For all that fear hell

God judges the spirit of all in relationship to Him.

1 Chronicles 28:9
“As for you, my son Solomon, know the God of your father, and serve Him with a whole heart and a willing mind; for the Lord searches all hearts, and understands every intent of the thoughts. If you seek Him, He will let you find Him; but if you forsake Him, He will reject you forever.

God does not "punish".

A. He disciplines/trains His believing children.

Hebrews 12:6
For those whom the Lord loves He disciplines, And He scourges every son whom He receives.”

B. He justly sentences unbelievers.

Rev. 20: 11-15
15 And if anyone’s name was not found written in the (Lamb's) "book of life", he was thrown into the "lake of fire."

The Eternal Spiritual Realms Created by God:
1. Heaven for God + angels + saved believers

Philippians 3:20
For our citizenship is in heaven, from which also we eagerly wait for a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ; (Second Coming)

2. "Lake of Fire" for A. the unholy 3 = devil + anti-christ + anti-spirit (false prophet) and B. Concepts of Death + Hades and C. lost UNbelievers

Revelation 20:10
And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the "lake of fire" and brimstone, where the beast (THE anti-christ) and the false prophet (anti-spirit) are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

Revelation 20:15...UNBELIEVERS!
And if anyone’s name was not found written in the (Lamb's) "book of life", he was thrown into the "lake of fire".

Bible says:

Matt. 18:8
"And if your hand or your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it from you;
it is better for you to enter (eternal spiritual) life crippled or lame, than having two hands or two feet, to be cast into the eternal fire,"

Matt. 25:46...........
"And these (unbelieving goat Nations) will go away into eternal (spiritual) punishment,
but the righteous (believing sheep Nations) into eternal (spiritual) life".

2 Thess. 1:9...........
"And these will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, (separation)
away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power,

Jude 7........
"Just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities around them, since they in the same way as these indulged in gross immorality and went after strange flesh,
are exhibited as an example, in undergoing the punishment of eternal fire".

Jude 12-13...........
"These men are those who are hidden reefs in your love feasts when they feast with you without fear, caring for themselves; clouds without water, carried along by winds; autumn trees without fruit, doubly dead, uprooted; wild waves of the sea,casting up their own shame like foam; wandering stars, for whom the black darkness has been reserved forever,".

Rev. 19:3...........
"And a second time they said, "Hallelujah! Her smoke rises up forever and ever".

Rev. 20:10........
"And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast (anti-Christ) and the false prophet (anti-spirit) are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever,".

Matt. 3:12 says........
"And His winnowing fork is in His hand, and He will thoroughly clear His threshing floor; and He will gather His wheat into the barn, but He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire."

Mark 9:43 says.........
"And if your hand causes you to stumble, cut it off; it is better for you to enter life crippled,
than having your two hands, to go into hell (gehenna), into the unquenchable fire."

The word "unquenchable" is asbestos in the Greek-------
According to the Enhanced Strong's lexicon, it means "unquenchable, the eternal hell fire to punish the damned

Luke 16:25..............
"So he called to him, 'Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'


Matthew 13NASB)....Jesus: The Wheat (believers) and Tares (un-believers) Explained
36 Then He left the crowds and went into the house. And His disciples came to Him and said,
Explain to us the parable of the tares of the field.”
37 And He said,
“The one who sows the good seed is the Son of Man (Jesus),
38 and the field is the world (kosmos);
and as for the good seed, these are the sons of the kingdom (of God);
and the tares are the sons of the evil one (satan);
39 and the enemy who sowed them is the devil, and
the harvest is the end of "the age";(of Grace) and
the reapers are angels.
40 So just as the tares are gathered up and >>burned with fire<<,
so shall it be at the [end of the age.
41 The Son of Man will send forth His angels, and
they will gather out of His kingdom (of heaven on earth) all stumbling blocks, and those who commit lawlessness, 42 and will throw them into the >>furnace of fire<<;("lake of fire": Revelation?)
in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.(conscious spiritual torment)
43 Then the righteous will shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father.
He who has ears, let him hear.

Your spirit should be VERY afraid.

Unless you are a saved believer, your SPIRIT will be eternally separated from God and the heavenly realms at your Body/Soul death.

Hebrews 9:27
And inasmuch as it is appointed for men to die (MORTAL Body/Soul combo ends) once and after this comes judgment,(of immortal SPIRIT)

A believer is NOT judged as to his spiritual position in Christ.

John 5:24
“Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal (spiritual) life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

John 3:18
He who believes in Him is not judged;
he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Ecclesiastes 12...Remember God in Your Youth: AT DEATH...
7 then the dust (Body/Soul combo) will return to the earth as it was, (SEE: Genesis 2:7)
and the SPIRIT (breath of life) will return to God who gave it. (SEE: Genesis 1:26 =>SPIRITUAL image)
8 “Vanity of vanities,” says the Preacher, “all is vanity!

Doug Melven said:

Matthew 18:8 Wherefore if thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast them from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life halt or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into everlasting fire.
18:9 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire.
Jesus was quite serious about eternal punishment.

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I guess you missed this post of mine: For all that fear hell

The original Greek text of the NT (nor the Septuagint of the OT) didn't have the word, "hell" (there was no such word at that time). The original words were: "sheol, hades, and gehenna". Most of what Jesus spoke about was referring to Gehenna (an actual place). The first occurrence of the word, "Gehenna" in the Bible was in Matt 5:21-22. In the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus said:

Ye have heard that it was said to them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment: but I say unto you, that every one who is angry with his brother shall be in danger of the judgment; and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council; and whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of the hell (gehenna—SGD) of fire.

When Jesus used the term “hell of fire” in these verses, he actually used the Greek word gehenna for the first time in inspired writing.


~Jesus' Teaching On Hell

To put Jesus words into context to understand what the Jews of Jesus' day would hear when Jesus spoke of Gehenna, I think this is a good study of all of the times Jesus used the word:

Doug Melven said:

Paul believed Jesus was serious about eternal punishment.
2 Thessalonians 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
1:9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

As soon as you leave this earth, you get no more chances to repent.
Hebrews 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

I truly wish you guys were right who preach against eternal punishment.
But, the plain truth of Scripture says otherwise.
Matthew 22:11 And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment:
22:12 And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding garment? And he was speechless.
22:13 Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen.

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αἰώνιον is the original word that was interpreted as "everlasting".....it also means (and should have been interpreted as) "age long". 2 Thessalonians 1:9 Lexicon: These will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power,

Ron Gurley said:

Your spirit should be VERY afraid.

Unless you are a saved believer, your SPIRIT will be eternally separated from God and the heavenly realms at your Body/Soul death.

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How can it be that anything can be separated from God? If he is omnipresent, he surely is in the lake of fire, no?
And if the lake of fire is a literal flaming torture chamber would not God be in the fire as he was with Shadrach, Meshaek and Abendnigo? If this is the case, wouldn't he not only be present but eternally watching every second of torture of billions of humans?
Can you clear this up for me?

Shempster said:

How can it be that anything can be separated from God? If he is omnipresent, he surely is in the lake of fire, no?

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Isn't it even possible that He actually IS the Lake of Fire Himself (which would still mean it's impossible to be separated from Him--that's an excellent point)?

There are several passages where His presence is symbolized by fire:



Genesis 15:17: It came about when the sun had set, that it was very dark, and behold, there appeared a smoking oven and a flaming torch which passed between these pieces.



Exodus 3:2-3: The angel of the LORD appeared to him in a blazing fire from the midst of a bush; and he looked, and behold, the bush was burning with fire, yet the bush was not consumed.


Exodus 13:21: The LORD was going before them in a pillar of cloud by day to lead them on the way, and in a pillar of fire by night to give them light, that they might travel by day and by night.

Deuteronomy 4:12: "Then the LORD spoke to you from the midst of the fire; you heard the sound of words, but you saw no form--only a voice


Daniel 7:9: "I kept looking Until thrones were set up, And the Ancient of Days took His seat; His vesture was like white snow And the hair of His head like pure wool His throne was ablaze with flames, Its wheels were a burning fire.




Acts 7:30: "After forty years had passed, AN ANGEL APPEARED TO HIM IN THE WILDERNESS OF MOUNT Sinai, IN THE FLAME OF A BURNING THORN BUSH.


Revelation 15:2: And I saw something like a sea of glass mixed with fire, and those who had been victorious over the beast and his image and the number of his name, standing on the sea of glass, holding harps of God.

.....and one that comes right out and describes God as "consuming fire":

Hebrews 12:29 For our God is a consuming fire.

Matthew 3:11....but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you in the Holy Spirit and in fire: whose fan is in his hand, and he will thoroughly cleanse his threshing-floor; and he will gather his wheat into the garner, but the chaff he will burn up with unquenchable fire.

...so why couldn't He actually be the Lake of Fire (burning off the dross and refining....thoroughly cleansing and purifying)?

In this verse it says that Christ is Eternal Life=And this is that testimony: God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son ~1 John 5:11

....and Rev 20:14 says that when death and Hades are thrown into the Lake of Fire...that's the second death. (Isn't the first death Adam?). To have a resurrection, there needs to be death.....but that will be the final death.

I'm not fully settled on this....but it seems to me that until all evil is eradicated fully, none of us are truly saved. IOW.....we need sin and evil to be fully destroyed (and I believe that's what's happening there in Rev 20). The next passage is titled, "A New Heaven and a New Earth".

Shempster said:

How can it be that anything can be separated from God? If he is omnipresent, he surely is in the lake of fire, no?
And if the lake of fire is a literal flaming torture chamber would not God be in the fire as he was with Shadrach, Meshaek and Abendnigo? If this is the case, wouldn't he not only be present but eternally watching every second of torture of billions of humans?
Can you clear this up for me?

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The lake of fire IS eternal separation. And, no one will be watching billions burn. Each person enters that horrible state alone --- no one else around.

Winken/lws

Winken said:

The lake of fire IS eternal separation. And, no one will be watching billions burn. Each person enters that horrible state alone --- no one else around.

Winken/lws

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.....but then here, in Revelation 14, it says this:

"They will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb"

.....keep in mind that "torment and sulfur (brimstone)" are terms used in the purification of metals:

βασανισθήσεται G928 = basanizo ....to test the purity

θείῳ G2303= theion.....which is very closely related to the word "theos"- divine/God. Thayer's concordance says:

"Brimstone; divine incense, because burning brimstone was regarded as having power to purify, and to ward off disease"

Maybe NONE will be burning forever and separated from God?

I'm reading more about that "sea of glass mixed with fire" (which sounds pretty close to the symbolism of the lake --sea--of fire). Here's a commentary on that passage from Bible study tools:

Still on the Lake of Fire.

There's only four references in the Bible (all in Revelation) that mention "Lake of Fire". Only one mentions people.

Revelation 19:20: "And the beast[5] was taken, and with him the false prophet[6] that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone."

Revelation 20:10 "And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever."

Revelation 20:14-15 "Then Death and Hades[7] were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire." [NKJV]

Revelation 21:8 "But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, as for murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death."[8]
************


Matthew 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: He shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with FIRE:

The lake of fire represents the process of God making things right with His creation of humanity. The creation of man is not some experiment that has gone horribly wrong by God. This kind of thinking belittles and undermines the sovereignty of God when His ways are lowered down to the level of a man. Contrary to what Christians think, God is in control of everything. The lake of fire is about judgment but this is a righteous judgment and not a grand display of evil where the souls of the wicked are tormented literally in a literal lake of hell fire. ~The Lake of Fire: This is a symbol…

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Winken said:

The lake of fire IS eternal separation. And, no one will be watching billions burn. Each person enters that horrible state alone --- no one else around.

Winken/lws

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This would be a translation and verse that you need to deal with.

KJV PSA 139:8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.

So when you say eternal separation, just exactly who is separated from who/what?

Q: How can it be that any (one) can be (spiritually) separated from God?

A: God is perfectly JUST. He loves sinners. He hates sin.
The eternal spiritual realm of " lake of fire " aka "hell" was created for those immortal spirits whose "free will" choice was to reject/forsake/deny His drawing/calling and gracious provisions for salvation.

Only the eternal spiritual realm of " heaven " / kingdom of God was created as a separated place for The TRI-UNE God, angels, and saved believers.

Read the Jewish tradition of spiritual separation after death in the "holding place" awaiting Divine Messiah:
Abraham's Busom = Paradise separated from Hades.
SEE: Luke 16:19-30

Q: If he is omnipresent, he surely is IN the "lake of fire", no?

A: Of couse not. The Creator as a part of / "in" His creation? The heresy of pantheism!

Q: And if the "lake of fire" is a literal flaming torture chamber ?

A: It is not. Only a spiritual realm to provide eternal separation from God. Its habitants sense spiritual separation for infinity...which is long time, especially when one gets near the end!! (Woody Allen joke!)

Rev. 20:10
and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

Shempster said:

How can it be that anything can be separated from God? If he is omnipresent, he surely is in the lake of fire, no?
And if the lake of fire is a literal flaming torture chamber would not God be in the fire as he was with Shadrach, Meshaek and Abendnigo? If this is the case, wouldn't he not only be present but eternally watching every second of torture of billions of humans?
Can you clear this up for me?

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2 Thessalonians 1:9 They will suffer the penalty of eternal destruction, separated from the presence of the Lord and the glory of His might,
Jesus said in Matthew 25:41, "Depart from Me you workers of iniquity".
If God says He won't be in a place, who are we to say different?

mkgal1 said:

Maybe NONE will be burning forever and separated from God?

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2 Thessalonians 1:8 in flaming fire, giving vengeance to those not knowing God, and to those not obeying the good news of our Lord Jesus Christ;
All that talk about this fire being purifying falls apart when God says it is "Vengeance".

Hillsage said:

This would be a translation and verse that you need to deal with.

KJV PSA 139:8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.

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The word for hell is sheol, the grave as shown in Psalm 16:10

"HELL" research...

The word "hell" from the Greek is mentioned 88 times in the Bible: ...BUT...
64 times as the Hebrew word "Sheol" in the OT, ...the lowest grave in the earth
11 times as "Hades" in the NT
1 time as "Tartarus",
12 times as "Geenna".
RESULT: inaccurate translations of similar words!

Hades... the abode or state of the dead: informal ( often not capital ) "hell"

Tartarus ...from Latin, from Greek Tartaros, of obscure origin

Geenna ...OT: offal and refuse were slowly burned .
NT Judaism: a place where the wicked are punished after death ...a place or state of pain and torment ... SYMBOLIC of "hell"

The "lake of fire" of Revelation is clearly described.

1. It is a place created by God to restrain satan, demons, the un-holy trinity, death, and the
bad side of Abraham's Bosom...Hades.
2. It is a place of eternal separation from the TRI-UNE GOD's realm in the future New Heavens and the New Earth and the New Jerusalem
3. At the Great White Throne Judgment, God sentences unbelievers whose names are NOT written in the Lamb's Book of Life to dwell therein.

Revelation 20:15 (NASB); SEE ALSO 21:8
And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life (believers),
he (unbelievers) was thrown into the lake of fire.

Revelation 21:8 (NASB)
But for the cowardly and unbelieving and abominable and murderers and immoral persons and sorcerers and idolaters and all liars (unsaved sinners),
their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”

And there is no provision for the removal of the SPIRITS sentenced to reside there

Matthew 13:50...Jesus' parable explained
and (angels) will throw them (tares=unbelievers) into the "furnace of fire"; in that PLACE there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Ron Gurley said:

Q: If he is omnipresent, he surely is IN the "lake of fire", no?

A: Of couse not. The Creator as a part of / "in" His creation? The heresy of pantheism!

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Then you're saying God is NOT omnipresent. There are plenty of verses that describe God in His creation (which is panENtheism)--"Christ in you", for example.

Ron Gurley said:

Q: And if the "lake of fire" is a literal flaming torture chamber ?

A: It is not. Only a spiritual realm to provide eternal separation from God. Its habitants sense spiritual separation for infinity...which is long time, especially when one gets near the end!! (Woody Allen joke!)

Rev. 20:10
and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

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Isn't the divorce of body and spirit in theological error? There was a purpose in God's full humanity in Christ.

"Hell" in the Bible...YES + clearly explained!