A Freemason with Answers

[DCP 32° K.T]

Tell that to the masons Coil, and Duncan.

*******

My conjecture is that the "On" from Osiris is taken from his other name Onnophoris.

******

Very gnostic stuff.
Do your web searching folks. Onnophoris, OTO, gnostic church

Coil does not support your conjecture. He flatly states that the ritualist was wrong in claiming On as a name of deity rather than a city name. Onnophoris is a Greek corruption of Wennefer, the actual other name of Osiris, which latter name ALSO was corrupted from the Egyptian 'Asar.

As to Duncan, although agreeing that it was likely a deity of some sort, certainly does NOT say that this deity was Osiris. So, it would appear that neither Duncan nor Coil support your contention.

As to Gnostic stuff, regular Masonry does not apply. If you are speaking of O.T.O, however, you would be correct in that they have borrowed Gnostic themes. However, O.T.O. is not recognized by most Masons and their Grand Lodges as being regular Masonry. In many jurisdictions of Masonry, participation in O.T.O. activities can lead to expulsion from the Fraternity. So, once again, it does not apply, web searches notwithstanding. Nice try, though.

I have posted on the derivation of jahbulon and its various forms over in the Freemasonry and Witchcraft thread. I have looked over some old manuscripts of Masonic rituals and seem to have found a pattern. You see, jahbulon appears to derive from a later Hebrew phrase. That phrase, I believe, was yahab 'El 'on, which means 'God gave strength' or a related derivitive meaning, a fitting phrase to speak if you knew the context of where it was given in the earliest Royal Arch traditions passed down through the Rite of Perfection. The oldest rituals exposures and ritual manuscripts containing Royal Arch tradition I have seen have the word given differently than what appeared later to come into use in England. The form of the word is a password and is spelled jahabulon. The explanations came still later as a means to explain what had no explanation.

Thus, I believe yahab 'El 'on became jahabulon in France, which in turn became jaobulon in England, which in turn became jahbulon (which word has been dropped entirely from the rituals of our Constitution Brethren in England since about 1989), which word in turn became what is the current form used in Royal Arch Ritual, in America, today. Of course, I am under obligations not to give that current form except in the manner in which I received it (a bit of an impossibility on the web and in the presence of non Royal Arch Masons and non-Masons among the Royal Arch Masons!), so will end there.

 

[billmcelligott]

Kenny,

I have as usual visited all the sites you have referenced and have the following conclusions.

-------------

Dr Ezzahir

http://www.geocities.com/aliezzahir/index.htm

I am a past Principle in Royal Arch Chapter, I have never seen any of these words or symbols used.



This is lifted from the said site.

Behold when I come unto the children of Israel and shall say unto them, the God of your fathers hath sent me unto you and they shall say unto me, what is his Name? What shall I say unto them? And god said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM, that is I Am from eternity to eternity. The second, BUL, is an Assyrian word, signifying, Lord or Powerful;



it is also a compound Hebrew word from the preposition Beth, in or on, and Ul, Heaven or High; therefore this Word means, Lord in Heaven or on High. The third, ON, is a Egyptian word, signifying Father of all, It is a Hebrew word signifying strength or power, and is expressive of the omnipotence of the father of all, thereby expressing the Omnipotence of the Father of all, as in that well-known prayer, Our father, which art in Heaven; taken together they will read thus: I am and shall be, Lord in Heaven or on High, Father of all, the all powerful Jehovah, Jove or Lord.



The character which are placed on the angles of the triangle are Hebrew, and are particularly worthy of attention, the Aleph, answering to our A, the Beth to our B, and the Lamed to our L. Take the Aleph and the Beth- they form the word AB, which means Father. Take the Aleph and Lamed- they form the word AL, which means Word. Take the Lamed, the Aleph and the Beth- they form the word LAB, which means Spirit. Take the Beth, the Aleph and the Lamed- they form the word BAL, which means Lord. taken together they will read thus: Father-Lord, Word-Lord, Spirit-Lord.



Now Thad correct me if I have mistaken your reference but this seems to conclude for us that Rev Wayne is much closer to the explanation of the word Jahbulon than you have been, remember this is your reference source. It certainly shows that there is no inclination to exchange the deity for some new or invented new God. The entire essence of Masonry is founded on the Old Testament the stories of which have been expanded a little for cause and effect.

-----------------------

Then your next reference does a complete about turn?

http://members.tripod.com/crossbearer-brian/id28.htm

JAH BUL ON the Masonic replacement for the name Jesus Christ, is ANTICHRIST! Once again, the Mason is forbidden by oath, to evangelize his Mason "brothers" and proclaim Jesus Christ as Lord!



This is just a total fabrication. There is no section shown or in any Masonic literature that will support this. “that instructs a Mason to evangelize” about anything to anybody, this has just been slapped on the end of the text to make yet another leap of assumptions.

--------------------------

As your example shows the probable explanation from Dr. Oliver I thought you might like to learn more about him. And some facts on the origins of Masonry.

http://ncmason.org/york2/judaism%20and%20christianity2.htm



----------------------

Lets move on to the Albert Pike and Luciferian accusations, we might as well try to cover as mych as possible.

http://ncmason.org/book/stb_0693.htm

This site will give you a full and respectful report including the Theo Taxill hoax.

--------------------

Here we agree Ken, do your web searching folks, but surf with an open mind and have no pre conceived conclusions.

If you go out to the wood shed looking for wood, you will probably come back with some wood.

-------------------

Henry Wilson Coil as you mentioned him :

Henry Wilson Coil, in Coil's Encyclopedia of Freemasonry, (Macoy Publishing, Richmond, Virginia, 1961, revised edition 1995, pages 164-165) listed definitions of Freemasonry in different categories:

Definition of Freemasonry in all times and places

Freemasonry is an oath-bound fraternal order of men; deriving from the medieval fraternity of operative Freemasons; adhering to many of their Ancient Charges, laws, customs, and legends; loyal to the civil government under which it exists; inculcating moral and social virtues by symbolic application of the working tools of the stonemasons and by allegories, lectures, and charges; the members of which are obligated to observe principles of brotherly love, equality, mutual aid and assistance, secrecy, and confidence; have secret modes of recognizing one another as Masons when abroad in the world; and meet in lodges, each governed somewhat autocratically by a Master, assisted by Wardens, where petitioners, after particular enquiry into their mental, moral and physical qualifications, are formally admitted into the Society in secret ceremonies based in part on old legends of the Craft.



Definition of Freemasonry in its broadest sense:

Freemasonry, in its broadest and most comprehensive sense, is a system of morality and social ethics, and a philosophy of life, all of simple and fundamental character, incorporating a broad humanitarianism and, though treating life as a practical experience, subordinates the material to the spiritual; it is of no sect but finding truth in all; it is moral but not pharisaic; it demands sanity rather than sanctity; it is tolerant but not supine; it seeks truth but does not define truth; it urges it votaries to think but does not tell them what to think; it despises ignorance but does not proscribe the ignorant; it fosters education but proposes no curriculum; it espouses political liberty and the dignity of man but has no platform or propaganda; it believes in the nobility and usefulness of life; it is modest and not militant; it is moderate, universal, and so liberal as to permit each individual to form and express his own opinion, even as to what Freemasonry is or ought to be, and invites him to improve it if he can.

Sounds a little different when you look closer old Henry.

 

[JasonW]

Ah....yes, the old tried and true "You don't know until you get the Higher degrees" routine. Well, dear friend....I AM a 33rd degre mason and still a Christian. Trust me...no lucifer here.

 

[JasonW]

Just a quick comment on the issue of secrecy....

Well Serpent you don't communicate with people if you lock them out of the room.

I would prefer tp have an open door, to allow everyone in.

I would ask you to stop by Microsoft sometime and just waltz right into the Board of Directors meeting. No, no, no...I don't think that will happen. Do you complain that you can not get into the meetings there? Why is it different for Masonry?

 

[O.F.F.]

To Whom if May Concern:

If you are interested in what Freemasonry is about from the perspective of former Masons who have "been there and done it" please go to the following link. Afterwards, I would be happy to answer any questions you may have from our point-of-view.

Freemasonry 101

 

[billmcelligott]

Just a quick comment on the issue of secrecy....



I would ask you to stop by Microsoft sometime and just waltz right into the Board of Directors meeting. No, no, no...I don't think that will happen. Do you complain that you can not get into the meetings there? Why is it different for Masonry?

Its no different at all, I just would like Freemasonry to be transparent. Its a personal thing. But until someone changes the rules it stays as it is.

I'm merely a past Master in Craft and Chapter, and there ain't no Lucifer here either.

 

[billmcelligott]

To Whom if May Concern:

If you are interested in what Freemasonry is about from the perspective of former Masons who have "been there and done it" please go to the following link. Afterwards, I would be happy to answer any questions you may have from our point-of-view.

If you are interested in what Freemasonry is about from the perspective of Mason who has "been there and is still doing it" please just ask.

 

[Ibrahim]

Masonry is the enemy to Righteous Muslims,christians, jews and all three must be aware of their true satanic religion and their history that dates bck t the opening slaughter at jerusalem in the time of the first crusade. In the Qur'an and Hadith it talks explicitly about the one eyed order that will come with lies and deciet to corrupt the hearts of men and turn them away from the Christ. Christians, we are in this together..... when the great war begins Allah tells us that the righteous christians left on this world will unite and all the beleivers will stand side by side to defeat this tide of the heathenistic cult that will win over the minds of millions of non chrsitian/muslims and that the state of israel and it's people will be it's closest ally and most loyal of servants. This is all from the Quran that came 1500 years ago. Wallahi (i swear by God)

 

[billmcelligott]

Now thats a twist Ibrahaim,

I spend a great deal of time convinving people that masonry is not a religion. you will find much on this board on the subject. It is no more Christian tahn Muslim and no more Hindu than Jewish.

This is from every Grand Lodge in the world.

 

[Nihilist Comedian]

Tell me, why does one become a freemason? What benefits can be gained that cannot be found elsewhere? Why should one live as a Freemason and not a human being? Tell me some famous intellectuals who were Freemasons, I shall research your claims and then we can see if I'm impressed.

Unless there's sombody in the list with an IQ of 185 or higher, I wont be convinced.

 

[Allahu-Akbar]

May I please ask why it is when I arrive on a Christian based forum I am welcomed.

I offer to give out information, as far as I am able to anyone that may be interested in Freemasonry, good or bad, in their opinion.

I am not an advocate for the recruitment of Freemasons I just want to see the public get the correct information.

Every time I put ouy my stall and say does anyone wants to know about Masonry, just ask. I get a terrific response. This means that people, Christian people, are interested in the subject. It matters not if you agree or disagree but there is an interest.

We just had a lively interaction on Masonry which went to 45 pages and it has been closed. This is the second thread on this fourm. Now I was told it was in the wrong section, well it could have been moved as have other threads.

So can someone please explain why do Christian forums find this a threat.

Now I do not want anyone to think this does not happen the other way round, it does. On some Masonic forums I have started a similar question on Christianity and Masonry. If I remeber correctly it had 1,000 replies in two weeks and it was closed.

What I find hard to understand is why Christains and Masons find it hard to communicate, throughout the western world they mostly attend the same Churches?

Why don't I just give them the Info about Freemasons? Ok Tell me this Why did napolean wanted to kick the freemasons out of france?

 

[Rev Wayne]

Tell me, why does one become a freemason?

Why indeed? Why does one become a member of any charitable organization? The reasons are as varied as the individuals who might answer that question.

What benefits can be gained that cannot be found elsewhere?

That's a tough one, I can't say I can think of any at all. Of course, the same goes for reasons not to join, I can't think of any at all.

Why should one live as a Freemason and not a human being?

I have no idea. As for myself, I do both.

Tell me some famous intellectuals who were Freemasons, I shall research your claims and then we can see if I'm impressed.

And after that, we can see if anyone is impressed with whether or not you're impressed.

Unless there's sombody in the list with an IQ of 185 or higher, I wont be convinced.

Maybe you never checked the Masonic population worldwide, it is 6 million by most counts.

Check the population of people gifted with 180 IQ and it is a small number indeed. In the UK, with 60 million people there are an estimated 60 with 180 IQ. In other words, one in a million.

Figure up the world population of 6 billion and calculate again. Figuring one in a million at 180 IQ, and doing the math of 1,000 millions in every billion, that adds up to 6,000 people worldwide who have an IQ that high. Taking the one in a million figure again and applying it to Masons worldwide, there would only be about 6 Masons around the world who would be expected to have an IQ so high.

Now tell me, exactly why would anyone place restrictions on Masonry 1,000 times stricter than what would be expected from the general population?

http://www.star.qmul.ac.uk/~rmh/gbellcurve.html

 

[DrFate]

Happy Resurection Day. Yahsuah arose from the grave and had a fish dinner.
I hope he had wine also.
Hail ASNTA.

 

[DrFate]

Jah Baal On? Baal was also used by the Hebrews as a substitute for the name of God YHVH. It means Lord or Master.

What I like is, if you want to play word games, Ja Bul On is spoken by three men in a circle. If you listen to the sequence it changes.

Jabullon,
onjabull,
or my favorite, BullOnJa.
Bullonja with mustard and mayo please.

 

[DrFate]

Tell me, why does one become a freemason? What benefits can be gained that cannot be found elsewhere? Why should one live as a Freemason and not a human being? Tell me some famous intellectuals who were Freemasons, I shall research your claims and then we can see if I'm impressed.

Unless there's sombody in the list with an IQ of 185 or higher, I wont be convinced.

Can you identify any of the famous freemasons in my avatar?
Here is a website with huge numbers of people who are famous freemasons"
http://www.masonicinfo.com/famous.htm

What do you get. I think you get free auto service and reduced rates at the Roadway Inns.

Oh and don't forget about the chickiepoos. The girls go crazy for a Fez wearing man.

 

[morningstar2651]

I have a question about symbolism. How many stairs should the cochleus (Winding Stairs) have and what is the importance of the number of stairs?

 

[Rev Wayne]

I have a question about symbolism. How many stairs should the cochleus (Winding Stairs) have and what is the importance of the number of stairs?

The number of the stairs is described as "three, five, and seven." In the drawings I have seen of it, that is exactly how it is depicted, three sets of steps with a landing above each. I understand the symbolism to be that it represents the medieval educational idea that there were Seven Liberal Arts and Sciences. Some have pointed out more than that number of the actual topics of study, but the number is symbolic, suggesting it is all-encompassing. The fact that the stairs "wind" shows a call to discipline, representing the upward climb of life, and the need for courage, strength, and faith. Equally symbolic of life is the fact that the end of the destination is the Master, where the Fellowcraft receives his wages.

 

[ravenscape]

How did some Masonic traditions and Gnosticism become intertwined? Is it only Scottish Rite and some forms of French Freemasonry that have Gnostic leanings?

 

[Rev Wayne]

Well, first of all, to offer an answer to the question, I would have to agree that your premise is true, which I don't. There were, however, Jewish Kabbalistic influences that were introduced into Freemasonry shortly after the formation of the United Grand Lodge of England. I don't profess to be knowledgeable to any degree on either of them, but as I understand it, the basics are similar. But as I understand the Incarnation and as I understand Gnosticism or Kabbalism, one of the main tenets seen as a "similarity" to Christianity is in reality very dissimilar. I don't think the idea as I see it expressed, particularly in Gnosticism, comes anywhere near to a Christian doctrine of the Incarnation. I am certain no card-carrying Gnostic would agree to a divine Jesus, there is a dualism present in Gnostic thinking that prevents that. And no informed Christian would agree with a Gnostic way of describing God taking residence in the human soul. The Gnostics, I believe, have more of a pantheistic take on it, and view all of us as connected because "God is in us." Christian teaching has that inner residence as the result of a Savior dying on a cross for the sins of humanity before indwelling takes place.

What does that have to do with Freemasonry? I honestly don't know. I make no pretence to being able to set aside my Christian beliefs and put on a Freemason's mantle. I was Christian first, I am Christian still, and actually a traditional virgin birth, inspired Word, born again, Jesus-only, Spirit-filled believer serving a bodily-resurrected and coming-again Lord. Most of the questions about Gnosticism/Kabbalism I leave to those more informed--and more interested.

As for Scottish Rite, I don't know. I've only been the basic three degrees, when I do advance, I plan to take the Christian path of York Rite. As for the French, all I can say is, they were more welcoming of the off-beat stuff, and I think it speaks for itself that the influences came in the strongest at the point they decided that it was no longer necessary to insist on a belief in God as a prerequisite for membership. From there, one can pretty well do the math. I think the English brethren were correct at that point to distance themselves from the French brethren.

 

[DrFate]

How did some Masonic traditions and Gnosticism become intertwined? Is it only Scottish Rite and some forms of French Freemasonry that have Gnostic leanings?

Freemasonry is a very diverse international interfaith Fraternity. The branches do not always agree with each other. When I was in the UK some of the Freemasons I met there said that they had nothing to do with the "Moderns" whoever they are.