A Millennium Full Of Sacrificial Blood?

Biblewriter said:

Yes, God very explicitly said ALL of these. And not even one of them says that what He said earlier is not true.

You are trying to use your interpretations of the meanings of some of what God said, to avoid other things that He also said. This does not work.

Only Dispensationalism fully accepts everything God said as absolute truth. All other systems of interpretation reject some of what Gd said.

Click to expand...

You seem to have missed something.

He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.

What is the first?
What is the second?

Biblewriter said:

Because, and specifically because, they were ALL said AFTER Jesus had ALREADY come, and gone back to heaven.

To deny that Jesus is coming back is full Preterism, which is not allowed in this forum. See the rules.

Click to expand...

Oh I’m not denying Jesus literally and physically comes in great days of judgement. I am denying that there is any such thing as a “second” coming. Seems the fact that the scripture has no such phrase anywhere might mean something.

Biblewriter said:

I will be for the people living on the earth at that time, AFTER we are gone

Click to expand...

Sorry I missed where this came from in the bible.
Just where does it say this?
A you say:-

Biblewriter said:

I am simply pointing out what He EXPLICITLY said

Click to expand...

Daniel Martinovich said:

Oh I’m not denying Jesus literally and physically comes in great days of judgement. I am denying that there is any such thing as a “second” coming. Seems the fact that the scripture has no such phrase anywhere might mean something.

Click to expand...

He will come again, is saying the same thing, even if the word "second" is not used.

Tolworth John said:

Sorry I missed where this came from in the bible.
Just where does it say this?
A you say:-

Click to expand...

In about two hundred or so explicitly stated prophecies.

Biblewriter said:

But what does that have to do with whether or not there will be a millennium?

Click to expand...

Do you agree that during the Millennium there will be immortal humans and mortal humans ?

1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 refers to those who will live on the Earth during the millennium in a IMMORTAL body...

Biblewriter said:

He will come again, is saying the same thing, even if the word "second" is not used.

Click to expand...

Oh, he literally has come again, more than once and he will continue to as long as the world continues. The false teaching and false prophecy is the added word “second.”

Biblewriter said:

The resurrected saints will be reigning with Christ. But in the Greek it says we will be reigning over the earth, not on the earth, as some of our English translations render it.

Click to expand...

Well, it seem that Iraneus believed that the Just will reign ON THE EARTH...

The dispensation mentioned by Iraneus makes no difference betwen Jews or Gentile [believers] about being part of the promise of the inheritance which God promised to the fathers....Thus the dispensation mentioned by Iraneus have nothing to do with Darby modern dispensationalism saying falsely that the Church will reign from Heaven.

Inasmuch, therefore, as the opinions of certain [orthodox persons] are derived from heretical discourses, they are both ignorant of God’s dispensations, and of the mystery of the resurrection of the just, and of the [earthly] kingdom which is the commencement of incorruption, by means of which kingdom those who shall be worthy are accustomed gradually to partake of the divine nature (capere Deum); and it is necessary to tell them respecting those things, that it behoves the righteous FIRST TO RECEIVE the promise of the inheritance which God promised to the fathers, and to reign in it, when they rise again to behold God in this creation which is renovated, and that the judgment should take place afterwards." (Against Heresies, by Irenaeus, book V, chapter XXXII, section 1.)

BABerean2 said:

A Millennium Full Of Sacrificial Blood?

Heb 10:16　 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;　

Heb 10:17　 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.　

Heb 10:18　 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.


Were there any "blood" sacrifices in the Old Testament that were not for sin?

　
Heb_9:7　 But into the second went the high priest alone once every year, not without blood, which he offered for himself, and for the errors of the people:



Heb_9:12　 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.



Heb_9:13　 For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh:
Heb_9:14　 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?



Heb_9:18　 Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood.

.

Click to expand...

That much is clear. Maybe the sacrifices are not for sin.

redleghunter said:

That much is clear. Maybe the sacrifices are not for sin.

Click to expand...

Ezekiel 45
22 And upon that day shall the prince prepare for himself and for all the people of the land a bullock for a sin offering.

redleghunter said:

Maybe the sacrifices are not for sin.

Click to expand...

Somebody here says the following verse will occur in the future, under a covenant not yet in effect.

Eze 44:29　 They shall eat the meat offering, and the sin offering, and the trespass offering; and every dedicated thing in Israel shall be theirs.

.

BABerean2 said:

Somebody here says the following verse will occur in the future, under a covenant not yet in effect.

Eze 44:29　 They shall eat the meat offering, and the sin offering, and the trespass offering; and every dedicated thing in Israel shall be theirs.

.

Click to expand...

Ezekiel 44 has perplexed theologians for centuries.

It is so easy to just allegorize it or ignore it as something that would have been fulfilled if Israel did not sin and reject the Kingdom.

It is just as easy to think we have it all figured out by saying yep there will be literal sacrifices even if we already know as stated in Hebrews the New Covenant is in Christ's Royal Blood.

I take note we were commissioned by Jesus Christ with the duty to see about spreading the Gospel to get people in the Kingdom. I'm satisfied that is full time work for all of His beloved.

I'm not saying I don't care, but am saying I'm not dogmatic on it.

There are already too many squabbles amongst the ekklesia. I'll take a pass on sacrifices in the millennial Kingdom on Earth.

redleghunter said:

Ezekiel 44 has perplexed theologians for centuries.

It is so easy to just allegorize it or ignore it as something that would have been fulfilled if Israel did not sin and reject the Kingdom.

It is just as easy to think we have it all figured out by saying yep there will be literal sacrifices even if we already know as stated in Hebrews the New Covenant is in Christ's Royal Blood.

I take note we were commissioned by Jesus Christ with the duty to see about spreading the Gospel to get people in the Kingdom. I'm satisfied that is full time work for all of His beloved.

I'm not saying I don't care, but am saying I'm not dogmatic on it.

There are already too many squabbles amongst the ekklesia. I'll take a pass on sacrifices in the millennial Kingdom on Earth.

Click to expand...

The battle between the Sinai Covenant and the New Covenant of Christ has done tremendous harm to the Body of Christ.
Sadly, during most of the history of our faith the Judaisers have won the day.

Paul had the courage to correct Peter in dealing with the Galatians believers.

.

BABerean2 said:

The battle between the Sinai Covenant and the New Covenant of Christ has done tremendous harm to the Body of Christ.
Sadly, during most of the history of our faith the Judaisers have won the day.

Paul had the courage to correct Peter in dealing with the Galatians believers.

.

Click to expand...

I don't see the millennial Kingdom as a Sinai covenant.

I believe the prophecies in the OT yet to be fulfilled are about the specific promises to Israel and Judah.

My pastor chose Isaiah 11 to kick off the advent sermon series. He cautioned there is Truth in the heavy use of poetry. Some fulfilled in the first Advent of Christ and some yet to be fulfilled. Some were convinced how YHWH would fulfill the first Advent prophecies. We should humble ourselves and listen.

redleghunter said:

I believe the prophecies in the OT yet to be fulfilled are about the specific promises to Israel and Judah.

Click to expand...

The New Covenant promised to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34, is found fulfilled by Christ during the first century in Hebrews 8:6-13, and is specifically applied to the Church in Hebrews 12:22-24, and 2 Corinthians 3:6-8.

On the Day of Pentecost Peter addressed the crowd as "all the house of Israel" in Acts 2:36.

The most important genealogy in the Bible is found in Matthew 1:1.
This is confirmed by Paul in Galatians 3:16.
The promise was made to the one seed, and not the many seeds.

.

BABerean2 said:

The New Covenant promised to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34, is found fulfilled by Christ during the first century in Hebrews 8:6-13, and is specifically applied to the Church in Hebrews 12:22-24, and 2 Corinthians 3:6-8.

On the Day of Pentecost Peter addressed the crowd as "all the house of Israel" in Acts 2:36.

The most important genealogy in the Bible is found in Matthew 1:1.
This is confirmed by Paul in Galatians 3:16.
The promise was made to the one seed, and not the many seeds.

.

Click to expand...

Agree completely. Is the covenant to Abraham completely fulfilled? Just something to consider.

redleghunter said:

Is the covenant to Abraham completely fulfilled?

Click to expand...

Gal 3:16　 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.　
Gal 3:17　 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.　
Gal 3:18　 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.　
Gal 3:19　 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.　
Gal 3:20　 Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.　
Gal 3:21　 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.　
Gal 3:22　 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.　
Gal 3:23　 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.　
Gal 3:24　 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.　
Gal 3:25　 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.　
Gal 3:26　 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.　
Gal 3:27　 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.　
Gal 3:28　 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.　
Gal 3:29　 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.　

.

BABerean2 said:

Gal 3:16　 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.　
Gal 3:17　 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.　
Gal 3:18　 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.　
Gal 3:19　 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.　
Gal 3:20　 Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.　
Gal 3:21　 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.　
Gal 3:22　 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.　
Gal 3:23　 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.　
Gal 3:24　 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.　
Gal 3:25　 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.　
Gal 3:26　 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.　
Gal 3:27　 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.　
Gal 3:28　 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.　
Gal 3:29　 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.　

.

Click to expand...

Agreed. Has the Promise fulfilled for the sons of Jacob as related to the time of Jacob's Trouble?

I'm not advocating a separate way to salvation for the sons of Jacob. Just that as a people God is not finished with them.

redleghunter said:

Has the Promise fulfilled for the sons of Jacob as related to the time of Jacob's Trouble?

Click to expand...

Jeremiah wrote during the time that the Israelites were going into and were in captivity in Babylon.
It was a tremendous time of trouble for the descendants of Jacob.

The only way to see the "time of Jacob's trouble" is with a time machine set to return you to the time that the Israelites were taken into captivity in Babylon.

The Olive Tree of Romans chapter 11 is a symbol of the New Covenant Church made up of Israelites and Gentiles grafted together into one tree.
Paul provides no path to salvation outside of the Olive Tree in Romans 11.

There is no Plan B outside of the Church.

.