,

[OldWiseGuy]

No they don't, they push the cost onto the insurance companies and those who can afford insurance.

True. So I am indirectly paying their bills as I can afford the insurance. Do I get credit for that ( I asked this question some years ago)? All I heard back was .....crickets.

 

[joshua 1 9]

He mentioned how the rich build hospitals, but failed to mention that they make you pay for it.

Maybe the rich that made their money off of WW1. After WW2 we had to work hard to try to maintain what they built after the first war. Now everyone wants to tear it down and put up a new building. Now it is more fashionable for the rich like Oprah and Hillary to build schools for young girls in Africa. They do not much invest in poor in this country. We do not see them down in Louisiana helping anyone there. We did not see them in New Orleans after Katrina. If texas has not sent a bus to help them they would have died in that stadium. All Bush cared about was law and order and Obama struggles with it but he is not willing to give much in the way of humanitarian aid either.

 

[W2L]

Big buildings create lots of money for lots of people, and for a long time. If you wish I still have all my expense records from 18 years of owning my apartment building. I could scan a page or two for you to peruse.

An apartment building isn't a mansion.

 

[W2L]

True. So I am indirectly paying their bills as I can afford the insurance. Do I get credit for that ( I asked this question some years ago)? All I heard back was .....crickets.

Poor people struggle to buy insurance as well. Not to mention you are forgetting we were talking about the righteous act of building hospitals, and then charging people to use it. It seems like the patients using the hospital pay for it in the end. Also, thatbrian is the one who brought this up. Does he support government assistance on HC? Do you? If not then why the boasting about building Hospitals?

 

[W2L]

Maybe the rich that made their money off of WW1. After WW2 we had to work hard to try to maintain what they built after the first war. Now everyone wants to tear it down and put up a new building. Now it is more fashionable for the rich like Oprah and Hillary to build schools for young girls in Africa. They do not much invest in poor in this country. We do not see them down in Louisiana helping anyone there. We did not see them in New Orleans after Katrina. If texas has not sent a bus to help them they would have died in that stadium. All Bush cared about was law and order and Obama struggles with it but he is not willing to give much in the way of humanitarian aid either.

I'm not preaching politics. I'm actually preaching love. I take no sides in politics and don't think any Christian should. I just don't see the wisdom in preaching against help for the poor, even if the government does it with our tax dollars. I don't promote it, but I don't stand in the way either. Everything I stand for is about love and unity within the church. Its also about being separate from the world and government.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Poor people struggle to buy insurance as well. Not to mention you are forgetting we were talking about the righteous act of building hospitals, and then charging people to use it. It seems like the patients using the hospital pay for it in the end. Also, thatbrian is the one who brought this up. Does he support government assistance on HC? Do you? If not then why the boasting about building Hospitals?

To the point. Uncollectable bills, and charity care, are dead-losses for hospitals. Only not-for-profit hospitals receive make-up subsidies for such losses. For-profit hospitals do raise their fees to try recover these losses but they still incur these losses as they can't raise fees too high in a competitive market.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

An apartment building isn't a mansion.

The principle is the same regardless of the size or use of the building. They produce lots of money, jobs, and value in the community. Owning a fine home doesn't cause another to live in a shack.

 

[W2L]

To the point. Uncollectable bills, and charity care, are dead-losses for hospitals. Only not-for-profit hospitals receive make-up subsidies for such losses. For-profit hospitals do raise their fees to try recover these losses but they still incur these losses as they can't raise fees too high in a competitive market.

Yes, but most hospitals are for profit. The poor still get overburdened with insurance costs, so the Hospital is not exactly doing the work of the Gospel. The hospital makes the patients pay for the hospital, That's not an example of love but profit.

Answer the question I asked, please. Do you appose government assistance for HC? Does thatbrian, who brought up hospitals, does he appose government assistance for HC?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

.

 

[W2L]

The principle is the same regardless of the size or use of the building. They produce lots of money, jobs, and value in the community. Owning a fine home doesn't cause another to live in a shack.

Not all landlords get rich. I once dreamed of being a landlord. I started to learn construction and maintenance for that reason. Back then though I wasn't the same person I am now. If I was a landlord I would help people buy houses. I would love to do good for people. It would greatly edify my soul to walk in love like that. However, I'm not able to even help myself now. All I have is my zeal and words. Its all I have to give.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Yes, but most hospitals are for profit. The poor still get overburdened with insurance costs, so the Hospital is not exactly doing the work of the Gospel. The hospital makes the patients pay for the hospital, That's not an example of love but profit.

Answer the question I asked, please. Do you appose government assistance for HC? Does thatbrian, who brought up hospitals, does he appose government assistance for HC?

But what does a secular enterprise like health care have to do with your argument about divisions within the church?

 

[jimmyjimmy]

,

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Not all landlords get rich. I once dreamed of being a landlord. I started to learn construction and maintenance for that reason. Back then though I wasn't the same person I am now. If I was a landlord I would help people buy houses. I would love to do good for people. It would greatly edify my soul to walk in love like that. However, I'm not able to even help myself now. All I have is my zeal and words. Its all I have to give.

I had a hunch that's where you were coming from in all this (been there, done that). Are you getting enough help with your problems?

 

[W2L]

But what does a secular enterprise like health care have to do with your argument about divisions within the church?

I knew that was coming. I was waiting for it. You guys are the ones boasting in the Rich being so generous by building hospitals. I just responded to that. You tell me what the answer is. Why do you boast about hospitals but appose HC assistance? If helping the poor is your goal then why stand in the way if the government wants to help?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

And charge rest of us double to make up for the loss.

We "give" to the poor constantly. Some of it is done by the government taking it from us, at gunpoint; some is done without our knowledge, like the hospital bill, and some is done by us voluntarily.

I don't begrudge this as I am in pretty good shape financially and I have great health insurance. I just wish the government would be more responsible with my money (although I can rationalize that as well).

 

[W2L]

And charge rest of us double to make up for the loss.

We "give" to the poor constantly. Some of it is done by the government taking it from us, at gunpoint; some is done without our knowledge, like the hospital bill, and some is done by us voluntarily.

You were the one boasting about how the rich are generous to build hospitals. Why are you complaining that it costs you so much to get HC then? Was the hospital only built for those who can afford it? Is that an act of righteous love which you boasted about?

 

[W2L]

I had a hunch that's where you were coming from in all this (been there, done that). Are you getting enough help with your problems?

Not really, but I persevere. This isn't about me though, I should have kept that to myself. Lets not derail the subject over me. I'm irrelevant.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

I knew that was coming. I was waiting for it. You guys are the ones boasting in the Rich being so generous by building hospitals. I just responded to that. You tell me what the answer is. Why do you boast about hospitals but appose HC assistance? If helping the poor is your goal then why stand in the way if the government wants to help?

I don't oppose HC assistance for the poor. My insurance premiums are inflated to help pay for this. But you seem to be saying that instead of building hospitals we should spend the money on health care for the poor. How would we provide health care without hospitals?

 

[jimmyjimmy]

,

 

[joshua 1 9]

Everything I stand for is about love and unity within the church. Its also about being separate from the world and government.

The Amish claim to be separated from the world. Still they pick and choose what they want and what they do not want just like everyone else.