Pro-Trump protesters storm US Capitol as lawmakers gather to count electoral votes

mindlight said:

Not supporting insurrection nor Trump here I want him gone today.

Nothing of any historical significance was broken however and a lot of damage related to the breakin itself and crowd pressure. This was not an unruly crowdlike BLM in Summer.

Nancy Pelosis office was a mess but no furniture broken.

That is what I see.

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That's your justification?

My impression of the level of control around the Capitol building was that it was lamentably poor. According to a report in the UK press only 150 police were on duty at first. This seems extraordinary, especially as I remember very many more police using strong-arm tactics to get the President to church last November when the BLM demonstration took place.

It is not as if the demonstration came as a surprise. A cynic might suggest that the police numbers were deliberately kept low. A more charitable view would be that this was through incompetence rather than intent.

mindlight said:

Nothing of any historical significance was broken however and a lot of damage related to the breakin itself and crowd pressure.

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This is some awful fine hair splitting to try and make people attempting an actual coup worse than those protesting police violence against minorities.

Don't be surprised if people start to question why you'd feel the need to do so.

PeterJames0510 said:

It's very sad to see this; I voted for Trump because I wanted to save the unborn. I knew he would have a temper tantrum, but this is going on too far. His 'condemnation' of violence is a little too little, too late when he just had a massive rally riling up his supporters. As Trump would often tweet: Very Sad.

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He doesn't care about the unborn. Trump only cares about Trump

TLK Valentine said:

That's your justification?

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Justification? No, it is an observation which I believe to be true.

mindlight said:

Justification? No, it is an observation which I believe to be true.

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Facts don't care about your feelings.

KCfromNC said:

This is some awful fine hair splitting to try and make people attempting an actual coup worse than those protesting police violence against minorities.

Don't be surprised if people start to question why you'd feel the need to do so.

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Is police violence against minorities any worse than the veteran woman being shot and killed yesterday?

KCfromNC said:

This is some awful fine hair splitting to try and make people attempting an actual coup worse than those protesting police violence against minorities.

Don't be surprised if people start to question why you'd feel the need to do so.

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If I had been a police man, probably in many cases an ex vet, seeing a bunch of people who also served and had nothing to prove when it came to violence , I would trust them to use proportionate force more than a bunch of ill disciplined rioters as with BLM and antifa. That said there were some scuffles as police did their jobs trying to prevent access. But levels of damage and overall violence WERE low. The people who died were protestors and 3 for medical reasons.

At the end of the day this was an insurrection but let's not overdo it on the whole violence angle, this was a peaceful insurrection, guys carrying guns and with military records could have done a lot worse, but did not.

Anyway supporting this insurrection and obstruction of democratic process and losing congress may mean an end to Trump 24, definitely hope so.

mindlight said:

Justification? No, it is an observation which I believe to be true.

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And irrelevant unless you use it as a justification.

Donald and his followers are justified in doing anything because the Hated Others have done worse... except this time, they haven't. Now you're scrambling to minimize the impact of what they tried to do in his name.

TLK Valentine said:

And irrelevant unless you use it as a justification.

Donald and his followers are justified in doing anything because the Hated Others have done worse... except this time, they haven't. Now you're scrambling to minimize the impact of what they tried to do in his name.

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IMHO: You are part of the problem of bipartisan politics in the USA. You are not being honest about this and are just villifying the others

mindlight said:

If I had been a police man, probably in many cases an ex vet, seeing a bunch of people who also served and had nothing to prove when it came to violence , I would trust them to use proportionate force more than a bunch of ill disciplined rioters as with BLM and antifa.

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If you had been a police officer, all it takes is a rented uniform to get you to look the other way. Good to know.

That said there were some scuffles as police did their jobs trying to prevent access. But levels of damage and overall violence WERE low. The people who died were protestors and 3 for medical reasons.

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4 deaths in the name of Donald are acceptable losses. Good to know.

At the end of the day this was an insurrection but let's not overdo it on the whole violence angle, this was a peaceful insurrection, guys carrying guns and with military records could have done a lot worse, but did not.

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A "peaceful insurrection" -- that's a good one. Nice justification.

Anyway supporting this insurrection and obstruction of democratic process and losing congress may mean an end to Trump 24, definitely hope so.

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That we agree on -- or perhaps his followers will escalate.

Carl Emerson said:

Did Antifa pose as Trump supporters in DC?

This from Israel news...

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In the most famous photo, they are confirmed Trump supporters, namely Jake Angeli and Jason Tankersley. Do a little reading, and you'll see their views are well-documented.

No, antifa did not invade the Capitol today, despite what Trump supporters say

The invasion of the US Capitol was 100% Trump supporters.

mindlight said:

IMHO: You are part of the problem of bipartisan politics in the USA. You are not being honest about this and are just villifying the others

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"the others" just broke into the Capitol Building to fight (on Donald's orders) to overthrow the government, and try to stop the transition of power -- the first time that's happened in 240 years...

... and you're scrambling for ways to show how it's no big deal.

The Trump supporters who attempted to overthrow the government were carrying large amounts of zip ties. They planned to take members of Congress and hold them hostage at gunpoint.

NxNW said:

The Trump supporters who attempted to overthrow the government were carrying large amounts of zip ties. They planned to take members of Congress and hold them hostage at gunpoint.

View attachment 292919

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Sounds like, unlike the usual "rioting and looting," this was a planned assault on democracy...

Still... Antifa... BLM.... those guys broke windows and stuff... this was peaceful.

It is tragic that four people lost their lives over this. While there have been reports of ANTIFA involvement which is not that surprising given they seem to have infilrated Trump demonstrations before, there where not a few Trump supporters also on the building. Please don't play into their (ANTIFA's) hands.

NxNW said:

The Trump supporters who attempted to overthrow the government were carrying large amounts of zip ties. They planned to take members of Congress and hold them hostage at gunpoint.

View attachment 292919

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How on earth do you know what they had them for? Or even who those guys are?

dms1972 said:

How on earth do you know what they had them for?

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Basic reasoning.

dms1972 said:

Or even who those guys are?

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Members of an insurrectionist mob.

Arc F1 said:

Is police violence against minorities any worse than the veteran woman being shot and killed yesterday?

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Since you or I don't know the precise details of the incident other that she was part of the MAGA mob illegally storming the capitol, it's wise to await further information

dms1972 said:

How on earth do you know what they had them for? Or even who those guys are?

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As noted earlier, in a different thread, pointed out by fourm Member Hans Blaster:

Green Sun said:

Great observation! I wasn't aware there was special-purpose equipment for this, but sure enough they're a dead ringer for flexible handcuffs.
Flexible Restraints, Disposable Cuffs & Flex-Cuffs | Galls

So even more evidence in the "kidnapping" pile!

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These are not just "zipties", they are a specific tool made for a specific purpose. Restraint of individuals. Visit the site if you don't believe me.