The Seven Mountains Mandate or Dominionism?

PatrickTate said:

I think that you are absolutely correct!

I plead guilty to being lukewarm and somewhat backslidden, as were the issues in the Laodicean Era of the Bride of Messiah Yeshua - Jesus, the Church and also were there even in the Apostolic or Ephesian Era.

If the Holy Spirit is given to me in a greater measure then surely I will become less lukewarm and less backslidden?

If I improve and manifest more of the Holy Spirit then people around me will benefit and I will pray for them a lot more and do so more effectively.

Former Atheist Howard Storm who had a near death experience was shown how important it is that we allow the Holy Spirit to speak through us and work through us.

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Again, I would use caution when following the advice of anyone to "make yourself into Jesus." That's really not the Gospel. We can't "make me" any better than we really are. We are not the same as Jesus. We're sinners. We're not God. That's kind of the whole point of coming to grips with God, meaning we're not God.

God can make us anything He want's but it's not going to be an exact replica of God who has always existed. To believe that is simply delusional. There is a line drawn between The Creator and the creation. These are simply not the same.

Most of us start out our believing lives worshiping our own imaginations of what or who God is and what God might or might not do. Fact is, we can't possibly imagine. God is well beyond our petty imaginations.

And rightfully so.

Even all the NDE stories, the entire sum of them, will never come close to even remotely describing the Wonders of God. And a lot of them will even say so. Word's just can't describe....because God is beyond all of that.

I am content to let my mind wander, endlessly, about that subject. But the minute I try to pin God down, I lose.

It's like a lot of professional chess players are now saying about playing chess with AI. None of them can actually win against the AI competitor. The best they can do is to learn new and untested, even unseen before strategies to use against other non AI human competitors, but the AI competitor is beyond winning against at this point. And the game is likely to remain that way, with a permanent line between the AI and the human. That's kind of how God is.

There's a Divine Message there, with AI. We're not even as good as a computer. The best we can do is to share in a bit of the pie.

David Lamb said:

However did you get that from my post? I didn't even mention the authority of Jesus. I thought this thread was about something called the Seven Mountains Mandate, which says that Christians have the mandate to assume authority over seven named aspects of life, such as governments, education and families. To avoid any further confusion on thos point, I assure you that I fully believe in the authority of Jesus Christ, Who is King of kings and Lord of lords.

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Dominion should not be interpreted as domination. It is really stewardship over creation and (in Genesis 1) was given to all human beings, not just to an elect.

DavidS said:

Dominion should not be interpreted as domination. It is really stewardship over creation and (in Genesis 1) was given to all human beings, not just to an elect.

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I agree with that.

PatrickTate said:

I think that you are absolutely correct!

I plead guilty to being lukewarm and somewhat backslidden, as were the issues in the Laodicean Era of the Bride of Messiah Yeshua - Jesus, the Church and also were there even in the Apostolic or Ephesian Era.

If the Holy Spirit is given to me in a greater measure then surely I will become less lukewarm and less backslidden?

If I improve and manifest more of the Holy Spirit then people around me will benefit and I will pray for them a lot more and do so more effectively.

Former Atheist Howard Storm who had a near death experience was shown how important it is that we allow the Holy Spirit to speak through us and work through us.

Howard Storm's Near-Death Experience - Near-Death Experiences and the Afterlife

Near-Death Experiences and the Afterlife profiles Howard Storm's Near-Death Experience . Did you enjoy reading this post, we have more!

near-death.com

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The Holy Spirit speaks and works through us because we are members of the corporate body of Christ. In Matt. 18:19 Jesus tells us that when even as few as two or three Christians, gathered together, agree on what to pray for, that prayer will be answered. In the following verse, Jesus explains why - because whenever Christians (even if just two or three in number) gather together in the name of Jesus, Jesus himself will be present. I interpret this to imply that the presence of Jesus (indwelling each Christian through the Holy Spirit) will guide their thoughts into conformity with the will of the Father. This is no superficial agreement (not an agreement for the sake of agreeing) but an agreement following an inward conviction (itself brought about by the Holy Spirit) as to what the will of God on the matter being prayed for really is.
This is broadly how Quaker meetings for church business work. Quakers call these "worship meetings for business" to indicate that their members gather in an attitude of worship which includes listening prayer with special attention to the discernment of God's will on practical matters concerning the church community. When a possible word from God is received, all members of the meeting hold it before God and if all members of the meeting become convicted that it is truly God's will, the matter in question is accepted. If there is no consensus agreement, the matter is prayed about until further clarification is received through the Holy Spirit.
In my opinion (and I feel led to this opinion by God) similar meetings of silent listening prayer and discernment held by Christians in business firms, political gatherings and so forth for all the seven spheres would result in the true hearing of God's will for both prayer and practical conduct of the different spheres. Just as the prophets spoke to kings and other leaders in Old Testament Israel, so these groups would speak to those with authority within the different spheres. Indeed, because the meetings would not "speak" until Holy-Spirit-agreement was reached, we could truly say that Jesus himself would be speaking through the meetings.
I suggest that those who are able, might promote such meetings in the spheres within which they are associated.

BelieveItOarKnot said:

Again, I would use caution when following the advice of anyone to "make yourself into Jesus." That's really not the Gospel. We can't "make me" any better than we really are. We are not the same as Jesus. We're sinners. We're not God. That's kind of the whole point of coming to grips with God, meaning we're not God.

God can make us anything He want's but it's not going to be an exact replica of God who has always existed. To believe that is simply delusional. There is a line drawn between The Creator and the creation. These are simply not the same.

Most of us start out our believing lives worshiping our own imaginations of what or who God is and what God might or might not do. Fact is, we can't possibly imagine. God is well beyond our petty imaginations.

And rightfully so.

Even all the NDE stories, the entire sum of them, will never come close to even remotely describing the Wonders of God. And a lot of them will even say so. Word's just can't describe....because God is beyond all of that.

I am content to let my mind wander, endlessly, about that subject. But the minute I try to pin God down, I lose.

It's like a lot of professional chess players are now saying about playing chess with AI. None of them can actually win against the AI competitor. The best they can do is to learn new and untested, even unseen before strategies to use against other non AI human competitors, but the AI competitor is beyond winning against at this point. And the game is likely to remain that way, with a permanent line between the AI and the human. That's kind of how God is.

There's a Divine Message there, with AI. We're not even as good as a computer. The best we can do is to share in a bit of the pie.

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And you mention the Gospel , and will you explain what the. Gospel is. found and what it means ??

dan p

Dan Perez said:

And you mention the Gospel , and will you explain what the. Gospel is. found and what it means ??

dan p

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Matt. 4:4, Luke 4:4, Deut. 8:3

BelieveItOarKnot said:

Matt. 4:4, Luke 4:4, Deut. 8:3

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And there is. the "

# 1 There the Gospel of Matthew

# 2 The Gospel of. Mark

# 3. Gospel of Luke

# 4 Gospel of. John

# 5. God's Gospel in Rom 1:1

# 6 The. Everlasting Gospel in the Revelation

# 7 GOSPEL OF THE GRACE OF GOD

# 8 THE GOSPEL OF YOUR SALVATION Eph 1:13

# Some say that they are BORN AGAIN , in. John 3:3 and 4

dan p

Dan Perez said:

And there is. the "

# 1 There the Gospel of Matthew

# 2 The Gospel of. Mark

# 3. Gospel of Luke

# 4 Gospel of. John

# 5. God's Gospel in Rom 1:1

# 6 The. Everlasting Gospel in the Revelation

# 7 GOSPEL OF THE GRACE OF GOD

# 8 THE GOSPEL OF YOUR SALVATION Eph 1:13

dan p

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Are you suggesting that those are 8 separate, different gospels?

I'm struggling to understand how the thread title, poll, and OP fit together.

Do I believe that our prayers are meaningful and God can use our prayers or help shape us through our prayers? Sure. Prayer isn't just wishful thinking; but neither is prayer magic.

But that has nothing to do Dominionism/Seven Mountains stuff. Which I consider to not only be bad theology and false teaching, but deeply troubling and spiritually dangerous doctrine that leads us radically afar from Christ. What does it profit a man to gain the whole world but forfeit his soul?

-CryptoLutheran

PatrickTate said:

Our words have great power....
that is one of the first things that near death experiencer Kevin Zadai was told by Jesus.

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There's no reason to believe Mr. Zadai was told anything by Jesus.

Jesus never taught us that that our words have power. Instead He taught us that we should use our words to build others up, to bless and not curse. To bless is not to have power, but to bend ourselves in love to desire the good of someone--even the one who curses us, or would shame us, it means loving even our enemies; those that wish us harm. If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn and offer the other as well. If someone wishes evil on you, do not respond with the same attitude and disposition, but rather be merciful even as our Father is merciful who sends His rain on the just and unjust alike, who is gracious and kind to the thankless and the wicked.

I can't change the hairs on my head through the words I speak. But I do have the choice to say something in love, or to say something in hate. To say something in anger, or to say something in kindness. To say something that tears down, or say something that encourages. With my words I can say something knowledgeable and which builds wisdom, or I can say something foolish; my words can be used to teach truth, or to perpetuate falsehood. With my words I can call someone "brother" or I can call someone "raka". I can rebuke error, I can teach truth, I can praise God, I can bless my fellow human beings made in God's image, or I can sin. But my words can't add a dollar to my bank account, add a hair to my balding head, or make me stop sneezing when allergy season hits.

With words Dr. Martin Luther King Jr inspired millions toward seeking racial and social justice.
With words Adolf Hitler poisoned the mind of millions to hate Jews, Communists, Socialists, Trade Unionists, Roma, homosexuals, and the disabled.

With words my pastor proclaims, in sermon, the beautiful and soothing Word of the Gospel of Jesus Christ and proclaims my sins are forgiven in the Sacrament of Holy Absolution in Christ's Holy Name.
With words the heretics of old drove men away from Christ and preached false gospels that ruined lives and tore hope away from those in need of hope.

But Dr. King couldn't magically end racism. Hitler couldn't magically exterminate everyone he hated. My pastor can't save me. And heretics can't change the truth of the Gospel.

Words are words, it's how we use them that matters. St. James tells us that from the same tongue comes blessing and cursing, with it we praise God our Father, and with it we disparage human beings made in God's Image. Such is the untamed wild beast that is the tongue--no power, but words do matter. I can use a hammer to build a house, or I can use a hammer to injure someone; but a hammer is just a hammer.

-CryptoLutheran

Dan Perez said:

And there is. the "

# 1 There the Gospel of Matthew

# 2 The Gospel of. Mark

# 3. Gospel of Luke

# 4 Gospel of. John

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Which are Accounts of the singular Gospel of Jesus Christ--His life, death, and resurrection and what God has done through Him, the Good News of God's reign through His Messiah in which He has put death to death, and lifted up the lowly, brought freedom to the captives.

That is why the full titles of these books are The Gospel according to Matthew, the Gospel according to Mark, etc.

Dan Perez said:

# 5. God's Gospel in Rom 1:1

# 6 The. Everlasting Gospel in the Revelation

# 7 GOSPEL OF THE GRACE OF GOD

# 8 THE GOSPEL OF YOUR SALVATION Eph 1:13

dan p

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Which are all the same Gospel. The one and singular Gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God, born of the Virgin, who lived, taught, suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified dead and buried, who rose on the third day, and who ascended into the heavens and is seated at the right hand of the Father from whence He will come again to judge the living and the dead--His kingdom shall never end. This is the Good News of God's Kingdom, the reign of God through His Messiah, where the least is greatest.

-CryptoLutheran

David Lamb said:

Are you suggesting that those are 8 separate, different gospels?

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And should know a basic. meaning of what gospel means , Good Tiding or GOOD NEWS

and Paul,s good news was the Body of Christ as today we are saved by Grace , ONLY , and many believe

that you are saved by Keeping the Law

And some say that they are saved by Water Baptism

Some by being Born Again , John 3 :3

Some are saved by the New Covenant

What say you ??

dan p

Dan Perez said:

And should know a basic. meaning of what gospel means , Good Tiding or GOOD NEWS

and Paul,s good news was the Body of Christ as today we are saved by Grace , ONLY , and many believe

that you are saved by Keeping the Law

And some say that they are saved by Water Baptism

Some by being Born Again , John 3 :3

Some are saved by the New Covenant

What say you ??

dan p

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Thanks. Yes I did know that "gospel" comes from old English words meaning "good news."

I agree that we are saved by grace. The law doesn't save - it shows us that we are sinners. Yes we must be born again to be saved, but as Ephesians 2 says, the new life we have is a result of God's grace.

I don't know a lot about Dominionism or Seven Story Mandate. What images and language did Jesus use in his teaching and parables of the Kingdom : Salt and Light - Leaven in a batch of dough (Matthew 13)

I can think of christians in the arts and contemporary music who seek to be salt and light, eg. Michael W Smith, there are many others including lots session musicians. MWS had a crossover hit with Place in this World back in the 1990s. I am not sure the idea of converting society from the top down is what the Parable of the Leaven is about.

dms1972 said:

I don't know a lot about Dominionism or Seven Story Mandate. What images and language did Jesus use in his teaching and parables of the Kingdom : Salt and Light - Leaven in a batch of dough (Matthew 13)

I can think of christians in the arts and contemporary music who seek to be salt and light, eg. Michael W Smith, there are many others including lots session musicians. MWS had a crossover hit with Place in this World back in the 1990s. I am not sure the idea of converting society from the top down is what the Parable of the Leaven is about.

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Everything in Jesus' teaching about the kingdom shows us that it is never top-down. It's not our job to build the kingdom; because the kingdom is already built--it is built in the bloody cross and empty tomb of Jesus, and He reigns at the right hand of the Father; the kingdom does not look like Caesar arrayed in purple, it looks like the Lamb of God slain before the foundation of the world. The kingdom does not look like the wealthy in their palaces of gold, it looks like lepers and prostitutes and tax collectors being told they are loved and forgiven and that they matter. The kingdom does not look like like someone standing tall and on top; it looks like a slave scrubbing floors.

The kingdom looks like a cross. The kingdom looks like a crown of thorns. The kingdom is where the greatest is the slave.

All forms of Dominionism and Triumphalism fundamentally deny the kingdom of God.
What does the Apostle say? When he spoke of having a thorn in his flesh, the Lord said to him, "My grace is sufficient for you, My strength is made present in weakness."

It is in suffering and weakness and smallness, not glory, that God shows Himself. Those who pursue glory will find a house built on a foundation of sand, and treasure that is rust and moth-food. Instead, "Store up treasures in heaven" Desire godliness, desire holiness, desire humility, and smallness.

Recall the Prophet Elijah who did not find God in the whirlwind, or in the earthquake, or in the blazing fire--but in the small insignificant whisper.

-CryptoLutheran

I don’t support dominionism or the mandate as its presented. But I see parallels with other groups who’ve employed the same for their own purposes. Nevertheless, there are elements one can utilize as a framework of sorts for related activities in one’s vocation as instruments of light or influence. And while we’re tasked to be beacons for the world the scope of our assignment and endowment of gifts will differ. That’s the principle I’ve adopted for my walk.

It isn’t heavy handed or dependent on questionable teachings. It’s simply the recognition of the places the Lord enabled me to make an impact and where they align categorically so to speak. The bulk of my gifts fall within the arenas of commerce, leadership and communication. As a result, I’m continually seeking ways to develop my skills and pursue opportunities within that sphere which may have a limited presence of believers or many working behind the scenes. The goal is anointed work which demonstrates kingdom principles in its makeup and function.

I view the ideal trilaterally. Both in the familial, marketplace and community and see my position as more of an ambassador than not. That’s why I don’t seek a role within christian organizations. I’m best suited in other settings. There’s the obvious within those parameters that references interests and the like. My work is centered in the media and arts and those are the areas where I’ve invested the bulk of my energy. On a service level that would entail engagement with a board, committee or fundraising initiative for the entity in question. And there’s a comparable degree of patronage. That’s what business does ideally. It pours into the community for its betterment.

Where I differ from most is how it looks. Just because I’m a believer doesn’t mean the bulk of my resources should go to christian organizations nor is that my mission. There’s specific things I want to support that aren’t a reflection of felt needs per se. But they’re equally important in our society and well aligned with my passions. Taking that from the singular and making it a familial task that everyone champions is our aim and legacy.

In respect to dominion, I view it in its truest context. An area of responsibility where I’ve been given authority to execute those qualities for the Lord. Rulership in that capacity doesn’t necessitate command nor are the whole beholden beyond their will. If they wish to listen and heed what comes forth that’s fine. But I won’t twist their arms or browbeat them. I’m a big proponent of example. The best way to make a difference is by exemplifying His principles not talking others to death.

As for the mountains from a categoric perspective, I think it’s worthwhile to form alliances with people from other sectors. You get a different vantage point and greater insight on the world. While I have no attraction to politicians for instance, I’m not opposed to building connections with individuals in that sphere and that holds true for the rest. I have no interest in perpetuating a christian bubble or limiting my associations to believers alone. I’m needed elsewhere and I know it.

Theology notwithstanding, the people most attracted to this ideology are your movers and shakers and I don’t use the term as a derogative. There’s definite personalities that would find it appealing which isn’t the result of ego. They’re more outgoing, adept at networking, great communicators and driven. You’re likely to draw type-a christians who are very goal oriented. If you listen to them talk you’ll see those traits.

But I’m less inclined to argue the merits (or lack thereof) of the principle and more likely to question its application. Beginning with the obvious. Where do you fall amongst the groups and how are you affecting change in that area/s? It isn’t uncommon to apply the wrong approach for the right reasons. If God is in the midst you’ll figure it out.

~bella