The Rule of faith and practice is not scripture "alone"

LoveofTruth · Dec 20, 2018

swordsman1 said:
No, the Spirit of Christ, the Holy Spirit did not dwell inside OT believers. Christ dwelling in the heart by faith only applies to New Testament believers who have the Holy Spirit indwelling them as the rest of Eph 3:16-17 makes clear.

Peter (still in the Old Covenant before Christ had died) said;

Matthew 16:16
"And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God." and this showed he was born again and had God dwelling in Him.

1 John 5:1
"Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God:..."

1 John 4:16
"15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.."

and we read

"10 Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me. 11 Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me. 12 Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit."(Psalm 51:10-12 KJV)

And Christ does dwell in the heart by faith of all time. The just shall live by faith in the Old Testament and the New. You are in error there.

"Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea; 2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea; 3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat; 4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ."(1 Cor 10:1-4 KJV)

LoveofTruth · Dec 20, 2018

swordsman1 said:
Firstly Eph 3:11-12 says nothing of the sort. The passage you quoted is not from Ephesians 3 it is from 1 Peter 1:11-12. And it was not referring to OT believers in general but to the OT prophets who spoke by the Spirit of Christ. 1 Peter 1:10 "the prophets who prophesied....". This verse was one of my proofs that the Spirit of Christ is the Holy Spirit remember? The OT prophets spoke under the influence of the Holy Spirit.

2 Peter 1:21 "for no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God."

It's not a few verses down, it is in a completely different book.

They are not 2 separate sentences, they are clauses linked with a "so that":

Eph 3:16-17 "that He would grant you, according to the riches of His glory, to be strengthened with power through His Spirit in the inner man, so that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith;"

.

These verses are not saying what you are saying.

When Christ is in men the Spirit will strengthen and empower them to minister and speak through Christ. This is how the Spirit of Christ in men and their union with Christ in their heart is effected and strenghened and the inner man is strengthend by the Holy Ghost. This inner man is the new man in Christ born again by the word of God. The Holy Ghost immerses believers into the body of Christ and empowers us and guides us. He guides the new man in Christ. That Christ may dwell in your heart through faith is done through the Spirit by which we are baptized or immersed into Christ, or into Jesus Christ. As many as have been baptized into Jesus Christ (Rom 6:3 KJV) and "as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ"(Gal 3:27 KJV). For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body (1 Cor 12:13 KJV).

Again the Trinity is in effect in men's hearts. A man is only moved by the Holy Ghost if he is already born again by the word of God, and immersed into Christ by the Holy Ghost. the seed sown in his heart and then he is in Christ and Christ in him. The Spirit of Christ works with God to testify and speak forth truth.

I can do all things through Christ. Jesus said without him we can do nothing. He spoke this in John 15 before the Holy Ghost was given. Though the Holy Ghost still had work in the Old Testament and so did the Father.

We read of God working through Jesus Christ in men in various places. But this shows that Jesus Christ and The Father and the Holy Ghost are all distinct but still one God. Each has a work and ministration.

"20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant, 21 Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen."(Hebrews 13:20,21 KJV)

2 Corinthians 5:19
To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself,..."

Bible Highlighter · Dec 20, 2018

LoveofTruth said:
No it wasn't a stupid question. You are implying that the Spirit of Christ is the Holy Ghost. But in scripture Jesus Christ is in believers and he is in them by his Spirit. And so the Spirit of Jesus Christ is in them. The word Christ is always associated with Jesus Christ as I can see and not specifically to the Holy Ghost..

I was speaking of this here

"LoveofTruth said: ↑

And do you say that 2 Cor 13:5 should not refer to Jesus Christ in us and instead the Holy Ghost in us these sections?"

and you said

""Christ in you", the Spirit of Christ, is the Holy Spirit. As I have shown"

Interesting that in that section it did not say any of the words you used. It says

2 Corinthians 13:5
"Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

You say this reference to Jesus Christ is in you" is to the Holy Ghost? This is not what Paul said here. Obviously Jesus Christ in believers is in then in Spirit and so the Spirit of Jesus Christ is in them. This word "Christ" here identifies with Jesus Christ the Son of God, not the Holy Ghost here. There is a reason for Paul's wording in every place and he is very specific in his wording as led by the Spirit.is the Holy Ghost.

You simply ignored my question using this verse and said "Christ in you, the Spirit of Christ, is the Holy Spirit". But this verse shows who Christ is and the Spirit of Christ and that is Jesus Christ, not the Holy Ghost here.

All three members of the Godhead are in believers, the Father the Son and the Holy Ghost. Each one is referenced in specific verses and their work.

You seem to have trouble with this verse. It clearly identifies who "Christ" is as "Jesus Christ". Jesus is the Christ as scripture shows and so if Christ is in a believer this is identified as Jesus Christ in them. And we know that Jesus Christ is in heaven in a body and so when we say Jesus Christ is in us, this is in Spirit, but not specifically referring to the Holy Ghost.

So if someone was to ask you "is Jesus Christ in you"?, using this verse (2 Cor 13:5 KJV) as the test. What would you say? would you say "no the Holy Ghost is in me, Paul meant the Holy Ghost instead of saying Jesus Christ is in you?."

I re-read the Word of God and carefully looked at the context again. You convinced me on the "Spirit of Christ" in Romans 8:9, and 1 Peter 1:11 is a reference to Jesus.

Thank you, Love of Truth.

I only disagree with you on Romans 8:2, though.
I believe the "Spirit of Life" is the Holy Ghost who is in Christ Jesus.

Please check out all the word references here and carefully compare them and it is obvious that it is the Holy Spirit (Especially Revelation 22:17).

Here is the link:

Blue Letter Bible - Spirit life.

Also, Romans 8:1 says,
"There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

The last word here in the verse is clearly in reference to the Holy Ghost.

May God bless you, brother.

swordsman1 · Dec 20, 2018

LoveofTruth said:
You said the seed is "plant seeds". The seed is the word of God and the seed is Christ. Neither are "plant seeds". Jesus is using a earthly figure of seeds planting, to refer to the seed which is the word of God sown in the heart. This seed is sown on every heart of all men everywhere as I can show by scripture. The something sown is the incorruptible seed, the word of God. This is the mystery that hath been hod from ages, Christ in you the hope of glory.

In Jesus's explanation of the parable of the sower he said the seed sown by the farmer is representative of God's proclaimed word (scripture), we know this because people "hear" it (Luke 8:12) - again this is Jesus's plain explanation, not another parable.

swordsman1 · Dec 20, 2018

LoveofTruth said:
Galatians 6:18
Brethren, the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit. Amen."

We already know that Jesus Christ is in every believer. The effect he has in us is of Him and the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ is Him working in us.

The word grace means

"from 5463; graciousness (as gratifying), of manner or act (abstract or concrete; literal, figurative or spiritual; especially the divine influence upon the heart, and its reflection in the life; including gratitude):--acceptable, benefit, favour, gift, grace(- ious), joy, libe"

Grace is an attribute, not a Person.

swordsman1 · Dec 20, 2018

LoveofTruth said:
When you say the Holy Ghost is the "Spirit of Christ" you seem to be denying that Jesus Christ came in the flesh. We do not read that the Holy Ghost came in the flesh as Jesus Christ the Son of God, or that the Father came in the flesh as Jesus Christ did. Jesus is the Christ. Christ died for our sins. Christ is in believers, this is Jesus Christ in us. If Jesus Christ is in us, he is in us in Spirit.

It is not denying that Jesus Christ came in the flesh. But, like it or not, scripture is clear that the Spirit of Christ is the Holy Spirit. We can go through those verses again if you wish (you haven't refuted them yet).

LoveofTruth · Dec 20, 2018

swordsman1 said:
In Jesus's explanation of the parable of the sower he said the seed sown by the farmer is representative of God's proclaimed word (scripture), we know this because people "hear" it (Luke 8:12) - again this is Jesus's plain explanation, not another parable.

While people can hear the word preached physically this is not Jesus meaning here he speaks of thier inner man hearing

Luke 8:12. Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.”

We know that these four soils cover all men of all time all over the earth and there is no creature that is not given the seed sown or the word of God sown

Hebrews 4:12, 13 “For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. 13. Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do.”

this is the true Light that lighteth every man that cometh into the world

John 1 - 9. That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.”

And as I have shown many times in Deuteronomy the word is nigh or close to all

swordsman1 · Dec 20, 2018

LoveofTruth said:
I don't believe in three Separate Spirits. But these THREE are one.

You believe in 3 distinct Spirits in one God, right? That is not orthodox Christian theology.

The verses you quote are not referring to the Spirit of Christ or the Father.

LoveofTruth · Dec 20, 2018

swordsman1 said:
Grace is an attribute, not a Person.

And yet it is from him and of him like heat from a fire. God’s divine influence in our hearts through Jesus Chrust and empowered by the Holy Ghost . But we also read;

Titus 2:11. For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,”

John 1 - 16. And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace. 17. For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.”

1 Corinthians 15:10. But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.”

Galatians 6 - 18. Brethren, the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit. Amen.”

Acts 15 - 11. But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.”

1 Thessalonians 1 - 1. Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus, unto the church of the Thessalonians which is in God the Father and in the Lord Jesus Christ: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.”

The grace is of God and flows from God it is not separate from Him. If God is in us He works in us through Jesus Christ this is His divine influence upon the heart.

LoveofTruth · Dec 20, 2018

swordsman1 said:
Grace is an attribute, not a Person.

And yet it is from him and of him like heat from a fire. God’s divine influence in our hearts through Jesus Chrust and empowered by the Holy Ghost . But we also read;

Titus 2:11. For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,”

John 1 - 16. And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace. 17. For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.”

1 Corinthians 15:10. But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.”

Galatians 6 - 18. Brethren, the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit. Amen.”

Acts 15 - 11. But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.”

1 Thessalonians 1 - 1. Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus, unto the church of the Thessalonians which is in God the Father and in the Lord Jesus Christ: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.”

The grace is of God and flows from God it is not separate from Him. If God is in us He works in us through Jesus Christ this is Hos divine influence upon the heart.

Some have touched on these issues if God’s grace given before any heard scripture and that God seeks them wherever they are they call it “provenient grace” some interesting thoughts.

We know God seeks all men everywhere by the true Light which lighteth every man that cometh into the world this light is shining in even the men as far away and in the most remote parts of the earth God did not leave himself without witness. All can feel after him and find him though he be not far from every one of us. He is close to all in the true Light, and the seed sown in the heart, the truth that men hold in unrighteousness, that which may be known of God is manifest IN them.

What is Prevenient Grace? - Seedbed

LoveofTruth · Dec 20, 2018

swordsman1 said:
You believe in 3 distinct Spirits in one God, right? That is not orthodox Christian theology.

The verses you quote are not referring to the Spirit of Christ or the Father.

Explain your view of three “separate” persons? What do You mean when you say “separate” and what do you mean by the word “person’s? “

And explain Jesus baptism where we see the Holy Ghost descend “bodily”

I simply believe the verses like these

1 John 5 - 7. For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.”

swordsman1 · Dec 20, 2018

LoveofTruth said:
Is not Christ Spirit before he came in the flesh? If not then what was Christ before he came in the flesh? If not Spirit then what? If Christ was Spirit before he came in the flesh and then Jesus Christ Came in the flesh he is still the Spirit of Christ only now in the flesh. So if Jesus Christ is in believers he is still the Spirit of Christ in them. Jesus said I in you and you in me. This would be by His Spirit.

I asked for scriptures that show that the 'Spirit of Christ' is Christ, not your theory.

LoveofTruth said:
"4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me."(John 15:4 KJV) This would be Jesus Christ in then and they in him before the Holy Ghost was given. So Jesus Christ in them is in Spirit, the Spirit of Christ in them.

If Christ is Spirit in believers then "the Spirit of Christ" is one and the same as Jesus Christ in believers. if Jesus Christ is in believers then Jesus Christ is in them in Spirit, and so "the Spirit of Christ is in them".

This verse doesn't prove that Christ and Spirit of Christ are one and the same because Christ himself was right there in front of them talking, not inside them!

LoveofTruth said:
Romans 8:2
For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death." Is the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus the person of the Holy Ghost here?

Yes, the 'Spirit of life' is the Holy Spirit. This is not a proof that the 'Spirit of Christ' is Christ.

LoveofTruth said:
Philippians 1:19
For I know that this shall turn to my salvation through your prayer, and the supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ,"Do you say here that the Spirit of Jesus Christ is the person of the Holy Ghost? If so,why didn't Paul say the Holy Ghost here?

Yes, the Holy Spirit. Same as the 'Spirit of Christ' clearly refers to the Holy Spirit in Rom 8:9, Gal 4:6, and 1 Pet 1:11.

Oh and here's another proof text.... Who was the Spirit that prevented Paul and his companions from entering countries?

Acts 16:6-7 "They passed through the Phrygian and Galatian region, having been forbidden by the Holy Spirit to speak the word in Asia; and after they came to Mysia, they were trying to go into Bithynia, and the Spirit of Jesus did not permit them.

LoveofTruth said:
"11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow. 12 Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into."(Ephesians 3:11,12 KJV)

Here, in the same chapter 3 vs's 11 we see Paul uses the expression "Spirit of Christ " and "Christ", and then in the very next verse he speaks of the "Holy Ghost" This is for a reason. Paul did not say that the "Spirit of Christ" was the "Holy Ghost" here or he could have used the same words. But he makes a distinction. This is part of the issue that we have been looking at.

That text is from 1 Peter 1:11, not Eph 3.

We know the Spirit of Christ here is the Holy Spirit because this is referring to OT prophets, and we know they spoke by the Holy Spirit:

2 Peter 1:21 For no prophecy was ever produced by the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.

But this verse still doesn't say the 'Spirit of Christ' is Christ, which is the proof I am asking for.

LoveofTruth said:
Romans 8:9
"But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his." This "any man" means just what it says, "any man" this would include all mankind from Adam until to day. There is no way around this truth here, that OT saints and those today have the Spirit of Christ in them. God dwells in all believers and works in all through Jesus Christ.

This text proves the "Spirit of Christ" is the Holy Spirit.

After previously talking about fleshly unbelievers, Paul says to the Romans in v9, "However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit" making it clear they are different from those devoid of the Spirit. He then continues to describe those unbelievers who are devoid of the Spirit, but this time using the phrase the Spirit of Christ, "But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him." . If the method of separation is the the lack of "Spirit of God", then how can the lack of "Spirit of Christ" , which has the same consequences, be anything other than the very same Spirit?

Every commentator I have read on Rom 8:9 is unanimous that the Spirit of Christ = Holy Spirit. Can you show me one that says otherwise?

With regard to "any man", you are using the KJV terminology "any man" (which means 'anyone') to make it seem like it must apply to all humans. That is the same trick Pentecostals employ for claiming that no human can understand tongues in 1 Cor 14:2. In Rom 8:9 the context is people in the present, not people in the past. Note the present tenses throughout. So it is referring to anyone in the current era.

swordsman1 · Dec 20, 2018

LoveofTruth said:
He clearly does and it is plain to see to the unbiased reader

"6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above:) 7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.) 8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart..."

You cannot agree to this I believe, even if you see it because it would shatter your entire argument. Though that should not matter we are not here to just win an argument. These issues affect many aspects of the christian walk and life and understanding.But if you saw that Christ was speaking in them the OT and his word in them was nigh or close unto them. This would mean that this was not speaking of the Holy Ghost, but of the Spirit Christ in them, the mystery that hath been hid from ages. And so the entire discussion would turn on this.

But I showed you clearly that this is what Paul is showing.

It is not just me who cannot see the meaning you are trying to force into Deut 30. There is not a single commentator who shares your view, is there? As I said this is your interpretation and yours alone.

LoveofTruth · Dec 20, 2018

Jason0047 said:
I re-read the Word of God and carefully looked at the context again. You convinced me on the "Spirit of Christ" in Romans 8:9, and 1 Peter 1:11 is a reference to Jesus.

Thank you, Love of Truth.

I only disagree with you on Romans 8:2, though.
I believe the "Spirit of Life" is the Holy Ghost who is in Christ Jesus.

Please check out all the word references here and carefully compare them and it is obvious that it is the Holy Spirit (Especially Revelation 22:17).

Here is the link:

Blue Letter Bible - Spirit life.

Also, Romans 8:1 says,
"There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

The last word here in the verse is clearly in reference to the Holy Ghost.

May God bless you, brother.

God bless Jason glad to hear.

I am considering the words “The law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus”.

I am considering these verses

John 5 - 26. For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;”

Philippians 1 - 19. For I know that this shall turn to my salvation through your prayer, and the supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ,”

John 1:1,4,9 “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 4. In him was life; and the life was the light of men. John. That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.” speaking of the Word of God here.

And we see overlap here of God working through the Father the Son and the Holy Ghost in many verses

Romans 8 - 9. But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. 10. And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.”

John 6 - 40. And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.”

With

1 John 1 - 1. That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life; 2. (For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us )”

John 3 - 36. He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.”
These last three verses were before the cross and before the Holy Ghost was given and poured on all flesh.

John 6 - 63. It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.”

Hebrews 4 - 12. For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.”

John 8 - 36. If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.”

2 Corinthians 4 - 10. Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body. 11. For we which live are alway delivered unto death for Jesus' sake, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh.”

John 11 - 25. Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:”

2 Timothy 1 - 10. But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:”

swordsman1 · Dec 20, 2018

LoveofTruth said:
No it wasn't a stupid question. You are implying that the Spirit of Christ is the Holy Ghost. But in scripture Jesus Christ is in believers and he is in them by his Spirit. And so the Spirit of Jesus Christ is in them. The word Christ is always associated with Jesus Christ as I can see and not specifically to the Holy Ghost..

No, scripture clearly shows that the Spirit of Christ is the Holy Spirit.

LoveofTruth said:
2 Corinthians 13:5
"Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

You say this reference to Jesus Christ is in you" is to the Holy Ghost? This is not what Paul said here. Obviously Jesus Christ in believers is in then in Spirit and so the Spirit of Jesus Christ is in them. This word "Christ" here identifies with Jesus Christ the Son of God, not the Holy Ghost here. There is a reason for Paul's wording in every place and he is very specific in his wording as led by the Spirit.is the Holy Ghost.

Yes, Paul is referring to the Holy Spirit here. We know that Christ only dwells in us by his Spirit (you say this yourself). And scripture shows us that the Spirit of Christ is the Holy Spirit.

He is talking about examining ourselves and asking how we know that Christ is in us. How do we know from within ourselves that we in the faith?

Romans 8:16 "The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are children of God,"

swordsman1 · Dec 20, 2018

LoveofTruth said:
You correction here,

John 4:24
"God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth."

The vast majority of translations say otherwise....

NASB God is spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.”
ESV God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.”
NIV God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.”
RSV God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.”
etc
etc

swordsman1 · Dec 20, 2018

LoveofTruth said:
Matthew 16:16
"And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God." and this showed he was born again and had God dwelling in Him.

That verse doesn't show that the Spirit of Christ was dwelling in Peter at that time.

LoveofTruth said:
"10 Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me. 11 Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me. 12 Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit."(Psalm 51:10-12 KJV)

I thought you said the Spirit of Christ is not the Holy Spirit!

None of the other verses you quoted show that the Spirit of Christ dwelt in OT saints either.

LoveofTruth · Dec 20, 2018

swordsman1 said:
He is talking about examining ourselves and asking how we know that Christ is in us.

No, you twist scripture here again and avoid the key word here which is “Jesus” Christ is in you..This was an important distinction and showing that Christ in you, is Jesus Christ in you not the Holy Ghost specifically in this case.

In some sense you seem to be denying that Jesus Christ is in you by this very test. You cannot say Jesus Christ but instead say the Holy Ghost here.
Many times I have tested with this verse others in different cults such as the Jehovah witnesses when I meet them and help them to come to salvation in Jesus Christ and they fail in this verse often. They do not believe that Jesus Christ is Almighty God so to them how could JESUS Christ be in us only God could do such a thing. They say Christ here and not Jesus as you did.

But we know that Jesus Christ is in us and this is the Spirit of Jesus Christ . Yes we can also say “Christ in us” but this word Christ is connected to Jesus Christ who also cane in the flesh. In this instance Paul uses this test and says Jesus Christ is in you. Similarly how John uses the test and says Jesus Christ cane in the flesh 1 John 4.

Philippians 1 - 19. For I know that this shall turn to my salvation through your prayer, and the supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ,”

Jesus Christ is distinguished from the Holy Ghost all through scripture though they are both working.

2 Corinthians 13 - 14. The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen.

Notice all three here and Jesus Christ is distinguished from the Holy Ghost.

Jesus said in John 15

John 15 - 4. Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me. 5. I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.”

This is before the cross and before the Holy Ghost was given. This is where the mystery of Christ in you is understood. This mystery hath been his from ages and from generations, (Col 1:26,27, and Ephesians 3:9) but it was there in a mysterious way in the secrets of men in the inward part or hidden parts. If Jesus said he is in them and they in him how do we suppose he is in them? By his Spirit of course. He is working in them by the seed sown, the word of God, Christ in them, as scripture shows. All of this is before the Holy Ghost was given.So Jesus is not speaking of the Holy Ghost baptism yet. Even though the Holy Ghost is involved in the work.

So your entire theory is in error as you can see here and God has always been close to every man

Acts 17 - 26. And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation; 27. That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:”

LoveofTruth · Dec 20, 2018

swordsman1 said:
That verse doesn't show that the Spirit of Christ was dwelling in Peter at that time.

I thought you said the Spirit of Christ is not the Holy Spirit!

None of the other verses you quoted show that the Spirit of Christ dwelt in OT saints either.

I showed clearly that Peter had God dwelling in him at that time in my post

I also said previously that the Spirit of the Father is holy and the Spirit of Christ is holy also and the Holy Ghost is holy.

When we read the Holy Spirit in the bible this can be speaking in a general term of God or the Spirit of Christ or the Father . God is a Spirit, but the persons in the Godhead are distinguished in other terms as we have been seeing.

We also see a reason for scripture using the words “Holy Ghost” or the Spirit of God. I believe when we often read of the words “Holy Ghost” this distinguishes the 3rd person of the Trinity From the God Father who is Spirit and the Spirit of the Son. These three are one. There are different functions of each.

We see such examples all over we know that God is a Spirit and yet we read

Romans 5 - 5. And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.”

Here we see the word “God” who is one person and the person of the Holy Ghost who is another. But do we say that God is not holy? God forbid! Yet there is need to distinguish the words and functions.

The Father, the Word and the Holy Ghost, these three are One.

swordsman1 · Dec 20, 2018

LoveofTruth said:
While people can hear the word preached physically this is not Jesus meaning here he speaks of thier inner man hearing

Luke 8:12. Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.”

We know that these four souls cover all men of all time all over the earth and there is no creature that is not given the seed sown or the word of God sown

Hebrews 4:12, 13 “For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. 13. Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do.”

this is the true Light that lighteth every man that cometh into the world

John 1 - 9. That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.”

And as I have shown many times in Deuteronomy the word is nigh or close to all

They still "heard" the God's word preached initially with their ears. That is the plain meaning of the word 'heard', and what the disciples would have understood it to mean in Jesus explanation. Remember they had asked him to explain the plain meaning of the his parable. Jesus was giving them exactly that - the plain easy-to-understanding meaning, not another parable that needs further deciphering. When he says the 'word of God' he means exactly that God's word, which people hear, not Himself. If that which was sown was Himself Jesus would have told the disciples plainly.

Can you show us a single commentator who agrees with your interpretation of the parable of the sower?

The Rule of faith and practice is not scripture "alone"

Christ builds His church from within us

Christ builds His church from within us

Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.

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Christ builds His church from within us

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Christ builds His church from within us

Christ builds His church from within us

Christ builds His church from within us

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Christ builds His church from within us

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Christ builds His church from within us

Christ builds His church from within us

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