7 year tribulation? Where is it in the Bible?

[Diamond7]

Where does the Bible say anything about a seven year tribulation. From what I understand this is a time when the Church will be removed so that God can pour out His wrath on the world.

 

[The Hour IS AT HAND]

Seems to me like we will be called up at the last trumpet.

1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

Neither can we make the mistake that Revelations is written in chronological order.
So I dont rightly know when we are called up in relation to the tribulation.

Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
Rev 11:16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
Rev 11:17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
Rev 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

I think its a mistake to say we wont be on the earth for any part of the tribulation, because whose getting their head cut off then? Revelation 20:4
Dan 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
Dan 9:25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
Dan 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
Dan 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

 

[Douggg]

Where does the Bible say anything about a seven year tribulation. From what I understand this is a time when the Church will be removed so that God can pour out His wrath on the world.

There is no "seven year tribulation" in the bible. I think where that phrase got its start is from believers in a pre-trib rapture - which is actually a mis-nomer. What is really meant is pre-70th week.

So rather than just admitting the misnomer - the leading teachers of the pre-trib rapture chose to call the 70th week - "the tribulation".

The rapture may indeed happen pre-70th week. But the term pre-trib needs to be changed to pre-70th week, and stop with "the tribulation" teaching - as a big initial part of the 70th week will not be tribulation, but a false messianic age instead which the world will be saying "peace and safety".

 

[Ivan Hlavanda]

Where does the Bible say anything about a seven year tribulation. From what I understand this is a time when the Church will be removed so that God can pour out His wrath on the world.

Daniel 9:27 reveals Antichrist's covenant with Israel will be for seven years, but in the middle of this week (3 ½ years into the tribulation), Antichrist will break the covenant, putting a stop to the Jewish sacrifices.
Isaiah 28:15 speaks of this covenant also 'Because you have said, “We have made a covenant with death,
and with Sheol we have an agreement'

Revelation 13:5 says that this will go on for 42 months, which is 3 ½ years (the second half of the tribulation). So, we see a covenant lasting to the middle of the “week” (Daniel 9:27) and the beast who made the covenant demanding worship for 42 months (Revelation 13:5). Therefore, the total length of time is 84 months or seven years.

Also compare Daniel 12:11 with Revelation 12:6
And from the time that the regular burnt offering is taken away and the abomination that makes desolate is set up, there shall be 1,290 days. 12 Blessed is he who waits and arrives at the 1,335 days. 13 But go your way till the end. And you shall rest and shall stand in your allotted place at the end of the days.”

6 and the woman fled into the wilderness, where she has a place prepared by God, in which she is to be nourished for 1,260 days

1290 days speaks of the second half of the tribulation (1290 days is 3.5 years)

The woman in rev 12 6 is Israel

 

[Ivan Hlavanda]

I think its a mistake to say we wont be on the earth for any part of the tribulation, because whose getting their head cut off then?

Those who are left behind after rapture of the Church and they repent and resist the Antichrist. They will be all killed. They'll be saved in the great Tribulation.

Rapture also must happen before the Great Tribulation, because during it, God will pour His wrath on the inhabitants of the Earth, but born again Christians were judged in Christ who took God's wrath for their sins thus satisfying God's just.

I also believe the revelation being written in chronological order. Chapter 2 and 3 describe the Church age, then rapture happens and the timeline from chapter 4 starts, and right almost unil the end, the next 7 years are described. The events on Earth and Heaven are described pararerly. While the Antichrist reigns on Earth, the Church is in Heaven. Notice from chapter 4 the language changes to OT, we now have the temple etc.
The 24 elders in Heaven represt the Church. 12 in the Bible means fulness, 2 means absolute. 24 means absolute fulness, thus the 24 represent the Church

 

[The Hour IS AT HAND]

How could this be in chronological order?

(Refering to the 7th trumpet)
Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

2 chapters later
Rev 13:6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

As well as...
Rev 16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
Rev 16:18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.
Rev 16:19 And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.

And then...
Rev 18:16 And saying, Alas, alas, that great city, that was clothed in fine linen, and purple, and scarlet, and decked with gold, and precious stones, and pearls!
Rev 18:17 For in one hour so great riches is come to nought. And every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off,
Rev 18:18 And cried when they saw the smoke of her burning, saying, What city is like unto this great city!
Rev 18:19 And they cast dust on their heads, and cried, weeping and wailing, saying, Alas, alas, that great city, wherein were made rich all that had ships in the sea by reason of her costliness! for in one hour is she made desolate.
Rev 18:20 Rejoice over her, thou heaven, and ye holy apostles and prophets; for God hath avenged you on her.
Rev 18:21 And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all.

Also...
Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Followed by...
Rev 22:6 And he said unto me, These sayings are faithful and true: and the Lord God of the holy prophets sent his angel to shew unto his servants the things which must shortly be done.
Rev 22:7 Behold, I come quickly: blessed is he that keepeth the sayings of the prophecy of this book.
Rev 22:8 And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which shewed me these things.

 

[anetazo]

Revelation chapter 9 . Time of tribulation of antichrist is shortened to 5 month period.

 

[RandyPNW]

Seems to me like we will be called up at the last trumpet.

1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

Neither can we make the mistake that Revelations is written in chronological order.
So I dont rightly know when we are called up in relation to the tribulation.

Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
Rev 11:16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
Rev 11:17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
Rev 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

I think its a mistake to say we wont be on the earth for any part of the tribulation, because whose getting their head cut off then? Revelation 20:4
Dan 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
Dan 9:25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
Dan 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
Dan 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

My own view is Postrib. The book of Revelation has repeat visions of Christ returning, showing several facets of this event. He doesn't come several times--the book just shows the same event from different points of view.

Yes, Christians die under the reign of the Beast, whose power may reside in Europe. He will be worshiped everywhere, but his empire is in Europe, the outgrowth of the 4th Kingdom of Dan 2 and Dan 7. That would be the Roman Empire, which evolved in Europe today.

So we are told in Dan 7 that Antichrist will reign for only 3.5 years, and this is repeated in Dan 12. This is not to be confused with another 3.5 year period associated with Antiochus 4, also mentioned in Dan 12. The two events seem to be linked for purposes of comparison.

The 7 year period comes from a false interpretation of Daniel's 70th Week in Dan 9. Those who interpret it this way cut off the 70th Week from the previous 69 Weeks, and apply it disjointed from the 69 consecutive Weeks. Of course, this is absurd. If the 70th Week is separated from the previous 69 Weeks, it no longer is the 70th Week!

So we only have a 3.5 year reign of Antichrist, persecuting the Church. And Christ comes back sometime *after* the 3.5 years. I think there will be an unknown number of days extending beyond the 3.5 years of Antichrist's reign. That will be the time the nations are mobilized to Armageddon, and Antichrist loses his world dominion to a world-wise uprising against him. At least, that's how I picture it. Others see it differently, but this is my two cents' worth.

 

[Douggg]

My own view is Postrib.

Randy, go here and custom title your screen-name information to say "Posttrib". The how to instructions are in post 9 of that thread.

I think it would help....

in our discussions, if everyone would put in their forum member display information their eschatological view point - i.e. futurist, historicist, partial preterist, idealist. See my description of myself to the left - as being a futurist, for example. Jerryhuerta shows himself as a...

www.christianforums.com

 

[eleos1954]

Where does the Bible say anything about a seven year tribulation. From what I understand this is a time when the Church will be removed so that God can pour out His wrath on the world.

Some believe the saved won't go through the great tribulation (the 7 plagues in Revelation) ... it
is the "secret rapture" idea.

I do not find this to be so ... the time of tribulation will be cut short ... but there will be some that do indeed go through it.

Mark 13

19For those will be days of tribulation unmatched from the beginning of God’s creation until now, and never to be seen again. 20 If the Lord had not cut short those days, nobody would be saved. But for the sake of the elect, whom He has chosen, He has cut them short. 21At that time if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There He is!’ do not believe it.…

 

[Jamdoc]

Where does the Bible say anything about a seven year tribulation. From what I understand this is a time when the Church will be removed so that God can pour out His wrath on the world.

"7 year tribulation" is unbiblical. What Jesus taught was there would be great tribulation after the abomination of desolation (Matthew 24:15-21).
No length of time is given in that passage but people connect it with the 'time, times, and half a time" in Daniel, and the 1260 days/42 months in Revelation.

But even then, it is 3.5 years, not 7. 7 is fabricated in order to back up pretribulationism. They declare the entire 70th week of Daniel as the wrath of God and "the Tribulation" (which they consider synonymous but in no place in the bible is that ever established) in order to make a case that of course God would remove the church for the entire duration of the 70th week. That however is also not biblical.

Furthermore, it's unbiblical to claim that Jesus said the elect would be taken away before great tribulation. Rather Jesus gave instructions regarding it, and warnings, but also promised to cut those days short.

Some people assume that Jesus meant if the days were let go on indefinitely it'd wipe out all life, and limiting it to 42 months is cutting it short.
However, Jesus said no man knows the day or hour of His return, but if people have the date of the abomination of desolation, they can calculate out 1260 days, and find the day if that was the case.
But... if Jesus meant that all the believers would die to persecution unless the 42 months was cut short, and for the elect, the 42 months will be cut short, with 0 clue on how short they will be cut.. now we have a totally unknown date, that fits with Paul's teachings in 2 Thessalonians 2, that that day wouldn't happen until apostasy and the antichrist would be revealed (at the abomination of desolation), and after those 2 events the return of Jesus becomes imminent.
So ultimately great tribulation then has no specific length of time.it could be 1259 days, it could be 10 days, it could be 2 years etc.

 

[Douggg]

So ultimately great tribulation then has no specific length of time.it could be 1259 days, it could be 10 days, it could be 2 years etc.

Daniel 12:11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

1335 days.

 

[Jamdoc]

Daniel 12:11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

1335 days.

the great tribulation starts after the abomination of desolation, and Revelation gives the beast 42 months, 1260 days, which is longer than the 1290
so I've thought maybe the 1290 was to be the first "half" and the 1260 the second.

but anyway, if you could calculate the date from revealed scripture then Jesus wouldn't be able to declare that no man knew the day or hour, not even Himself, only the Father.

 

[Douggg]

the great tribulation starts after the abomination of desolation, and Revelation gives the beast 42 months, 1260 days, which is longer than the 1290
so I've thought maybe the 1290 was to be the first "half" and the 1260 the second.

The big question with verses 11 and 12 is 1290 days.... to what ?

I have concluded 1290 days to when the world sees the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. In the 45 remaining, the kings of the earth will assemble their armies with the intent to make war on Jesus.

 

[Diamond7]

Furthermore, it's unbiblical to claim that Jesus said the elect would be taken away before great tribulation.

There are a lot of layers of understanding and I do not think anyone knows the Bible well enough to make the claims you are trying to make. Clearly, Paul tells us that through the Blood of Jesus we shall be saved by him from the wrath of God. We all know that there are many different viewpoints on this topic."

 

[Jamdoc]

The big question with verses 11 and 12 is 1290 days.... to what ?

I have concluded 1290 days to when the world sees the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. In the 45 remaining, the kings of the earth will assemble their armies with the intent to make war on Jesus.



View attachment 335628

Good luck transporting a massive army from the east to Israel in 45 days.

as to the 1290 days, the text says, from the cutting off of sacrifices until the setting up of the abomination of desolation is 1290 days.
I mean we get taught that they are the same event but the text seems to say the sacrifices are cut off 1290 days before the setting up of the image of the beast.

and again, I would not try to set a date for the day Jesus said no man knew the day or hour. You're using information that was available to Jesus, and He declared He did not know that day. None of us are more knowledgeable about scripture than Jesus. if Jesus declared He did not know the day, then you cannot calculate the day from scripture. the 1290 days, 1335 days, and 1260 days are therefore NOT possible days that Jesus returns. Those are known dates, to what events, well, they can be multiple things, but not the day Jesus comes down from heaven.

 

[Douggg]

Good luck transporting a massive army from the east to Israel in 45 days.

Your point is well taken. The massive Chinese (and allies) military coming from the east - will be before the 45 days. They will kill a third of man-kind on their way. Which will probably be in India and Pakistan - my guess, perhaps because of their allegiance with the beast-king.

I am providing 3 visuals to help explain. The first is the prelude to Armageddon, Daniel 11:40-44, then the sign of the Son of Man appearing in heaven, then the beast-king meets his end between the seas in Daniel 11:45.

Before the sign of the Son of Man appearing in heaven. Toward the end of the 7 years, the movements of armies of Daniel 11:40-44 will take place - to attack the beast-king (because it is likely that he will be diverting all the middle east oil to the western nations)

Those militaries attack on the beast-king (king of the west - i.e. dictator or the EU, with the US and Canada as allies) - as a prelude to Armageddon.

At the height of the military actions, the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven. Which then, will the armies of the world already in the middle east, the kings of the earth will stop their attack on the beast-king, and side with him in uniting together to take-on Jesus. "Why do the heathen rage, and the people image a vain thing." right? Psalms 2.

 

[Douggg]

and again, I would not try to set a date for the day Jesus said no man knew the day or hour.

Not knowing the day nor hour applies to the rapture/resurrection event.

The seven years and projected end, differently, will begin when the Antichrist, as the perceived King of Israel messiah to the Jews, confirms the Mt. Sinai covenant for 7 years. Moses made that requirement of confirming the Mt. Sinai covenant on a 7 year cycle back in Deuteronomy 31:9-13.

Hasn't been done in modern times because the Muslim control the temple mount. And the Mt. Sinai covenant confirms that God gave the land of Israel to the children of Israel as theirs forever. And since Moses required that the reading of the law (the method of confirming the covenant) to the nation of Israel has to be from the place of God's choosing - which the Jews now hold as being the temple mount - the Muslims are never going to let that happen.

So it will have to be after Gog/Magog. And Islam's presence on the temple mount removed.

Also, Moses said the reading of the law to the nation of Israel, when during the year, is to be done on the feast of tabernacles - a fall feast.

So those are some things to look for.
--------------------------------------------------

I think that the Ezekiel 38-39 Gog/Magog event is not too far into the future. What do you think ?

 

[David Kent]

Daniel 9:27 reveals Antichrist's covenant with Israel will be for seven years, but in the middle of this week (3 ½ years into the tribulation), Antichrist will break the covenant, putting a stop to the Jewish sacrifices.
Isaiah 28:15 speaks of this covenant also 'Because you have said, “We have made a covenant with death,
and with Sheol we have an agreement'

Revelation 13:5 says that this will go on for 42 months, which is 3 ½ years (the second half of the tribulation). So, we see a covenant lasting to the middle of the “week” (Daniel 9:27) and the beast who made the covenant demanding worship for 42 months (Revelation 13:5). Therefore, the total length of time is 84 months or seven years.

Also compare Daniel 12:11 with Revelation 12:6
And from the time that the regular burnt offering is taken away and the abomination that makes desolate is set up, there shall be 1,290 days. 12 Blessed is he who waits and arrives at the 1,335 days. 13 But go your way till the end. And you shall rest and shall stand in your allotted place at the end of the days.”

6 and the woman fled into the wilderness, where she has a place prepared by God, in which she is to be nourished for 1,260 days

1290 days speaks of the second half of the tribulation (1290 days is 3.5 years)

The woman in rev 12 6 is Israel

Daniel 9 does not mention Antichrist. That is a false teaching. The whole prophecy is about Messiah the Prince and the results of the crucifixion.

There is no future seventh week. There is no removal of the church. When Jesus comes there will be no 2nd chance.
The woman in Revelation 12 is the church.

 

[Jamdoc]

There are a lot of layers of understanding and I do not think anyone knows the Bible well enough to make the claims you are trying to make. Clearly, Paul tells us that through the Blood of Jesus we shall be saved by him from the wrath of God. We all know that there are many different viewpoints on this topic."

There's a lot of biblical support for my claim.
First off the audience of the Olivet Discourse was 4 disciples, believers, no the audience of the Olivet Discourse was not unbelieving Jews as a dispensationalist will try to spin it, and Jesus kept saying THEY will see these things, that is believers will.
Daniel 7, Revelation 12, and Revelation 13 identify that the Antichrist will make war against the saints, against Christians, and in Revelation 6 we have the 5th and 6th seals

Revelation 6

9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

At this point, God has not judged the world yet. God has not brought His wrath yet, which is to avenge the martyrs, and deal with the division of His land (the controversy of Zion). Judgement is currently delayed until an appointed number of martyrs has been reached.

continuing on in the 6th seal

12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;
13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.
14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;
16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

These are the same signs that Jesus gave in the Olivet Discourse as happening immediately after the tribulation (Matthew 24:29-31). So the Great Tribulation Jesus talked about, that's done. It's cut short by the 6th seal, as Jesus promised that for the elect's sake, those days shall be cut short (Matthew 24:22)

17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

This is the Day of the Lord, and what marks the beginning of the Wrath of God.

Revelation 7

1 And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.
2 And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea,
3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.
4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.

The Angels that are to dispense the wrath of God, are stayed from doing so, until the 144,000 of the tribes of Israel are sealed.

then

9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

...
13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?
14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

Remember I said that the 6th seal had the signs that came right after the Great Tribulation? Well, that is more proof here, that the great tribulation is over, and is before the trumpets and bowls.

However you parcel out the chronology of Revelation, the facts are that Jesus said great tribulation happens after the Abomination of Desolation, but the signs that accompany the 6th seal are immediately after the tribulation He referred to. So Great Tribulation can only include up to the 5th seal, and does not include the wrath of God.