Chatting with a street evangelist

PloverWing · Friday at 1:16 PM

I was parking the car yesterday to go into the bank, and I saw a street evangelist standing at the large intersection near the parking lot. (Photo posted below, cropped to show only his sign but not the evangelist himself, to protect his privacy.) I've seen him before; he stands with his sign on the walkway at my university many days, just outside my office window, and he also shows up each year across the street from our town's Pride Festival.

And I decided to go over and talk to him.

I'm feeling I need to reach across the divide and see if we can meet each other as human beings. We mostly discussed whether a list of sins is the best way to draw people to Christ (and we still disagreed on this at the end of the conversation). There was a bit of dueling Bible verses, a bit of grace vs repentance, and a bit of (the obvious, given the sign) dispute over whether gay people can be Christians.

We didn't come to any agreements, and I didn't realistically expect us to. But maybe I have a little better understanding of what drives him to stand by the road day after day with that sign. He feels he needs to warn people about God, and I can see that as a caring act. I don't know if he came to any understanding of me or my point of view.

I'm planning to greet him by name when I walk by him on campus this fall, ask how he's doing, maybe chat a little more, try to build some kind of relationship. The body of Christ, in all its diversity, is so hard, but it's our calling.

d taylor · Friday at 1:41 PM

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Ask this person "how does a person become a born again child of God". If this person answers any answer beside belief in Jesus, then they believe in a work based way to God.

PloverWing · Friday at 3:19 PM

d taylor said:
Ask this person "how does a person become a born again child of God". If this person answers any answer beside belief in Jesus, then they believe in a work based way to God.

Interesting question to ask. Maybe I'll ask him when I see him on campus in September.

Akita Suggagaki · Friday at 4:00 PM

PloverWing said:
He feels he needs to warn people about God, and I can see that as a caring act. I don't know if he came to any understanding of me or my point of view.

What is your point of view and how does it differ from his?

1Tonne · Friday at 4:56 PM

d taylor said:
Ask this person "how does a person become a born again child of God". If this person answers any answer beside belief in Jesus, then they believe in a work based way to God.

Agreed. It is by putting our trust in Him. But there are many who call Him Lord and continue in sin, and Jesus says that He never knew them. So, a believer will have actions that show he is a believer. The fruit will be that he loves righteousness. So, through belief we are saved but those who believe will be changed.

PloverWing said:
We mostly discussed whether a list of sins is the best way to draw people to Christ

We do need to warn people about their sin. (Many Christians avoid this) When doing this, we need to do it with much wisdom and also, gentleness and respect.
Personally, I would not use a sign like this, but by seeing that sign, people may start to think about their sins.
Sometimes, true love is to point out people's faults in the hope that they will leave their sins.

1Tonne · Friday at 5:07 PM

PloverWing said:
dispute over whether gay people can be Christian

Of course, a gay person can be saved if he believes. But if he believes and continues to break God's law because he loves his sin, then he is on a very slippery slope. We are justified by works and not by faith alone. So, belief without works is dead.

PloverWing · Friday at 11:02 PM

Akita Suggagaki said:
What is your point of view and how does it differ from his?

It's a good question, and I'm finding it hard to put my answer into words.

To address the obvious, I'm LGBTQ-affirming, so the evangelist and I disagree there. (And, following CF rules, we can't discuss this in further detail.)

But I don't think it's just that. Suppose his sign had a different list of sinners to exclude: Galatians 5:19-21, say, or Revelation 21:8. So now it's sins like quarrelling, anger, jealousy, lying, and I picture a sign saying that God rejects these people. I think that still hits my gut the same way.

I think it is wonderful that God -- the creator of the universe, who cares about everything that was made, and who entered into the creation as a human being to heal our brokenness and to transform us into what God had always wanted us to be -- invites us into communion with God. The Christian life can be a good one. But I'm often in conversation with atheists and other non-Christians who see Christianity as making people worse -- meaner, crueler to the neighbors around them. I try to make the case to them that you can be kind and compassionate even if you're a Christian, that Jesus talked at length about love of neighbor, including your enemies, and including people who cannot pay you back. And then the guy with the sign walks through the campus, and we're back to Christianity being about rejecting people.

Maybe different approaches work for different people. Maybe there are folks who look at a sign like that and say "I had no idea that idolatry was bad. I'm going to get rid of my Dancing Shiva statue right away! I love Jesus so much now!" But that wouldn't be my reaction.

During our conversation, the evangelist did ask me what I thought he should put on his sign (because I clearly didn't like his). I don't have a good answer yet, but I think I'd want something inviting, something that suggests that God is good and Christianity is good. Maybe "Come unto me, all ye that labor and are heavy-laden, and I will give you rest" or some similar verse. If I had to express the love of God for the universe in one sentence on one sign, what would it be? A worthwhile question, which I will have to ponder.

1Tonne · 2025-08-09T00:04:16-0500

PloverWing said:
But I'm often in conversation with atheists and other non-Christians who see Christianity as making people worse -- meaner, crueler to the neighbors around them. I try to make the case to them that you can be kind and compassionate even if you're a Christian, that Jesus talked at length about love of neighbor, including your enemies, and including people who cannot pay you back. And then the guy with the sign walks through the campus, and we're back to Christianity being about rejecting people.

Yes. There will be some people who disagree with his sign. And his sign may even make some people angry. But the sign speaks the truth, and as well as those who get angry, there will also be some who see it and their conscience may be pricked. Though the Law comes the knowledge of sin.

He is like a man ploughing up the hard ground of the heart with the Law, making it ready for the seed that we need to sown; the Gospel. So, since he has done the hard work by ploughing up the hard ground, if another Christian comes along and shares the Gospel, the seed may go in and much growth may happen.
So, pray for his ministry

PloverWing · 2025-08-09T00:27:59-0500

1Tonne said:
He is like a man ploughing up the hard ground of the heart with the Law, making it ready for the seed that we need to sown; the Gospel. So, since he has done the hard work by ploughing up the hard ground, if another Christian comes along and shares the Gospel, the seed may go in and much growth may happen.
So, pray for his ministry

To me, it seems more like he's planting weeds in the flower garden, and I'm concerned that the flowers are going to get choked out by the weeds.
But I am already praying for him as my fellow Christian. He has enthusiasm and a desire to serve God, and that is something God can use.

1Tonne · 2025-08-09T02:22:47-0500

PloverWing said:
To me, it seems more like he's planting weeds in the flower garden, and I'm concerned that the flowers are going to get choked out by the weeds.
But I am already praying for him as my fellow Christian. He has enthusiasm and a desire to serve God, and that is something God can use.

Many will not like the scripture written on the sign. Many also did not like it when Jesus or the disciples pointed out others' sins, either. We just need to be careful when doing it.

d taylor · 2025-08-09T06:59:10-0500

PloverWing said:
To me, it seems more like he's planting weeds in the flower garden, and I'm concerned that the flowers are going to get choked out by the weeds.
But I am already praying for him as my fellow Christian. He has enthusiasm and a desire to serve God, and that is something God can use.

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If this person has never believed in Jesus for God's free gift of Eternal Life. Then he is just a person holding up a sign.

Akita Suggagaki · 2025-08-09T08:19:57-0500

PloverWing said:
It's a good question, and I'm finding it hard to put my answer into words.

To address the obvious, I'm LGBTQ-affirming, so the evangelist and I disagree there. (And, following CF rules, we can't discuss this in further detail.)

But I don't think it's just that. Suppose his sign had a different list of sinners to exclude: Galatians 5:19-21, say, or Revelation 21:8. So now it's sins like quarrelling, anger, jealousy, lying, and I picture a sign saying that God rejects these people. I think that still hits my gut the same way.

I think it is wonderful that God -- the creator of the universe, who cares about everything that was made, and who entered into the creation as a human being to heal our brokenness and to transform us into what God had always wanted us to be -- invites us into communion with God. The Christian life can be a good one. But I'm often in conversation with atheists and other non-Christians who see Christianity as making people worse -- meaner, crueler to the neighbors around them. I try to make the case to them that you can be kind and compassionate even if you're a Christian, that Jesus talked at length about love of neighbor, including your enemies, and including people who cannot pay you back. And then the guy with the sign walks through the campus, and we're back to Christianity being about rejecting people.

Maybe different approaches work for different people. Maybe there are folks who look at a sign like that and say "I had no idea that idolatry was bad. I'm going to get rid of my Dancing Shiva statue right away! I love Jesus so much now!" But that wouldn't be my reaction.

During our conversation, the evangelist did ask me what I thought he should put on his sign (because I clearly didn't like his). I don't have a good answer yet, but I think I'd want something inviting, something that suggests that God is good and Christianity is good. Maybe "Come unto me, all ye that labor and are heavy-laden, and I will give you rest" or some similar verse. If I had to express the love of God for the universe in one sentence on one sign, what would it be? A worthwhile question, which I will have to ponder.

I see what you mean. The Kingdom of God involves a great deal more than avoiding sexual sin.

How about Matthew 25:41-43?
“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’

We often blow that off, don't we?

But even Jesus started on a more positive note:
3 “Blessed are the poor in spirit,
for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
4 Blessed are those who mourn,
for they will be comforted.
5 Blessed are the meek,
for they will inherit the earth.
6 Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness,
for they will be filled.
7 Blessed are the merciful,
for they will be shown mercy.
8 Blessed are the pure in heart,
for they will see God.
9 Blessed are the peacemakers,
for they will be called children of God.
10 Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness,

Now that would get my attention.

PloverWing · 2025-08-09T10:18:20-0500

d taylor said:
If this person has never believed in Jesus for God's free gift of Eternal Life. Then he is just a person holding up a sign.

I have no reason to doubt this person's Christian faith. He is a Christian with whom I disagree.

d taylor · 2025-08-09T11:34:15-0500

PloverWing said:
I have no reason to doubt this person's Christian faith. He is a Christian with whom I disagree.

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Well my post is not baseless. What verse does he have on his sign, a verse that is addressed to believers and dealing with their inheritance (loss or gain) in the kingdom of God. The verse is not addressing unbelievers entering the kingdom of God.

Entering is not the same as inherent. Jesus did not say inherent through the door, He said enter through the door. Which is only done by belief in Jesus and not by the many actions people attempt to do in their life.

And He said to them, “Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able. When once the Master of the house has risen up and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and knock at the door, saying, ‘Lord, Lord, open for us,’ and He will answer and say to you, ‘I do not know you, where you are from,’ then you will begin to say, ‘We ate and drank in Your presence, and You taught in our streets.’ But He will say, ‘I tell you I do not know you, where you are from. Depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity.’ There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, and yourselves thrust out. They will come from the east and the west, from the north and the south, and sit down in the kingdom of God. And indeed there are last who will be first, and there are first who will be last.”

Another verse about entering

“Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.

So on the surface of your post and not actually knowing the full extent of this persons message and knowing who his targeted audence is (unbelievers or believers), but seeing what verse he is using.

I believe this person believes in a very legalistic way back to God. Which is not a belief in Jesus for Eternal Life focused message.

So if he believes in a faith in Jesus for Eternal Life message for unbelievers, why preach using 1 Corinthians 9. which does not mention belief in Jesus for Eternal Life at all.

Gregory Thompson · 2025-08-09T11:46:26-0500

Akita Suggagaki said:
I see what you mean. The Kingdom of God involves a great deal more than avoiding sexual sin.

Yeah, if libido fulfillment is not replaced with the Holy Spirit, (when avoiding sexual sin is the goal) then it just follows the repressed behavioral modification script. When something is repressed it just gets worse until it explodes.

Akita Suggagaki · 2025-08-09T11:50:18-0500

Gregory Thompson said:
Yeah, if libido fulfillment is not replaced with the Holy Spirit, (when avoiding sexual sin is the goal) then it just follows the repressed behavioral modification script. When something is repressed it just gets worse until it explodes.

Repressed and projected back out at others.

Gregory Thompson · 2025-08-09T11:53:00-0500

Akita Suggagaki said:
Repressed and projected back out at others.

Yes, that would be more relevant to the OP.

1Tonne · 2025-08-09T16:57:29-0500

d taylor said:
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If this person has never believed in Jesus for God's free gift of Eternal Life. Then he is just a person holding up a sign.

Also, if a person chooses to believe but still lives in their sin, then they are in big trouble.

d taylor said:
-

Well my post is not baseless. What verse does he have on his sign, a verse that is addressed to believers and dealing with their inheritance (loss or gain) in the kingdom of God. The verse is not addressing unbelievers entering the kingdom of God.

Entering is not the same as inherent. Jesus did not say inherent through the door, He said enter through the door. Which is only done by belief in Jesus and not by the many actions people attempt to do in their life.

And He said to them, “Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able. When once the Master of the house has risen up and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and knock at the door, saying, ‘Lord, Lord, open for us,’ and He will answer and say to you, ‘I do not know you, where you are from,’ then you will begin to say, ‘We ate and drank in Your presence, and You taught in our streets.’ But He will say, ‘I tell you I do not know you, where you are from. Depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity.’ There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, and yourselves thrust out. They will come from the east and the west, from the north and the south, and sit down in the kingdom of God. And indeed there are last who will be first, and there are first who will be last.”

Another verse about entering

“Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.

So on the surface of your post and not actually knowing the full extent of this persons message and knowing who his targeted audence is (unbelievers or believers), but seeing what verse he is using.

I believe this person believes in a very legalistic way back to God. Which is not a belief in Jesus for Eternal Life focused message.

So if he believes in a faith in Jesus for Eternal Life message for unbelievers, why preach using 1 Corinthians 9. which does not mention belief in Jesus for Eternal Life at all.

The problem with your understanding is you are restricting the definition of metanoia (“repent”) to mean only “change your mind” in an abstract sense, while ignoring the context of how it’s used in Scripture. Yes, the word literally means a change of mind, but in biblical usage that change is moral and directional, turning from sin to God.
-In Luke 24:47, Jesus says that “repentance for the forgiveness of sins” should be preached to all nations. If repentance is just changing your mind without dealing with sin, then why link it with forgiveness of sins?
-In Acts 26:20, Paul says he preached “that they should repent, turn to God, and do works befitting repentance.” This shows repentance involves more than intellectual belief, it’s a heart change that produces a changed life.
-In 1 Thessalonians 1:9, Paul describes conversion as “turning to God from idols.” That’s repentance in action, a change of mind so deep that it results in a change of life.

When Jesus said, “Repent and believe the gospel” (Mark 1:15), He was not calling for bare mental assent. He was calling for a whole-life turning to Him in faith, which by nature means turning away from sin. That’s why the apostles could preach both “repent” and “believe” without contradiction; they are two sides of the same coin.
By this biblical definition, the evangelist’s message is sound: faith in Jesus and a real turning from sin are both essential to salvation.

Gregory Thompson · 2025-08-09T17:49:49-0500

Think of it like this, it's just a parable, so it follows until it doesn't.

Jesus wants to translate us to a new heaven and a new earth without sin.

So any sin within us will read as corrupted data.

So when we are "saved" think of it as a file of data that can be transferred to the new environment.

The evangelist question is for the "saved" is how saved are you?

Chatting with a street evangelist

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