Recent Biblical Archaeology

J_B_ · Feb 5, 2023

I don't know much about the nitty-gritty of archaeology, but I check in from time to time to see what's going on. There have been several groundbreaking discoveries as of late (yes, I'm aware of the pun), but the one that interested me most comes at timestamp 10:37 in the second video. Evidence of the Kingdom of Edom was found in 2019. As far as I know, that's the first time extra-Biblical evidence has confirmed something from the book of Genesis. There have been other enticing possibilities in the past, but none of them really held up, so this is pretty cool - at least so far.

Hvizsgyak · Feb 5, 2023

Over the past 10 years, I have been absolutely absorbed by what archeology has found out about events that took place in Genesis. I wanted to follow the progression of God's presences with the early Hebrew people. I studied the history of the surrounding kingdoms to see what lead up to God calling Abraham out of Ur. Fascinating stuff. But I wanted to share with you this archeological finding that seems to be very strong evidence of the Hebrews in the Deuteronomy Book Era of the Old Testament (around the 13th and 12th century BC). Although its was pretty big news, you may have seen this already but just in case you didn't hear about this historical find, here it is.

I did hear about the discovery of Edom. Biblical archeologists will have their hands full if they find more ancient Hebrew history. Everybody will want to get in on the action. There will be some amazing finds and I'm looking forward to seeing secular archeologists' chins drop where they can't deny that the Bible is fairly accurate.

God bless.

J_B_ · Feb 5, 2023

Hvizsgyak said:
Over the past 10 years, I have been absolutely absorbed by what archeology has found out about events that took place in Genesis. I wanted to follow the progression of God's presences with the early Hebrew people. I studied the history of the surrounding kingdoms to see what lead up to God calling Abraham out of Ur. Fascinating stuff. But I wanted to share with you this archeological finding that seems to be very strong evidence of the Hebrews in the Deuteronomy Book Era of the Old Testament (around the 13th and 12th century BC). Although its was pretty big news, you may have seen this already but just in case you didn't hear about this historical find, here it is.

I did hear about the discovery of Edom. Biblical archeologists will have their hands full if they find more ancient Hebrew history. Everybody will want to get in on the action. There will be some amazing finds and I'm looking forward to seeing secular archeologists' chins drop where they can't deny that the Bible is fairly accurate.

God bless.

Are you referring to the Merneptah Stele? That's a 13th century BC reference to Israel by an Egyptian Pharaoh, which I believe is the earliest known extra-Biblical reference to Israel as a nation. Anyway, I'm not sure if that's what you meant since it appears you left out the link you had intended to insert.

Astrid · Feb 7, 2023

Hvizsgyak said:
Over the past 10 years, I have been absolutely absorbed by what archeology has found out about events that took place in Genesis. I wanted to follow the progression of God's presences with the early Hebrew people. I studied the history of the surrounding kingdoms to see what lead up to God calling Abraham out of Ur. Fascinating stuff. But I wanted to share with you this archeological finding that seems to be very strong evidence of the Hebrews in the Deuteronomy Book Era of the Old Testament (around the 13th and 12th century BC). Although its was pretty big news, you may have seen this already but just in case you didn't hear about this historical find, here it is.

I did hear about the discovery of Edom. Biblical archeologists will have their hands full if they find more ancient Hebrew history. Everybody will want to get in on the action. There will be some amazing finds and I'm looking forward to seeing secular archeologists' chins drop where they can't deny that the Bible is fairly accurate.

God bless.

Of course the Bible gets some things right,
there's no " jaw drop" ipon mention of Egypt,
cows, and diversity other such that the Bible gets right.
Where do you see " jaw drop" for
"secular" archeologists? It's kind of
a weird thing you are proposing.

Oh, and, very important:
What difference do you imagine there
is between " secular" and, what, " Bible"
archaeologists?

Is there " jaw drop" at proof that many
things described in the bible are simply
fiction? See " flood ".

AV1611VET · Feb 7, 2023

Estrid said:
Oh, and, very important:
What difference do you imagine there
is between " secular" and, what, " Bible"
archaeologists?

Bible archaeologists can go much deeper into a discovery than secular archaeologists can.

While secular archaeologists are standing around myopic, Bible archaeologists not only name the founder of a civilization, but can even give a mini-bio of him, complete with things he said.

In the case of the aforementioned Edom, all secular archaeologists can do is look at the artifacts and rush off to update their paperwork; whereas the paperwork for Biblical archeologists is already filled out.

They know who the founder is, who the founder's father is, his mother, his twin brother, and lots of other stuff.

LOTS of other stuff.

While secular archaeologists might be able to fill out an index card on a discovery, Biblical archaeologists have chapters and chapters on a find BEFORE they even think to begin to look.

I, as a little boy in Sunday school in 1964, knew Edom existed long before archaeologists found it 55 years later.

To sum it up, secular archaeologists are myopic.

Hans Blaster · Feb 7, 2023

AV1611VET said:
Bible archaeologists can go much deeper into a discovery than secular archaeologists can.

While secular archaeologists are standing around myopic, Bible archaeologists not only name the founder of a civilization, but can even give a mini-bio of him, complete with things he said.

In the case of the aforementioned Edom, all secular archaeologists can do is look at the artifacts and rush off to update their paperwork; whereas the paperwork for Biblical archeologists is already filled out.

They know who the founder is, who the founder's father is, his mother, his twin brother, and lots of other stuff.

LOTS of other stuff.

While secular archaeologists might be able to fill out an index card on a discovery, Biblical archaeologists have chapters and chapters on a find BEFORE they even think to begin to look.

I, as a little boy in Sunday school in 1964, knew Edom existed long before archaeologists found it 55 years later.

To sum it up, secular archaeologists are myopic.

Ok, then smartypants, who founded Edom?

AV1611VET · Feb 7, 2023

Hans Blaster said:
Ok, then smartypants, who founded Edom?

Esau, Jacob's twin brother.

Hans Blaster · Feb 7, 2023

AV1611VET said:
Esau, Jacob's twin brother.

Jacob the father of the "founders" of all the Isrealite tribes?

Where did Esau get the people to start his new nation? Nations need people.

Tuur · Feb 7, 2023

Hans Blaster said:
Where did Esau get the people to start his new nation? Nations need people.

Umm...how can to put this delicately...let's just say don't count out kinfolk.

There's also slaves and workers. These would not be restricted to a certain location.

There should be something like a "critical mass" in settlement. Once it reaches a certain size, it attracts more who see opportunities' there. This increases until it reaches a limiting factor, such as resources or opportunities.

Hans Blaster · Feb 7, 2023

Tuur said:
Umm...how can to put this delicately...let's just say don't count out kinfolk.

There's also slaves and workers. These would not be restricted to a certain location.

There should be something like a "critical mass" in settlement. Once it reaches a certain size, it attracts more who see opportunities' there. This increases until it reaches a limiting factor, such as resources or opportunities.

I'm no expert on such things (I only read that book the one time), but didn't Jacob trick Easu out of his inheritance? If so where'd he even get the slaves or land?

AV1611VET · Feb 7, 2023

Hans Blaster said:
Jacob the father of the "founders" of all the Isrealite tribes?

Affirmative.

Malachi 3:6 For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.

Hans Blaster said:
Where did Esau get the people to start his new nation? Nations need people.

Genesis 36:2 Esau took his wives of the daughters of Canaan; Adah the daughter of Elon the Hittite, and Aholibamah the daughter of Anah the daughter of Zibeon the Hivite;

AV1611VET · Feb 7, 2023

Hans Blaster said:
I'm no expert on such things (I only read that book the one time), but didn't Jacob trick Easu out of his inheritance? If so where'd he even get the slaves or land?

Now see.

You know more about Edom than those archaeologists do.

Thanks for the QED.

Tuur · Feb 7, 2023

Hans Blaster said:
I'm no expert on such things (I only read that book the one time), but didn't Jacob trick Easu out of his inheritance? If so where'd he even get the slaves or land?

Slaves came from all over. Is the question from which local did he get slaves, or were there slaves available?

Land is simple, and is what countless people have done over and over again: Claim it and if no one can jockey you off it, it's yours.

Hans Blaster · Feb 7, 2023

Tuur said:
Slaves came from all over. Is the question from which local did he get slaves, or were there slaves available?

Land is simple, and is what countless people have done over and over again: Claim it and if no one can jockey you off it, it's yours.

Huh? (Again no inheritance = no money, that means no land, slaves, etc.)

I see no reason to think the Esau tale is even remotely true. Why should I?

Tuur · Feb 7, 2023

Hans Blaster said:
Huh? (Again no inheritance = no money, that means no land, slaves, etc.)

I see no reason to think the Esau tale is even remotely true. Why should I?

Like who would every think someone growing up in the projects would become a billionaire. But Howard Schultz did. And who, pray tell, is Howard Schultz? The former CEO of Starbucks.

Unlike Schultz, Esau had an advantage: He was running the family business. He didn't have the birthright, but Jacob wasn't around to claim it. No, Jacob skipped out because Esau had made up his mind to kill him.

Here's the kicker: Esau may have traded his birthright, but there's no indication he turned it over to Jacob when he returned. And it doesn't seem Jacob wanted to press the point. If anything, it looks like he wanted to buy him off or at least put him in a good mood.

As to land, think about the occupation of both Esau and Jacob. Grazing required a nomadic or semi-nomadic existence. There's hints that the availability of water played a huge role, and that makes sense. Claim the water, and you've claimed the land. It would be possible to write a western loosely based on Jacob and Esau. Maybe someone already has. Where a land purchase is recorded in this era, the discussion involves a cave or caves and an associated field. But Jacob and Esau weren't farmers.

Astrid · Feb 8, 2023

Tuur said:
Like who would every think someone growing up in the projects would become a billionaire. But Howard Schultz did. And who, pray tell, is Howard Schultz? The former CEO of Starbucks.

Unlike Schultz, Esau had an advantage: He was running the family business. He didn't have the birthright, but Jacob wasn't around to claim it. No, Jacob skipped out because Esau had made up his mind to kill him.

Here's the kicker: Esau may have traded his birthright, but there's no indication he turned it over to Jacob when he returned. And it doesn't seem Jacob wanted to press the point. If anything, it looks like he wanted to buy him off or at least put him in a good mood.

As to land, think about the occupation of both Esau and Jacob. Grazing required a nomadic or semi-nomadic existence. There's hints that the availability of water played a huge role, and that makes sense. Claim the water, and you've claimed the land. It would be possible to write a western loosely based on Jacob and Esau. Maybe someone already has. Where a land purchase is recorded in this era, the discussion involves a cave or caves and an associated field. But Jacob and Esau weren't farmers.

And that isnt archaeology

FrumiousBandersnatch · Feb 10, 2023

AV1611VET said:
Bible archaeologists can go much deeper into a discovery than secular archaeologists can.

While secular archaeologists are standing around myopic, Bible archaeologists not only name the founder of a civilization, but can even give a mini-bio of him, complete with things he said.

In the case of the aforementioned Edom, all secular archaeologists can do is look at the artifacts and rush off to update their paperwork; whereas the paperwork for Biblical archeologists is already filled out.

They know who the founder is, who the founder's father is, his mother, his twin brother, and lots of other stuff.

LOTS of other stuff.

While secular archaeologists might be able to fill out an index card on a discovery, Biblical archaeologists have chapters and chapters on a find BEFORE they even think to begin to look.

I, as a little boy in Sunday school in 1964, knew Edom existed long before archaeologists found it 55 years later.

To sum it up, secular archaeologists are myopic.

And, by your description, Bible archaeologists are unscientific ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Astrid · Feb 10, 2023

FrumiousBandersnatch said:
And, by your description, Bible archaeologists are unscientific ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Intellectually dishonest.
Doesn't even reach the level of
scientific dishonesty any more than
a common card cheat can do bank fraud

The woo- pedlars in their
1/2 clever ignorance accuse
others of what they are, and love
their shabby frauds like ron wyatt.

Never ever do the woo peddlars
and evolution deniers produce a fact.

Until one of them has a fact, they are
not worth talking to.

No more than those offering
"reward for info leading to..."
have time for vacuous drivel
from someone with zero knowledge
or expertise.

AV1611VET · Feb 10, 2023

Estrid said:
No more than those offering "reward for info leading to..." have time for vacuous drivel from someone with zero knowledge
or expertise.

John 7:15 And the Jews marvelled, saying, How knoweth this man letters, having never learned?

FireDragon76 · Feb 10, 2023

It doesn't really "prove" Genesis's narrative is completely true . It's been well known for some time that Canaanite city-states contained numerous kingdoms.

Genesis is an ancient history, which doesn't necessarily mean it doesn't contain fantastical elements or politically-biased redactions.

J_B_ said:
Are you referring to the Merneptah Stele? That's a 13th century BC reference to Israel by an Egyptian Pharaoh, which I believe is the earliest known extra-Biblical reference to Israel as a nation. Anyway, I'm not sure if that's what you meant since it appears you left out the link you had intended to insert.

It's not that controversial among ancient Near East scholars that Canaan was a tribute state of Egypt, so it's not surprising that an Egyptian stele would mention Israel. That doesn't mean that the actual history was exactly the same as what is portrayed in the Bible. The Bible makes alot out of Israel being a large migrant group under Moses that conquered Canaan, whereas the actual evidence doesn't suggest the sort of widespread invasion and slaughter in the Bible actually took place. It appears to be more of a national myth.

Recent Biblical Archaeology

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