God did not create from nothing

Warden_of_the_Storm · 2026-07-01T15:17:28-0500

AV1611VET said:
But you're turning it into one by refusing to investigate any further than that one claim.

And why do I say that?

WARNING: Requires investigation.

23 October 4004 BC to be exact.

Sure is.

Now explain what isn't Young Earth Creationism to a T, but initially sounds like it.

WARNING: Requires investigation.

Embedded age is nothing because it means nothing and is just something you made up. It makes God out to be deceptive and somehow you're okay with that, but I and others are not.

You're a YEC, and nothing you can say will convince me or others that you aren't.

AV1611VET · 2026-07-01T15:34:33-0500

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
Embedded age is nothing because it means nothing and is just something you made up.

You wouldn't know, would you?

Especially since you're quoting me out of context.

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
It makes God out to be deceptive and somehow you're okay with that,

Is this research speaking?

Or do I hear someone thinking out of context?

Someone doesn't have the whole picture, does he?

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
... but I and others are not.

* cough *

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
You're a YEC, and nothing you can say will convince me or others that you aren't.

That's your call.

I can handle that, since you are taking me out of context and telling science to take a hike.

Warden_of_the_Storm · 2026-07-01T15:39:22-0500

AV1611VET said:
You wouldn't know, would you?

Especially since you're quoting me out of context.

Is this research speaking?

Or do I hear someone thinking out of context?

Someone doesn't have the whole picture, does he?

* cough *

That's your call.

I can handle that, since you are taking me out of context and telling science to take a hike.

Once again; science has nothing to do with what you yourself have written on these forums.

Then prove me wrong then. Show how, despite you saying in your own words that the world was created 6000 years ago, you cannot be called a Young Earth Creationist.

Refuse to do so, and I’ll continue to call you what you appear to be, and that is a YEC. Because you are one, and I see not reason not to call you one.

dlamberth · 2026-07-01T15:47:14-0500

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
Because you are one, and I see not reason not to call you one.

Agreed!!!

Ophiolite · 2026-07-01T15:54:22-0500

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
Refuse to do so, and I’ll continue to call you what you appear to be, and that is a YEC. Because you are one, and I see not reason not to call you one

dlamberth said:
Agreed!!

My stance may be subtly different, or probably just a different take on the same thing. @AV1611VET is free to think of himself as whatever he wishes and free to deny he is a YEC as often and in as many ways as he wishes. We are free to ignore this silly posturing and recognise him for what he has presented himself as.

Warden_of_the_Storm · 2026-07-01T15:55:35-0500

Ophiolite said:
My stance may be subtly different, or probably just a different take on the same thing. @AV1611VET is free to think of himself as whatever he wishes and free to deny he is a YEC as often and in as many ways as he wishes. We are free to ignore this silly posturing and recognise him for what he has presented himself as.

I would definitely call that a polite way to say it.

2PhiloVoid · 2026-07-01T15:56:37-0500

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
Embedded age is nothing because it means nothing and is just something you made up. It makes God out to be deceptive and somehow you're okay with that, but I and others are not.

You're a YEC, and nothing you can say will convince me or others that you aren't.

I'm not sure why it's worth the time to go round and round with AV about 'Embedded Age.' He's apparently made up the theory almost by himself and neither his favorite bible gurus nor his own pastor teach 'Embedded Age Theory.' He didn't even start talking about it until 2015.

He's stating that it's what he believes. .............. Isn't that right, @AV1611VET ?

Warden_of_the_Storm · 2026-07-01T15:59:02-0500

2PhiloVoid said:
I'm not sure why it's worth the time to go round and round with AV about 'Embedded Age.' He's apparently made up the theory almost by himself and neither his favorite bible gurus nor his own pastor teach 'Embedded Age Theory.'

He's stating that it's what he believes. .............. Isn't that right, @AV1611VET ?

Oh of course he can state what he wishes (obviously as long as it follows the site's rules) as can I. And if one of our statements is based on objective reality and information taken from this website, all the better.

AV1611VET · 2026-07-01T16:04:57-0500

Ophiolite said:
We are free to ignore this silly posturing and recognise him for what he has presented himself as.

For some here, that won't happen though.

To recognize me for what I have presented myself to be would take insight and removal of mental blocks.

Warden said your post was a "polite way of saying it," despite the fact that he strenuously disagrees with me.

But we'll see.

If he continues to refer to me as a YEC ... well ... so much for respect to your post.

2PhiloVoid · 2026-07-01T16:06:18-0500

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
Oh of course he can state what he wishes (obviously as long as it follows the site's rules) as can I. And if one of our statements is based on objective reality and information taken from this website, all the better.

I imagine that late at night, after he's signed-off of Christian Forums, shut the lights off and lying there with his wife, he's a little frustrated that no one will believe his insistence that God imbued the cosmos with 'embedded age.' I often wonder what his wife thinks about it all. She's probably like my wife: sort of tired of hearing half my gabbing. ^_^

But we know how these things go, I'm sure Einstein was a little frustrated at first as well when folks didn't initially believe his Theories of Relativity.

Warden_of_the_Storm · 2026-07-01T16:07:12-0500

AV1611VET said:
For some here, that won't happen though.

To recognize me for what I have presented myself to be would take insight and removal of mental blocks.

Warden said your post was a "polite way of saying it," despite the fact that he strenuously disagrees with me.

But we'll see.

If he continues to refer to me as a YEC ... well ... so much for respect to your post.

He can say what he wants and I can say what I want. Respect has nothing to do with it.

Still waiting on how you're not a YEC by the way.

AV1611VET · 2026-07-01T16:15:54-0500

2PhiloVoid said:
I'm not sure why it's worth the time to go round and round with AV about 'Embedded Age.'

But he doesn't know what he's going round and round about.

2PhiloVoid said:
He's apparently made up the theory almost by himself and neither his favorite bible gurus nor his own pastor teach 'Embedded Age Theory.'

My pastors are both YECs, but believe God embedded age into His creation.

That's where I first got that idea.

I have, to date, not discussed this with them, as I don't see it that much of an issue inside of our church.

Where I would say this or that rock is a million years old, my pastors would say they're not older than 6000 years.

I see that as a contradiction in terms, but they apparently see it differently.

2PhiloVoid said:
He didn't even start talking about it until 2015.

And I have made it clear, that if someone can give me a better term for it, I'll be glad to consider it.

Even change it, if I have to.

2PhiloVoid said:
He's stating that it's what he believes.

Yup.

2PhiloVoid said:
.............. Isn't that right, @AV1611VET ?

Affirmative.

But again, you're talking to a wall here, who has convinced himself I'm a YEC, without looking at the whole picture.

Warden_of_the_Storm · 2026-07-01T16:19:32-0500

AV1611VET said:
But he doesn't know what he's going round and round about.

My pastors are both YECs, but believe God embedded age into His creation.

That's where I first got that idea.

I have, to date, not discussed this with them, as I don't see it that much of an issue inside of our church.

Where I would say this or that rock is a million years old, my pastors would say they're not older than 6000 years.

I see that as a contradiction in terms, but they apparently see it differently.

And I have made it clear, that if someone can give me a better term for it, I'll be glad to consider it.

Even change it, if I have to.

Yup.

Affirmative.

But again, you're talking to a wall here, who has convinced himself I'm a YEC, without looking at the whole picture.

I'm still waiting for you to show me how you cannot be called a Young Earth Creationist. Just saying that you're not one does nothing at all.

2PhiloVoid · 2026-07-01T16:23:58-0500

AV1611VET said:
But he doesn't know what he's going round and round about.

My pastors are both YECs, but believe God embedded age into His creation.

That's where I first got that idea.

I have, to date, not discussed this with them, as I don't see it that much of an issue inside of our church.

Where I would say this or that rock is a million years old, my pastors would say they're not older than 6000 years.

I see that as a contradiction in terms, but they apparently see it differently.

And I have made it clear, that if someone can give me a better term for it, I'll be glad to consider it.

Even change it, if I have to.

Yup.

Affirmative.

But again, you're talking to a wall here, who has convinced himself I'm a YEC, without looking at the whole picture.

Well, AV, I don't know what to tell you. I understand that you hold your own essentially personally thought out Embedded 'Deep' Age theory, and if that floats your boat, which apparently it does, then that neither takes the shirt off my back nor chaffs my hide.

But, I'm not sure why it's important to get others to acknowledge your position which is essentially your own interpolation about God's Creation.

Everyone here who wants to be a Christian or who feels even the tiniest draw to believe the Genesis Creation account is going to make heads or tales out of it the best that they can. But I also think shaming each other for not understanding or accepting our respective, individual interpretive positions isn't going to necessarily make us better Christians or ............... here's the kicker ................. save anyone.

AV1611VET · 2026-07-01T16:27:46-0500

2PhiloVoid said:
I imagine that late at night, after he's signed-off of Christian Forums, shut the lights off and lying there with his wife, he's a little frustrated that no one will believe his insistence that God imbued the cosmos with 'embedded age.'

Actually I'm the type to go tell others what mental blocks do to people.

A lot of my conversations at banquets start with, "You know what evolutionists say about [insert doctrine here]?"

Another example is ...

AV: Jesus didn't walk on water.
Church member: Wha...???
AV: No -- it violates buoyancy laws!
[eyes roll and then give way to looks of sorrow and head shaking]

2PhiloVoid said:
I often wonder what his wife thinks about it all.

My wife is a YEC.

2PhiloVoid said:
She's probably like my wife: sort of tired of hearing half my gabbing.

That's about it.

2PhiloVoid said:
But we know how these things go,

I doubt it.

2PhiloVoid said:
I'm sure Einstein was a little frustrated at first as well when folks didn't initially believe his Theories of Relativity.

Two questions:

1. What did they call him?
2. Did they take the attitude science can take a hike (out of context)?

AV1611VET · 2026-07-01T16:30:50-0500

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
He can say what he wants and I can say what I want.

Yup.

And I'll observe and report, if you're interested.

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
Respect has nothing to do with it.

Nor politeness?

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
Still waiting on how you're not a YEC by the way.

No doubt.

Platte · 2026-07-01T16:47:37-0500

2PhiloVoid said:
I'm not sure why it's worth the time to go round and round with AV about 'Embedded Age.' He's apparently made up the theory almost by himself and neither his favorite bible gurus nor his own pastor teach 'Embedded Age Theory.' He didn't even start talking about it until 2015.

He's stating that it's what he believes. .............. Isn't that right, @AV1611VET ?

Is there a way to Create a functional Earth without age? Based on Genesis, Its obvious Adam was created with age isn't it?

Platte · 2026-07-01T16:49:31-0500

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
I'm still waiting for you to show me how you cannot be called a Young Earth Creationist. Just saying that you're not one does nothing at all.

How can you be a Young Earth Creationist if you don't believe the Earth is Young?

2PhiloVoid · 2026-07-01T16:56:39-0500

AV1611VET said:
Actually I'm the type to go tell others what mental blocks do to people.

AV, you might consider that some of your own perspective and personal feelings about the malignancy of evolutionary theory stems from your deeper involvement in Cold War era politics and the Vietnam War.

I respect the fact that you're a military veteran, but some of the ways in which evolution has been characterized by Literal Bible Christians comes from over emphasizing how evolutionary theory has been gerrymandered and then played out in certain political realms (like in China, Vietnam and Korea, Russia) through bad philosophical outlooks like Neo-Marxism (and Communism), Nietzschean Nihilism and Social Darwinism (e.g. Nazis)..... but these outcomes only partly soil the veracity of evolutionary science. They don't despoil the whole thing.

It really goes back to how some people---ignorant people---have tended to use evolutionary theory for this or that politically contrived ideology.

AV1611VET said:
A lot of my conversations at banquets start with, "You know what evolutionists say about [insert doctrine here]?"

I'm sure you're a gas at those banquets, AV.

AV1611VET said:
Another example is ...

AV: Jesus didn't walk on water.
Church member: Wha...???
AV: No -- it violates buoyancy laws!
[eyes roll and then give way to looks of sorrow and head shaking]

Actually, Jesus' walking on the water belongs to a different era of historiography and isn't really parallel in epistemic nuance to the Creation account of Genesis 1. Moses and Jesus lived in two different periods, where both literature, history and the sciences of their times were different.

So, if some idiot deems that they can simply spout off that "there's no way Jesus could have walked on water because .......... Physics prevents it," we all know that person isn't dealing with a full deck. So...........I wouldn't be using that as 'another example' at those banquets.

AV1611VET said:
Two questions:

1. What did they call him?
2. Did they take the attitude science can take a hike (out of context)?

Initially, fellow scientists characterized Einstein's theories as "scientific dada." ^_^

Hans Blaster · 2026-07-01T17:27:10-0500

2PhiloVoid said:
So, if some idiot deems that they can simply spout off that "there's no way Jesus could have walked on water because .......... Physics prevents it," we all know that person isn't dealing with a full deck. So...........I wouldn't be using that as 'another example' at those banquets.

It just doesn't get cold enough to walk on. Me, walking on the lakes back home... definitely did that.

God did not create from nothing

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SCIENCE CAN TAKE A HIKE

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Recalcitrant Procrastinating Ape

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As I figure it, what comes around....

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SCIENCE CAN TAKE A HIKE

As I figure it, what comes around....

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SCIENCE CAN TAKE A HIKE

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As I figure it, what comes around....

SCIENCE CAN TAKE A HIKE

SCIENCE CAN TAKE A HIKE

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As I figure it, what comes around....

Reconstruction 3 will come

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