Unconditional Election

bcbsr · May 5, 2019

According to Reformed theology a person is fated to eternal life prior to birth, and that not based upon God's foreknowledge of their faith. That is the "U" (Unconditional Election) in the Calvinist's "T.U.L.I.P" acronym. As such under Reformed Theology the elect are never in their life in danger of going to hell as they are predestined prior to birth to go to heaven and nothing can change that fate. Logically such people have been saved insomuch as they are guaranteed eternal life and are eternally secure in their fate. Thus Reformed Theology removes faith in Christ as a pre-condition for salvation.The apostle answers the question "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" with "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved" which logically contradicts "Unconditional Election". Under Reformed Theology a person cannot do anything to make themselves elect to eternal life.

Episkopay · May 5, 2019

We all have free choice within the parameters we are given. A rich man in this life can decide to buy a yacht or not. Most of us can't. But most of us CAN decide to eat a banana. That is well within the financial capabilities of almost everyone. And if someone wants a banana and can't afford one...he can always ask someone for one.

The confusion comes in when we misunderstand the callings in Christ. They are on 2 levels. Righteousness and holiness.

A person cannot decide to be born from above. God decides that. But a man can decide to forgive his brother or not.

One who is called to be a saint has many more options (like a rich man) than does a person who is left to obey God in his own strength (a poor man).

Both can be saved. But the righteous man is scarcely saved...if he remains faithful. And the saint is abundantly saved...if he remains faithful.

So then just as in this life there is greater and lesser...so it is in the kingdom of God.

Peter J Barban · May 5, 2019

bcbsr said:
According to Reformed theology a person is fated to eternal life prior to birth, and that not based upon God's foreknowledge of their faith. That is the "U" (Unconditional Election) in the Calvinist's "T.U.L.I.P" acronym. As such under Reformed Theology the elect are never in their life in danger of going to hell as they are predestined prior to birth to go to heaven and nothing can change that fate. Logically such people have been saved insomuch as they are guaranteed eternal life and are eternally secure in their fate. Thus Reformed Theology removes faith in Christ as a pre-condition for salvation.The apostle answers the question "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" with "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved" which logically contradicts "Unconditional Election". Under Reformed Theology a person cannot do anything to make themselves elect to eternal life.

You have not come up with a new idea, as you probably know. The Reformed have already dealt with this. I think to be fair you need to consider the reformed answer to your concern.

Albion · May 5, 2019

bcbsr said:
Logically such people have been saved insomuch as they are guaranteed eternal life and are eternally secure in their fate. Thus Reformed Theology removes faith in Christ as a pre-condition for salvation.The apostle answers the question "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" with "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved" which logically contradicts "Unconditional Election". Under Reformed Theology a person cannot do anything to make themselves elect to eternal life.

That's your mistake. Election does not mean being chosen to eternal life independent of everything else, Christ, Faith, etc. It means that the person is chosen to receive the Faith that saves. You had it exactly backwards.

Apologetic_Warrior · May 5, 2019

bcbsr said:
Thus Reformed Theology removes faith in Christ as a pre-condition for salvation.The apostle answers the question "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" with "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved" which logically contradicts "Unconditional Election". Under Reformed Theology a person cannot do anything to make themselves elect to eternal life.

Nope, unconditional election secures faith in Christ, and should be understood in terms of the ordo salutis (order of salvation), such that those elected from eternity will be called (drawn) at a time of God's choosing and those he effectually calls will be monergistically regenerated and irresistibly (because of regeneration) believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and be freely justified, and this not of themselves it is the gift of God, least any man should boast.

Dave L · May 5, 2019

Episkopay said:
We all have free choice within the parameters we are given. A rich man in this life can decide to buy a yacht or not. Most of us can't. But most of us CAN decide to eat a banana. That is well within the financial capabilities of almost everyone. And if someone wants a banana and can't afford one...he can always ask someone for one.

The confusion comes in when we misunderstand the callings in Christ. They are on 2 levels. Righteousness and holiness.

A person cannot decide to be born from above. God decides that. But a man can decide to forgive his brother or not.

One who is called to be a saint has many more options (like a rich man) than does a person who is left to obey God in his own strength (a poor man).

Both can be saved. But the righteous man is scarcely saved...if he remains faithful. And the saint is abundantly saved...if he remains faithful.

So then just as in this life there is greater and lesser...so it is in the kingdom of God.

“O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: It is not in man that walketh to direct his steps.” (Jeremiah 10:23)

Hammster · May 5, 2019

bcbsr said:
According to Reformed theology a person is fated to eternal life prior to birth, and that not based upon God's foreknowledge of their faith. That is the "U" (Unconditional Election) in the Calvinist's "T.U.L.I.P" acronym. As such under Reformed Theology the elect are never in their life in danger of going to hell as they are predestined prior to birth to go to heaven and nothing can change that fate. Logically such people have been saved insomuch as they are guaranteed eternal life and are eternally secure in their fate. Thus Reformed Theology removes faith in Christ as a pre-condition for salvation.The apostle answers the question "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" with "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved" which logically contradicts "Unconditional Election". Under Reformed Theology a person cannot do anything to make themselves elect to eternal life.

It’s not a contradiction. Election does not equal regeneration, justification, etc.

Episkopay · May 5, 2019

Hammster said:
It’s not a contradiction. Election does not equal regeneration, justification, etc.

Here is a man who does not have to assume things into errors! Good on ya!

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Unconditional Election

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