Are 'formers' or 'free thinkers' mistreated?

honorthesabbath said:

I disagree here. Are you saying that as God's children we are NOT obligated to obey the law against murder or sexual immorality? What about those male babies who at birth, are circumcised for non-religious reasons, now are they obligated to sacrifice too?

Your premise is flawed. Paul IS referring to being obligated to the WHOLE ceremonial law for salvation. This is what the preceding chapters in Galatians is all about.

Click to expand...

Please give evidence to support your view that when Paul refers to the "whole law," he means the "ceremonial law."

tall73 said:

At another time Paul had Timothy circumcised for practical reasons. It is the intent that was the issue. Circumcision is nothing, and un-circumcision is nothing.

Click to expand...

I would not say it was practical reasons. It was so that he would be more acceptable in his ministry to the Jews. Because their prejudice had built a wall and to break down their barrier he had to perform their ceremonial surgery.

RC_NewProtestants said:

I would not say it was practical reasons. It was so that he would be more acceptable in his ministry to the Jews. Because their prejudice had built a wall and to break down their barrier he had to perform their ceremonial surgery.

Click to expand...

That is the meaning of "for practical reasons."

tall73 said:

Do you think the ribbing will be about your views on the issue or the fact that you are checking out guys at the YMCA?

lol

Click to expand...

LOL! I haven't had a good laugh on these boards (other than some lame reports against me) in a long time! Thank you Night and Tall! That is just what I needed today!

In CHRIST alone...

i am a new SDA... wow, i dunno how i would look at a former SDA.. i dint know that someone could have found truth and just let it go so... weird to me..

if they stopped honouring the Holy Day, wow.. i would come to realize that there are many ppl in the SDA who dont understand the 10 commandments..

i dont think there is much we can do about it still.. its the Ex-Saints who are gonna do the most persecuting so look out for ppl leaving the church..
lol
i could definately see where Ex-SDA ppl get mistreated for real.. i would probably treat them differently out or confusion... i would asically count that person as non-christian

freeindeed2 said:

LOL! I haven't had a good laugh on these boards (other than some lame reports against me) in a long time! Thank you Night and Tall! That is just what I needed today!

Click to expand...

Pastor Free! I finally caught up to you! There are indeed quite a number of familiar folks on this forum

freeindeed2 said:

In CHRIST alone...

Click to expand...

There is no other name given by which we must be saved (Acts 4:12).

Victor

Dania said:

i am a new SDA... wow, i dunno how i would look at a former SDA.. i dint know that someone could have found truth and just let it go so... weird to me..

Click to expand...

Jesus is the Truth.

if they stopped honouring the Holy Day, wow.. i would come to realize that there are many ppl in the SDA who dont understand the 10 commandments..

Click to expand...

'Formers' who left the SDA church over theological/doctrinal/Scriptural discrepancies tend to understand the 10 C's to a much larger degree than the average person sitting in the SDA pew.

i dont think there is much we can do about it still..

Click to expand...

If you could do something, what would you do?

its the Ex-Saints who are gonna do the most persecuting so look out for ppl leaving the church..
lol

Click to expand...

"But you are now being persecuted by those who want you to keep the law, just as Ishmael, the child born by human effort, persecuted Isaac, the child born by the power of the Spirit." Gal. 4:29

Who's doing the persecuting? You should read the whole book of Galatians!

i could definately see where Ex-SDA ppl get mistreated for real.. i would probably treat them differently out or confusion... i would asically count that person as non-christian

Click to expand...

I agree than many 'former's' do face mistreatment.

But you consider anyone who leaves the SDA denominational orgainzation as a 'non-Christian'???

In CHRIST alone...

i guess i wrote the message slap dash so u could see the points i was making..

i consider ppl who dishonor the Holy Day (as the first message was suggesting) as non-christian..

2. on what basis do u say that ppl who have left the SDA understand the 10 Commandment to a greater extent.. back up these statements please. cause i wanna understand them more if possible.

jesus is the truth.. i dont argue that.. what about him?
just mentioning his name doesnt give me a thing.. suppose in my eyes jesus was a good prophet.. or one of the ways to heaven... would that be the TRUTH.. so understanding the commandments of jesus is what i call truth in this case.

"But you are now being persecuted by those who want you to keep the law, just as Ishmael, the child born by human effort, persecuted Isaac, the child born by the power of the Spirit." Gal. 4:29
----- so i am guessing that u are saying that ppl who want other to keep the commandments of god (let just be plain, remember the Holy Day, we all know this is the dilema) are the ones who are persecuting the ppl.. lol.

this highlight to me that u are one of them that dont understand Paul's writing when he refers to the word "law" in his books...

al i can say is what a pity cause i am drained at this moment to even bother debating with you about something u have no clue aout and will refute anyway. someone take it away

ie. the different between Moses' Law and the 10 Commandments when Paul speaks...

Dania said:

i guess i wrote the message slap dash so u could see the points i was making..

i consider ppl who dishonor the Holy Day (as the first message was suggesting) as non-christian..

Click to expand...

Wow, so only Sabbath-keepers are true Christians, in your opinion? Even Adventism doesn't officially teach that.

ie. the different between Moses' Law and the 10 Commandments when Paul speaks...

Click to expand...

Paul doesn't separate them.

VictorC said:

Pastor Free! I finally caught up to you! There are indeed quite a number of familiar folks on this forum

Click to expand...

Glad you caught me, and YES there are!

There is no other name given by which we must be saved (Acts 4:12).

Victor

Click to expand...

NO other name!

When are we going to meet for lunch? I'll pay! I'm up every Monday, Wednesday, or Friday. I have quite a bit of flexibility.

In CHRIST alone...

Sophia7 said:

Wow, so only Sabbath-keepers are true Christians, in your opinion? Even Adventism doesn't officially teach that.

Paul doesn't separate them.

Click to expand...

in my eyes, if one willing disobeys or decides they are not going to obey the command of GOD.. i dont think they will go to heaven.. so i would minister to them just as i would a sinner.. who is sinner willfully.. for in truth they are willfully sinner..

this has nothing to do with SDA ma'am..
and eventually its up to Jesus.. but i would think after he has clearly made this line, i would think he would stick with it and all outside of the line.. who were deceived by the devil are lost...

not that non-commandment follower are bad people.. dont dont take that approach. they are simple cheated and deceive by the devil and they fall short of the requirements of GOD..

2. yes paul does separate them.. maybe you dont see it, but its either he i an unstable mad man who constantly contradicts his own idea and the idea that JESUS taught...

i dunno why u ppl hold on to Pauls work to justify your disobedience... i jesus say one thing and paul come and say another.. whic would you rather to believe?? anyway you tek it! the commandments should be kept. PAUL EVEN SAYS THEY SHOULD BE KETCH

Dania

Dania,
I am a former adventist. I am going to a bible teaching church. If it didn't follow God's word I would have been gone in a heart beat. Why I left the SDA is because the church is based on the words of EGW.
I was not mistreated by any of my SDA friends and we study the bible together without any guides such as commentaries, EGW, etc.
In the NT we are told the greatest commandment is to love God with all our heart and the second is to love our neighbors. When you have the true love of God you do not want to do harm to others.
Again it comes down to your walk with the Lord regardless of what church one belongs to.
My salvation is from Jesus not a church and He is who I have to listen to. God knows each individual and where he/she needs to be in their christian walk.
I am not judging you about your walk with the Lord and expect the same respect from you.
Not all who leave the church have walked away from God, just from the church for doctrinal reasons and for personal reasons.

freeindeed2 said:

'Formers' who left the SDA church over theological/doctrinal/Scriptural discrepancies tend to understand the 10 C's to a much larger degree than the average person sitting in the SDA pew.

Click to expand...

This is a stretch if I ever read one!

mva1985 said:

This is a stretch if I ever read one!

Click to expand...

They have had to wrestle with the law in the context of the old and new covenants. Many do not even know that the Bible refers to the 10 C's as the covenant God made with Israel. And many haven't studied the covenants at all. It's not a stretch, mva.

In CHRIST alone...

Dania said:

in my eyes, if one willing disobeys or decides they are not going to obey the command of GOD.. i dont think they will go to heaven..

Click to expand...

Should we conclude, then, that salvation is contingent upon "the law" or "works?"

BFA

Dania said:

in my eyes, if one willing disobeys or decides they are not going to obey the command of GOD.. i dont think they will go to heaven..

Click to expand...

You all make heaven sound like a holiday destination.

Dania said:

in my eyes, if one willing disobeys or decides they are not going to obey the command of GOD.. i dont think they will go to heaven.. Dania

Click to expand...

sentipente said:

You all make heaven sound like a holiday destination.

Click to expand...

Today's understatement.
More like an impossible aspiration no one is going to accomplish, since God has already charged all the covenant recipients disobedient already in Romans 11:32. I would be sweating bullets if it weren't for passages such as these:

Romans 7:6 - now we are delivered from the law
Romans 10:4 - Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth
2 Corinthians 3:7-13 - the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones...the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished
Ephesians 2:15 - Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances
Colossians 2:14 - Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross
1 Timothy 1:9 - the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners
Galatians 3:13 - Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law
Galatians 4:4-5 - God sent forth his Son...To redeem them that were under the law

So Christ told us to earn our salvation when He told us to obey the commandments? Say it ain't so!

TrustAndObey said:

So Christ told us to earn our salvation when He told us to obey the commandments? Say it ain't so!

Click to expand...

I have a favor to ask of you.
When you post a question such as this one, please use the 'quote' button when you reply.
Apparently the vBulletin software settings need this in order to anchor your post to the one you reply to, and it seems to be the only way I can tell who you're directing a question to, and in what context.
Victor

It's open to anyone, that's why I didn't anchor it.