Would you marry a woman who was a former stripper or X-rated star if she turned into a Christian ?

Paidiske · Nov 22, 2023

Ignatius the Kiwi said:
Do you believe female promiscuity leads to marital fidelity?

I believe that past sexual history, on its own, is no reliable predictor of future sexual behaviour, actually. I just found it interesting that when I googled to find information about your question, the results I found were as I posted.

Ignatius the Kiwi said:
If so, how would you counsel a young woman in that lifestyle not to engage in it?

My general approach would probably begin with exploring her motivations and emotions. It's my experience that there's usually more than enough there that needs healing, to take the conversation forward.

Ignatius the Kiwi said:
I suppose all you're doing for me is convincing me that it doesn't matter.

That your own sexual behaviour doesn't matter? If that's what you're getting from what I'm saying, we really are completely talking past one another.

Divide · Nov 22, 2023

Paidiske said:
I would argue that the most Christian desire would be to find the person with whom both of you can grow together in godliness and faithfulness. And when it comes to that, their sexual history is simply beside the point.

And what if it isnt simply beside the point? Then they're mean and hostile, lol.

Do you agree that people should have consequences and responsibility for their actions and choices? It doesnt sound like it.

Shall my prospective Wife have no self discipline? It isnt beside the point, it is the point.

Paidiske · Nov 22, 2023

Divide said:
And what if it isnt simply beside the point? Then they're mean and hostile, lol.

Not necessarily, but it might be wise to ask yourself why it isn't beside the point. Some on this thread seem to feel the need to punish people for their past, but that's not our calling as Christians.

Divide said:
Do you agree that people should have consequences and responsibility for their actions and choices?

Yes.

Divide said:
Shall my prospective Wife have no self discipline? It isnt beside the point, it is the point.

Firstly... their behaviour in the past might not have been about a lack of self discipline. (Indeed, surviving sex work might take a very great deal of self discipline, for what it's worth). Secondly, the question is not whether someone lacked self-discipline in the past, it's whether they have self-discipline now. I wonder how much self-discipline it takes, to successfully exit that lifestyle?

Divide · Nov 22, 2023

Paidiske said:
That your own sexual behaviour doesn't matter? If that's what you're getting from what I'm saying, we really are completely talking past one another.

You did say it was beside the point. SO I go the same impression he did. Peoples sexual behavior is very important in their past, in the present and in the future of a marriage. If a girl has no restraint or self discipline about her sexuality before her marriage to whatever man, then she will continue to be irresponsible throughout the marriage.

And that's not hostile. That's life. So if she gets turned down for marriage because of her past, who is the bad guy there? The potential husband for wanting his wife to be as good a girl as she can? Or the dippy girl who thinks such matters should be beside the point? Oh that might be nice for her, but if he says no to marrying her, by whos actions was a wrongness created? His or hers? Yes, there are consequences and responsibi;ity in life for ones actions

Divide · Nov 22, 2023

Paidiske said:
Firstly... their behaviour in the past might not have been about a lack of self discipline.

Why are you making excuses for promiscuous women? It was exactly a lack of self discipline.

Paidiske said:
(Indeed, surviving sex work might take a very great deal of self discipline, for what it's worth)

So being a SW now is being self disciplined? Surely you jest! WHo taught you such a thing?!

Paidiske · Nov 22, 2023

Divide said:
You did say it was beside the point.

Beside the point when considering someone's potential to be a good life partner in the future.

Divide said:
If a girl has no restraint or self discipline about her sexuality before her marriage to whatever man, then she will continue to be irresponsible throughout the marriage.

Hmm. So her willingness to commit to a Christian marriage is, in your view, feigned? Or perhaps you think she is deluding herself about her own ability to live up to that commitment?

It's a pretty low view of human beings, isn't it?

Divide said:
Oh that might be nice for her, but if he says no to marrying her, by whos actions was a wrongness created?

I'm not arguing that it's a "wrong" to turn her down at all. I'm interrogating the attitudes people hold which might lead to them making that decision.

Hazelelponi · Nov 22, 2023

Divide said:
And what if it isnt simply beside the point? Then they're mean and hostile, lol.

Do you agree that people should have consequences and responsibility for their actions and choices? It doesnt sound like it.

Shall my prospective Wife have no self discipline? It isnt beside the point, it is the point.

I think the point people are trying to make is that there's literally zero point beating people about the head with judgement about a past someone left behind.

As a former Muslim who is now a Christian are you going to constantly look at me as if I'm a potential suicide bomber or are you going to respect me as a fellow Christian.

Coming from a past of any kind is so hard... I literally walked into Christianity completely alone, no family, no friends, almost like a person completely devoid of a past save my adult son.

My husband's family is literally the only family I have. Do you know how hard that is?

Would treating me like a non-Christian be helpful to remind me of all my past sins at every turn do you suppose?

At what point should we treat others as fellow Christians?

I believe this is the point people are trying to make...

We should be discerning - not be Pharisees...

Paidiske · Nov 22, 2023

Divide said:
Why are you making excuses for promiscuous women? It was exactly a lack of self discipline.

That's an unfounded assumption; and from what I know of women who engage in sex work, often quite an incorrect one.

Divide said:
So being a SW now is being self disciplined? Surely you jest! WHo taught you such a thing?!

There may be any number of character flaws involved in taking up sex work. But having the tenacity to continue to turn up and work hard in a role where you are consistently degraded and exploited, in order to survive and make your way in life, whatever else might be said of it, does take a degree of self-discipline. You want someone who knows how to persevere when the going gets tough? You might well do worse than someone who's learned that in incredibly adverse circumstances.

I'm curious, have you ever had any conversations with women who are, or have been, or are considering entering into, sex work, about their experiences, their motivations, their feelings, their hopes and dreams and fears? Because I have, and the stereotypes in this thread don't match the reality.

Divide · Nov 22, 2023

Hazelelponi said:
At what point should we treat others as fellow Christians?

When we see their fruit beyond their words. I'm guessing that happens in about 1 out of 1000 cases of druggie/drunk/SW girls turned Christian. It seems very far fetched that it could be a good marriage.

Hazelelponi · Nov 22, 2023

Divide said:
When we see their fruit beyond their words. I'm guessing that happens in about 1 out of 1000 cases of druggie/drunk/SW girls turned Christian. It seems very far fetched that it could be a good marriage.

Seems so to you... But honestly your likely to not actually know how many people become real Christians who have such pasts and went on to make wonderful wives.

In America in the old west the men often looked to the brothels to find their wives, as there wasn't any other women to marry out there at one point.

Many I'm sure made loving devoted wives, and the West was built upon them as much as the men they married.

mikeforjesus · Nov 22, 2023

In theory yes if they repented. In practice I prefer not to but would if didn’t find otherwise for cant know if truly repented that many of them are frauds that have not and only if I knew it was safe not to carry deadly diseases.

Confused-by-christianity · Nov 22, 2023

"Would you marry a woman who was a former stripper or X-rated star if she turned into a Christian ?"

The answer is yes. Here are a few reasons why ...
1) Now.
She's not an adult entertainer now. She was, but not anymore. Now - she is a christian which i presume means she has opened to an encounter with god and would like to embark on her christian journey.
2) I don't think anyone is innocent anyway.
I love people - im not naive about them, i know them and love them anyway. all of us have done and still do bad stuff all the time - i guess i just accept that??!! (Side note here: The people who freak me out the most are the ones who have really strong views of right and wrong - spread their views making others feel bad, they (apparently) dont do any wrong themselves, have no vices (apparently ???). i think to myself "how is that possible??" - I actually dont think it is, i think they just hide it from view or justify what they do ???).
Someone honest with me about their past and focussed on their future - being their best potential selves - that's pure beauty !!! I can see god's face in it.
3) I'm all for growth. I want to see people grow and be better and better. I think that permanent marks stunt growth - i dont want to contribute to someones permanent shadow lingering over them - i want them to break out and do better and better.

Divide · Nov 22, 2023

Paidiske said:
I'm curious, have you ever had any conversations with women who are, or have been, or are considering entering into, sex work, about their experiences, their motivations, their feelings, their hopes and dreams and fears? Because I have, and the stereotypes in this thread don't match the reality.

Like there isnt anything else they can do to make money. See, you are making excuses for them.

Are you close to the sex trade? You cant sit here and tell me how upstanding the SW are, that's bunk, ok?

I can see how it would be nice if the girld be as looses as she wants while younger and still live happily ever after with all respect or it's somehow unfair to them? Maybe if she hadnt had those character flaws?

She can turn tricks but she cant flip burgers? That is inane. No one is stuck in the sex trade. They wrok SW because they want to.

Divide · Nov 22, 2023

Hazelelponi said:
Seems so to you... But honestly your likely to not actually know how many people become real Christians who have such pasts and went on to make wonderful wives.

In America in the old west the men often looked to the brothels to find their wives, as there wasn't any other women to marry out there at one point.

Many I'm sure made loving devoted wives, and the West was built upon them as much as the men they married.

That's true.

I didnt find my wife on the Maury show or in a brothel. Given the choice I wouldn't either. Not because of anything except my own personal values and preferences. Man does not have to take his wife from the ST if he doesnt want to. Or he can if he wants to. I choose not. That doesnt make me mean unsensitive or hostile to them as people or Sisters in Christ, it just means that was my choice.

Too much risk with those girls. Oh I'm sure it's worked a million times (since the beginning of history) but that doesnt mean it is good odds!

Some here sound like I am mean or ungodly because I wont marry a SW, like I am obligated to marry her regardless of her past? That's incredibly funny. It is not take what you can get for a wife and be happy with it. It's keep on looking until you find a good one.

mikeforjesus · Nov 22, 2023

I think you are right confused by Christianity which actually is what I also believed which I did not know I was being hypocrite to change my mind by others persuasion though I know it carries risk if one cheats one but is right not to judge past if person you can see is living right now but should test it safe if person has diseases can transmit. What I like this song which shows the importance not to judge any for marriage if they do not carry risk to harm you and if not to welcome to church.

m.youtube.com/watch?si=p-v_bwWfwyY8W7Sk&v=OEhRucEVzH8&feature=youtu.be

Hazelelponi · Nov 22, 2023

Divide said:
That's true.

I didnt find my wife on the Maury show or in a brothel. Given the choice I wouldn't either. Not because of anything except my own personal values and preferences. Man does not have to take his wife from the ST if he doesnt want to. Or he can if he wants to. I choose not. That doesnt make me mean unsensitive or hostile to them as people or Sisters in Christ, it just means that was my choice.

Too much risk with those girls. Oh I'm sure it's worked a million times (since the beginning of history) but that doesnt mean it is good odds!

Some here sound like I am mean or ungodly because I wont marry a SW, like I am obligated to marry her regardless of her past? That's incredibly funny. It is not take what you can get for a wife and be happy with it. It's keep on looking until you find a good one.

That's not mean... not every man is the same and as we spoke earlier in the thread, marriage is for life and we have to be as realistic as possible as to what we can personally handle.

You just occasionally sound harsh. I know it's just your trying to make a point...

Divide · Nov 22, 2023

Hazelelponi said:
That's not mean... not every man is the same and as we spoke earlier in the thread, marriage is for life and we have to be as realistic as possible as to what we can personally handle.

You just occasionally sound harsh. I know it's just your trying to make a point...

Some posters may have mised that post, lol. The thing that bugs me is I seem to hear very faintly that social norms are being changed.

If a man cheats on a woman, everyone cheers her on to drop the bum. But when a girl has a 3 year affair with her husbands friend or whatever...she made a mistake and should be forgiven, he should be a big enough man to love her anyway. Even raise another mans baby. Then he's a good man!

What a bunch of malarky!

Divide · Nov 22, 2023

Doesn't anyone realize that God gave mankind marriage as a shadow of His own relationship with us? Bride of Christ anyone, hello?

Is in not prudent for a man to be choosy when choosing a wife? It sounds harsh perhaps but it is not harsh. It's an important reality about relationships.

The bride has made herself ready is what scripture says. It doesnt say that the bride is allowed to sacrifice to other gods and somehow dodge the responsibility of fidelity within the heart because she says she is offended because she reaps consequences for her own irresponsibility.

WIll they call God harsh and hostile if He says I never knew you? The scriptural parrellels to marriage are all over the place and should be taken seriously. Not my rules mind you, God's rules.

One time I was in discussion about marriage to a female and I brought up Proverbs 31 into the conversation. She knee jerked and said I aint never going to be a wife like that! I didnt marry her. Even if she felt unworthy to be able to acheive being a Proverbs 31 wife, that wasnt what she meant. She meant she will not do it, or try. Too much entitlement, too much self pride. In an instant she took the converation from an "us" thing to a "her" thing. Red flag red flag, run!

GDL · Nov 22, 2023

What a thread!

My answer with tongue firmly in cheek is, depends what she looks like!

My real answer: We all come with baggage. She's carrying some heavy bags. All of us will inadvertently raise warning flags usually pretty quickly. Use your God given mentality and leading of the Spirit to recognize those warnings. If your orientation is fleshly, then you're going to ignore them in favor of some fantasy that can end up being hell on earth. Be truthful with yourself about your own limitations. If you get involved physically, then all bets are off, and you'll learn some very harsh lessons for your sinful behavior. Slow, self-controlled, asking God for assistance and guidance and to help you see reality and decide rightly. Give it time and you'll know. Also consider along the way whether or not she is truly in Christ (Matt7:16-20). Same goes for yourself (2Cor13:5). If you find yourself having thoughts you know or think to be sinful, ask our Lord & High Priest to help stop them and keep them at bay (Heb4:15-16). If you cross the line mentally, then acknowledge it to God without hesitation (1John1:9). IOW, abide in Christ and walk in Spirit and you will not fulfill the lusts of flesh (Gal5:16).

Paidiske · Nov 22, 2023

Divide said:
Like there isnt anything else they can do to make money. See, you are making excuses for them.

Excuses? No. But pointing out that some of the assumptions and statements being made don't carry much weight, yes.

Divide said:
Are you close to the sex trade?

My pastoral work brings me into contact with folks engaged in that trade.

Divide said:
You cant sit here and tell me how upstanding the SW are, that's bunk, ok?

It's bunk that sex workers might have some positive character traits?

Divide said:
I can see how it would be nice if the girld be as looses as she wants while younger and still live happily ever after with all respect or it's somehow unfair to them?

That isn't really the question under consideration. The question isn't, "Is it unfair to treat repentant former sex workers with judgement and rejection?" It's, "What's the most godly attitude to take to repentant former sex workers?"

Divide said:
She can turn tricks but she cant flip burgers? That is inane. No one is stuck in the sex trade. They wrok SW because they want to.

Often not true. People do indeed get stuck in the sex trade. And while some advocates love to tell you that sex workers enjoy their work and choose it from a position of empowerment, that doesn't match the reality of anyone I've ever actually met. Domestic violence, abuse, trauma, mental illness and so on, are extremely common pathways into that industry.

Would you marry a woman who was a former stripper or X-rated star if she turned into a Christian ?

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