3abn Continued

[Adventist Dissident]

Just because I am new to post doesn't mean I haven't done my homework for a long time. I have. You are just one of many that think they know what happened. If Danny is whining now as you put it, he has reason to be. We all know the origination of these unsubstianted rumors. You said you don't deal in gossip you deal in fact. Unless you were there to witness what went down between Danny and Linda and Linda and the doctor, how do you know their facts? You don't. You have your opinion and I have mine.

so you were there???

 

[Adventist Dissident]

We all know the origination of these unsubstianted rumors.

pray tell which are rumors and which are unsubstianted? ans who is the source, since you are privy to so much special knowledge.

Unless you were there to witness what went down between Danny and Linda and Linda and the doctor, how do you know their facts?

unfortunately in the inconsistant fashion typical of Danny suporters, you don't hold your self or Danny to the same standard. dany is the one Who started all of this. I beleve it was a divine blunder.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

Just because I am new to post doesn't mean I haven't done my homework for a long time. I have. You are just one of many that think they know what happened. If Danny is whining now as you put it, he has reason to be. We all know the origination of these unsubstianted rumors. You said you don't deal in gossip you deal in fact. Unless you were there to witness what went down between Danny and Linda and Linda and the doctor, how do you know their facts? You don't. You have your opinion and I have mine.

just because you are new here does not mean you have either.

 

[steffanphilip]

so you were there???

Are you saying you were? How exactly have you procured your allegations ? Did you actually use Pickle as the source of your allegations?

I'll stick with the documented facts for now.

The save3abn site is registered to Gailon Joy. That means he controls every aspect of what appears on the site. What appears on the site is allegations and more allegations. What doesn't appear on the site is Gailon's conviction for embezzlement.

Linda, in desposition is caught in a lie. Once again documented.

Against these documented facts, Pickle, Icedragon and noahswife make allegations. Pickle then insinuates that whoever has spoken against them is supportive of child molestation. That, I believe, is very indicative of the words and tactics used by this anti-3ABN group.

Write all you want, but facts are facts and allegations are allegations.

And I believe I can now post the links which exposes the vitriol that drives these people.

By the way, the information presented below is public. Go to www.whois.org and type in save3abn.com to see the same information.

whois information for save3abn.com
Registrant:
G. Arthur Joy
3 Clinton Road, Box 1425
Sterling, MA 01564
US

Registrar: NAMESDIRECT
Domain Name: SAVE3ABN.COM
Created on: 09-JAN-07
Expires on: 10-JAN-08
Last Updated on: 11-JAN-07

Administrative, Technical Contact:
Joy, G. Arthur gabbjoy4@comcast.net
3 Clinton Road, Box 1425
Sterling, MA 01564
US
(978) 422-3464

 

[noahswife]

Just because I am new to post doesn't mean I haven't done my homework for a long time. I have. You are just one of many that think they know what happened. If Danny is whining now as you put it, he has reason to be. We all know the origination of these unsubstianted rumors. You said you don't deal in gossip you deal in fact. Unless you were there to witness what went down between Danny and Linda and Linda and the doctor, how do you know their facts? You don't. You have your opinion and I have mine.

Tomatoe,

I am curious how you did your homework? How did you decide what information was credible and what was not? You seem familiar with other forums. Are you posting there too?

 

[Pickle]

such arrogance for someone so new.

That someone new (if I'm understanding you correctly, icedragon), noahswife, is a friend.

 

[Pickle]

Jim is correct when he says that Satan is out to get 3ABN.

There are multiple ways to do that, though. One way is to get the leaders at 3ABN to take their eyes off Jesus, to sin, to refuse to repent, to listen to those who sympathize with the erring and who encourage them in their disobedience.

The Lord teaches us, in the directions given to Aaron, reconciliation to his just punishments, even if his wrath comes very nigh. He would have his people acknowledge the justness of his corrections, that others may fear. In these last days, many are liable to be self-deceived, and they are unable to see their own wrongs. If God, through his servants, reproves and rebukes the erring, there are those who stand ready to sympathize with those who deserve reproof. They will seek to lighten the burden which God compelled his servants to lay upon them. These sympathizers think they are performing a virtuous act by sympathizing with the one at fault, whose course may have greatly injured the cause of God. Such are deceived. They are only arraying themselves against God's servants, who have done his will, and against God himself, and are equally guilty with the transgressor. There are many erring souls who might have been saved if they had not been deceived by receiving false sympathy. (1SP 278, 279)

 

[noahswife]

Mr SteffanPhilip,

You claim that you deal in documented facts. You state:

"Linda, in desposition is caught in a lie. Once again documented."

Can you show me where this specific fact is documented on the internet?

As to the 3abn.com site, are you claiming that any document posted is a forgery or not authentic? If so, why have the authors of the documents remained silent for so long?

 

[Adventist Dissident]

That someone new (if I'm understanding you correctly, icedragon), noahswife, is a friend.

a freiend of who? you? danny, linda.

 

[Jimlarmore]

Yesterday, I sent an e-mail directly to 3ABN staff over all of this mess thats going on. I have been told that most of the board is very approachable and will discuss what their role has been in this. We'll see how they respond.

I am now going to making an appeal for cooler heads to prevail here. It takes two to tango. If we stop responding to these guys they will eventually go play somewhere else. IOW, I hope this thread can just die out into obscurity. I don't think what is going on is serving to glorify the Lord at all. I am just as guilty as anyone on this but I think too many times we let personal pride get involved and the real truth of this situation becomes secondary. None of us can change what has happened in the past. I have continued to post after I said I wouldn't to try to stem the damage that was going on towards a ministry of God. This whole mess sickens my soul to the core and I know that it will only get worse if we don't back off and let it go for awhile.

To my way of thinking the Lord will take care of His own. He always has and always will. If Danny is the guilty party here to the point that God no longer wants him to run His ministry then He will remove Danny. Nothing we do here will hasten or delay that if the Lord wants it. The only thing we are managing to do here is denigrate the Seventh-day-Adventist church in general to the whole world. Do we really want to do that? Think about that,,,,please.

God Bless
Jim Larmore

 

[Pickle]

a freiend of who? you? danny, linda.

noahswife is a friend of all those who have concerns about 3ABN, and would like to see the allegations addressed and the issues resolved.

 

[Pickle]

I have been told that most of the board is very approachable and will discuss what their role has been in this.

This is good news.

Gailon requested the privilege of talking to the board last December and was refused. I've spoken with Walt Thompson twice now and talked about the same. Both times he's refused to consider it, saying that it's too late now. he thinks the problems should be dealt with in another way than what they are, but can't seem to suggest another way to deal with them.

When I relayed my conversations to Gailon, he asked when Walt has ever been willing to have us speak to the board. If it's too late now, when wasn't it too late? It does appear to me that Walt thinks it has always been too late, and that Gailon has never been offered that privilege since he came on board in mid-August.

I think it was yesterday I emailed Walt and asked him how I could go over his head and request a meeting with the board. Haven't heard anything back yet.

I do hope you make progress in that direction.

If Danny is the guilty party here to the point that God no longer wants him to run His ministry then He will remove Danny.

Think what that really means, if you are suggesting that there be no human involvement whatsoever. For God alone to remove Danny without human cooperation means that he would be smitten with death. Personally, I think a more loving approach is for us to cooperate with God in having him removed through other means.

And then think of the implications: Are all Adventists in any position of influence free to do as they please, not being able to be removed by anyone but God? How about local church officers? Conference officials? The heads of our institutions? No, each and every one of these leaders can be removed by man, not just by God alone.

 

[Jimlarmore]

This is good news.

Gailon requested the privilege of talking to the board last December and was refused. I've spoken with Walt Thompson twice now and talked about the same. Both times he's refused to consider it, saying that it's too late now. he thinks the problems should be dealt with in another way than what they are, but can't seem to suggest another way to deal with them.

I didn't say that there would be a board meeting to reverse anything or that they are now willing to take part in anything like this mess here. My comment was that privately, some board members are open to discuss what happened. We already know from official statements what they did and why.

When I relayed my conversations to Gailon, he asked when Walt has ever been willing to have us speak to the board. If it's too late now, when wasn't it too late? It does appear to me that Walt thinks it has always been too late, and that Gailon has never been offered that privilege since he came on board in mid-August.

To my way of thinking the board gave Linda ample opportunity to stop doing what she was doing but she refused. Her choices got her where she is. Guilty or not, when you are asked by the boss or someone who holds your job in their hands to stop what you are doing and you refuse,,, what else should she expect?

Think what that really means, if you are suggesting that there be no human involvement whatsoever. For God alone to remove Danny without human cooperation means that he would be smitten with death. Personally, I think a more loving approach is for us to cooperate with God in having him removed through other means.

There's a lot worse things that can happen to us other than falling asleep in death. I'm not one to dictate the actions of God. He holds every breath I take in His hands, He wouldn't have to take Danny's life to make him step down if that is what He wants. Don't limit the ways and means of the Lord.

And then think of the implications: Are all Adventists in any position of influence free to do as they please, not being able to be removed by anyone but God? How about local church officers? Conference officials? The heads of our institutions? No, each and every one of these leaders can be removed by man, not just by God alone.

3ABN has a board of directors to watch over the actions of the main players there. So does the GC and all of the state conferences. IOW, there is accountability so it's not as you are slanting it to be. It was the board who fired Linda from being vice president of 3ABN, not Danny. That action didn't happen over night and from what I have seen on T.V. the board kneels down and prays fervently before each and every meeting to ask God's direction for them. These are rational folks who can think and reason as well as anyone and I'm sure they pondered long and hard over this situation before they acted. Don't you think they fully realized the emotional storm this would bring? Don't you think that if there was any other way to resolve this they would have done it?

Let's let this lie and let the Lord work. I'm confident He will bring to pass the things that need to come to pass.

God Bless
Jim Larmore

 

[noahswife]

IceDragon,

I apologize for the brevity of my response to your statement when the "Satan Card" was played yet again by those who do not believe 3abn should be subject to scrutiny. I meant that "IT" is a statement they (those who position themselves as supporting DS and his actions and do not believe questions should be asked regarding same) repeat when they don't want to deal with the facts or issues. It is like any other card and is meant to trump whatever else you might have to say.

I take responsibility for not being more articulate and that you took my statement as directed at you personally. Please reread it understanding the meaning i had intended and that is I have heard this before and repeating it does not change how i feel about it or make it any more true.

And Bob, thanks for picking up on this matter as I had missed it with the flurry of posts. Unlike some, I accept responsibility for when my words do not reflect my thoughts or intentions.

 

[Pickle]

I didn't say that there would be a board meeting to reverse anything or that they are now willing to take part in anything like this mess here. My comment was that privately, some board members are open to discuss what happened. We already know from official statements what they did and why.

Are you sure, Jim? Have board members been up front and told us why they have not dealt with Danny over his handling of the Tommy Shelton child molestation allegations? or are you referring only to a small part of the scandal, just the Linda part?

And I said nothing about having a board meeting to reverse everything. I was only talking about having the privilege of being able to share our concerns with the board, something Walt Thompson refuses to consider allowing.

To my way of thinking the board gave Linda ample opportunity to stop doing what she was doing but she refused.

Please be specific. When did they give her this opportunity when the very first board meeting we are aware of that dealt with this issue was on May 30, 2004? Was not that the very board meeting that fired her?

Walt Thompson did tell me that there were no other board meetings prior to May 30.

Guilty or not, when you are asked by the boss or someone who holds your job in their hands to stop what you are doing and you refuse,,, what else should she expect?

No boss or board has the authority to dictate what physician I choose or what marriage counselor I choose. And as far as I can tell, that's the one thing that has been established and agreed upon by both sides and/or irrefutable evidence: Dr. Abrahamsen was treating Nathan Moore for meth addiction, and was giving counsel to Linda regarding her marriage.

Now if there was more to it than that, thus far Danny has not provided any evidence to that effect.

3ABN has a board of directors to watch over the actions of the main players there.

I think you're being naive. There is reported to have been a time when an elder raised a question in the Thompsonville Church regarding Danny, and he ended up losing his job at 3ABN. Board members who cross Danny risk getting booted off the board. I have seen no evidence of accountability thus far.

A retired conference official told me he was outraged at the tribute given to Tommy by Danny on New Years' Eve. He shared his perspective with Walt, but Walt just won't budge.

Let's let this lie and let the Lord work. I'm confident He will bring to pass the things that need to come to pass.

He will bring to pass what needs to happen, and He will use us if we let Him. But in my opinion, to just let all this lie would be irresponsible and would be a shirking of our duty.

 

[noahswife]

Rosie55,

I see you have posted since my questions to you, so I thought I would ask them again:

1. What did you think when Linda was removed from 3abn? How did you first learn about it?

2. Did you watch the 3abn show where they said goodbye to Tommy Shelton? Did you know at that time about the allegations against Tommy Shelton and wonder why there was such a difference in how the two situations were handled?

You mentioned that 3abn is a comfort to you when you are home and ill. It has been a comfort to my parents as well. I do hope that you are not ill often as that can be very discouraging.

 

[bonedealer]

Jim is correct when he says that Satan is out to get 3ABN.

There are multiple ways to do that, though. One way is to get the leaders at 3ABN to take their eyes off Jesus, to sin, to refuse to repent, to listen to those who sympathize with the erring and who encourage them in their disobedience.

i have been following this saga in four different venues now for over a year . . . there is a curious occurrence that seems to arise over and over again and you, mr. pickle, employee it all the time . . . whenever someone disagrees with you, you automatically accuse them of being advocates for sin . . . you accuse them of exhibiting many unchristian behaviours and character traits - and it doesn't matter if they provide evidence that you have been wrong or manipulated peoples words . . . you seem to be focused on the destruction of 3abn and people associated with that network . . . one would think that yours is a constant exercise in proving your spiritual superiority by trying to convince others that danny shelton and others are just men of evil . . . in speaking about this in my weekly small group gathering it is evident to us that there isn't much truth in your work and that most of the claims you have made have been the result of misrepresenting what other God-directed people have said . . .

just 2 cents from the bonedealer

 

[Pickle]

i have been following this saga in four different venues now for over a year . . . there is a curious occurrence that seems to arise over and over again and you, mr. pickle, employee it all the time . . . whenever someone disagrees with you, you automatically accuse them of being advocates for sin . . . you accuse them of exhibiting many unchristian behaviours and character traits - and it doesn't matter if they provide evidence that you have been wrong or manipulated peoples words . . . you seem to be focused on the destruction of 3abn and people associated with that network . . . one would think that yours is a constant exercise in proving your spiritual superiority by trying to convince others that danny shelton and others are just men of evil . . . in speaking about this in my weekly small group gathering it is evident to us that there isn't much truth in your work and that most of the claims you have made have been the result of misrepresenting what other God-directed people have said . . .

just 2 cents from the bonedealer

It is very easy to make vague accusations. Why not get specific, with actual quotes to back up what you are saying?

People can disagree with me. That's fine. That doesn't make them advocates of sin, as you put it.

When people go beyond disagreeing and think it's fine for Danny to give a glowing tribute to an alleged pedophile while sending an alleged adulteress off in disgrace, the average person has to wonder about that. Where is the consistency? Where is the morality?

Now notice that I didn't twist anyone's words in saying the above. No one disputes the fact that:

• Tommy is an alleged pedophile.
• Linda is an alleged adulteress.
• Danny did send Tommy away with a glowing tribute with promises that he would be back.
• Danny did send Linda away in disgrace, even taking away from her the title of co-founder.

By the way, where is your small group located?

 

[Adventist Dissident]

I have started a poll. the measuer the fourm on this topic. Where doe se every one stand? please go and take the poll

 

[bonedealer]

I didn't say that there would be a To my way of thinking the board gave Linda ample opportunity to stop doing what she was doing but she refused. Her choices got her where she is. Guilty or not, when you are asked by the boss or someone who holds your job in their hands to stop what you are doing and you refuse,,, what else should she expect?
God Bless
Jim Larmore

this has been clear from the start . . . linda was receiving marriage counseling from the person who was treating her son, that does seem to be an unethical arrangement, what type of emotional connection was developed during the time all those phone calls were being made, where might it have lead had no one made it a point to counsel linda to end the relationship . . . it seems as if there were other options open to her in regard to nathan's treatment, including continuing with the doc in another country . . . but the board and others told her that her relationship the way it had developed had to end, if it didn't then there would be consequences . . . it seems as if those who would defend linda are willing to excuse anything she might have done that could even be perceievd as being inappropriate much less be over the line into the definite inappropriate realm . . . linda made her choices and then didn't like the results and didn't want to have to accept them . . .

just 2 cents from the bonedealer