Why Christians Should Embrace Partial Preterism

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Ronald

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Can you define this?
That the Church replaced and became Israel. We were grafted into the vine but remember, the Jews were blinded for the sake of the Gentiles and they are blinded to this day. Some have come to Christ but the time will come when they will be enlightened (Rom. 11). God has not discarded them. This kind of theology has led to anti-Semitism.
The U.S. has always been an ally of Israel.
This scripture still hold true:
"I will bless those who bless you and the one who curses you, I will curse and in you all the families of the earth will be blessed." GEN. 12:3
Not all covenants between God and Israel have been fulfilled. And JESUS has many prophesies to yet fulfull.
The plain logic and discernment that we can get from prophecies concerning Jesus is that He literally fulfilled them when He came the first time. Why should we not expect the same, concerning remaining unfulfilled prophecies?
 
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David Kent

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I fully agree that Revelation is not chronological throughout, but how does that even remotely debunk what I submitted in the post you were addressing? Do you agree or disagree that the martyrs seen in Revelation 20:4, for not worshiping the beast's image, were martyred before satan is even loosed? And if you agree, it would be silly to think they weren't martyred during the 42 month reign of the beast in Revelation 13, don't you think?
I believe as did the reformers.
 
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sovereigngrace

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Did you even read what i wrote?
Your question is FULLY answered in the post you quoted.



Correct!
You can't have a "First resurrection" that isn't actually "First".

However, The First Resurrection is not something Jesus does, or was, it's something Jesus IS.

"I am the resurrection and the Life"

Jesus Christ is the First Resurrection, and on those that take part in it, the 2nd death has no power.

Jesus Christ was the first to rise out of the dead. Jesus was, literally, the "first resurrection." This fact, well attested by the writings of the New Testament, MUST form the basis for understanding Revelation 20:5-6:

"This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is the one who has a part in the first resurrection; over these the second death has no power" (Revelation 20:5-6)

The first resurrection was Jesus Christ:

Revelation 1:5

Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the first-born out of the dead Acts 26:23
Christ should suffer and...be the first that should rise from the dead

Colossians 1:18
He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead

1 Corinthians 15:20
Christ hath risen out of the dead--the first-fruits of those sleeping he became


Jesus Christ was, plainly, the first resurrection. This fact forms the basis of St. John's depiction of the tribulation martyr saints becoming full partakers of the "first resurrection" in Revelation 20--everything Christ received by his death and resurrection is granted to them. Revelation 20:4-6, therefore, depicts the reality of Pauline theology concerning the identity Christ's followers had "in Him." Paul had taught that the saints were to become partakers of Christ's own reign and victory over death. Paul, with his detailed theology of our baptism into the very death and resurrection of Jesus (Rom 6:3-14), taught that the saints had co-resurrection and co-enthronement in the realized resurrection and enthronement of Jesus Christ.

Revelation 20:4-6 is a narrative depiction of the saints' realization of the glorious promise Paul held out for them in his teachings--the saints are depicted as having attained the goal for which they all strove. As Paul taught, their resurrection and reign was "in Christ," and their sufferings and martyrdoms were honored by God with the reward of partaking in Christ's own resurrection, enthronement, and reign. They realized the promise of Paul's teaching that the saints were truly to take part in the first resurrection, the resurrection of Jesus Christ. Truly, on these the second death has no power (Rev 20:6).



Wait what?
Were raised?
The Resurrection of the dead in Christ is ...PAST?

Sin, death and hell had to be confronted and defeated before the dead in Christ could depart Abraham's bosom. Dead believers were released from the captivity of Abraham’s bosom and ushered into the heavenly abode as He defeated the sin, death and the grave. As He rose they rose. After all, He was defeating the grave on their behalf.

Ephesians 4:8-10: says, “When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men. (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth? He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things).”

Jesus said in Revelation 1:17-18, “I am the first and the last: I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell (hades) and of death.”

Since the resurrection, Christ reigns supreme over all His enemies from His throne in heaven. This rule happening only after Christ triumphed over His enemies at the cross and gloriously rose from the dead.

Colossians 2:9-10, 14-15 confirms: "For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power … Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; And having spoiled (or divested or disarmed) principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.”

Christ defeated sin, death, Satan and every enemy of righteousness at the cross. He now reigns over all creation, the Israel of God (His redeemed) and His enemies (as God and man). Satan has lost his accusation seat in heaven, along with his minions. He cannot now bring accusations before the throne of God against the redeemed. Man's awful penalty has been paid in full. Satan has nothing on the redeemed. Geographically the Gospel was overwhelmingly restricted to the lone nation of Israel, with a few scarce exceptions. The darkened nations have now seen a great light. Christ has endowed the New Testament Church with a spiritual power over Satan himself and all devils. They are now subject to the authority of the Church as they function under the power of the Holy Ghost and employ the inspired will of God as their main weapon.

1 Peter 3:22 says, that Christ, is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him.”

Without a doubt, Christ is reigning over His enemies since the resurrection, waiting for their final predetermined put down. Those who question Christ’s current reign do great assault upon the truth of God’s Word and undermine the current sovereign kingly position that He now assuredly holds.
 
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parousia70

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That the Church replaced and became Israel.

When did the Original Jewish Church, the Apostles, the 3000 on Pentecost, etc.. CEASE being National Israel?

The Church has never REPLACED Israel, it always WAS, and Remains Israel...

Saying the Church has replaced Israel would be the same as Saying the 7000 Faithful of Israel who refused to Bow their Knee to Baal also "Replaced" Israel(1 Kings 19:1-18; Romans 11:2-36)

Saying the Church has replaced Israel would be the same as Saying The Faithful "Church" of the nation in the Wilderness "Replaced" Israel when they entered the Promised Land (Numbers 14:26-45; Numbers 21:5-9; Numbers 16:1-50, Acts 7:38-45)

Saying the Church has replaced Israel would be the same as Saying the small but faithful remnant In Isaiah's day "Replaced" Israel. (Isaiah 10:22-23; Isaiah 1:7-9; Romans 9:27-29)

The Church NEVER Replaced Israel, the Church is, and always was, the Faithful Remnant OF Israel, and indeed is the only entity through which the continuation of the BIBLICAL NATION of Israel itself MUST be counted, for the rest were cut off forever (Acts 3:22-24)

God struck down thousands of rebellious Israelites in the wilderness (Num 14:26-45; Num 21:5-9; Num 16:1-50), though the church was preserved and led to the Promised Land (Acts 7:38-45); In Isaiah's day, apostasy became so rampant that "All Israel" continued to exist through a small but faithful remnant (Isa 10:22-23; Isa 1:7-9; Rom 9:27-29); And again as mentioned above, in Elijah's era, the multitude of Israelites who worshiped the false god Baal was so great that "All Israel" narrowed to a mere seven thousand men (1 Kings 19:1-18; Rom 11:2-4). Lastly, at the close of the Old Testamental age, Israel was again reduced to a small remnant of faithful elect ones (Rom 11:5). The Jewish Pharisees and temple rulers grew wicked to the point of killing God's holy Messiah and apostles (1 Thess 2:14-16), and throngs wanted Caesar as king instead of Messiah, the son of David (Jn 19:15). Then, as in times past, "All Israel" survived and continued on EXCLUSIVELY through the faithful sons, the Nazarene Sect (The REMNANT), while the unfaithful apostates were "cut off" from among the people FOREVER.

Just as the jewish church abode with Moses in the wilderness (Acts 7:37-38), so Jesus had HIS jewish church (Mt. 16:18-19).

St. Paul said that when the nation was in mass apostasy, the TRUE NATIONAL Israel was carried on not through the lineages of the wicked sons but rather through the OBEDIENT FEW (called the "remnant"), such as was true in Isaiah's day (Romans 9:27-29) and Elijah's day (Romans 11:3-5).

St. Peter says the same thing at Acts 3:22-24, where it is clear that the wicked jews who refuse Christ were to be "cut off from among the People of Israel" while the faithful jews (John the Baptist, Joseph and Mary, the Twelve, the Seventy, the three thousand on Pentecost day, and many thousands of other jews) were the True Faithful Israel.

And within a few years after Pentecost, the faithful Israel learned how to start accepting both jewish and also gentile followers from all over the empire to convert into their Nation (1 Peter 2:9-10; Mt 21:40-45). And so the tiny remnant True Israel grew into a worldwide Judaism living under the promised NEW covenant of Israel's Messiah.

And so it was also in Moses' day, when the countless thousands of wicked sons of Abraham were slain in the wilderness while the faithful sons of Abraham survived and got to enter the Promised Land. We must NEVER count the continuation of Israel through the wicked sons but rather always through the faithful remnant!

Israel survived *exclusively* in the sect of the Nazarenes. They received with joy their promised New Covenant and obediently rejected all former biases against the non-Abrahamic families of earth so that Genesis 12:3 might finally be attained (Gal 3:7-9/Rom 4:13-18)---via the work of the Jewish Messiah. This sole surviving form of covenant Judaism is known worldwide as Christianity, the Jewish church gone global.

The church always was the covenanted Israel, the church continues to be the covenanted Israel.
The only difference is that the NEW covenant of Israel enabled Jewish fullness to be bestowed upon gentile people groups (Gen 12:3).


The REAL "replacement theology" is the one who seeks to REPLACE the Faithful Sons of Abraham with the Wicked ones as the true Heirs.

Such is, sadly, RAMPANT here on CF.

The U.S. has always been an ally of Israel.
This scripture still hold true:
"I will bless those who bless you and the one who curses you, I will curse and in you all the families of the earth will be blessed." GEN. 12:3
Modern Secular Israel has Legalized Gay Marriage
Do you Bless that Israel?

Modern Secular Israel has Legal on demand FREE abortion for any female 15 years old and up.
Do you Bless That Israel?

Here is the Scriptural TRUTH about the Identity of Israel:
The Israelite apostles of the Jewish Messiah say I am a Jew (Romans 2:27-29), say I am "Abraham's seed" (Romans 4:16/Galatians 3:29), say I am "the peculiar people, royal priesthood, holy nation" (1 Peter 2:9-10), say I am the circumcision-less Israel of God (Galatians 6:15-16), say I am "no longer a stranger but a fellow citizen of the commonwealth" (Ephesians 2:19), say I was once not a people but now am the people of God (1 Peter 2:10) and say I am the circumcision (Philippians 3:2-3).

Each and every one of these statements takes a key identifier/distinctive of Israel and labels me with it. Meanwhile, Christ calls the disobedient genetic sons of Abraham the "sons of satan" and the "synagogue of satan" (Revelation 2:9/John 8:39-47), and St. John says that those who deny the Son have no claim whatsoever to the Father (1 John 2:23)
 
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sovereigngrace

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That the Church replaced and became Israel. We were grafted into the vine but remember, the Jews were blinded for the sake of the Gentiles and they are blinded to this day. Some have come to Christ but the time will come when they will be enlightened (Rom. 11). God has not discarded them. This kind of theology has led to anti-Semitism.
The U.S. has always been an ally of Israel.
This scripture still hold true:
"I will bless those who bless you and the one who curses you, I will curse and in you all the families of the earth will be blessed." GEN. 12:3
Not all covenants between God and Israel have been fulfilled. And JESUS has many prophesies to yet fulfull.
The plain logic and discernment that we can get from prophecies concerning Jesus is that He literally fulfilled them when He came the first time. Why should we not expect the same, concerning remaining unfulfilled prophecies?

So, we haven't replaced anyone, we have joined faithful Israel. The term is actually a slur invented by Premils in order to discredit Amillennialism and to undermine those who believe Israel has been expanded out since Christ to include the Gentiles. The fact is: we didn't replace anyone. We joined believing Israel. A more accurate terms are ‘Inclusion Theology’ or ‘Expansion Theology’. Amils see a continuity between God’s people in the Old and New Testament. That is because we have joined faithful Israel (God's elect).
 
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mkgal1

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Christ was the first resurrection, the firstfruits, the first forgotten from the dead. It was only after He defeated the grave that the dead in Christ were raised to heaven to reign with Christ.
[Loud applause!] Exactly!!
 
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DavidPT

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That seems like an odd question from an Amil to another AM. Just an observation.


Actually things like that make an interesting point. Take Premil for instance. All Premils agree as to when the millennium begins and when it ends. Thus it's not a multiple choice question. But when it comes to Amils though, not all Amils can even agree as to when the millennium begins and when it ends. Why not if Amil is supposed to be the correct position? Which Amil should one trust to provide the correct beginning and finishing of the millennium, since not all Amils are even in agreement about these things? Should when the millennium begins and ends really be a multiple choice question?
 
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DavidPT

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I agree with that - that the "coming of the Son of Man" followed the 42 month reign of the beast in Rev 13. I'm still not understanding you as to why you believe that's impossible?

It's impossible per Amil if coming from a futurist perspective, in regards to the 42 month reign of the beast in Revelation 13. From that perspective, the coming of Christ I am referring to is when He returns to stay for forever, bodily thus visible to all. That is what we call the 2nd coming, including many Amils.

If the thousand years follow the 42 month reign of the beast in Rev 13, and that the futurist position is that the coming I'm referring to follows the 42 month reign of the beast in Revelation 13, how can that not logically mean that the thousand years follow the coming I'm referring to rather than precede it instead?

It might look like this.

All Premils and all futurist Amils(I guess that's what you might call them), agree that after the 42 month reign of the beast in Revelation 13 is fulfilled, the coming I mentioned above happens next. What follows that then, where even you apparently at least agree with what follows next, except you don't take the coming you were referring to in your post I'm addressing, to be the same coming I'm referring to? The thousand years is what comes next. Thus why some forms of Amil are impossible since those positions contradict the actual chronology of events.

Those forms of Amil claim the chronology is this---the thousand years, followed by satan's little season, which means the 42 month reign of the beast in Revelation 13 to them, regardless that Revelation 20:4 already tells us the 42 month reign of the beast in Revelation 13 is fulfilled and in the past before satan is ever loosed, followed by the coming I mentioned above, thus impossible that the 42 month reign of the beast in Revelation 13 can happen during satan's little season after the thousand years like some Amils claim. They have the chronology of events all messed up, not even making any sense in the process, thus disagreeing with the texts involved altogether.
 
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keras

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Such false beliefs do not 'solve the issue' at all. They just make it possible for those who dislike the idea of themselves having to face the events described by the Prophets, to sit back and put it all out of mind.

But such an attitude is rather foolish, given the current world situation.
Do preterists, Amillenists, etc, of any color, really believe mankind will solve our problems? Do people think we will just continue muddling along and one fine day; Yay! Jesus will Return.

Friends, you have believed the Salvation Message of the Bible, now believe the Prophetic Message.
2 Peter 3:1-7 reminds us of how the Lord changed the world in Noah's time and that He will again at some future time, this time by fire. Don't you think it would be good to know something about that forthcoming Day; what we should do then and what will happen afterward?
I WILL be vindicated. And those who pursue rabbit trails will regret it.
Correction: The Prophets WILL be vindicated.....
 
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Ronald

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When did the Original Jewish Church, the Apostles, the 3000 on Pentecost, etc.. CEASE being National Israel?

The Church has never REPLACED Israel, it always WAS, and Remains Israel...

Saying the Church has replaced Israel would be the same as Saying the 7000 Faithful of Israel who refused to Bow their Knee to Baal also "Replaced" Israel(1 Kings 19:1-18; Romans 11:2-36)

Saying the Church has replaced Israel would be the same as Saying The Faithful "Church" of the nation in the Wilderness "Replaced" Israel when they entered the Promised Land (Numbers 14:26-45; Numbers 21:5-9; Numbers 16:1-50, Acts 7:38-45)

Saying the Church has replaced Israel would be the same as Saying the small but faithful remnant In Isaiah's day "Replaced" Israel. (Isaiah 10:22-23; Isaiah 1:7-9; Romans 9:27-29)

The Church NEVER Replaced Israel, the Church is, and always was, the Faithful Remnant OF Israel, and indeed is the only entity through which the continuation of the BIBLICAL NATION of Israel itself MUST be counted, for the rest were cut off forever (Acts 3:22-24)

God struck down thousands of rebellious Israelites in the wilderness (Num 14:26-45; Num 21:5-9; Num 16:1-50), though the church was preserved and led to the Promised Land (Acts 7:38-45); In Isaiah's day, apostasy became so rampant that "All Israel" continued to exist through a small but faithful remnant (Isa 10:22-23; Isa 1:7-9; Rom 9:27-29); And again as mentioned above, in Elijah's era, the multitude of Israelites who worshiped the false god Baal was so great that "All Israel" narrowed to a mere seven thousand men (1 Kings 19:1-18; Rom 11:2-4). Lastly, at the close of the Old Testamental age, Israel was again reduced to a small remnant of faithful elect ones (Rom 11:5). The Jewish Pharisees and temple rulers grew wicked to the point of killing God's holy Messiah and apostles (1 Thess 2:14-16), and throngs wanted Caesar as king instead of Messiah, the son of David (Jn 19:15). Then, as in times past, "All Israel" survived and continued on EXCLUSIVELY through the faithful sons, the Nazarene Sect (The REMNANT), while the unfaithful apostates were "cut off" from among the people FOREVER.

Just as the jewish church abode with Moses in the wilderness (Acts 7:37-38), so Jesus had HIS jewish church (Mt. 16:18-19).

St. Paul said that when the nation was in mass apostasy, the TRUE NATIONAL Israel was carried on not through the lineages of the wicked sons but rather through the OBEDIENT FEW (called the "remnant"), such as was true in Isaiah's day (Romans 9:27-29) and Elijah's day (Romans 11:3-5).

St. Peter says the same thing at Acts 3:22-24, where it is clear that the wicked jews who refuse Christ were to be "cut off from among the People of Israel" while the faithful jews (John the Baptist, Joseph and Mary, the Twelve, the Seventy, the three thousand on Pentecost day, and many thousands of other jews) were the True Faithful Israel.

And within a few years after Pentecost, the faithful Israel learned how to start accepting both jewish and also gentile followers from all over the empire to convert into their Nation (1 Peter 2:9-10; Mt 21:40-45). And so the tiny remnant True Israel grew into a worldwide Judaism living under the promised NEW covenant of Israel's Messiah.

And so it was also in Moses' day, when the countless thousands of wicked sons of Abraham were slain in the wilderness while the faithful sons of Abraham survived and got to enter the Promised Land. We must NEVER count the continuation of Israel through the wicked sons but rather always through the faithful remnant!

Israel survived *exclusively* in the sect of the Nazarenes. They received with joy their promised New Covenant and obediently rejected all former biases against the non-Abrahamic families of earth so that Genesis 12:3 might finally be attained (Gal 3:7-9/Rom 4:13-18)---via the work of the Jewish Messiah. This sole surviving form of covenant Judaism is known worldwide as Christianity, the Jewish church gone global.

The church always was the covenanted Israel, the church continues to be the covenanted Israel.
The only difference is that the NEW covenant of Israel enabled Jewish fullness to be bestowed upon gentile people groups (Gen 12:3).


The REAL "replacement theology" is the one who seeks to REPLACE the Faithful Sons of Abraham with the Wicked ones as the true Heirs.

Such is, sadly, RAMPANT here on CF.


Modern Secular Israel has Legalized Gay Marriage
Do you Bless that Israel?

Modern Secular Israel has Legal on demand FREE abortion for any female 15 years old and up.
Do you Bless That Israel?

Here is the Scriptural TRUTH about the Identity of Israel:
The Israelite apostles of the Jewish Messiah say I am a Jew (Romans 2:27-29), say I am "Abraham's seed" (Romans 4:16/Galatians 3:29), say I am "the peculiar people, royal priesthood, holy nation" (1 Peter 2:9-10), say I am the circumcision-less Israel of God (Galatians 6:15-16), say I am "no longer a stranger but a fellow citizen of the commonwealth" (Ephesians 2:19), say I was once not a people but now am the people of God (1 Peter 2:10) and say I am the circumcision (Philippians 3:2-3).

Each and every one of these statements takes a key identifier/distinctive of Israel and labels me with it. Meanwhile, Christ calls the disobedient genetic sons of Abraham the "sons of satan" and the "synagogue of satan" (Revelation 2:9/John 8:39-47), and St. John says that those who deny the Son have no claim whatsoever to the Father (1 John 2:23)
You have a different understanding, different interpretations of scripture than I do.
The Church is the BODY of CHRIST. It had its beginning at Pentecost. It consists of all believers, most who are not from the nation of Israel, but from all nations. Spiritually we are from Abraham's seed, but Israel is still Israel. We are a royal priesthood but not of Israel. There is now no Greek, no Jew, no male, no female. In CHRIST, spiritually - ISRAEL is a place, a nation filled with Jews, with cities like TEL Aviv, Jerusalem. Actually Jesus will return there and put his feet on the ground. He will descend from the clouds as He ascended, as many watched Him, He will return.
 
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Ronald

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So, we haven't replaced anyone, we have joined faithful Israel. The term is actually a slur invented by Premils in order to discredit Amillennialism and to undermine those who believe Israel has been expanded out since Christ to include the Gentiles. The fact is: we didn't replace anyone. We joined believing Israel. A more accurate terms are ‘Inclusion Theology’ or ‘Expansion Theology’. Amils see a continuity between God’s people in the Old and New Testament. That is because we have joined faithful Israel (God's elect).
You haven't replaced anyone, you just believe the Church is Israel and THAT is called Replacement theology. God is not done with the Jewish nation of Israel.
 
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keras

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You haven't replaced anyone, you just believe the Church is Israel and THAT is called Replacement theology. God is not done with the Jewish nation of Israel.
No; over 20 prophesies say that God will destroy those apostate, Jesus deniers and only a small remnant will survive to join their Christian brethren. That is their fate. Amos 2:4-5, Jeremiah 10:18, Romans 9:27
 
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sovereigngrace

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You haven't replaced anyone, you just believe the Church is Israel and THAT is called Replacement theology. God is not done with the Jewish nation of Israel.

No. That is called: 'integration into'!
 
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Andrewn

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But when it comes to Amils though, not all Amils can even agree as to when the millennium begins and when it ends.
Most Amils would agree that the Millennium started with the Crucifixion and Resurrection of the Lord and will end with the release of Satan and the manifestation of the antichrist. It's not such a dilemma like you make it.

All Premils and all futurist Amils(I guess that's what you might call them), agree that after the 42 month reign of the beast in Revelation 13 is fulfilled, the coming I mentioned above happens next.
Rev 20:4, as you said, necessitates that one has to choose a different position: preterism, historicism, or idealism.

Those forms of Amil claim the chronology is this---the thousand years, followed by satan's little season, which means the 42 month reign of the beast in Revelation 13 to them, regardless that Revelation 20:4 already tells us the 42 month reign of the beast in Revelation 13 is fulfilled and in the past before satan is ever loosed, followed by the coming I mentioned above, thus impossible that the 42 month reign of the beast in Revelation 13 can happen during satan's little season after the thousand years like some Amils claim.
This can be a problem unless one proposes multiple antichrists: past, present, and future. Where is @jgr he's the expert on this :).
 
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Ronald

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Replacement Theology | Jewish Voice Ministries International

----------------------------------------------


>Covenant with Noah – everlasting, (for ages an ages until the new heaven and new earth)

“Now behold, I Myself do establish My covenant with you, and with your descendants after you; and with every living creature that is with you, the birds, the cattle, and every beast of the earth with you; of all that comes out of the ark, even every beast of the earth. I establish My covenant with you; and all flesh shall never again be cut off by the water of the flood, neither shall there again be a flood to destroy the earth.” God said, “This is the sign of the covenant which I am making between Me and you and every living creature that is with you, for all successive generations; I set My bow in the cloud, and it shall be for a sign of a covenant between Me and the earth. Gen. 9:9-13

>Covenant with Abraham – everlasting (for ages and ages until the new heaven and earth - and the stars are gone)

“And He took him outside and said, ‘Now look toward the heavens, and count the stars, if you are able to count them.’ And He said to him, ‘So shall your descendants be.’ ” Gen. 15:5

>Covenant with Moses – The Law was given and was a requirement of Israel to abide by. It is spiritual and teaches us what sin is. The New Covenant makes the requirements of the Law obsolete, but does not remove the Law, it remains for sinners. We are under Grace because Christ fulfilled the Law for us. But the unrighteous/unsaved will be judged by the Law.

>To David, His Everlasting Covenant is reiterated (for ages and ages ... until the new heaven and new earth)


“He has remembered His covenant forever,
The word which He commanded to a thousand generations,
The covenant which He made with Abraham,
And His oath to Isaac.
Then He confirmed it to Jacob for a statute,
To Israel as an everlasting covenant,
Saying, ‘To you I will give the land of Canaan

As the portion of your inheritance,’ ”
Psalm 105:8-11




>He did not cast out the nation of Israel, He chastises them.

‘For I am with you,’ declares the Lord, ‘to save you;
For I will destroy completely all the nations where I have scattered you,

Only I will not destroy you completely.
But I will chasten you justly

And will by no means leave you unpunished.’ Jer. 30:11

>Nations that will plunder Israel …


“For thus says the Lord of hosts, “After glory He has sent me against the nations which plunder you, for he who touches you, touches the apple of His eye.” Zech. 2:8


>Proof that Israel is not cast away and rejected in the following verse. Paul identifies himself as an Israelite, of the tribe of Benjamin, distinguishing himself and God’s chosen nation.

I say then, God has not rejected His people, has He? May it never be! For I too am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. God has not rejected His people whom He foreknew…”. Rom. 11:1, 2

>Israel is distinguished from the Gentiles.

What then? What Israel is seeking, it has not obtained, but those who were chosen obtained it, and the rest were hardened; just as it is written,

“God gave them a spirit of stupor,
Eyes to see not and ears to hear not,
Down to this very day.” Rom. 11:7, 8



“But by their transgression salvation has come to the Gentiles, …” Rom. 11:11


>You cannot read these passages and think that the Church is Israel.
So what has already happened and what will come of Israel?


"but, ‘As the Lord lives, who brought up the sons of Israel from the land of the north and from all the countries where He had banished them.’ For I will restore them to their own land which I gave to their fathers." Jer. 16:15


“Say to them, ‘Thus says the Lord God, “Behold, I will take the sons of Israel from among the nations where they have gone, and I will gather them from every side and bring them into their own land;” Ezek. 37:21



“Gather yourselves together, yes, gather,
O nation without shame,
Before the decree takes effect—
The day passes like the chaff—
Before the burning anger of the Lord comes upon you,
Before the day of the Lord’s anger comes upon you.
Seek the Lord,
All you humble of the earth
Who have carried out His ordinances;
Seek righteousness, seek humility.
Perhaps you will be hidden
In the day of the Lord’s anger.” Zeph. 2:1-3


>We have seen the re-gathering of Jews that were scattered throughout the world since the time of Christ, back to their promised land, when it became a nation in 1948 and Jerusalem recaptured in 1967.

“And just as it happened in the days of Noah, so it will be also in the days of the Son of Man: they were eating, they were drinking, they were marrying, they were being given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and the flood came and destroyed them all.” Luke 17: 26, 27
 
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claninja

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So when is the great white throne judgment?

After we physically die

Hebrews 9:27 Just as man is appointed to die once, and after that to face judgment

When heaven and earth pass away

Revelation 20:11 Then I saw a great white throne and the One seated on it. Earth and heaven fled from His presence, and no place was found for them
 
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sovereigngrace

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When heaven and earth pass away

Revelation 20:11 Then I saw a great white throne and the One seated on it. Earth and heaven fled from His presence, and no place was found for them

When did/does that happen?
 
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claninja

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No, because the 'little season' of Satan being loosed happens after the 1000 years is past - not when it begins.

Thanks for the response CG. I agree that Satan is loosed after the parabolic "1,000 years". But I believe these 2 passages are parallel, as I don't believe satan has 2 "little seasons".

Revelation 12:12 Therefore rejoice, O heavens, and you who dwell in them! But woe to the earth and the sea; with great fury the devil has come down to you, knowing he has only a short time.”

Revelation 20:3 And he threw him into the Abyss, shut it, and sealed it over him, so that he could not deceive the nations until the thousand years were complete. After that, he must be released for a brief period of time.

Thus, Christ's ascension to the throne is the fulfillment of the parabolic "1,000 years".

There are a literal 1,000 years from the time of David until Christ. Thus Christ's ascension fulfills Jeremiah 33:17, in which David would "never lack a man on the throne". The 1,000 years is the fulfillment of the binding of the strong man during Christ's ministry, death, resurrection and ascension, resulting in the apostles sitting on thrones to judge Israel and those in Christ being made a kingdom of priests through the power of the Spirit.

It was upon Christ's ascension that satan then cast out to make war on the peoples of God:

John 14:30 I will no longer talk much with you, for the ruler of this world is coming, and he has nothing in Me

Revelation 20:7-8 When the thousand years are complete, Satan will be released from his prison, and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—to assemble them for battle. Their number is like the sand of the seashore.

Revelation 12:13-17 And when the dragon saw that he had been thrown to the earth, he pursued the woman who had given birth to the male child. But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle to fly from the presence of the serpent to her place in the wilderness, where she was nourished for a time, and times, and half a time.Then from the mouth of the serpent spewed water like a river to overtake the woman and sweep her away in the torrent. But the earth helped the woman and opened its mouth to swallow up the river that had poured from the dragon’s mouth. And the dragon was enraged at the woman, and went to make war with the rest of her children, who keep the commandments of God and hold to the testimony of Jesus.

And the dragon stood on the shore of the sea
 
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