HELL IS NOT A SECRET TO BE KEPT

Skidder

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Still?
Obviously rejecting Christ has NOTHING to do with it if they are STILL under wrath.
It means they were ALREADY under wrath, as I said in the first place.

We don't have to reject Christ to come under wrath. We are BORN under wrath.
Through no fault of our own, I might add.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Skidder said:
Did you read why those who reject Christ are still under God's wrath?
Wrath has to do with being under the law. Christ is end of the law for righteousness for everyone who believes...

John 3:36
He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the WRATH OF GOD abides on him.”

Romans 4:15
because THE LAW brings about WRATH; for where there is NO LAW there is NO TRANSGRESSION.
Romans 10:4
For CHRIST IS THE END OF THE LAW for righteousness to EVERYONE WHO BELIEVES.
 
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Saint Steven

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...the false hell of ecumenism...
Why do you make that connection? There is nothing particularly ecumenical about Universalism. Assuming that is what you are attacking here. I would think that ecumenicalism agrees with your views on hell, since it is a Roman Catholic thing. They created hell. (and it's been hell ever since - lol) Actually led to the dark ages. And here you are, defending it.
 
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Skidder

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No, your exact words were;

"Your version of a "Godly person" and "over-aggressive". Your opinion is noted."

It felt less like you were genuinely taking note of my opinion, and more that you were simply disregarding it as 'just my opinion' so I wouldn't bug you anymore. Again, whether or not this was how you intended it, this is how it came out--and how you come off to others is very important in debates. Your words are your own responsibility, not mine or anyone else's. Even then, I think that hardly excuses you for losing your temper with me afterward, accusing me of manipulation and trying to deflect any semblance of accountability by passing the blame onto me instead multiple times.

In any case, I won't reply to you after this. I personally don't find it pleasant to have civil debates with people who do not take responsibility for their own words and actions and instead treat others with passive-aggression and contempt. I pray that God will soften your heart in this area.

God Bless.
Thank you. Your sharp rebukes for my bad behavior have been clearly noted.
 
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Saint Steven

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Wrath has to do with being under the law. Christ is end of the law for righteousness for everyone who believes...

John 3:36
He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the WRATH OF GOD abides on him.”

Romans 4:15
because THE LAW brings about WRATH; for where there is NO LAW there is NO TRANSGRESSION.
Romans 10:4
For CHRIST IS THE END OF THE LAW for righteousness to EVERYONE WHO BELIEVES.
Let's at least look at a decent translation without all your modifications. And a bit more context. (where needed)

This is obviously not a reference to the general wrath of God, but rather the wrath that came with the law that God gave to the Israelites alone through Moses.

John 3:36
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on them.

Romans 4:14-15
For if those who depend on the law are heirs, faith means nothing and the promise is worthless, 15 because the law brings wrath. And where there is no law there is no transgression.

Romans 10:4
Christ is the culmination of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes.
 
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Skidder

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Why do you make that connection? There is nothing particularly ecumenical about Universalism. Assuming that is what you are attacking here. I would think that ecumenicalism agrees with your views on hell, since it is a Roman Catholic thing. They created hell. (and it's been hell ever since - lol) Actually led to the dark ages. And here you are, defending it.
This is the first definition that comes up when I type in "ecumenical" on google search. Universal is one of the binding principles which also means all-inclusive and all-embracing. And I do not embrace the false hell of some denominations along with their false reconciliation.

ec·u·men·i·cal
/ˌekyəˈmenək(ə)l/

adjective
adjective: ecumenical; adjective: oecumenical
  1. representing a number of different Christian Churches.
    Similar:
    nondenominational
    nonsectarian
    universal
    catholic
    all-embracing
    all-inclusive
    Opposite:
    denominational
    • promoting or relating to unity among the world's Christian Churches.
      "ecumenical dialogue"
 
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Saint Steven

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I do not embrace the false hell of some denominations along with their false reconciliation.
Some? Ecumenical refers to all. As in all-inclusive.

There are no Christian Universalist denominations.
There is a Unitarian Universalist denomination. But that is different than Christian Universalism.
 
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Skidder

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Let's at least look at a decent translation without all your modifications. And a bit more context. (where needed)

This is obviously not a reference to the general wrath of God, but rather the wrath that came with the law that God gave to the Israelites alone through Moses.

John 3:36
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on them.

Romans 4:14-15
For if those who depend on the law are heirs, faith means nothing and the promise is worthless, 15 because the law brings wrath. And where there is no law there is no transgression.

Romans 10:4
Christ is the culmination of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes.
This was written to the church in Rome and Galatia not the synagogue. Clearly says they were under the law, but delivered through Christ.

Romans 7
Therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ, that you may be married to another—to Him who was raised from the dead, that we should bear fruit to God. 5 For when we were in the flesh, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death. 6 But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter.

And now the letter to Galatia....

Galations 3
Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”), 14 that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. 23 But before faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, "kept for the faith which would afterward be revealed. 24 Therefore the law was our "tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.
 
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theoneandonlypencil

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@Saint Steven Alright, I'm going to address your argument now. As much as I appreciate the reactions to my posts, I do not think you're going to like what I have to say, but I must say it regardless. (it may also be a tad bit long, since I can't condense my thoughts very well, but please try to bear with me)


Firstly, as others have stated, you do not have evidence that the Bible--any translation--is not true. But, we can assume it is true by the fact that it does records certain events correctly; and in recent years, we have even found historical mention by a Roman senator/historian named Tacitus, in this quote;

“the persons commonly called Christians, who were hated for their enormities. Christus, the founder of the name, was put to death by Pontius Pilate, procurator of Judea in the reign of Tiberius.”

source: https://www.history.com/news/was-jesus-real-historical-evidence


Another note is that we do have historical records of what was changed in the bible and what was not--because all such occasions would have been VERY significant, of course. The best part about there being so many bibles is that you can always compare it to other copies to see what has been changed.

Furthermore, if there is no Bible, there is no God. Without God's words, we are left with man--and when left with man...well, why are you even Christian? Why are you not Buddhist, Islamic, or any of the other made-up religions? What makes Christianity any different, when any man can claim to know the word of God? At that point, it's no longer a truth, it's a philosophy. A way of life. Something optional.

That's just touching on the tip of the iceberg when it comes to the bible's authenticity and why it is necessary. I'm sure you can find more resources, but this isn't my main point for this post.


My main point is the unstable foundation that Universalists have built their faith on. As a precaution, though, I'd like to point out that I'm no expert on this branch of theology--so feel free to correct me if I make any wrong assumptions.

Moving on...

You asked 'What happens to those without excuse, who have never heard of the Gospel?'.

The answer is simple; they are not saved. Even if they've never heard of God, they are not saved.

Now then, let me explain a bit more.

We know that idolatry is a sin, right? Right. And idolatry is when we place anything above God, especially other 'gods'. Idolators can not inhabit the kingdom of God; this is truth from both the old and new testaments.

Now, perhaps if one did not have the capacity to believe in anything , such as the case with newborns or those who cannot hear & see, they might be spared God's wrath, as it is he himself who has made them that way. However, I'd be hard-pressed to find a group of any people, at any point in history who did not believe in ANYTHING. Even Atheism, the belief in no God, is a belief nonetheless. Even more so, it's attributing God's work to someone or something else--which is blasphemy.

A leering issue with universalism is that, in essence, it is claiming that idolators and blasphemers(which are really one and the same, in many ways)can inherit the kingdom of God. That does not make sense, because God and Jesus have both made it very clear that those who practice idolatry and blasphemy, among any other sin, will be forfeiting their share in the tree of life. You may say that 'they must be worshipping because deep down they're worshipping God', but if that were the case, why would God so strongly condemn idolatry? Because they're not worshipping God. They're worshipping a counterfeit of God, which more than likely somewhere earlier along the lines of history, through their ancestors...rejected Christ. That's how all other religions come into existence, denial of the one true God. We are not hard-wired to love God. In our flesh, we are hard-wired to desire sin and to be further from God until we repent. It is God that changes our hearts, and how can we know him if we do not know His word?

Another issue is that universalism dismisses the importance of the Great Commission. If everyone was to be saved, then why would we need to evangelize in the first place? If people aren't getting saved, it is in part, due to not all of us partaking in this commission as we should.

Mark 16:15 ESV
And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation.

Matthew 28:19-20 ESV
Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”


Finally, you say that the bible is biased towards damnationism, or whatever it is called. I disagree. The bible is full of terrible events, sure--but do you forget what kind of awful things the wicked people of the times long gone committed? There were people placing their children on burning hot idols, letting them writhe in pain burning alive while their parents were drunk in a crowd of revelry, tricked into thinking they were going to be blessed by some 'god'. If God is perfect and just, do you think he would not administer punishment for such a thing? God is very loving, but he does what he knows is for the best...and that does not always align with what WE want. Our selfish 'me me me' views really block our understanding of scripture.

Think back to when you were a child. Perhaps there was a time that you wanted to eat a bunch of candy, but your parents told you 'no'. You probably were mad at your parents at the time, thinking they were being unfair--but in all reality, they were doing it because they loved you and they didn't want you to get a stomach ache.

God would much rather as many of us be saved as possible. But he did give us the choice to choose our paths, and not all of us will choose him. Do you never wonder why if all are so enamored by God and his goodness, why they had to create false Gods to worship in his place? There is a lot of good in the bible. Just the fact that none of us deserve salvation, that God allowed His only Son to die just so that the price for our wickedness could be paid so that he can justly declare us clean, makes the sacrifice of giving up some honestly less-than-healthy sinful habits that could send us to hell seem like a drop in the bucket in comparison. All he asks is that we love and obey his rules--not out of fear, but because we love him and we trust him.

In any case, God sending people to hell doesn't make him less loving either. If a judge sentences a murderer or thief to jail, he isn't unloving for doing so. That person knew the punishment for doing something like that, but they did it anyway knowing the consequences. God is just; if he did not punish people for wrongdoings, he would no longer be just. Hell is the punishment--but salvation, repentance, and belief in him is an offer to have those charges paid by someone who loved us enough to take the punishment for us.
 
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Skidder

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@Saint Steven Alright, I'm going to address your argument now. As much as I appreciate the reactions to my posts, I do not think you're going to like what I have to say, but I must say it regardless. (it may also be a tad bit long, since I can't condense my thoughts very well, but please try to bear with me)


Firstly, as others have stated, you do not have evidence that the Bible--any translation--is not true. But, we can assume it is true by the fact that it does records certain events correctly; and in recent years, we have even found historical mention by a Roman senator/historian named Tacitus, in this quote;

“the persons commonly called Christians, who were hated for their enormities. Christus, the founder of the name, was put to death by Pontius Pilate, procurator of Judea in the reign of Tiberius.”

source: https://www.history.com/news/was-jesus-real-historical-evidence


Another note is that we do have historical records of what was changed in the bible and what was not--because all such occasions would have been VERY significant, of course. The best part about there being so many bibles is that you can always compare it to other copies to see what has been changed.

Furthermore, if there is no Bible, there is no God. Without God's words, we are left with man--and when left with man...well, why are you even Christian? Why are you not Buddhist, Islamic, or any of the other made-up religions? What makes Christianity any different, when any man can claim to know the word of God? At that point, it's no longer a truth, it's a philosophy. A way of life. Something optional.

That's just touching on the tip of the iceberg when it comes to the bible's authenticity and why it is necessary. I'm sure you can find more resources, but this isn't my main point for this post.


My main point is the unstable foundation that Universalists have built their faith on. As a precaution, though, I'd like to point out that I'm no expert on this branch of theology--so feel free to correct me if I make any wrong assumptions.

Moving on...

You asked 'What happens to those without excuse, who have never heard of the Gospel?'.

The answer is simple; they are not saved. Even if they've never heard of God, they are not saved.

Now then, let me explain a bit more.

We know that idolatry is a sin, right? Right. And idolatry is when we place anything above God, especially other 'gods'. Idolators can not inhabit the kingdom of God; this is truth from both the old and new testaments.

Now, perhaps if one did not have the capacity to believe in anything , such as the case with newborns or those who cannot hear & see, they might be spared God's wrath, as it is he himself who has made them that way. However, I'd be hard-pressed to find a group of any people, at any point in history who did not believe in ANYTHING. Even Atheism, the belief in no God, is a belief nonetheless. Even more so, it's attributing God's work to someone or something else--which is blasphemy.

A leering issue with universalism is that, in essence, it is claiming that idolators and blasphemers(which are really one and the same, in many ways)can inherit the kingdom of God. That does not make sense, because God and Jesus have both made it very clear that those who practice idolatry and blasphemy, among any other sin, will be forfeiting their share in the tree of life. You may say that 'they must be worshipping because deep down they're worshipping God', but if that were the case, why would God so strongly condemn idolatry? Because they're not worshipping God. They're worshipping a counterfeit of God, which more than likely somewhere earlier along the lines of history, through their ancestors...rejected Christ. That's how all other religions come into existence, denial of the one true God. We are not hard-wired to love God. In our flesh, we are hard-wired to desire sin and to be further from God until we repent. It is God that changes our hearts, and how can we know him if we do not know His word?

Another issue is that universalism dismisses the importance of the Great Commission. If everyone was to be saved, then why would we need to evangelize in the first place? If people aren't getting saved, it is in part, due to not all of us partaking in this commission as we should.

Mark 16:15 ESV
And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation.

Matthew 28:19-20 ESV
Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”


Finally, you say that the bible is biased towards damnationism, or whatever it is called. I disagree. The bible is full of terrible events, sure--but do you forget what kind of awful things the wicked people of the times long gone committed? There were people placing their children on burning hot idols, letting them writhe in pain burning alive while their parents were drunk in a crowd of revelry, tricked into thinking they were going to be blessed by some 'god'. If God is perfect and just, do you think he would not administer punishment for such a thing? God is very loving, but he does what he knows is for the best...and that does not always align with what WE want. Our selfish 'me me me' views really block our understanding of scripture.

Think back to when you were a child. Perhaps there was a time that you wanted to eat a bunch of candy, but your parents told you 'no'. You probably were mad at your parents at the time, thinking they were being unfair--but in all reality, they were doing it because they loved you and they didn't want you to get a stomach ache.

God would much rather as many of us be saved as possible. But he did give us the choice to choose our paths, and not all of us will choose him. Do you never wonder why if all are so enamored by God and his goodness, why they had to create false Gods to worship in his place? There is a lot of good in the bible. Just the fact that none of us deserve salvation, that God allowed His only Son to die just so that the price for our wickedness could be paid so that he can justly declare us clean, makes the sacrifice of giving up some honestly less-than-healthy sinful habits that could send us to hell seem like a drop in the bucket in comparison. All he asks is that we love and obey his rules--not out of fear, but because we love him and we trust him.

In any case, God sending people to hell doesn't make him less loving either. If a judge sentences a murderer or thief to jail, he isn't unloving for doing so. That person knew the punishment for doing something like that, but they did it anyway knowing the consequences. God is just; if he did not punish people for wrongdoings, he would no longer be just. Hell is the punishment--but salvation, repentance, and belief in him is an offer to have those charges paid by someone who loved us enough to take the punishment for us.
Well said, especially like the last paragraph. He would not be just if He did not punish sin. And that is where His loving grace comes in. Jesus Christ took the wrath for sin upon Himself, and offers this free pardon to all with no strings attached. But will not force this free gift of life on anyone.

Thank you for your words, and sorry for being so bull headed!!

Grace and Peace to you and your family!!
 
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theoneandonlypencil

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Well said, especially like the last paragraph. He would not be just if He did not punish sin. And that is where His loving grace comes in. Jesus Christ took the wrath for sin upon Himself, and offers this free pardon to all with no strings attached. But will not force this free gift of life on anyone.

Thank you for your words, and sorry for being so bull headed!!

Grace and Peace to you and your family!!

Thank you kindly! I also apologize if I came down on you too harshly--I'm still working on myself, and for what it's worth I do rather you have a strong zeal to preach and stand by God's word, as you have shown, than not at all. You make a lot of good points :D

Grace and Peace to you & yours as well!
 
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Saint Steven

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This was written to the church in Rome and Galatia not the synagogue. Clearly says they were under the law, but delivered through Christ.
This is a misconception due to the situation with the Judaizing Circumcision Group. (see Acts 15) In actuality, the gentiles were never under the law that God gave to the Israelites alone through Moses. But the Circumcision claimed they needed to be under the law. See Galatians chapters three and five. "You foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you? …" - Gal. 3:1

Romans 2:14-15
(Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15 They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.)

1 Corinthians 9:20-22
To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. 21 To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law), so as to win those not having the law. 22 To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some.
 
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Saint Steven

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Firstly, as others have stated, you do not have evidence that the Bible--any translation--is not true.
I haven't said anything against the Bible in reference to it being true, or not.

However, I do believe there are translation problems. And this understanding is not unique to Universalism. Anyone who has looked into it knows that the translations don't agree with each other and that there are translation problems of many kinds. This does not nullify the Bible. I still trust it and use it on a daily basis.

The biggest problem with the Bible from the perspective of Universalism is that it was translated with a Damnationist bias. Are you familiar with the history of where our Bible came from?

The Bible did not come from the Eastern/Greek church (the early church) where what we now call Universalism was the common majority belief. The Bible came from the Western/Latin Roman Catholic church (the state church). It was a collection of books that were voted on to determine which would be canonized and which would not. For instance, the book of James only made it into the New Testament (NT) by a narrow margin in the vote.

So unfortunately, what we call the Bible today, especially in reference to the NT, is a biased Damnationist document. Therefore, proving Universalism from such a text is difficult, as you might imagine. Fortunately, a few texts slipped through that give us a glimpse at the greater hope. Here's a sampling.

1 John 2:2
He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.

Romans 11:32
For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.

Romans 5:18
Consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people,
so also one righteous act resulted in justification and life for all people.

Colossians 1:20
and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross.

1 Timothy 2:4
who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth.

1 Corinthians 15:22
For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive.
 
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Saint Steven

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You asked 'What happens to those without excuse, who have never heard of the Gospel?'.

The answer is simple; they are not saved. Even if they've never heard of God, they are not saved.
My question (as best I recall) was about the billions who have never even heard the name of Christ. For which I was accused of taking the liberal view.

When pressed, most Damnationists will begin to soften the hard and fast rule. They will typically not enforce their doctrine on these people groups.
- Children who died at birth (including aborted children)
- Children under the age of accountability
- The mentally handicapped
- Those who have never heard of Christ or the Gospel (countless billions)

Would you say that it is just for God to consign these groups of individuals to eternal conscious torment in hell with no hope of escape?
 
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Revelation 20:14-15 Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
14 And Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This lake of fire is the second death. 15 And anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.

So is it death or is it eternal torment? And why is it that the unbelieving nations, consumed by fire in Rev 20;9 and thrown into the fire in Rev 20:15 later emerge purified and repentant in Rev 21:24-26 to bring their good stuff to the throne and receive healing in Rev 22:2? Why is that? Could it be that the old man in destroyed an left as a puddle of wormy sludge, and the renewed man 'died to self alive in Christ' emerges? Could salvation, not damnation or annihilation, be the omega like we're told? Could the total victory of Christ be fulfilled in the coming of heaven to earth?

Good news for all, eh. Where's that superabundant grace when it's needed most? Where's that trade mark mercy and forgiveness? And what of the holiness? Or is it just a case of 'Shut your trap and get on the grill, Joe'?

Ps love your 'easy to read' version of damnation translation. 'Have a nice day.' Is that what they call the banality of evil?
 
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Now, perhaps if one did not have the capacity to believe in anything , such as the case with newborns or those who cannot hear & see, they might be spared God's wrath, as it is he himself who has made them that way.
There. That's what I am talking about. A concession based on individual cases. This shows that even Damnationists (for the most part) understand that their doctrine can't apply strictly and still be fair justice. The ight in the dark tunnel of Damnationism.
 
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A leering issue with universalism is that, in essence, it is claiming that idolators and blasphemers(which are really one and the same, in many ways)can inherit the kingdom of God.
No, we are not saying that at all.

To enter the kingdom, one must acknowledge Jesus Christ as Lord.
The Bible tells us that every knee will bow and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord. But notice WHERE this will happen. In heaven and on earth and under the earth. (in the realm of the dead)

The Bible also says, no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit. And that those who declare with their mouth that Jesus is Lord will be saved. And that Christ died and returned to life so that he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living.

Philippians 2:10-11
that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow,
in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
11 and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord,
to the glory of God the Father.

1 Corinthians 12:3
Therefore I want you to know that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says,
“Jesus be cursed,” and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit.

Romans 14:9
For this very reason, Christ died and returned to life so that
he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living.

Romans 10:9
If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart
that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Note on "acknowledge" in Philippians 2:11
S1843 eksomologéō (from 1537 /ek, "wholly out from," intensifying 3670 /homologéō, "say the same thing about") – properly, fully agree and to acknowledge that agreement openly (whole-heartedly); hence, to confess ("openly declare"), without reservation (no holding back).
 
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Saint Steven

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A leering issue with universalism is that, in essence, it is claiming that idolators and blasphemers(which are really one and the same, in many ways)can inherit the kingdom of God. That does not make sense, because God and Jesus have both made it very clear that those who practice idolatry and blasphemy, among any other sin, will be forfeiting their share in the tree of life. You may say that 'they must be worshipping because deep down they're worshipping God', but if that were the case, why would God so strongly condemn idolatry? Because they're not worshipping God. They're worshipping a counterfeit of God, which more than likely somewhere earlier along the lines of history, through their ancestors...rejected Christ. That's how all other religions come into existence, denial of the one true God. We are not hard-wired to love God. In our flesh, we are hard-wired to desire sin and to be further from God until we repent. It is God that changes our hearts, and how can we know him if we do not know His word?
In reference to what I have bolded above, all the major world religions were established before Christ came. How could they have rejected him?

Furthermore, the Bible tells us that the end will not come until "this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations" before the end comes. If the end has not yet come, then the gospel has not everywhere been preached. Right?

How many have died with NO KNOWLEDGE of the gospel? (countless billions)

Matthew 24:14
And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.
 
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Another issue is that universalism dismisses the importance of the Great Commission. If everyone was to be saved, then why would we need to evangelize in the first place? If people aren't getting saved, it is in part, due to not all of us partaking in this commission as we should.
That is yet another misconception about the greater hope.

We do not take the position that evangelism is of no importance, nor do we deny the Great Commission. However, I would point out that the Great Commission is not to make converts, it is to make disciples. Which from my perspective happens before during and after a person is saved. My best friend is agnostic. I am discipling him.

Here's a question for you. Are disciples made by threatening people with hell if they don't "convert"? That sounds more like extortion than evangelism.
 
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Finally, you say that the bible is biased towards damnationism, or whatever it is called. I disagree. The bible is full of terrible events, sure--but do you forget what kind of awful things the wicked people of the times long gone committed? There were people placing their children on burning hot idols, letting them writhe in pain...
Isn't that what you are accusing God of doing? Burning his own children.

We were created in the image of God. Nothing in creation is more like him. Could you (being evil) consign your children to eternal torment with no hope of escape for disobeying you? What kind of a parent would do that? An unfathomable evil to accuse God of.

Matthew 7:9-11
“Which of you, if your son asks for bread, will give him a stone? 10 Or if he asks for a fish, will give him a snake? 11 If you, then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give good gifts to those who ask him!
 
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In any case, God sending people to hell doesn't make him less loving either. If a judge sentences a murderer or thief to jail, he isn't unloving for doing so.
Your concept of eternal punishment makes human justice look humane by comparison.

Human justice has the purpose of correction. They call prisons correctional institutions. As horrible as they are, they have a purpose. An eternal hell with no hope of escape lacks any good purpose.

And frankly, if the angels were binding you hand and foot preparing to throw you into the lake of fire, how long would it takes for you to became a believer?
 
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