144,000

[aniello]

Ah, forgot. When we went to J'lem years ago met with R. Richman and Reyna, his Rebbetzin, and they introduced us to Yishai Fliescher and his wife, Malka, most hospitable, gracious brethren and cisterns, who was on Arutz Sheva at the time. He's a lawyer also, an IDF veteran and a real tiger. I like Tigers.

When I get around Bambi and the Seven Dwarves I become rather nervous.

 

[yedida]

CHumney, Bill Cloud, Rico, Tony Robinson et al are here:

Hebrew Roots, Messianic Israel, Torah Observant,Messianic Jewish Teachings | The Hebraic Roots Network

Always felt Eddie was a bit over the edge in his costuming up, had some good info. sometimes though.

Try googling GLC, should come up and they have round the clock programming. Some programs are good, some are well....... Think you might enjoy Dr. Diana Dye, our Jewish friend in Santa Fe. See her at Kol Beramah when we are able to get up there.

Cool, thanks, put a bookmark on that site!! I'll get to listen more once we've moved - I'm gonna have my own bedroom again!! Yay!! I'm on the sofa in the living room right now
so I have to use headphones when I listen to something and they cause migrains to start up or get worse. Can't wait to move!!
I joined up on Rico's forum, nice people, but not at all lively.

 

[Henaynei]

I don't know the others, but do be aware Chumney is strongly 2 House, considered a heresy in MJism.

 

[Yahudim]

CHumney, Bill Cloud, Rico, Tony Robinson et al are here:

Hebrew Roots, Messianic Israel, Torah Observant,Messianic Jewish Teachings | The Hebraic Roots Network

Always felt Eddie was a bit over the edge in his costuming up, had some good info. sometimes though.

Try googling GLC, should come up and they have round the clock programming. Some programs are good, some are well....... Think you might enjoy Dr. Diana Dye, our Jewish friend in Santa Fe. See her at Kol Beramah when we are able to get up there.

I LIKE Eddie's shiny silk pajamas. I also understand that the Orthodox Jewish tailors that makes them for him, get's a good chuckle inside their collective hands every time he wears them.

 

[yedida]

I don't know the others, but do be aware Chumney is strongly 2 House, considered a heresy in MJism.

Thanks!! That explains the unsettled "feelings" I've always gotten when I've heard/read him - more familiar with his written works but never delved too deeply into them. (Now, by two-house, are you referring to the gentiles are all from the 10 "lost" tribes and there are no true gentiles who believe in Yeshua/Jesus? camp?)

 

[aniello]

I don't know the others, but do be aware Chumney is strongly 2 House, considered a heresy in MJism.

Yep, he's 2 house as can be, as he came(past tense) across to me.

Always thought his costuming up very affectatious. Grates on my nerves in general.

But, it's his show, I suppose,.......I don't watch it.

 

[yedida]

Yep, he's 2 house as can be, as he came(past tense) across to me.

Always thought his costuming up very affectatious. Grates on my nerves in general.

But, it's his show, I suppose,.......I don't watch it.

Were you just directing me then to the person you named? and not the others? Cause I didn't see her name listed among the teachers there. Now you got me confused

 

[aniello]

Were you just directing me then to the person you named? and not the others? Cause I didn't see her name listed among the teachers there. Now you got me confused

As far as Dr. Diana Dye goes, she appears on GLC(God's Learning Channel). If you google GLC you can find it. Once on there poke around and you will find you can watch their various programmers and they keep the last 5 programs of each available. Dr. Dye is a friend of Jewish family origin and quite knowledgeable. Some of the other programmers are worthwhile, like Dr. Marvin Wilson(Abraham Our Father author as I recall), there are other programmers I would n't wish on a dog.

The reference to the other place, which happens to have Eddie Chumney, is a mere reference, nothing more.

On these things I'm not in the position to play Gawwd and tell anyone what to watch.

Was meant to be mere referrals only.

 

[Jonathan95]

It's dangerous to make predictions as followers of Harold Camping find out regularly, and others. Like Temp says, there are still a lot of things to happen. Realistically we can continue to best use this opportunity to learn more, grow more, walk with Him closer, help each other, because we may think we have some idea of the carnage, but I doubt we really do. Were still a way off yet, 2018-20, a bit more maybe??? But we will not be surprised. I hear you, Yeshida, and I would hope He has mercy on you, because probably you're correct in your thoughts. But it's the blind, the lame, the down syndrome children, the autistic, the innocent children, these are the ones that hurt me. It is my prayer continually He takes them away first.

There are solar eclipses and lunar eclipses ahead, on Jewish holidays in 2014-2015 and apparently that's rare. So I believe something is gonna happen then.

These videos show how the lunar and solar eclipses land on the Jewish Holidays. Which might mean that something big is going to happen soon:

Blood Moons Mark Blitz part 1 - YouTube


Now to the predictions. Well, it says:

Matthew 25:13
Watch therefore [give strict attention and be cautious and active], for you know neither the day nor the hour when the Son of Man will come.
Matthew 25:12-14 (in Context)

So I believe we can atleast know the year, and maybe month, and week too.

 

[Temptinfates]

It is human nature to assume everything has to happen in one's own lifetime. Some people say they believe the Jews and their calender is Hashem's timetable. So, I look it up and this is year 5772. That is 228 years left according to that calender--if you believe in the 6 day 6000 year models that are out there.
I have listened to or read many people over the years and heard many, many theories. Most of these theories basically uphold prophecies in revelation, daniel, and ezekial. Many of these omit Zechariah and other events that are written. Omitting of these type things is their flaws. It is the same reasoning that Darwin's theory is true and they only want to submit the information that supports the theory--which contradicts scientific reasoning. Yet, many people succumb to the same type of ideas when they listen to some of the prophetic theories that are presented. But, that is not what they do. They teach an idea then find scripture to support their idea. You must consider all prophecy, not just throw out the parts that don't fit your theory.
I see that when people read revelation about the 144,000. The book lists Jews and names them by tribe. It is written there, but people cannot accept it for what it clearly says. That there will be a time that there will be a group of Jews doing a specific thing for G-ds purpose. This is not a salvation issue either. Most Christian theology cannot accept this. ...That Hashem will call out or call a group of Jews to his purpose. I just accept what it says.
Most people want to hurry up prophecy because they either fear death, or want to see the great things written take place. I will die before all these things take place. I will see some of the things come to pass, but, no way will I see it all. I can accept that.
Some people have been told the bible says to convert the Jews and then Messiah will come. So, they concentrate on this trying to hurry things up. It will not happen that way.
After all the history and the covenants and the teachings we find in the Tanach, writings...G-d will once again be really present with "the Jews". This flies in the face of most of christendom. It is because he gave his word to them. He has to make it good to them. But, people don't want to even consider that this may be so. They already have it all figured out...lol.
To say such a thing is an affront to what many have been programmed to believe. G-d is not going to rapture people off the earth and leave whatever is left to the Jews and unbelievers. "we believers get rescued, and the unbelievers (the Jews) will be left on earth during the tribulation". What bunk. It's ok according to these people to teach that they get to go to heaven because they profess, while people that believe in the Father will be left behind. This is sick. No believers on earth to accomplish what? Just so G-d could see man's demise? These people have a sick view of the G-d I know. Nope, not going to happen that way. There will be a witness of him as long as this earth is here. Many of these people will lose their way when they see things happen and they are still here. But, really, they gave themselves over to man's ideas about what G-d is supposed to do, instead of just clinging to the walk they are supposed to walk with him through these events.
This is the problem with man. Hashem told me and my family "A". Then he told us "B". Now, being human and thinking we "knew" that we were going to get from "a" to "B" in a straight line. We had it all figured out the way things were supposed to happen. It's human nature.
Now, "a" did happen and "B" did happen. But, it did not happen the way we thought we understood it. It happened exactly as He said, just not the way we thought. We didn't even think the way would have twists and turns. Some people make that mistake with their understanding of prophecy. They think the events have to tumble like dominos and do not consider that perhaps there may be a prophetic event they have not considered, or that these things really are in Hashem's timing-and that we being human, may have it just a wee bit wrong. That is why I listen to prophecy teachers with many grains of salt. But, I weigh things with things that I know have to happen for the Jews, and when theories leave those things out or try to replace it, then I know them for what they are.
Temptinfates

 

[pat34lee]

Yep, he's 2 house as can be, as he came(past tense) across to me.

Always thought his costuming up very affectatious. Grates on my nerves in general.

But, it's his show, I suppose,.......I don't watch it.

Eddie Chumney is two house in that he believes that Israel (as opposed to Judah) is still among the nations. He does not teach replacement theology; e.g. that the 'church' is the House of Israel. See this statement paper from Eddie and Monte Judah:
Dan Juster, Monte Judah and Eddie Chumney Two House Meeting

 

[yedida]

I second greatly what Temp has said. Looking into Rev., Ezek., Dan. etc. is very exciting and fun and much can actually be gleaned from such study. But, no one should get dogmatic about any of it. Because getting dogmatic about points A, B and C require that all other points are fully understood and line up with the first 3. And I don't think anyone has that kind of grasp on what all is being shown to us. I believe that much is yet hidden.
So, what to do? Put out time and effort into what we do know and understand and what we, individually, can control. And that is Me, Myself and I. No one can control anything else, but we can control ourselves, for good or for bad. So make sure we are each where God wants us to be at the time He wants us there, and all the rest will fall into place. If it happens tomorrow or 100 years from now, we'll be ready and waiting right where He would have us to be.

 

[aniello]

Eddie Chumney is two house in that he believes that Israel (as opposed to Judah) is still among the nations. He does not teach replacement theology; e.g. that the 'church' is the House of Israel. See this statement paper from Eddie and Monte Judah:
Dan Juster, Monte Judah and Eddie Chumney Two House Meeting

This is NOT aimed at you, ad hominem, Patrick, just a general blow off by an old, very tired man of the whole d--n-d monkey business thing, in general.

As regards Eddie Chumney et. al. it's all fine as far as I'm concerned. Folks will decide whatever for themselves.

I have little interest in all these modern come-lately groups(like UMJC, MJAA, et. al.). I'm sure they are fine, but they have nothing to do with my believing Y'shua is The Messiah. Acts 1 to around Acts 10 is about all I can handle as the absolute beginning of what I believe is Messianic Judaism, that which comes after(modern day stuff) is "come-lately stuff". Being a Jew by birth, albeit only a 1/2 breed Jew, I did pretty much grow up in a functiong Jewish community, something I virtually never see discussed here. Because of the racial-ethnic-religious mix of my family, I would guess there is not much we share in common across the board culturally maybe even in values and moral order, in a manner of speaking. No big darn deal to me. I just try, when opportunity permits, to share the message with my traditional synagogue attending Jewish brethren(if they ask, I don't push them) and my Native American family(we consider practically any "Indian" our family). That must sound very strange to many of y'all. It's OK. To understand either culture, deeply, maybe you have to be born into such. I dunno. It happens that I was.

I'm sure the lads you linked to are fine people, just not my interest nor concern, really.

As an attorney, daily seeing American and other Euro-centric philosophy based societies going into the sewer regardless of the zillions of laws we have, it is my considered opinion that only Torah instructed law keeping could serve to maintain order and sanity, within the consideration that we do not presently live within a theocracy. I'm not holding my breath. What I do see is a more callous regard for each other, much more violent and absolutely depraved behaviour criminally but, ironically, with society accepting such as an acceptable norm. Some may call my attitude here "One Law", the option is the now visible chaos we most assuredly are proceding toward.As a snide aside that I won't hide I understand that UK now stands for United Kaliphate.

I go to work tomorrow, court in the PM, more fun and games. Hearing on where to place 3 throw away children(youngest 8 months) in the morning, afternoon a juicy divorce mess with a man who beats his ex-wife to be and got his overweight fat slob sister to also go beat up his wife. I have so much fun, NOT.

A year and a half ago I came here hoping to get some hints from fellow Y'shua believing real Jews on how to share the Messiah Message with both my Jewish brethren(when they make the opportunity available) and my native family more effectively. The net experience has been zilch, totally.

I have no need, nor desire, to continue on this subject here at present.

Again Pat34, I have NO animus toward you! But, I am royally peeved with the zoo parade that goes on here quite a bit of the time.

'sta finito.
ciaou

 

[yedida]

Some of us try aniello, even us gentiles, but we get blindsided so much that it's really difficult to cut thru the muck and mire. It gets very frustrating.

 

[Temptinfates]

My advice is to pray, Aniello.
They probably already watch you to see what you are about, already. It really is the HS that opens doors. Some people have methods/protocals they follow for witnessing. It's not hard for me. People come up and ask me stuff....kind of weird sometimes. Witnessing to family members Jew or Gentile can cause trouble sometimes. So, you have to be sure he is wanting it to happen. That is why you have to pray about it. Talk to him about it. This is the first thing I can advise. It is not your responsibility that they believe. Their free-will comes into play as did yours. The HS can draw them and present an opportunity. Then if they ask, just tell them. You gotta wait on him, though. And never allow a thought to come in that tells you that He is not hearing your prayers. May he reward you openly for what you pray in secret.
Temptinfates

 

[visionary]

My advice is to pray, Aniello.
They probably already watch you to see what you are about, already. It really is the HS that opens doors. Some people have methods/protocals they follow for witnessing. It's not hard for me. People come up and ask me stuff....kind of weird sometimes. Witnessing to family members Jew or Gentile can cause trouble sometimes. So, you have to be sure he is wanting it to happen. That is why you have to pray about it. Talk to him about it. This is the first thing I can advise. It is not your responsibility that they believe. Their free-will comes into play as did yours. The HS can draw them and present an opportunity. Then if they ask, just tell them. You gotta wait on him, though. And never allow a thought to come in that tells you that He is not hearing your prayers. May he reward you openly for what you pray in secret.
Temptinfates

That is true... I can remember a time when I just finished learning a new thing that the Holy Spirit revealed to me during my reading and studying and praying time.. and I was so excited with the revelation, that I said "Ohh... I wish I could tell somebody this... "ding dong"... immediately someone was at my door ringing the bell. .. "Thank you Lord" as I skipped to the door... poor encyclopedia salesman was in for a big surprise... It was an awesome experience. Right there at the door the conversation quickly went from "Hi I am here to sell" to "Well Hi.. you just got here in time to hear what I just learned." .. and from there the Lord took over and told him stuff so awesome that even though it was coming out of my mouth, I was amazed at the telling of it. I know it wasn't me. Even the salesman's head glowed like he was on Mount Sinai learning like Moses did that day.

 

[Temptinfates]

I'm laughing, Vis.
One time about 6 years ago we went to church with my aunt. Now her church is of the pentecostal type and they had a guest preacher from knoxville. The guys sermon was on (I think Isiah chap 6). In the middle of his sermon he said "G-d is not a 50 cent G-d".
Over the next week, my wife had three different people come up to her and ask her for exactly 50 cents. My wife said "Temp, that is so weird. nobody asks for just 50 cents. They usually just ask if you have any amount to help out.". That never happened again.
We were in Augusta dealing with a child custody case involving my nephew. So, we went to church with my nephew. The HS was telling my wife to ask for Jennifer. My wife was new to being a believer and she got scared. So, my wife didn't do as asked. Later we found out that there had been a girl named Jennifer that had recently been coming there. G-d was wanting to heal her, but it didn't happen. My wife was too scared to stand up in this church and allow the HS to work. Now, she has learned better.
So, I ask you, Vis--do you remember everything that was said, or did he just take over and tell the man what he needed to hear? Just wondering is all.
Temptinfates

 

[visionary]

I'm laughing, Vis.
One time about 6 years ago we went to church with my aunt. Now her church is of the pentecostal type and they had a guest preacher from knoxville. The guys sermon was on (I think Isiah chap 6). In the middle of his sermon he said "G-d is not a 50 cent G-d".
Over the next week, my wife had three different people come up to her and ask her for exactly 50 cents. My wife said "Temp, that is so weird. nobody asks for just 50 cents. They usually just ask if you have any amount to help out.". That never happened again.
We were in Augusta dealing with a child custody case involving my nephew. So, we went to church with my nephew. The HS was telling my wife to ask for Jennifer. My wife was new to being a believer and she got scared. So, my wife didn't do as asked. Later we found out that there had been a girl named Jennifer that had recently been coming there. G-d was wanting to heal her, but it didn't happen. My wife was too scared to stand up in this church and allow the HS to work. Now, she has learned better.
So, I ask you, Vis--do you remember everything that was said, or did he just take over and tell the man what he needed to hear? Just wondering is all.
Temptinfates

We both benefited from the telling of it... it had to do with how the Lord moved upon the people during the dark ages, preserving his Word, when scriptures was the in thing to burn, how they were translated by hand sometimes just one book at a time, and smuggled around. The salesman was an encyclopedia salesman, and was starting to show the history found in the books he was selling was good for me and my children. The Lord just picked up from there and revealed to the both of us, the spirit moving upon people over the centuries, causing this idea to go from concept to understanding and changing the world in sometimes small ways to large ways to better ways. IT is hard to explain, but it was fascinating as He was telling it, cause I sure didn't know all this that was told the way the Lord sees it. Even as I say it, it doesn't have the brilliance that it did that day.

 

[Temptinfates]

Thank you, Vis. Brilliance is a very familiar description, BTW.
Temptinfates

 

[aniello]

Thank you Temptifaith,

I do pray though.

That is true... I can remember a time when I just finished learning a new thing that the Holy Spirit revealed to me during my reading and studying and praying time.. and I was so excited with the revelation, that I said "Ohh... I wish I could tell somebody this... "ding dong"... immediately someone was at my door ringing the bell. .. "Thank you Lord" as I skipped to the door... poor encyclopedia salesman was in for a big surprise... It was an awesome experience. Right there at the door the conversation quickly went from "Hi I am here to sell" to "Well Hi.. you just got here in time to hear what I just learned." .. and from there the Lord took over and told him stuff so awesome that even though it was coming out of my mouth, I was amazed at the telling of it. I know it wasn't me. Even the salesman's head glowed like he was on Mount Sinai learning like Moses did that day.

That would be a thrilling experience for sure. However the following is the setting I deal with, along with my sometimes very unwilling wife.

The setting is literlly a traditional(meaning non messianic) Conservetive Shul in the big town about 90 miles to our north. Sometimes it is an M.O. Shul in a town about 70 miles further away from the first Shul I mentioned, about 170 or so miles from our compound at the edge of a Rez in the sticks where we live.

Anyway there(either place) we attend Torah service and afterward usually there is an Oneg( Joy, food, drink, prayers at the end more or less and pleasant conversation). It is during Oneg we have the chance to converse with our friends. Needless to say we do not jump up and shout "Have you heard of the 4 spiritual laws? and G-d has a plan for your life" or whatever. Also, I've never had the experience of seeing a salesman coming to the Shul on Shabbat and ringing the doorbell. We try to be with real Jews, since we are, and not wait for the occassional disenfranchised alienated Jew to just run into at the mall or whereever.

Realize most synagogue Jews I know don't normally ever converse about Jesus. Thsy don't care. Also, trying to sell them Isa. 53 is futile because most of them have been forewarned and counter educated against that line and other pitches xtians try to make.

So, we're sitting at the table, one of 30 or so, and once in a great while one of our folks will ask some sort of question like this(which is rare). "Hey aniello, SiouxJew, have you ever read any of the prophets/nevi'im?" And we try to veeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrry carefully answer; "yes,............why?" Hopefully we will have a conversation that will eventually lead to the fact that the Temple was destroyed(no joy in that for us) therefore there can be no valid(per Torah) blood sacrifice made for sin, and, thus, where does that leave us?

Generally, and as concisely as I know to put it, they will reply that they are Torah instructed(from their rabbi) to do t'shuvah, tefilah and tzedakah. Plus one other little thing, at least from most of our friends.


"
O Israel, return to the L-RD your G-d,
For you have stumbled because of your iniquity;

Take words with you,
And return to the L-RD.
Say to Him,
"Take away all iniquity;
Receive us graciously,
For we will offer the sacrifices of our lips. "

As far as my friends are concerned that gets it, complete with required sacrifice.

And so there it culminates as far as they are concerned. As you surely know they don't accept NT, most will not listen to it, at this point.

So, you tell me, what had a person better be able to prove, from the Tenack only, that thus and such is still required, that nothing, essentially, changed?

What, specifically and literally, would you counter with?