What did Adam and Eve not know?

yeshuaslavejeff · Nov 11, 2019

renniks said:
I think all these people trying to make it metaphorical are missing the point. Maybe it is a metaphor, but first of all, it's literal. Don't complicate it. Before, they weren't sexually aware, after, they were, and felt the need to wear clothes.

ie. CONSCIENCE..... guilty...... that's why they HID (as if!) FROM the CREATOR !

yeshuaslavejeff · Nov 11, 2019

JackRT said:
I am constantly impressed that Christians (like me) can come up with so many wildly different interpretations of the same Bible verse(s).

That's not so surprising. The enemy helps do that with multitudes (billions of people).

What is surprising, is that the Father can do with those who trust Him, rely on Him, and do as He says (i.e. don't try to interpret what HE says is not open to interpretation).

Instead, as Jesus Praised the Father : PRAISE YOU FATHER IN HEAVEN,

for REVEALING Salvation and everything concerning Salvation

to little children (who don't interpret, for one; pure, innocent, forgiven little children)..

AND (this is the good part)

HIDING IT from the educated ones (who love to interpret) ....

d taylor · Nov 11, 2019

DamianWarS said:
v4-5 But the serpent said to the woman, “You will not surely die. For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

v7 Then the eyes of both were opened, and they knew that they were naked. And they sewed fig leaves together and made themselves loincloths.

what exactly did Adam and Even "not know" before eating the fruit. The serpent tells them if they eat the fruit they will know the difference between good and evil... do we accept this? After they ate it, they knew they were naked. being naked is neither good/evil yet Adam and Eve knew they were naked after eating the fruit and before it seems they did not. To me this seems to be about either shame or the lust of being naked that they experienced. They always knew their bodies weren't covered but something was different after eating the fruit that uncovered bodies meant something else.

so how does Adam and Eve knowing they were naked connect with them knowing good and evil? if they didn't know good and evil how were they to know that following God was good and following the serpent was evil?

As of now we are not given full details of events. So could the Knowing of good and evil be the knowing about or understanding of what caused satan's fall or that satan has become the adversary of God.

Did Adam and Eve know about the fall of satan. It does not sound like they did.

renniks · Nov 11, 2019

yeshuaslavejeff said:
ie. CONSCIENCE..... guilty...... that's why they HID (as if!) FROM the CREATOR !

Yeah, did I say otherwise?

Pavel Mosko · Nov 11, 2019

Sabertooth said:
What is "Gineskoed?"

lol

I was making a verb out of the Greek word for Know.

WanderedHome · Nov 11, 2019

DamianWarS said:
v4-5 But the serpent said to the woman, “You will not surely die. For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

v7 Then the eyes of both were opened, and they knew that they were naked. And they sewed fig leaves together and made themselves loincloths.

what exactly did Adam and Even "not know" before eating the fruit. The serpent tells them if they eat the fruit they will know the difference between good and evil... do we accept this? After they ate it, they knew they were naked. being naked is neither good/evil yet Adam and Eve knew they were naked after eating the fruit and before it seems they did not. To me this seems to be about either shame or the lust of being naked that they experienced. They always knew their bodies weren't covered but something was different after eating the fruit that uncovered bodies meant something else.

so how does Adam and Eve knowing they were naked connect with them knowing good and evil? if they didn't know good and evil how were they to know that following God was good and following the serpent was evil?

It's not that Adam and Eve didn't know something- it's that they knew exactly what they had before and what they had lost. They just didn't know what it was like to lose it.
St. John Chrysostom, the most famous preacher among the Church Fathers, talks about this in his Homily 16 on Genesis 2:25.

Basically, he says that Adam and Eve were naked before, in a sense, but not truly because they were clothed with "the glory from above, garbed better than any garment." They were stripped of their God-given grace and saw the baseness that they had fallen to. It wasn't about their loins, but about their shame in rejecting that Communion with God.
They were not ordinary humans before the fall... I mean they were, they weren't like aliens or anything

... but at their creation, God had endowed them with such lavish gifts of grace and dignity (like royalty) and were clothed in the light of God. When they broke that, they became like we are now.
I mean, think about how Moses' face shone like the sun when he came down from being in God's Presence... and the Transfiguration of Jesus... imagine being created without any sin, or its consequences, and being in the presence of God 24/7!

DamianWarS · Nov 11, 2019

martymonster said:
Being naked means, not having a covering for your sin. Their eyes being opened means they could see. In other words, they understood that their good works weren't enough, they needed a saviour.

you quickly go to the spiritual. how does the text inform us that what Adam and Eve saw was uniquely spiritual and not physical? I'm still not quite clear how you reconcile the realization that they are physically naked with this spiritual nakedness and how the text gets us there. it makes for a good devotion but where is it in the text?

JackRT · Nov 11, 2019

yeshuaslavejeff said:
That's not so surprising. The enemy helps do that with multitudes (billions of people).

What is surprising, is that the Father can do with those who trust Him, rely on Him, and do as He says (i.e. don't try to interpret what HE says is not open to interpretation).

Instead, as Jesus Praised the Father : PRAISE YOU FATHER IN HEAVEN,

for REVEALING Salvation and everything concerning Salvation

to little children (who don't interpret, for one; pure, innocent, forgiven little children)..

AND (this is the good part)

HIDING IT from the educated ones (who love to interpret) ....

Just reading the words of scripture is an interpretation in itself. But something that we all too easily forget is that scripture itself is already an interpretation.

JackRT · Nov 11, 2019

JackRT said:
Just reading the words of scripture is an interpretation in itself. But something that we all too easily forget is that scripture itself is already an interpretation.

martymonster · Nov 11, 2019

DamianWarS said:
you quickly go to the spiritual. how does the text inform us that what Adam and Eve saw was uniquely spiritual and not physical? I'm still not quite clear how you reconcile the realization that they are physically naked with this spiritual nakedness and how the text gets us there. it makes for a good devotion but where is it in the text?

If you try to understand the physical, you are completely missing the point.
The spiritual is all there is, and all that matters.

Joh 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
Joh 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Here's how I know what the symbols in that scripture mean.

Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
Rev 3:18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

Rev 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.

Eph 1:18 The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,

Pro 17:24 Wisdom is before him that hath understanding; but the eyes of a fool are in the ends of the earth.

Jer 5:21 Hear now this, O foolish people, and without understanding; which have eyes, and see not; which have ears, and hear not:

DamianWarS · Nov 11, 2019

martymonster said:
If you try to understand the physical, you are completely missing the point.
The spiritual is all there is, and all that matters.

hmm... can we say that Gen 1-2 as well? I tend to agree, yet when I speak of Gen 1 this way there's a lot of backlash.

martymonster · Nov 11, 2019

DamianWarS said:
hmm... can we say that Gen 1-2 as well? I tend to agree, yet when I speak of Gen 1 this way there's a lot of backlash.

Of course you can say that. It kind of depends on the interpretation though.

friend of · Nov 11, 2019

I'm wondering what adam and eve concept of what death was before the fall...

DamianWarS · Nov 11, 2019

martymonster said:
It kind of depends on the interpretation though

Consistency is what I'm aiming at

martymonster · Nov 11, 2019

DamianWarS said:
Consistency is what I'm aiming at

Well, if you let scripture interpret scripture, consistency is what you'll get.
If you take one verse and try and interpret it by itself, inconsistency and heresy is what you'll end up with.

I'm kind of curious about your understanding of Gen 1:2?

DamianWarS · Nov 11, 2019

martymonster said:
Well, if you let scripture interpret scripture, consistency is what you'll get.
If you take one verse and try and interpret it by itself, inconsistency and heresy is what you'll end up with.

I'm kind of curious about your understanding of Gen 1:2?

why are you interested in my interpretation of Gen 1:2? you realize I said Gen 1-2, meaning chapter 1 and chapter 2 (since the OP is more focused on chapter 3). But as I said I agree with you as you said it clear "If you try to understand the physical, you are completely missing the point. The spiritual is all there is, and all that matters."

yeshuaslavejeff · Nov 12, 2019

renniks said:
Yeah, did I say otherwise?

I don't remember, and I don't think you did. Someone else did though......

yeshuaslavejeff · Nov 12, 2019

JackRT said:
Just reading the words of scripture is an interpretation in itself. But something that we all too easily forget is that scripture itself is already an interpretation.

That's where people get mixed up. (Instead of believing Yahuweh, what He Says, thinking it needs interpreted) (the whole definition/ meaning/ history of the word has been changed for everyone, almost)

dcalling · Nov 12, 2019

DamianWarS said:
v4-5 But the serpent said to the woman, “You will not surely die. For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

v7 Then the eyes of both were opened, and they knew that they were naked. And they sewed fig leaves together and made themselves loincloths.

what exactly did Adam and Even "not know" before eating the fruit. The serpent tells them if they eat the fruit they will know the difference between good and evil... do we accept this? After they ate it, they knew they were naked. being naked is neither good/evil yet Adam and Eve knew they were naked after eating the fruit and before it seems they did not. To me this seems to be about either shame or the lust of being naked that they experienced. They always knew their bodies weren't covered but something was different after eating the fruit that uncovered bodies meant something else.

so how does Adam and Eve knowing they were naked connect with them knowing good and evil? if they didn't know good and evil how were they to know that following God was good and following the serpent was evil?

Adam and Eve already know what's good, i.e. that is God and what's bad, i.e. disobey God.

The serpant lied, the tree can't make Adam and Even to be like God, the tree simply polluted them and they lost their innocence, now they have shame, and started to judge others instead of let God do that, they no longer lover one another as bones/flesh, but as other creations.

Blade · Nov 12, 2019

Like the bother said.. it was a lie. They had no problem with a animal/serpent talking. I would only GUESS if it was me this serpent talking GOD made and only told the truth. Lying.. well no one knew what that was. So why would you even question it? And remember we only read what is needed in this world. After this is all over we will know everything that was said..

But Satan is a lair. And full of wisdom. Got 1/3 of heaven to go with him ..while GOD was right there in all His glory.

What did Adam and Eve not know?

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Arch-Dude of the Apostolic

Active Member

Follower of Isa Al Masih

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Veteran

Follower of Isa Al Masih

Veteran

A private in Gods army

Follower of Isa Al Masih

Veteran

Follower of Isa Al Masih

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

Senior Member

Veteran

Similar threads