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BrandonLParks

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The Nihilist said:
Christianity has a long and proud tradition of oppressing, torturing, and murdering those who disagree with it, which I hardly think constitutes loving one's enemy. Of course, it has a similar tradition of saying that most christians don't follow Christ, so I don't suppose that there's really a significant internal contradiction.

I would agree with you that our history has some such infamy in it. That doesn't mean they are following scripture by perpetuating such hate. The bible is clear that we must be loving and peaceful with our enemies. Unfortunately some Christians have used the bible to push their own worldly agenda.
Blessings,
-Brandon


 
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rjc34

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"Christianity" does not have any such traditions. "Humanity" does. That people propose to call themselves Christian and then proceed to act completely opposite of Christ Himself isn't really a contradiction internal to Christianity but a sad fact of life for most human beings. Even among those in the Bible who loved God the most they remained plagued by their own emotions and how those led them into actions they knew were wrong.

Perhaps it's neither, instead it's the Church, which falls under Christianity. Whether or not you think they were acting in accordance with scripture is irrelevant. The point is that 1) these atrocities happened, and 2) they were done in the name of Christianity.
 
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Zebra1552

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Perhaps it's neither, instead it's the Church, which falls under Christianity. Whether or not you think they were acting in accordance with scripture is irrelevant. The point is that 1) these atrocities happened, and 2) they were done in the name of Christianity.
Is Stalin representative of Atheists?
 
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BrandonLParks

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Jaws13 said:
Is Stalin representative of Atheists?

Oh my gosh, Jaws, what a wonderful analogy. I have never thought to use this before but it is a wonderful illustration that what one does in the name of an ideology does not necessarily represent that ideology.
Blessings,
-Brandon


 
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Wiccan_Child

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they may have misguided opinions and views on what the bible is actually trying to say ...it should never be about hate ..they are doing it wrong .
Leviticus 18:22 hardly seems full of roses and kittens...
 
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Zebra1552

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Not at all. I was pointing out the severity and the hate implicit in Leviticus 18.
There isn't any. They were laws created to unify the people of Israel and prevent uprisings, rebellions, and falling away from the faith. We see that each time Israel becomes dis-unified that many, many people die- both from Israel and other nations. To ignore the cultural context of the verse and transplant your own opinion onto a text that's 3500 years old written in an entirely different country than the one you live in is horrendously illogical.
 
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Gabe7

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There isn't any. They were laws created to unify the people of Israel and prevent uprisings, rebellions, and falling away from the faith. We see that each time Israel becomes dis-unified that many, many people die- both from Israel and other nations. To ignore the cultural context of the verse and transplant your own opinion onto a text that's 3500 years old written in an entirely different country than the one you live in is horrendously illogical.

What if someone wants to do something against those laws but that doesn't harm other people? Could such a person view those laws are hateful towards them and people like them? I think I might view them as at least arbitrary in such a situation.
 
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Hakan101

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What if someone wants to do something against those laws but that doesn't harm other people? Could such a person view those laws are hateful towards them and people like them? I think I might view them as at least arbitrary in such a situation.

Do you mean sexual sin? As in, premarital sex, or homosexual relations, as laws that don't harm other people?
 
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Zebra1552

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What if someone wants to do something against those laws but that doesn't harm other people? Could such a person view those laws are hateful towards them and people like them? I think I might view them as at least arbitrary in such a situation.
Laws like what? Shellfish? Mixed fibers? Most OT Law had a point behind it- health, unity, obeying God, being a good example, etc- and it is that principle that is important to follow. You wouldn't eat McDonalds 5 times in one week, for example, just as a Jew wouldn't eat pork.
 
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Wiccan_Child

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What is hateful about rules and consequences?
A great deal. I submit the Holocaust for your preusal - a rule was made wherein the Jews (and gays, cripples, etc) were deemed unworthy of life. Do you not consider that rule to be hateful?

I sincerely hope your answer is an unequivocal 'yes'.
 
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Wiccan_Child

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There isn't any. They were laws created to unify the people of Israel and prevent uprisings, rebellions, and falling away from the faith. We see that each time Israel becomes dis-unified that many, many people die- both from Israel and other nations. To ignore the cultural context of the verse and transplant your own opinion onto a text that's 3500 years old written in an entirely different country than the one you live in is horrendously illogical.
Who says I ignored it? Who says I didn't look at the cultural context, yet came to that conclusion regardless? Am I not entitled to my own opinion?
 
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rjc34

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Is Stalin representative of Atheists?

A few things. First, stop capitalizing atheism and atheists, because neither word is a pronoun.

Your analogy fails because these Christians did what they did in the name of God. Regardless of how you defend it, and regardless what the scriptures say, they did it, and they used scripture to back up their intentions.

Is Stalin representative of all people with moustaches? Is Stalin representative of all people who don't believe in Santa?

Exactly.
 
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Hakan101

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A few things. First, stop capitalizing atheism and atheists, because neither word is a pronoun.

Your analogy fails because these Christians did what they did in the name of God. Regardless of how you defend it, and regardless what the scriptures say, they did it, and they used scripture to back up their intentions.

Is Stalin representative of all people with moustaches? Is Stalin representative of all people who don't believe in Santa?

Exactly.

Don't you know that even Satan twisted the scripture for his intentions to mislead Christ? There is more than what people say and do, you have to look at their heart. One can do anything "in the name of God", but if it goes against his will, they are only profaning his name, not glorifying it.
 
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Zebra1552

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A few things. First, stop capitalizing atheism and atheists, because neither word is a pronoun.
Says the person who won't capitalize words like Bible and God. I'll take my chances with the Grammar Police.

Your analogy fails because these Christians did what they did in the name of God. Regardless of how you defend it, and regardless what the scriptures say, they did it, and they used scripture to back up their intentions.
The analogy doesn't fail at all. Are Muslim terrorists representative of Islam, then? In any other context you call them loons, but now all the sudden they're Christians. Why the double standard?

Is Stalin representative of all people with moustaches? Is Stalin representative of all people who don't believe in Santa?

Exactly.
Then neither are acts that directly violate the Bible representative of Christianity.
 
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Who says I ignored it?
The fact that you call it hateful without any support.

Who says I didn't look at the cultural context, yet came to that conclusion regardless? Am I not entitled to my own opinion?
I say you didn't. First of all, you didn't demonstrate such an argument that supports the conclusion, and secondly, you being entitled to your own opinion doesn't make it right.
 
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