first shall be last according to scripture and the placement of staff, by staff, as leaders, cops, police, anything but servants is very telling.

I applaud the openness Erwin. I think that there will be a very chaotic time while the old guard, members and staff, try to bully their way back into the comfort zone but the dust will settle and CF will be a better place for it.

I have more thoughts but for now those should suffice.

 

[RedTulipMom]

The entire site is the 'family'. Not good enough? Need your own separate 'family' within a 'family'? That sounds elitist and cliquish. I think that's part of the cultural change Erwin has in mind.....the elimination of elitist sub-cultures and cliques.

amen

 

[Leanna]

My way of looking at it is that Erwin isn't saying this site isn't to be Christian anymore, or that anyone who wants to claim they're a Christian is one. He's saying that it's not his place to tell someone they're not a Christian because only God can know that.

As to how the site is governed, it's hard to say at this point what is intended, but you don't have to agree with a rule to obey it or enforce it. While I don't personally agree that swearing is wrong, it would be wrong for me to do so at this site because I'm a participating member who agreed to follow the rules.

Mods have always been pretty lenient. You had to do/say something pretty out of line to get points. A warning meant nothing, so no one should base that on anything, they were just reminders.

Okay so hmmm it wasnt three warnings and you're out?

 

[GraceInHim]

And I have no problem with that Grace.

However, He never condoned sin. Ever. If you think he condoned sin - show me with scripture.

Never said he did

And when it was time, the word Christian was used.

think debating on this is still against roolz (if not mistaken) Make a thread in GT and we can discuss this further if you wish

It should mean something - not just any ole thing one creates

no one is creating anything.. opening doors to all on CF, even sinners is something Christ did.. learning THE WAY takes more time and maybe looking for a 1 lost sheep is better then sticking with the 99 jmho

 

[wmc1982]

I know you cant vote erwin out nor do i want to. I was just making a point.

I know. But no, things will never go back to the way they used to be.

 

[openup4christ]

Okay so hmmm it wasnt three warnings and you're out?

NO its three warning then its an infraction then once you get three in fractions you get a ban usally just for a month..... its not that bad

 

[GreenMunchkin]

If I misunderstood - I apologize.

I figure this discussion has sort of polarized opinions and muddied the water an awful lot, so it's easy to misunderstand one another.

I just don't think anyone is saying we shouldn't *all* be able to fellowship. The issue remains who is placed in a position of authority, and how they get there.

 

[livingword26]

Jesus never condoned sin - but then neither did he spurn the company of sinners.

But He did not do all of His teachings publicly either. Many times He and His disciples retreated to private places for prayer and teachings. Christians need Christian only fellowship sometimes. If it cannot be done here, then they will have to find another place to do it.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

One thing for sure the peacemakers would NOT rule.

 

[kiwimac]

Unfortunately I think we have seen his appreciation. But hey he holds no ill will if we leave. Yippee!!!!!

For what it is worth I won't be back, quite honestly the only reason I came here was for the Congregational fora and for what it is worth they are sufficiently being gutted.

Sorry that I will miss the free for all in OBOB though that could be fun.

Go ahead Ray sing with joy.

Why would I do that JT?

You and I don't always agree but I appreciate your POV. Stay, old son, we need you here.

 

[meant4worship]

Brothers and Sisters....

I came to Christian Forums just a few short months ago. There are still many areas of CF that I haven't visited. There are many nuances I haven't explored and much I do not know or understand of the workings of CF. I do not write the following words from a heart that has any CF agenda.

I do write from a heart of grief.... I've spent about a half hour reading Erwin's original post as well as flipping through pages of the posts that have followed. There is no way to read through every one.

Today is my birthday. I have experienced an incredible outpouring of love from my brothers and sisters on this forum. If it had not been for what I've experienced here, I really wouldn't have had much of a birthday. It's been amazing. So, I flip over to see what Erwin has envisioned for CF and what I read is backbiting and jealousy and distrust and murmuring.... we are the Christians who are to be salt and light????? If I were an unbeliever who had stumbled onto this thread I would run for the hills based on the display of emotion one against another in a forum where we are to love one another. I would say we have proven atheistic skeptics correct in their assumptions we are no different than the world....shame on us!!!!

When I first read Erwin's post, I was skeptical as to whether a new "open" forum could possibly work. Not because I feel I need to be protected. But because I fear that just what has happened in this thread will continue and nonbelievers who come for the answers to their questions might be rebuffed and never come into a saving knowledge of Jesus Christ.

Christ never intended for our churches, our houses of worship, our "Christian Forums" to be an escape route. If you're looking for peace and safety, Christianity isn't for you. We are to be a hospital for the sick. The last stop before someone spends an eternity in hell. And, as it pertains to believers, a place where we greet one another with psalms, hymns and spiritual songs as we live out our faith before a lost and dying world.

Erwin, I will continue in my support of CF. Brothers and Sisters, I love you and pray God will fill you with His conviction and a refreshed love one for another and for those He intends to bring to us for His purposes and glory!!!