A conversation about unity.

[RileyG]

No, it doesn't tell anything. Most of us still confess the catholic church, just not the Roman Catholic church.

When one says Roman Catholic Church, it very much includes those Eastern Catholics who are in full communion with the Pope.

The Catholic Church is made up of 24 particular Churches, 1 is just Roman aka Latin rite.

And yes, I’m aware small c catholic means the universal Church many Christians profess in the Apostle and Nicene creeds.

 

[RileyG]

It does guarantees survival because His Church is still around.

Amen!

 

[RileyG]

The term church refers, in its primary theological sense, to the community of Christian believers united in faith and sacramental life, and secondarily to the physical building designated for public worship. Etymologically, church derives from the Old English cirice, itself rooted in the West Germanic kirika, which was borrowed from the Greek kyriakē (κυριακή), meaning “of the Lord” or “belonging to the Lord,” a feminine adjective formed from kyrios (κύριος), “Lord.” This term originally denoted the “Lord’s house” (kyriakē oikia) and was adopted into early Christian usage to describe both the liturgical assembly and the sacred space in which it gathered. The semantic evolution reflects both ecclesiological and architectural dimensions of Christian tradition.

Yes. The Greek word is eclesia which refers to the community of believers, not only the building itself.

Well said.

 

[Hentenza]

Funny, all who have separated from His Church refer to themselves under a different name than the "Catholic Church", the name first used for His Church at the turn of the first century. Sort of tells you something, they are something different than His Church

Nah. Katholithos meant the church universal (adjective) not Catholic (noun) Church. The term was first used to describe the early, universal Christian Church and appears in the Nicene Creed as a mark of the Church's worldwide, all-embracing nature, rather than referring specifically to the Roman Catholic Church. All early churches were independent churches ran by their own bishop. Your church usurped power as the church in Rome, the capital of the Roman Empire, began to gain power, particularly after Constantine.

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

No, it doesn't tell anything. Most of us still confess the catholic church, just not the Roman Catholic church.

Most of us rarely mention Protestant denominations because we rarely have any reason to do so.

One is bound to acknowledge that the Catholic Church, founded by Christ and perpetuated through apostolic succession, is not a denomination among many, but the one, holy, catholic, and apostolic Church, outside of which there is no ordinary means of salvation (cf. Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus, Lateran IV, 1215; Dominus Iesus, 2000). The term "Roman Catholic" is a misnomer when applied to the universal Church, for she is not a regional sect but the Mystical Body of Christ, governed by the Successor of Peter and possessing the fullness of truth and sacramental grace. Ecumenism, properly understood, does not imply doctrinal compromise nor parity among ecclesial communities, but rather the call to restore unity by drawing separated brethren into full communion with the Church Christ Himself established (cf. Unitatis Redintegratio, §3; Lumen Gentium, §8). The Church recognises that elements of sanctification and truth exist outside her visible structure, yet these are ordered towards Catholic unity and derive their efficacy from her own plenitude (cf. Catechism of the Catholic Church, §819).

One ought not be deceived by sentimental appeals to “diversity” that obscure the gravity of schism and heresy. The Second Vatican Council, while initiating a pastoral openness to dialogue, did not revoke the dogmatic claims of the Church nor dilute her divine constitution. Ecumenism is grounded in Christ’s prayer “that they may all be one” (John 17:21), but this unity is not a vague spiritual fellowship—it is visible, hierarchical, and sacramental, centred on the Eucharist and governed by the Petrine office (cf. Ut Unum Sint, §20–23). The Church does not seek mutual recognition of doctrinal error, but conversion to the truth. Protestant communities, though often sincere, lack valid sacraments (save baptism) and apostolic succession, and thus cannot be considered churches in the proper sense (cf. Dominus Iesus, §17). One is called, therefore, not to relativise truth, but to labour for the return of all Christians to the one fold under the one Shepherd.

 

[concretecamper]

No, it doesn't tell anything. Most of us still confess the catholic church, just not the Roman Catholic church.

I guess these days a man can confess he is a woman, a woman can confess she is a cat, and non Catholics can confess they are Catholic. Welcome to the 21st century

 

[RileyG]

Nah. Katholithos meant the church universal (adjective) not Catholic (noun) Church. The term was first used to describe the early, universal Christian Church and appears in the Nicene Creed as a mark of the Church's worldwide, all-embracing nature, rather than referring specifically to the Roman Catholic Church. All early churches were independent churches ran by their own bishop. Your church usurped power as the church in Rome, the capital of the Roman Empire, began to gain power, particularly after Constantine.

There were five seats of bishops in early Christianity. Rome, Alexandria, Jerusalem, Antioch, and Constantinople.

They were all in union until the Great Schism of 1054 when the Western Pope and Eastern Patriarch of Constantinople excommunicated one another from each other Churches.

There was always a bishop in Rome, long before Constantine.

 

[public hermit]

Most of us rarely mention Protestant denominations because we rarely have any reason to do so.

One is bound to acknowledge that the Catholic Church, founded by Christ and perpetuated through apostolic succession, is not a denomination among many, but the one, holy, catholic, and apostolic Church, outside of which there is no ordinary means of salvation (cf. Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus, Lateran IV, 1215; Dominus Iesus, 2000). The term "Roman Catholic" is a misnomer when applied to the universal Church, for she is not a regional sect but the Mystical Body of Christ, governed by the Successor of Peter and possessing the fullness of truth and sacramental grace. Ecumenism, properly understood, does not imply doctrinal compromise nor parity among ecclesial communities, but rather the call to restore unity by drawing separated brethren into full communion with the Church Christ Himself established (cf. Unitatis Redintegratio, §3; Lumen Gentium, §8). The Church recognises that elements of sanctification and truth exist outside her visible structure, yet these are ordered towards Catholic unity and derive their efficacy from her own plenitude (cf. Catechism of the Catholic Church, §819).

One ought not be deceived by sentimental appeals to “diversity” that obscure the gravity of schism and heresy. The Second Vatican Council, while initiating a pastoral openness to dialogue, did not revoke the dogmatic claims of the Church nor dilute her divine constitution. Ecumenism is grounded in Christ’s prayer “that they may all be one” (John 17:21), but this unity is not a vague spiritual fellowship—it is visible, hierarchical, and sacramental, centred on the Eucharist and governed by the Petrine office (cf. Ut Unum Sint, §20–23). The Church does not seek mutual recognition of doctrinal error, but conversion to the truth. Protestant communities, though often sincere, lack valid sacraments (save baptism) and apostolic succession, and thus cannot be considered churches in the proper sense (cf. Dominus Iesus, §17). Thou art called, therefore, not to relativise truth, but to labour for the return of all Christians to the one fold under the one Shepherd.

So your thread about unity is really about denigrating those not of your particular denomination. Understood.

 

[RileyG]

I guess these days a man can confess he is a woman, a woman can confess she is a cat, and non Catholics can confess they are Catholic. Welcome to the 21st century

Interesting note. The official name of the Eastern Orthodox Church is the Orthodox Catholic Church and they refer to themselves as one, holy, Catholic, and apostolic church.

It’s also semantics.

Baptists aren’t the only ones who baptize.

Episcopalians aren’t the only ones with bishops

Etc

 

[concretecamper]

Nah. Katholithos meant the church universal (adjective) not Catholic (noun) Church. The term was first used to describe the early, universal Christian Church and appears in the Nicene Creed as a mark of the Church's worldwide, all-embracing nature, rather than referring specifically to the Roman Catholic Church. All early churches were independent churches ran by their own bishop. Your church usurped power as the church in Rome, the capital of the Roman Empire, began to gain power, particularly after Constantine.

Thank you for proving my point, of the list that I responded too, only ONE is named Catholic

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

So your thread about unity is really about denigrating those not of your particular denomination. Understood.

Absolutely and positively not. It is not I who raised the alleged errors either of others or of the Catholic Church.

 

[public hermit]

I guess these days a man can confess he is a woman, a woman can confess she is a cat, and non Catholics can confess they are Catholic. Welcome to the 21st century

You couldn't be more dismissive of your fellow Christians, could you?

It's sad to see this, but it's not surprising.

 

[RileyG]

Thank you for proving my point, of the list that I responded too, only ONE is named Catholic

Only uppercase Catholic refers to the Church of Rome.

Churches such as Old Catholic Church, Ecumenical Catholic Church, Liberal Catholic Church, Polish National Catholic Church and American Catholic Church aren’t part of the RCC. Even though they have “Catholic” in their name.

 

[Hentenza]

Thank you for proving my point, of the list that I responded too, only ONE is named Catholic

Comprehension? Hint: It is not your church.

 

[concretecamper]

Baptists aren’t the only ones who baptize.

Baptists have believers baptism, not water baptism for the forgiveness of sins.

Episcopalians aren’t the only ones with bishops

Episcopalians don't have a valid priesthood and therefore don't have a valid bishopric

 

[RileyG]

Baptists have believers baptism, not water baptism for the forgiveness of sins.

Episcopalians don't have a valid priesthood and therefore don't have a valid bishopric

I’m aware, according to our Catholic beliefs.

 

[concretecamper]

Comprehension? Hint: It is not your church.

Precisely, it is His Church

 

[concretecamper]

I’m aware, according to our Catholic beliefs.

According to His Church's teaching

 

[RileyG]

According to His Church's teaching

Yes. I’m in agreement with you because I accept what the RCC teaches.

 

[Hentenza]

Absolutely and positively not. It is not I who raised the alleged errors either of others or of the Catholic Church.

It was me who raised the point about closed communion to address the unity issue among some churches including yours. This was on topic to the thread. However you’ve been tooting your horn since the OP so any comment not consistent with your opinion has been met with hostility. So as long as we toe the line all is well. (Not).