20 major reasons to reject the Premillennial doctrine

[Timtofly]

There are living mortals in the Millennium. Only after that is Death no more. Revelation 20:4-6

They are resurrected souls, given incorruptible bodies. They have been judged by those sitting on the thrones.

 

[Timtofly]

Go back and read Genesis 3:15, if you do not think the story starts over again at the beginning of Revelation 12.

What was the promise God made to Satan?

What verse in Revelation 12, fulfilled Genesis 3:15?

You all think the story starts all over again, and again, and again, etc.

I can read without giving an opinion that changes the narrative to fit a devotional sermon, even if the Holy Spirit blessed the sermon, and people came to know Christ and find Salvation. The eschatology is still just an opinion.

 

[Timtofly]

That is your opinion. To the rest of us, we see where the Holy Spirit locates this.

When in your opinion does John introduce Satan into the Narrative?

 

[sovereigngrace]

What verse in Revelation 12, fulfilled Genesis 3:15?

You all think the story starts all over again, and again, and again, etc.

I can read without giving an opinion that changes the narrative to fit a devotional sermon, even if the Holy Spirit blessed the sermon, and people came to know Christ and find Salvation. The eschatology is still just an opinion.

Christ's victory over sin, death and Satan through His atoning death and victorious resurrection. The grave could not hold the man child.

 

[keras]

They are resurrected souls, given incorruptible bodies. They have been judged by those sitting on the thrones.

The martyrs killed during the GT; the final 3 1/2 years of this age, will be brought back to life. Just as Lazarus was. They can die again as he did, but that second death has no power. They will receive immortality at the GWT Judgment

So when Jesus returns those resurrected martyrs will live alongside all the faithful Christian peoples who have survived the GT. Mostly those who were kept in the place of safety. Rev 12:14

 

[sovereigngrace]

The martyrs killed during the GT; the final 3 1/2 years of this age, will be brought back to life. Just as Lazarus was. They can die again as he did, but that second death has no power. They will receive immortality at the GWT Judgment

So when Jesus returns those resurrected martyrs will live alongside all the faithful Christian peoples who have survived the GT. Mostly those who were kept in the place of safety. Rev 12:14

How about actually showing us where the Bible teaches that "martyrs killed during the GT (the final 3 1/2 years of this age) will be brought back to life, just as Lazarus was, and can then die again as he did, instead of always articulating your own personal opinions?

 

[keras]

How about actually showing us where the Bible teaches that "martyrs killed during the GT (the final 3 1/2 years of this age) will be brought back to life, just as Lazarus was, and can then die again as he did, instead of always articulating your own personal opinions?

I always have scriptural proofs for what I write.

Revelation 20:4 is quite plain; the martyrs killed by the 'beast', will be brought back to life and will reign with Jesus for the next 1000 years.
There is no mention of their receiving immortality then. That awaits the GWT Judgment, after the Millennium.

Any teachings of 'glorified bodies' or becoming immortal before the GWT, is false and cannot happen.

 

[sovereigngrace]

I always have scriptural proofs for what I write.

Revelation 20:4 is quite plain; the martyrs killed by the 'beast', will be brought back to life and will reign with Jesus for the next 1000 years.
There is no mention of their receiving immortality then. That awaits the GWT Judgment, after the Millennium.

Any teachings of 'glorified bodies' or becoming immortal before the GWT, is false and cannot happen.

That is talking about the here-and-now. The dead in Christ are reigning now in heaven. I have repeatedly showed you that and have repeatedly avoided it.

 

[keras]

That is talking about the here-and-now. The dead in Christ are reigning now in heaven. I have repeatedly showed you that and have repeatedly avoided it.

So your belief is that every Christian goes immediately to heaven upon death?
When are they Judged?
What do they do in heaven, reign over who?

Contrary to your belief, scripture says the dead know nothing and they 'sleep' until they stand before God at the GWT Judgment; after the Millennium. Eccl 9:5-6, Acts 13:36, Revelation 20:5, +

 

[sovereigngrace]

So your belief is that every Christian goes immediately to heaven upon death?
When are they Judged?
What do they do in heaven, reign over who?

Contrary to your belief, scripture says the dead know nothing and they 'sleep' until they stand before God at the GWT Judgment; after the Millennium. Eccl 9:5-6, Acts 13:36, Revelation 20:5, +

They go upon death to heaven. Judged when Jesus comes.

 

[keras]

They go upon death to heaven. Judged when Jesus comes.

So dead Christians are admitted to heaven before Judgment? Pretentious nonsense, illogical and unscriptural.

That your belief is totally contradictory to Bible teaching, is proved by Revelation 20:11-15, where we are told the Judgment of everyone who has ever lived will stand before God. Only those whose names are found in the Book of Life will go into Eternity with God.

 

[Timtofly]

I always have scriptural proofs for what I write.

Revelation 20:4 is quite plain; the martyrs killed by the 'beast', will be brought back to life and will reign with Jesus for the next 1000 years.
There is no mention of their receiving immortality then. That awaits the GWT Judgment, after the Millennium.

Any teachings of 'glorified bodies' or becoming immortal before the GWT, is false and cannot happen.

I never claimed they had immortality. I said those on earth will never have immortality. They are not part of the church. They have incorruptible bodies that cannot grow old and die. Mortality is the lack of one's spiritual self. The Greeks messed with the definitions that Paul was using. Being a god and mortal were opposites. Death and decay is corruption. Being immortal is not living forever. Being immortal is being sons of God. Immortality is the glorified image of God.

Being incorruptible means the body cannot decay, thus degenerate into natural death. A body that does not age, can still be killed by murder, just not natural aging causes. A glorified body, cannot be killed by anything or any one, unless God states it happens or God allows it or does it. But to what end? Not even those in the lake of fire actually die. They have just died physically and spiritually, not permanently.

 

[keras]

I never claimed they had immortality. I said those on earth will never have immortality. They are not part of the church. They have incorruptible bodies that cannot grow old and die. Mortality is the lack of one's spiritual self. The Greeks messed with the definitions that Paul was using. Being a god and mortal were opposites. Death and decay is corruption. Being immortal is not living forever. Being immortal is being sons of God. Immortality is the glorified image of God.

Being incorruptible means the body cannot decay, thus degenerate into natural death. A body that does not age, can still be killed by murder, just not natural aging causes. A glorified body, cannot be killed by anything or any one, unless God states it happens or God allows it or does it. But to what end? Not even those in the lake of fire actually die. They have just died physically and spiritually, not permanently.

The Bible never tells us about any state other that mortal and immortal.
The theory of 'glorified bodies', is a false teaching.

Lazarus died and was brought back to life, then he died again. Just as the resurrected martyrs will be. Rev 20:4

 

[Timtofly]

The Bible never tells us about any state other that mortal and immortal.
The theory of 'glorified bodies', is a false teaching.

Lazarus died and was brought back to life, then he died again. Just as the resurrected martyrs will be. Rev 20:4

Where is your proof Lazarus died again? Paul explains what corruption and mortality is in 1 Corinthians 15.

As for the image of God that is symbolized by a robe of white. Robe of white is not literal, it is symbolic of a light. That is God's image. As beings wrapped in light, we will be able to see God’s face. Revelation 22:4

Being immortal is being in the total image of God. Spiritually we are symbolic lights. When the church is presented complete in the 6th seal, Jesus will present it in white robes, literally glorified bodies of physical light in the full restoration of Adam's original form. Why is it hard to grasp that Adam lost both his spiritual and incorruptible body when he disobeyed? They both died that day. Adam and Eve were given corruptible bodies that would die and decay.

 

[sovereigngrace]

Where is your proof Lazarus died again? Paul explains what corruption and mortality is in 1 Corinthians 15.

As for the image of God that is symbolized by a robe of white. Robe of white is not literal, it is symbolic of a light. That is God's image. As beings wrapped in light, we will be able to see God’s face. Revelation 22:4

Being immortal is being in the total image of God. Spiritually we are symbolic lights. When the church is presented complete in the 6th seal, Jesus will present it in white robes, literally glorified bodies of physical light in the full restoration of Adam's original form. Why is it hard to grasp that Adam lost both his spiritual and incorruptible body when he disobeyed? They both died that day. Adam and Eve were given corruptible bodies that would die and decay.

Jesus was the first to conquer the grave, not Lazarus. The Bible makes it clear that Christ is "the first resurrection" (Acts 26:23 and Revelation 20:6), "the firstborn from the dead" (Colossians 1:18), "the firstfruits of them that slept" (1 Corinthians 15:20), "first begotten of the dead" (Revelation 1:5).

 

[Timtofly]

Jesus was the first to conquer the grave, not Lazarus. The Bible makes it clear that Christ is "the first resurrection" (Acts 26:23 and Revelation 20:6), "the firstborn from the dead" (Colossians 1:18), "the firstfruits of them that slept" (1 Corinthians 15:20), "first begotten of the dead" (Revelation 1:5).

Lazurus did not conquer the grave. Jesus was the one who raised him from death. So your proof is that Jesus commanded Lazarus to go back into the tomb, after 30 minutes of living proof, and die again? Ok, that sounds like a personal interpretation of reality to me. Unless you have Scriptural proof that Lazarus died again, all you have is speculation.

If your post is that strict about Lazarus, then the two witnesses laying dead in Jerusalem, while the 7 vials are poured out for 3.5 days, were not resurrected either. They just had a near death experience like Lazurus?

 

[sovereigngrace]

Lazurus did not conquer the grave. Jesus was the one who raised him from death. So your proof is that Jesus commanded Lazarus to go back into the tomb, after 30 minutes of living proof, and die again? Ok, that sounds like a personal interpretation of reality to me. Unless you have Scriptural proof that Lazarus died again, all you have is speculation.

If your post is that strict about Lazarus, then the two witnesses laying dead in Jerusalem, while the 7 vials are poured out for 3.5 days, were not resurrected either. They just had a near death experience like Lazurus?

Lazarus would have doubtless died a natural death.

 

[keras]

Lazarus would have doubtless died a natural death.

Well, you have that right.
And so will the Trib martyrs that Jesus will bring back to life at His Return.

No one will become immortal before the GWT Judgment.

 

[Timtofly]

Lazarus would have doubtless died a natural death.

That is not Scriptural proof. He already died a natural death. How many natural deaths do we get? Jesus waited 4 days, no? Lazarus was dead longer than Jesus was. You have no proof of the state of body Lazarus came back in. Was Jesus not able to give Lazarus an incorruptible body? "It is finished" on the Cross removed the ban from Paradise, the angel blocking the entrance. If Moses, Enoch, Elijah had incorruptible bodies that would never again see death, before the Cross, what would stop Lazarus from having an incorruptible body before the Cross?

 

[keras]

That is not Scriptural proof. He already died a natural death. How many natural deaths do we get?

Lazarus was raised in his mortal body. He was still wrapped in cloths.
He lived again until he finally died of old age. Just as the boy Elijah raised and the girl Jesus raised.
But Martha knew that Lazarus would be raised on the last day, John 11:24, and it will be then; that he and all those whose names are Written in the Book of Life, will receive immortality.