Why does God's presence leave some people?

"I believe, O Lord, help thou my unbelief."

I don't know why. I have one speculation, though:

When I am totally sure of myself, I tend to be smug and arrogant.

I have been hurt pretty badly by people who were totally sure of their beliefs, and who were as a result smug and arrogant.

So maybe it's a chance to do something better, even if it's a bit harder. You might take it as a sign that God figures you can cross the street without having someone hold your hand.

Why God's presence leaves people: Isaiah 59:1-2. "Behold, the LORD'S hand is not shortened, that it cannot save; neither his ear heavy, that it cannot hear: But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear."

Of course, it's not always so set-in-stone, there are points in time when the most righteous of men in God's sight don't feel His presence. A large percentage of the time it can be attributed to our own pride, vainglory, self-righteousness, selfishness, and sins as a whole, but as we can see in Job's account sometimes He may take a step backwards for our own benefit.

Hello Johnclay, welcome to christianforums ! I will do my best to try to answer your question.

First, are you asking about Gods presence leaving a believer, or a non believer?

Gods presence never leaves the believer, we are indwelt by His Spirit upon salvation and it is promised that He will never leave us nor forsake us.

John 14:16. "And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever,
17. "even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you.
18. "I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.
Hebrews 13:5. Let your conduct be without covetousness, and be content with such things as you have. For He Himself has said, "I will never leave you nor forsake you.''
6. So we may boldly say: "The Lord is my helper; I will not fear. What can man do to me?''

2 Corinthians 1:21. Now He who establishes us with you in Christ and has anointed us is God,
22. who also has sealed us and given us the Spirit in our hearts as a deposit.

Ephesians 1: 13. In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,
14. who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.

We can greive Gods spirit and walk out of fellowship with God , we can let the worries of this life greive us and doubt, but He doesnt leave us even though to us it feels like it because of our burden whether it be because of something that has happened to us , or because of our own actions.

The verse you posted from James is about asking for wisdom from God , and the context is speaking to believers, whose faith is being tried by others due to persecution-that verse is not about salvation.

About a non believer seeking God :

Proverbs 8:17. I love those who love me, and those who seek me diligently will find me.

Jeremiah 29:11. For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, says the Lord, thoughts of peace and not of evil, to give you a future and a hope.
12. Then you will call upon Me and go and pray to Me, and I will listen to you.
13. And you will seek Me and find Me, when you search for Me with all your heart.

Jeremiah 33:3. `Call to Me, and I will answer you, and show you great and mighty things, which you do not know.'

I have a question for you , in seeking Him , are you also willing to surrender yourself to His will , even if it means you have to admit your ways are not His? That you may have to give up some things that may be in your life?

I hope this adresses some of what you asked.

God does not leave the believer and I agree with the pastor on feelings but i dont agree with the second statement that its not being humble enough when it comes to a believer feeling apart from God as the only reason - there are many reasons why a person who is a believer can feel apart from God .

You've stated however yourself here

I realized that I didn't really believe in the historical Jesus

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and then

I was wanting to just be a very liberal Christian

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This scenerio isnt about having received Christ and then Christ leaving you if you can admit that you realized that you really didnt believe. He says you will find Him when you search for Him with all your heart. This means willing to be in His will , not what we want for ourselves , but what He wants for us and wants us to be. when you are ready to surrender yourself to Him , that is when you will find Him in no uncertain term.

If you are defining the terms , then its not surrendering your will to His. Its when we are ready to surrender ourselves to Him - fully trusting Him (faith is not blind , the primary meaning of the word is complete trust). Are you willing to Trust Him completely with your life - even if it conflicts with your own desires? Those are the things you should ask yourself if you are seeking with all your heart.

As far as discussing the purpose driven life , that is not a book Ive read so I cannot adress that issue except to say i do not agree with the sentiment as shown and without its context, I couldnt possibly critique it any further than whats written.

If you want some good books to read , I reccommend "The new evidence that demands a verdict" by Josh McDowell and "Growing deep in the Christian life" by Charles Swindoll and "Classic Christianity" by Bob George - if you want evidence presented on the historic Christ , I reccommend "The Case for Christ " and "The Case for Faith" by Lee Strobel .

I also strongly suggest reading the bible , starting in the book of John.

Lastly again, in a believer, God never leaves them even though the believer may be in a very strained relationship and may "feel" as if God has left them but that is not the case. Do you always feel euphoric feelings of love for someone you care about each instance of each day? Is it possible for a person to misread a situation? sure it is. Its the same thing with our relationship with God.

For example , if we neglect our prayer life , it would be about the same as neglecting communication with a loved one and then feeling distant from the loved one because of it. Does it mean there is no longer relationship?

JohnClay said:

I was wondering why God's presence isn't always felt by Christians? Is he testing them or something?
e.g.
2 Chronicles 32:31b "...God left him to test him and to know everything that was in his heart."

This is related:
Say a person is praying to be convinced of God i.e. to feel his presence, but is half an atheist:
James 1:6-8

Why can't God accept the half-faith like I described. Or if he does sometimes I guess he doesn't very much.

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Greetings
When we sit each day in front of TV's or movies or other things, according to Scripture it dull's our senses to God's presence, this is the same thing that lot had happen to him, he vexed his rightious soul by viewing there ungodly deeds from day to day.

This is only the start if you want to find your answer, God will respond to your little bit of faith but only if he see;s in your heart your serious about finding him.

We can't play games with him, he say's when we seek him with all of our hearts we will find him. If he shows you he is true, what would you do with your new found knowledge?

If you'll read his Bible, he can speak to you through the word, it works. You need quite time to read. Then take time to think about what you read, and if you have a question, ask God to explain it to you, then be still or read on, but listen within you and he will speak.

Remember he knows if your seeking a answer.
Peace to all in Jesus
Rev Malone

God's Presence never leaves. He never leaves even for a moment. The feeling or sense or Him being there can leave us though.

One of the biggest lessons I learned was that my God is a real person, not an emotion. God isn't a feeling or a sense, He is a real person. He nevers leaves, but sometimes we feel like He has for one reason or another.

It could be because we push him away, we ignore him, he is teaching us a lesson, others take away His presence (as in a social situation when God is moving and someone hurts the Holy Spirit so he "leaves"), or for other reasons that could be possible.

The three greatest reasons why I feel like God is away (although He is always right by me) is because I push him away, I ignore him, or He wants me to seek Him and chase after Him for one reason or another, which I think is just linked to the first two reasons.

One time it was so that I would learn a big lesson on emotion vs. reality. God NEVER leaves us. Just the emotion/sense of Him being by us does sometimes. Huge difference.

The three greatest reasons why I feel like God is away (although He is always right by me) is because I push him away, I ignore him, or He wants me to seek Him and chase after Him for one reason or another, which I think is just linked to the first two reasons.

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When I am totally sure of myself, I tend to be smug and arrogant.

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When I was newer to the faith, the drops in feeling seemed related to my overdependence on emotion. These days, it relates more to overconfidence in religiosity. It's not that God is toying with us, or leaving us. These were lessons I really needed to learn, not just for myself but so I didn't steamroll other people.

Not feeling His presence also encourages us to trust Him at His word -- He tells us the terms of salvation, but they seem to easy so we want to make it harder and then feel like we've deserved His acceptance.

There are other similar faith issues, where we need to learn how to depend on His word, rather than what we think the Bible should say. Cause and effect principles depend on us knowing (eg, knock, and the door will be opened).

But if you want to find out what's going on, ask Him. Look at documented cases in the Bible where God's spirit left someone. Angeltruth added that Jesus promised to never leave us; you and Blakemichael pointed out some prior instances. See also 1Sa 16:14, Pr 16:18, Isa 25:11

A new promise was made that was important. Jesus would be with His people, and He would send the Holy Spirit to dwell in us.



http://www.studylight.org/desk/?query=job+35:12&translation=nas&st=1&new=1&sr=1&l=en

It's weird but I know what you mean, Sometimes I think some people were never really meant to be Christians because God makes sure of it,
I am beginning to experience this something goes wrong no matter what and it just makes you want to switch off

JohnClay said:

I was wondering why God's presence isn't always felt by Christians? Is he testing them or something?
e.g.
2 Chronicles 32:31b "...God left him to test him and to know everything that was in his heart."

This is related:
Say a person is praying to be convinced of God i.e. to feel his presence, but is half an atheist:
James 1:6-8

Why can't God accept the half-faith like I described. Or if he does sometimes I guess he doesn't very much.

Click to expand...

God says the World will never know Him (His spirit will not be inside of them).

God's spirit will never leave the true follower in Christ.

Hello my friend, The lord our God has no part with sin. However, you are speaking of a believer. As you know all believers have The Spirit of God in them. God does not see the sin of a believer because He looks at the believer through Jesus and the believer is sinless thanks to His sacrifice. Well, you know how you said that sometimes God's presence leaves you, well, that's not the case... remember how He promised he would never leave us or forsake us.... believe that when He says something it is true and He always keeps His promises! The reason you or other believers feel like God's presence has left them is because they have left Him... in thier heart or in the minds...they have taken they eyes off Jesus. You see, as we sin, if we do not continually confess our sins and repent then our guilt will make us feel seperated from God, but God does not leave us. Remember when The Lord washed the disciples feet and Peter wanted him to wash his whole body, then The Lord said that he who has been washed needs not bathe but only needs to wash his feet. This is saying that we are cleansed from our sins as a whole, but that we need to continually confess and repent our sins daily. This is not for salvation, but for our own daily good. That we may not be weighed down with our sin.... we must cast our burdens upon Him. Also, i find that when i am not focused on The Lord i start to feel distant... so the cure is to get reconnected and stay connected all day, everyday as much as possible through prayer and reading The Word, and doing for others in His name. Then as you do these things all the time, you will feel His presence and see that He never left you, not even for a second! God Bless You! amen.