3abn Continued

[tomatoe]

My understanding is that that is not how the allegations in Virginia came to light.

Well then, you would be wrong. There were no allegations of any kind until Dryden came there to pastor. I know someone on the church board. That would be first hand information. The last time she was contacted Dryden had yet to name any names or prove anything from anyone.

 

[Pickle]

I am with PP, if he got one report of this type of abuse, he needed to investigate it.

He certainly had a lot of reports from Illinois, didn't he?

 

[Pickle]

I believe that was true when he was in Arkansas. Now my understanding is he has been hired on regular conference salary since he moved to Oklahoma.

Could be that my friend is wrong. How many churches does he have, and how large are they?

 

[tomatoe]

Not really, just means the person might have been clueless to the situation. Just becaue taht one man didnt' know, doesn't mean there was no "dirt". I am with PP, if he got one report of this type of abuse, he needed to investigate it.

There was no allegations whatsoever in DunLoring...until Dryden came there. He was the one that said there were allegations and that is after he went around trying to find dirt where there wasn't any. No allegations were made when he came there. As stated previous, I know someone on the church board there. They are aware that he went looking for something when no claims at all had been made and even that same church board has not been given any names after all of this time. In other words, Dryden had big statements to make but then never produced the people he said were making these claims, nor did he even produce names.

 

[Pickle]

My friend just called back and said he is certain he isn't ordained yet, and he thought that he wasn't on full salary, but when I pressed him on that, he wasn't absolutely certain.

I thought that the number and size of the churches might help us to know if Ronnie was on full salary or not. But if you'd rather not answer, that's fine.

 

[Pickle]

There was no allegations whatsoever in DunLoring...until Dryden came there.

Seems to me there was something before Dryden got there, but the details on that haven't been clear to me.

But we should be clear that even if Dryden cooked up everything in Dunn Loring, we still have allegations in Illinois spanning a number of years, totally unrelated to Dryden, with names that are known, and testimony that agrees as to what Tommy would allegedly say to the ones he was trying to victimize.

Plus we also have an eye witness account of a lady that says she caught Tommy in a house with a boy. It wasn't even Tommy's house.

And we also have an eye witness that has Danny in Tommy's presence when an alleged victim and his parents were coming to return a car. Thus we have an eye witness that testifies that Danny knew about the allegations around 1985.

Plus we have a witness who claims that Danny told them that Tommy had approached Danny himself.

Plus we have another relative, a male, that claims that Tommy approached him too.

Given all of this, whatever allegations there are in Dunn Loring are the more credible. And two of those three or four allegations are coming from individuals who were adults at the time.

Given all of this, it is totally inexcusable for Walt to still not have contacted any of the alleged victims to get their side of the story, and then to maintain that he did an adequate investigation. I just can't fathom why he has dealt with this situation this way.

 

[Princessdi]

This would all be great, Tomatoe if we didn't have victims statements, and EVERYONE agreed that something inappropriate happened. His credentials were snatched for a reason. Not just becaue he lost the Dryden popularity contest. You and your friends are just trying to keep it from being criminal. You admit something happened, but you maintain they were "consenting" relationships. So Dryden didnt' make up stuff out of the thin air. Something DID happen! TS approached young and boys for sex. Consenting or not(I believe not) he was abusing his position of authority as a re pastor and an he is an adulterer, at the very least, child molester worse case( which by the victims statements is the case).

There was no allegations whatsoever in DunLoring...until Dryden came there. He was the one that said there were allegations and that is after he went around trying to find dirt where there wasn't any. No allegations were made when he came there. As stated previous, I know someone on the church board there. They are aware that he went looking for something when no claims at all had been made and even that same church board has not been given any names after all of this time. In other words, Dryden had big statements to make but then never produced the people he said were making these claims, nor did he even produce names.

 

[Pinkpanther007]

Whether he is on stipend or salary, and whether he is ordained or not, Ronnie is a pastor.

BTW, being on salary and being ordained are two different things. I believe there may be a little confusion over that.

 

[truthmagnet]

I am aquainted with someone that goes to the Dun Loring church. They said Dryden was seeking people out asking questions such as "did you see anything at all done inappropiately when TS was here? The person said he talked to Dryden directly on this subject. He ask Dryden why he was trying to find dirt where there was none. That shows me the motive and intent.

saying somebody and something at sometime; isn't any kind of productive conclusion.

 

[truthmagnet]

A screen name is just that. It does not have to say who the person behind it is. would it outrage you to find that Tomatoe is not a tomato, Peach a peach, or Icedragon a scaly monster? Are they being deceitful?

Steffan, I know many retired pastors who are called pastor. I also know many pastors who are not ordained. Is Ronnie Shelton called a pastor? Is he ordained? How about John Dinzey? Is Joe Obrien? Roi Ewing? 3ABN has them working as pastors in the pastoral department. Is 3ABN perpetrating a deception on the viewers and callers? Where are they pastoring? What are the names of their churchs? When were they ordained? Have they ever cleared up that misunderstanding? Have any of them made any public statement that they are not pastors to counter 3ABN's statement that they are? Which person at 3ABN approved of them being called pastors? Did Danny? Does that make him a liar?

i believe icedragon is a cold, scaly dragon. are you saying he is not? ;~(

 

[Pinkpanther007]

There was no allegations whatsoever in DunLoring...until Dryden came there. He was the one that said there were allegations and that is after he went around trying to find dirt where there wasn't any. No allegations were made when he came there. As stated previous, I know someone on the church board there. They are aware that he went looking for something when no claims at all had been made and even that same church board has not been given any names after all of this time. In other words, Dryden had big statements to make but then never produced the people he said were making these claims, nor did he even produce names.

If Dryden had even heard of what had happened in Illinois, he had a pastoral responsibility to ask questions. It is also possible that someone, or more, told Dryden what had happened when he arrived. People in an abusive situation seldom trust those in authority who surround and share authority with the abuser. It is likely that they would not want to share what had happened with their abuser's church board for fear of the reaction that too many have endured: suspicion and abuse from their church.

Fear of derision and further abuse from family, friends, church and community is one of the major factors in keeping abuse victims silent. It compounds their despair, and when they see their worst fears carried out against others who have been bold enough to come forward, their resolve to remain silent and let the abuser continue his/her actions is further solidified. This in turn is a major factor in the proliferation of abuse.

 

[noahswife]

saying somebody and something at sometime; isn't any kind of productive conclusion.

And remember Truth Magnet, Tomatoe made it quite clear several days ago how he feels about answering questions and that:

I am satisfied with what I know and how I know it. I do not feel obligated in anyway to provide the answers of how or why I have that information.

It seems to me that this attitude makes having any adult conversation with Tomatoe impossible

 

[Adventist Dissident]

i believe icedragon is a cold, scaly dragon. are you saying he is not? ;~(

cold and scaly, never thought of my self that way? Actually my name was taken from a jacket of the same name. the idea of the icedragon is that unlike conventional fire breathing dragons, this dragon ice breating dragon. you will be turned to ice instead of ash if he breaths on you.

 

[noahswife]

Good morning to you Steffan

You have posted repeatedly concerning certain findings in the tax case. Could you answer a question for me?

Is your only knowledge of this matter reading ALJ Rowe's decision or have you discussed it with anyone that was there during the hearing or from 3abn?

 

[dclem]

It would be inexcusable for a pastor who finds allegations of abuse NOT to ask around. That would be the height of pastoral irresponsibility.

Agreed, but then he should have turned it over to the proper authorities, not take it upon himself to have meetings and send out letters.

 

[dclem]

and as another example:

www save3abn com / glenn - dryden - to - walt - thompson - may - 2003 . htm

it is interesting that dryden wants to control all communications between dr. thompson and any of the "victims" or their families . . . what would be the purpose or necessity of his calling the families first . . . dryden also follows this with a list of demands (blackmail anyone?) that have to be met, seemingly to satisfy no one in particular than dryden himself . . . the most curious of these demands is this one . . .

quote: "pastor glenn dryden of the ezra church of god (***-***-****) should be consulted as to the victims of whom he is aware and as to which of these may be contacted directly."

again the focus is on himself and his control of the situation . . . he also says that there should be contact with the franklin county police dept . . . is this the same department that was contacted by someone when the allegations where first made and the department found no substantial evidence to pursue an investigation or charges . . .

the final demand on the list is an effort by dryden to force tommy to disparage himself to all of the people he had ever worked with or for . . . does this give credence to the claim of jealousy - i would argue that even at the very least it circumstantially does . . . dryden is known to have strangely appeared behind tommy after every appointment he had and each and every time trying to disparage tommy . . .

This has been my point from the beginning. Glenn Dryden has a history of getting in everyone's business. Furthermore, the list of suggested "action items" he wrote up absolutely infuriates me every time I read it. Who is he to make up such a list? He doesn't have a clue what the victims need as far as closure is concerned.

That being said, Tommy Shelton IS guilty of sexual abuse.

 

[tall73]

Agreed, but then he should have turned it over to the proper authorities, not take it upon himself to have meetings and send out letters.

Yes, and he is legally bound to do so by most state laws (perhaps all, not sure on every state).

 

[Pickle]

Agreed, but then he should have turned it over to the proper authorities, not take it upon himself to have meetings and send out letters.

Duane, that would only be for allegations that concerned minors, correct? The ones involving adults would have to be handled in house, correct?

 

[PeacefulSDA]

Duane, that would only be for allegations that concerned minors, correct? The ones involving adults would have to be handled in house, correct?

Pickle,
This is something that has concerned me for quite some time. Why didn't Dryden report the allegations of abuse against minors to the authorities? Dryden's 2003 letter clearly states, first that "Constrained by an ethical, if not legal, obligation..." (showing that he understood his duty in his capacity as a pastor) and second, that "At least six boys in our community were sexually abused..." Is it possible that these boys and their families didn't want the matter to become public? Would that release Dryden from responsibility to report the allegations?

 

[Pickle]

Why didn't Dryden report the allegations of abuse against minors to the authorities?

Perhaps you know something I don't. Do you know for a fact that he did not report them?