S Walch
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thestudent7000 said:
You know, it's always best to quote the verse before 29:
Mark 12:28-31
28 One of the teachers of religious law was standing there listening to the discussion. He realized that Jesus had answered well, so he asked, "Of all the commandments, which is the most important?"
29 Jesus replied, "The most important commandment is this: `Hear, O Israel! The Lord our God is the one and only Lord. 30 And you must love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, all your mind, and all your strength.' 31 The second is equally important: `Love your neighbour as yourself.' No other commandment is greater than these
/me sighs
Jesus is quoting from the Torah - as the religious teacher asks "Of all the commandments, which is the most important?" - Meaning "Where in the Torah are the most important commandements?"
Verse 29-30 is a direct quote of Deuteronomy 6:4-5, and verse 31 is a direct quote from Leviticus 19:18
Ahhh the old "Where does Jesus say "I am God, Worship me!" line variant.
Very well - let's see.
• John 5:16-30
16 So the Jewish leaders began harassing Jesus for breaking the Sabbath rules.
17 But Jesus replied, "My Father never stops working, so why should I?"
18 So the Jewish leaders tried all the more to kill him. In addition to disobeying the Sabbath rules, he had spoken of God as his Father, thereby making himself equal with God.
19 Jesus replied, "I assure you, the Son can do nothing by himself. He does only what he sees the Father doing. Whatever the Father does, the Son also does.
20 For the Father loves the Son and tells him everything he is doing, and the Son will do far greater things than healing this man. You will be astonished at what he does.
21 He will even raise from the dead anyone he wants to, just as the Father does.
22 And the Father leaves all judgment to his Son,
23 so that everyone will honour the Son, just as they honour the Father. But if you refuse to honour the Son, then you are certainly not honouring the Father who sent him.
24 "I assure you; those who listen to my message and believe in God who sent me have eternal life. They will never be condemned for their sins, but they have already passed from death into life.
25 "And I assure you that the time is coming, in fact it is here, when the dead will hear my voice--the voice of the Son of God. And those who listen will live.
26 The Father has life in himself, and he has granted his Son to have life in himself.
27 And he has given him authority to judge all mankind because he is the Son of Man.
28 Don't be so surprised! Indeed, the time is coming when all the dead in their graves will hear the voice of God's Son,
29 and they will rise again. Those who have done good will rise to eternal life, and those who have continued in evil will rise to judgment.
30 But I do nothing without consulting the Father. I judge as I am told. And my judgment is absolutely just, because it is according to the will of God who sent me; it is not merely my own.
John 8: 49-59
49 "No," Jesus said, "I have no demon in me. For I honor my Father--and you dishonor me. 50 And though I have no wish to glorify myself, God wants to glorify me. Let him be the judge. 51 I assure you, anyone who obeys my teaching will never die!"
52 The people said, "Now we know you are possessed by a demon. Even Abraham and the prophets died, but you say that those who obey your teaching will never die! 53 Are you greater than our father Abraham, who died? Are you greater than the prophets, who died? Who do you think you are?"
54 Jesus answered, "If I am merely boasting about myself, it doesn't count. But it is my Father who says these glorious things about me. You say, `He is our God,' 55 but you do not even know him. I know him. If I said otherwise, I would be as great a liar as you! But it is true--I know him and obey him. 56 Your ancestor Abraham rejoiced as he looked forward to my coming. He saw it and was glad."
57 The people said, "You aren't even fifty years old. How can you say you have seen Abraham?"
58 Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, before Abraham was, I AM."59 At that point they picked up stones to kill him. But Jesus hid himself from them and left the Temple.
*Notes on John 8:49-59:*
When the Jewish Pharisees charged that Jesus was demon possessed, he responded that if anyone followed his word, they would never die. The Jews retorted that Abraham was dead, and preceded Jesus, and yet Jesus, known as the son of a Carpenter from Nazareth was apparently greater than Abraham? Jesus responded by saying that Abraham had seen him, and had anticipated his advent. In 8:57, the Jews asked a very good question "You aren't even fifty years old. How can you say you have seen Abraham?"
It was a fair enough question. Abraham had lived 2000 years prior, so how could Abraham have seen Jesus seeing as though the longest human lifespan recorded in the Bible was 969 years (Methuselah) and quite certainly, Jesus didn't look 2000 years old!
Jesus' answer both froze and shocked the crowd:"Truly, truly before Abraham was, I AM"
This statment of Jesus was considered the highest sort of blasphemy by the Jews. First of all, Jesus claimed to have existed before Abraham the father of the Jewish nation, before the one whom the covenant had been given in Genesis 12:1-3. Secondly, Jesus used the Aramaic word translated as "I AM.".
In the aramaic language, this word transliterated the sacred name of God Himself, YHWH. this was the name that YHWH gave Moses at the burning bush when Moses asked, "To what name shall I give them?" (Exodus 3:13-14). God revealed his name as YHWH. the word is four simple letters in the Hebrew language, so it is called the Tetragrammation ("Four letters").
NO Jews EVER uttered the name of God. Ever. In fact, YHWH in considered so holy that whenever the Jewish Scribes came to It when writing down one of the books of the Old testament, they would get a new pen and new ink, write down the word and then chuck the pen and the ink away, and then continue writing down the rest of the book.
Now, Jesus, this teacher not only uttered the inutterable word YHWH, but He ascribed it to Himself and on the very temple grounds. The Jews therefore picked up stones to stone Jesus, as there was NO other way to interperate what Jesus just claimed: That he himself was God.
Their response was inevitable.
We can even look to what a Muslim scholar says too:
From Abdullah Yusaf 'Ali's commentary for the Bible:
"Jesus was charged by the Jews with blasphemy as claiming to be God or the Son of God. The Christians ... adopted the substance of this claim, and made it the corner stone of their faith. Allah clears Jesus of such a charge or claim."
A Muslim scholar, writing a commentary for the Bible hereby admits that the chrage brought against Jesus was that of blasphemy - the claim of being God himself.
Want some more?
I think we do. I know I do - Jesus is awesome to talk about.
John 10:24-39
24 Jewish leaders surrounded him and asked, "How long are you going to keep us in suspense? If you are the Messiah, tell us plainly."
25 Jesus replied, "I have already told you, and you don't believe me. The proof is what I do in the name of my Father. 26 But you don't believe me because you are not part of my flock. 27 My sheep recognize my voice; I know them, and they follow me. 28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish. No one will snatch them away from me, 29 for my Father has given them to me, and he is more powerful than anyone else. So no one can take them from me. 30 The Father and I are one."
31 Once again the Jewish leaders picked up stones to kill him. 32 Jesus said, "At my Father's direction I have done many things to help the people. For which one of these good deeds are you killing me?"
33They replied, "Not for any good work, but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, have made yourself God."
34 Jesus replied, "It is written in your own law that God said to certain leaders of the people, `I say, you are gods!' 35 And you know that the Scriptures cannot be altered. So if those people, who received God's message, were called `gods,' 36 why do you call it blasphemy when the Holy One who was sent into the world by the Father says, `I am the Son of God'? 37 Don't believe me unless I carry out my Father's work. 38 But if I do his work, believe in what I have done, even if you don't believe me. Then you will realize that the Father is in me, and I am in the Father."
39 Once again they tried to arrest him, but he got away and left them.
Oh, once AGAIN the Jews claim that Jesus again made himself God!
My my my. That's twice now. Oh but wait, this is OBVIOUSLY a part of the Bible that has been corrupted by men
What was I thinking!
..but wait, I don't believe it's corrupted, as Jesus himself states in verse 35:
"And you know that the Scriptures cannot be altered."
So, the Torah can never be altered! God will not allow it!
The entire New and Old testiment = Scripture. So, therefore, IT CAN NEVER BE ALTERED!!
Not enough to convince you that within the Bible Jesus claims to be God?
Alright - You muslims claim that only God is worthy of worship, and Jesus would never allow someone to worship him?
Let's again look to John's Gospel, Chapter 9:24-39
24 So for the second time they called in the man who had been blind and told him, "Give glory to God by telling the truth, because we know Jesus is a sinner."
25 "I don't know whether he is a sinner," the man replied. "But I know this: I was blind, and now I can see!"
26 "But what did he do?" they asked. "How did he heal you?"
27 "Look!" the man exclaimed. "I told you once. Didn't you listen? Why do you want to hear it again? Do you want to become his disciples, too?"
28 Then they cursed him and said, "You are his disciple, but we are disciples of Moses. 29 We know God spoke to Moses, but as for this man, we don't know anything about him."
30 "Why, that's very strange!" the man replied. "He healed my eyes, and yet you don't know anything about him! 31 Well, God doesn't listen to sinners, but he is ready to hear those who worship him and do his will. 32 Never since the world began has anyone been able to open the eyes of someone born blind. 33 If this man were not from God, he couldn't do it."
34 "You were born in sin!" they answered. "Are you trying to teach us?" And they threw him out of the synagogue.
35 When Jesus heard what had happened, he found the man and said, "Do you believe in the Son of Man?"
36 The man answered, "Who is he, sir, because I would like to."
37 "You have seen him," Jesus said, "and he is speaking to you!"
38 "Yes, Lord," the man said, "I believe!" And he worshiped Jesus.
39 Then Jesus told him, "I have come to judge the world. I have come to give sight to the blind and to show those who think they see that they are blind."
Did Jesus stop the man from worshipping him?
No, Jesus did not. Jesus, throughout the Gospels allows people to worship him, and never stops them.
If YHWH is only to be worshipped, why would Jesus allow HIMSELF to be worshipped unless he was YHWH?
I can only come to one conclusion from the Bible. Jesus was God.
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