Jesus claimed He came to fulfill the Law, Did He?

[Hentenza]

Tell me Sabbsthblessings, how do you keep the Sabbath?

 

[Hentenza]

How do you know how I keep the Sabbath. Only God does and He knows how everyone else does as well.

But that is not true. You call everyone that does not agree with your idea of Sabbath keeping sinners. You compare us to idolaters, murderers, ect. As it always happens with those that keep the law, you have become the judge. You have become the one that identifies sin.

There is a preparation day for the Sabbath but many of these things are taken out of context. I do not think you're really interested in understanding God's Sabbath, just the same one the pharisees kept.

Moving goal posts again? Not surprised.

 

[Hentenza]

In Galatians use it in context to the Sabbath commandment and let’s see what that looks like. Paul was very clear about the law he was referring to which is the main theme of Galatians and if I had to guess, you don't know what law that is.

Again, the Sabbath is the 4th commandment and there are laws in the law of Moses on how to properly keep it. If you have to keep the fourth commandment then you also have to keep the part of the law of Moses that explains its keeping. You can’t have it both ways.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

But that is not true. You call everyone that does not agree with your idea of Sabbath keeping sinners.

I said breaking the Sabbath is no different than breaking God's other commandments, it all sin, not according to what I say, but what the Bible says 1 John 3:4 James 2:11-12 Mat 5:19-30 Rom 7:7

You compare us to idolaters, murderers, ect.

I didn't say this, the Bible does. So please stop quoting me out of context. I never accused anyone of doing anything because I am not God. I can point out what is sin according to the Bible, but we all have to stand before Him 2 Cor 5:10 based on what we do and only God knows that.

As it always happens with those that keep the law, you have become the judge. You have become the one that identifies sin.

Quote one time where I judged anyone and said they are sinners. I quoted the Bible what it says and sorry if you can't see the difference. I have no idea what people do in their lives as I am not God nor judge and have no desire to be either

Moving goal posts again? Not surprised.

You are something special. I think its best I move on. Its what the Bible tells me to do. Mat 15:3-14

Take care.

 

[Hentenza]

I said breaking the Sabbath is no different than breaking God's other commandments, it all sin, not according to what I say, but what the Bible says 1 John 3:4 James 2:11-12 Mat 5:19-30 Rom 7:7

I didn't say this, the Bible does. So please stop quoting me out of context. I never accused anyone of doing anything because I am not God. I can point out what is sin according to the Bible, but we all have to stand before Him 2 Cor 5:10 based on what we do and only God knows that.

Do you want me to go find the post or do you want to go find it first?

Quote one time where I judged anyone and said they are sinners. I quoted the Bible what it says and sorry if you can't see the difference. I have no idea what people do in their lives as I am not God nor judge and have no desire to be either

You are something special. I think its best I move on. Its what the Bible tells me to do. Mat 15:3-14

Take care.

So you quote Mat, 15:3-14 to accuse me of being a Pharisee. Got it. So much for not judging others.

Here, maybe you can learn from scripture. This is Paul’s description of what it is to walk by the Spirit to Galatians. Walk by the Spirit and ALL law has been fulfilled by Christ who redeemed us from all sin.


“But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not carry out the desire of the flesh. For the desire of the flesh is against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; for these are in opposition to one another, in order to keep you from doing whatever you want. But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the Law. Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are: sexual immorality, impurity, indecent behavior, idolatry, witchcraft, hostilities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions, envy, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law. Now those who belong to Christ Jesus crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭5‬:‭16‬-‭24‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

Galatians 5:17-24 For the desire of the flesh is against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; for these are in opposition to one another, in order to keep you from doing whatever you want. But if you are led b | New American Standard Bible -

For the desire of the flesh is against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; for these are in opposition to one another, in order to keep you from doing whatever you want. But if you are led b

bible.com

Be blessed.

 

[XrxrX]

Not at all, Paul is quoting OT.

Exo 34:29 Now it was so, when Moses came down from Mount Sinai (and the two tablets of the Testimony were in Moses’ hand when he came down from the mountain), that Moses did not know that the skin of his face shone while he talked with Him. 30 So when Aaron and all the children of Israel saw Moses, behold, the skin of his face shone, and they were afraid to come near him. 31 Then Moses called to them, and Aaron and all the rulers of the congregation returned to him; and Moses talked with them. 32 Afterward all the children of Israel came near, and he gave them as commandments all that the Lord had spoken with him on Mount Sinai. 33 And when Moses had finished speaking with them, he put a veil on his face. 34 But whenever Moses went in before the Lord to speak with Him, he would take the veil off until he came out; and he would come out and speak to the children of Israel whatever he had been commanded. 35 And whenever the children of Israel saw the face of Moses, that the skin of Moses’ face shone, then Moses would put the veil on his face again, until he went in to speak with Him.

Whose face is now in the New Covenant? Jesus. There is no veil on Jesus we can go directly to Him as He is our High Priest and Mediator of the New Covenant.

I'm aware of the analogy Paul is using, I'm not questioning the analogy.. I'm saying you are misusing the passage. Paul is stating that the Mosaic Law was a "ministry" and that ministry is being REPLACED, not "updated" or "improved" so you can "break the Law and not die" as you guys preach, but REPLACED. Completely and totally.

Heb 9:15 And for this reason He is the Mediator of the new covenant, by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant, that those who are called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance.

1 Tim 2:For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;


You are not staying in the context of this passage. I can see why you want to move away from the context of the passage we were discussing because it doesn't say what you want it to.

It's the full context of the passage.

But if you want to go here thats fine..

The phase "under the law" means under the condemnation of the law, the wages of sin is death,

And this is where you parse your "new rules" where you get to not really keep Sabbath correctly but claim "it's ok because the curse is gone"... this doesn't honor the Law.

again obeying God and His Law is not what is bad

And His Law is Love.

, sadly the other spirit has done a good job of twisting this. Breaking God's law is sin 1 John 3:4 and under condemnation Rom 6:23

Rom 3:19 Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become [a]guilty before God.

A tutor, to bring people to faith.. which we already have.

We are all under the condemnation of the law unless, we are keeping it through the power of the Holy Spirit John 14:15-1

There is now no condemnation, remember.. the "ministry of Condemnation"? REPLACED. And John 14:15, what are those Commands? Believe on the Son and Love each other as He has loved us. NOT "refraining from work on a day of the week".

1 John 3:24 Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

Again, new commands.

Rom 8:1 8 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who[a] do not walk according to the flesh, (sin) but according to the Spirit.

Flesh and Spirit are delineating saved and unsaved, there is no condemnation for the saved.

Sin is breaking God’s law 1 John 3:4 Rom 7:7 James 2:11-12

If we are not ministering through the Spirit and keeping God's law, than our master is someone other than God, sadly many don't even realize this. It’s the deceitfulness of sin Heb 3:13 that many have harden their heart to and won't allow God to define sin or His law which He does. What the Holy Spirit is calling us out of if we hear Him Heb 3:7-19

Yes, sin is bad.. you'd be surprised that Christians are well aware of that.

Rom 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?




According to Paul he needed the law to know what sin is. Are we really more wise than he was?

UNTIL faith, the verse is crystal clear.

Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, “You shall not covet.”

Again, UNTIL... verbatim in the verse.

The issue is people want to go based on what feels right to them, and depend on their own version of right and wrong (righteousness) instead of God's Psa 119:172 Isa 56:1-2. Our version is filthy rags and our heart deceitful Jer 17:9

James 1:22 But be doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves. 23 For if anyone is a hearer of the word and not a doer, he is like a man observing his natural face in a mirror; 24 for he observes himself, goes away, and immediately forgets what kind of man he was. 25 But he who looks into the perfect law of liberty and continues in it, and is not a forgetful hearer but a doer of the work, this one will be blessed in what he does.

Exactly, the Law of Liberty.. the Law of Christ.. the Law of Love.

James 2:11 For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder.” Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of the law. 12 So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty.

Believers are not judged. But our actions are 'judged' by the world, and we are to judge each other in the faith, by the reed of scripture.

Rev 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city.

And this is a "Millennial prophesy" which is a whole can of worms I'm not getting into here. Suffice to say, we've already entered God's Kingdom and are seated with Christ in heavenly realms. We're in the Book of Life, and have Eternal Life by God's Grace, not His Law.
So, I assume you're learning from 119 Ministries, you have all the exact 'bullet points', I would suggest you rethink their teaching as it is rank error.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I'm aware of the analogy Paul is using, I'm not questioning the analogy.. I'm saying you are misusing the passage. Paul is stating that the Mosaic Law was a "ministry" and that ministry is being REPLACED, not "updated" or "improved" so you can "break the Law and not die" as you guys preach, but REPLACED. Completely and totally.

The ministry is being replaced, not the law.

The law went from tables of stone to tablets of the heart 2 Cor 3:3 Heb 8:10

And this is where you parse your "new rules" where you get to not really keep Sabbath correctly but claim "it's ok because the curse is gone"... this doesn't honor the Law.

These appear to be your words not mine.

And His Law is Love.

Amen.

A tutor, to bring people to faith.. which we already have.

Faith does not void the law, it establishes it.. Rom 3:31

There is now no condemnation, remember.. the "ministry of Condemnation"? REPLACED.

No condemnation if one is keeping God's Law. Sin is still breaking God's law 1 John 3:4 James 2:11-12 and when we do not subject ourselves to God's law we are walking in the flesh, not the Spirit. Rom 8:7-8 and the wages of sin is still death in the NC Rom 6:23. Its why we need a conversion.

And John 14:15, what are those Commands? Believe on the Son and Love each other as He has loved us. NOT "refraining from work on a day of the week".

How do we beleive in Him but not beleive what He teaches. Belief is interconnected with obedience you will see this in Heb 3:7-19 Heb 4:2,6,11

Jesus taught on the Ten Commandments saying when we keep our rules/laws over obeying the commandments of God, quoting directly from the Ten one worships Him in vain and their heart is far from Him Mat 15:3-14 because its rebelling against what God placed in our heart- His laws. Heb 8:10 Why Jesus taught not to break the least of these commandments again quoting directly from the Ten Commandments as one would be in fear of sin and judgement Mat 5:19-30. Jesus taught a lot on the Ten Commandments including the Sabbath, both by teaching and example. This doctrine we do not have to keep God's Law or 9 of the Ten Commandments forgetting the one commandment God said to Remember is not a doctrine coming from Scripture.

Luke 6:46 But why do you call Me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do the things which I say?

Again, new commands.

No where does it say new commands automatically deletes old ones. Not anything Jesus taught.

Flesh and Spirit are delineating saved and unsaved, there is no condemnation for the saved.

Yes, because they are not rebelling against the law of God. Rev 22:14 Rev 14:12

Yes, sin is bad.. you'd be surprised that Christians are well aware of that.

Best to allow God to define what sin is and not us. 1 John 3:4 James 2:11-12 Mat 5:19-30 Rom 7:7

UNTIL faith, the verse is crystal clear.

Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? Certainly not! On the contrary, we establish the law. When we come to Jesus did He teach not to obey the law? No He taught the opposite John 14:15 Mat 19:17-19 Mark 7:7-13 Mat 15:3-14 Mat 5:19-30

Seems clear

Again, UNTIL... verbatim in the verse.

Exactly, the Law of Liberty.. the Law of Christ.. the Law of Love.

God and Christ are the Same as is there Laws. The Bible defines what the law of liberty is James 2:11-12 but thats the issue I have found people not allowing the Bible to explain Itself, instead seek their own reasoning and own desires.

Believers are not judged. But our actions are 'judged' by the world, and we are to judge each other in the faith, by the reed of scripture.

2 Cor 5:10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad.

We do not judge ourselves, God does.

And this is a "Millennial prophesy" which is a whole can of worms I'm not getting into here. Suffice to say, we've already entered God's Kingdom and are seated with Christ in heavenly realms. We're in the Book of Life, and have Eternal Life by God's Grace, not His Law.
So, I assume you're learning from 119 Ministries, you have all the exact 'bullet points', I would suggest you rethink their teaching as it is rank error.

No, Jesus has not came the second time, there is still sin in the world and when He comes every eye will see Him, His saints will meet Him in the air, none of that has happened yet.

We are probably too far apart in our understanding of God's Word and I will probably leave it as agree to disagree but wish you well.

 

[XrxrX]

The ministry is being replaced, not the law.

The Mosaic Law WAS the MINISTRY.

The law went from tables of stone to tablets of the heart 2 Cor 3:3 Heb 8:10

The Law of LOVE, God's Love poured into our hearts to overflow.

These appear to be your words not mine.

Amen.

Faith does not void the law, it establishes it.. Rom 3:31

"Establishes/Upholds".. recognizing the Law is perfect, and that you FAILED in keeping the Mosaic Law.. ESTABLISHES that the Law is perfect, and therefore leave it alone. THAT is what upholds the Law for what it is, not "lawkeepers" that sullie the Law by their halfway attempts at it, which Also demeans the Blood of Jesus.

No condemnation if one is keeping God's Law.

No.... no condemnation.. PERIOD.

Sin is still breaking God's law 1 John 3:4 James 2:11-12 and when we do not subject ourselves to God's law we are walking in the flesh, not the Spirit.

Again, no... "walking in the flesh" is a euphemism for an unregenerate unbeliever, which we are not and have NO part of. "Walking in the Spirit" is the ONLY thing a Believer can do, because we HAVE the Spirit indwelling us. We NEVER are walking without the Spirit.

Rom 8:7-8 and the wages of sin is still death in the NC Rom 6:23. Its why we need a conversion.

The wages are death, and Jesus died for us, and we died with Him.

How do we beleive in Him but not beleive what He teaches. Belief is interconnected with obedience you will see this in Heb 3:7-19 Heb 4:2,6,11

The Obedience of Faith, and we DID obey.

Jesus taught on the Ten Commandments saying when we keep our rules/laws over obeying the commandments of God, quoting directly from the Ten one worships Him in vain and their heart is far from Him Mat 15:3-14 because its rebelling against what God placed in our heart- His laws. Heb 8:10 Why Jesus taught not to break the least of these commandments again quoting directly from the Ten Commandments as one would be in fear of sin and judgement Mat 5:19-30. Jesus taught a lot on the Ten Commandments including the Sabbath, both by teaching and example. This doctrine we do not have to keep God's Law or 9 of the Ten Commandments forgetting the one commandment God said to Remember is not a doctrine coming from Scripture.

Jesus had a ministry before the Cross. Offered one last chance for Israel to conform to the Covenant.. they refused. We don't attain Everlasting Life by "rule keeping", this is Christianity 101. I will not name what you are teaching, because inexplicably.. it's "against the rules", but I think we all know.

Luke 6:46 But why do you call Me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do the things which I say?

Speak for yourself.. He said "Believe on Me, and love as I have loved", I for one do what He commands.

No where does it say new commands automatically deletes old ones. Not anything Jesus taught.

"For if that which is DONE AWAY.. was glorious, much more that which REMAINETH is glorious."

Yes, because they are not rebelling against the law of God. Rev 22:14 Rev 14:12

Best to allow God to define what sin is and not us. 1 John 3:4 James 2:11-12 Mat 5:19-30 Rom 7:7



Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? Certainly not! On the contrary, we establish the law.

What you teach doesn't establish the Law, teaching to 'halfway' keep the Law profanes it.

When we come to Jesus did He teach not to obey the law? No He taught the opposite John 14:15 Mat 19:17-19 Mark 7:7-13 Mat 15:3-14 Mat 5:19-30

He spoke to those Under the Law.. and yes, BOUND to obey the Mosaic Law.

Seems clear

God and Christ are the Same as is there Laws. The Bible defines what the law of liberty is James 2:11-12 but thats the issue I have found people not allowing the Bible to explain Itself, instead seek their own reasoning and own desires.

2 Cor 5:10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad.

Spoken to a mixed audience, clearly evangelistic.. which would clearly denote what happens Outside salvation. We sit ON the Throne WITH Jesus. We judge men and angels WITH Christ. Believers do not recieve recompence for bad done in the body, obviously.. nor do unsaved recieve recompence for "good".. because there is none. This is what happens to the unsaved world.. and that judgement has Already happened. They were found wanting, and we are hidden in Christ.

We do not judge ourselves, God does.

“Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, HAS eternal life, and Does.. NOT.. COME.. INTO..JUDGEMENT..., but HAS... passed out of death into life."

"For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? But them that are without God judgeth."

No, Jesus has not came the second time, there is still sin in the world and when He comes every eye will see Him, His saints will meet Him in the air, none of that has happened yet.

We are probably too far apart in our understanding of God's Word and I will probably leave it as agree to disagree but wish you well.

"But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart. Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away."
Our "understandings" are certainly as far apart..
"And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence."

I would suggest you meditate on this..
"And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day. And they that found him gathering sticks brought him unto Moses and Aaron, and unto all the congregation. And they put him in ward, because it was not declared what should be done to him. And the LORD said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp. And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the LORD commanded Moses."

It illustrates the seriousness of what you teach.. and how it is flawed.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

The Mosaic Law WAS the MINISTRY.

Verse please

"Establishes/Upholds".. recognizing the Law is perfect, and that you FAILED in keeping the Mosaic Law..

You have no idea what I do or don't do, only God knows what us each do, nothing we can hide from Him Ecc 12:13-14

The Ten Commandments is not the law of Moses. God claimed the Ten Commandments as His, not Moses. Moses is not God.

THAT is what upholds the Law for what it is, not "lawkeepers" that sullie the Law by their halfway attempts at it, which Also demeans the Blood of Jesus.

Verse please

No.... no condemnation.. PERIOD.

Verse please that says we can disobey God's law and be living in His Spirit

We NEVER are walking without the Spirit.

Verse please. If everyone is walking in the Spirit why is there so much sin?

The wages are death, and Jesus died for us, and we died with Him.

But does someone who died with Jesus continue breaking God's law and sinning? Or are they living a new life in Christ abiding in Him, keeping His commandments?

Romans 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? 2 Certainly not! How shall we who died to sin (breaking God's law 1 John 3:4 James 2:11-12) live any longer in it? 3 Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? 4 Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

If we are living in Christ what does that look like according to Him?

John 15:10 If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love.
1 John 3:24 Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.
1 John 2: 3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God [a]is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 6 He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.

The Obedience of Faith, and we DID obey.

Jesus is the Judge of us, nothign we can hide from Ecc 12:13-14 we do not judge ourselves.

Why He will say

Mat 7: 21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’ The word he used means sin and sin is lawlessness- God's version, not mans.

Jesus had a ministry before the Cross. Offered one last chance for Israel to conform to the Covenant.. they refused. We don't attain Everlasting Life by "rule keeping", this is Christianity 101. I will not name what you are teaching, because inexplicably.. it's "against the rules", but I think we all know.

This is the exact opposite of what happened. The covenant was the Ten Commandments Exo 34:28 and the covenant was broken because they did not continue it. Heb 8:9 otherwise God would have never made a new one, because God's Laws was not the issue as if only worshipping God is the issue or not committing murder was the issue, the issue was sin and breaking God's laws. God in His mercy and longsuffering instead of disregarding humanity, wrote a New Covenant established on better promises Heb 8:6 it still has God's laws now written on a better surface, our hearts, with better promises on how we can keep if we do not rebel. God does not lower His righteous standards to us, He lifts those who have a willing and open heart to Him

Speak for yourself.. He said "Believe on Me, and love as I have loved", I for one do what He commands.

How does one beleive and not do what He asks? Such as Mat 5:19-30 Mat 15:3-14 Mark 7:7-13 Luke 4:16 Isa 56:1-6 Mat 19:17-19

"For if that which is DONE AWAY.. was glorious, much more that which REMAINETH is glorious."

Again context, the law was not done away with, says no where in the Scriptures. Like we can now worship other gods, or covet and break the least of these commandments. Jesus said I did not come to destroy the Law and fulfill does not mean to destroy but to fill full like a wedding covenant. Why breaking the least of these commandments and teaching others to comes with a serious warning sadly many gloss over. Mat 5:19-30

What you teach doesn't establish the Law, it profanes it.

Placing the glory on the Testimony of God who wrote and spoke His commandments that I am encouraging peopel to keep the way God said is profaning it.

Isa 5:20 Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil; Who put darkness for light, and light for darkness; Who put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

What God blesses, no man can reverse Num 23:20

He spoke to those Under the Law.. and yes, BOUND to obey the Mosaic Law.

You do not seem to understand the difference of the Ten Commandments and the Law of Moses despite the Testimony of God Exo 31:18 and He claiming His law the Ten Commandments as His Exo 20:6, God is not Moses. One is the Creator of everything, the other the creation. Moses didn't even take credit for God's works Exo 32:16 - do we really know better than God's own Testimony and the testimony of Moses?

“Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, HAS eternal life, and Does.. NOT.. COME.. INTO..JUDGEMENT..., but HAS... passed out of death into life."

The conditions- hears My word and believes which means do. We do not judge this God does. Many believers will say Lord Lord but did not do God's will.

Mat 7: 21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’ The word he used means sin and sin is lawlessness- God's version, not mans.

You really need to come up to speed with what our Faith is.. and is not.

"But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart. Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away."
Our "understandings" are certainly as far apart..
"And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence."

Faith certainly is not breaking the commandments of God and not having the faith of Jesus Rev 14:12 Nor does this verse say so. It’s more inline with what I wrote previously about Jesus replacing Moses, not replacing God’s Law, that was written on the heart of the NC believer.

I would suggest you meditate on this..
"And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day. And they that found him gathering sticks brought him unto Moses and Aaron, and unto all the congregation. And they put him in ward, because it was not declared what should be done to him. And the LORD said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp. And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the LORD commanded Moses."

Why would I mediate on those who broke God's Sabbath and were punished for it. The wages of sin is death. Just like those in the OT who committed adultery and murder was a death sentence. In the OT they were under theocracy, in the NT, sin is still sin and punishable by God if we have not confessed and forsaken our sins Rom 6:23 Pro 28:13 Heb 10:26-30 but Judgement is the last day and not everyone who says Lord Lord will enter through the gates of heaven

Rev 22:14 14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city.

It illustrates the seriousness of what you teach.. and how it is flawed.

Not at all. I am more about focusing on ways to obey Him and the beautiful promises and blessing it brings than focusing on those who followed the path of disobedience we are warned not to follow Heb 4:11

Perhaps this is something for you to consider in prayer.

Exo 20:12 Moreover I also gave them My Sabbaths, to be a sign between them and Me, that they might know that I am the Lord who sanctifies them.
Eze 20:20 hallow My Sabbaths, and they will be a sign between Me and you, that you may know that I am the Lord your God.’

Isa 56:1 Thus says the Lord:

“Keep justice, and do righteousness,
For My salvation is about to come,
And My righteousness to be revealed.
2 Blessed is the man who does this,
And the son of man who lays hold on it;
Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”

6 “Also the sons of the foreigner (Gentile)
Who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him,
And to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants—
Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And holds fast My covenant—
7 Even them I will bring to My holy mountain,
And make them joyful in My house of prayer.
Their burnt offerings and their sacrifices
Will be accepted on My altar;
For My house shall be called a house of prayer for all nations.”


Rev 22:3 And there shall be no more curse, but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it, and His servants shall serve Him.

God loves us each so much He would never force someone to obey Him by force nor would He ever make someone keep one of His commandments for eternity if they were so opposed to it now. Its why God's judgment will be a judgement of Love as not everyone would be happy in heaven when the Sabbath continues for worship to our Creator for eternity.

Isa 66:23 And it shall come to pass
That from one New Moon to another,
And from one Sabbath to another,
All flesh shall come to worship before Me,” says the Lord

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Again, no... "walking in the flesh" is a euphemism for an unregenerate unbeliever,

Paul is contrasting walking in the flesh (sin) versus walking the Spirit and than flat out defines what walking in the flesh means

Romans 8: 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

So if we are arguing against keeping the law of God and not subject to it, laying them aside as to say its not for me Mark 7:7-13
I would personally would want to spend more time in prayer asking God to help me change my will for His. Psa 40:8 Heb 8:10. We all struggle keeping God's commandments and can only keep them through His Spirit John 14:15-18 but if we are flat out rejecting God's laws I think we are only deceiving ourselves that we are abiding in Christ, when we are told plainly those who do is conditional


John 15:10 If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love.
1 John 3:24 Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.
1 John 2: 3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God [a]is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 6 He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.

 

[Hentenza]

@SabbathBlessings

How do you keep the Sabbath day? Do you follow the 39 melachot?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

@SabbathBlessings

How do you keep the Sabbath day? Do you follow the 39 melachot?

No, I look to the Bible for guidance. The Bible has plenty to say on how we are to keep the Sabbath holy by the Testimony of God and example of Jesus and the apostles. I would be happy to share if honestly interested, if another reason is motivating the question, no thanks, I’ll keep it between me and God.

 

[Hentenza]

No, I look to the Bible for guidance. The Bible has plenty to say on how we are to keep the Sabbath holy by the Testimony of God and example of Jesus and the apostles. I would be happy to share if honestly interested, if another reason is motivating the question, no thanks, I’ll keep it between me and God.

Ok fair enough. I was just curious.

 

[Yarddog]

One poster claims Jesus didn't fulfill ALL the Law, but Jesus in Matt 5: 17 said; “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. Notice Jesus didn't say some of the laws, like the poster claims, because there is no qualifier in His words. Then Jesus went on to tell us that nothing could be removed from said Law until everything was accomplished. The poster also claims that indeed some of the commands of the Law have been fulfilled and are no longer required to be kept. It appears that the poster has been given the discretion to choose what commands can be disregarded.

To those of us posters that believe Jesus did what He came to do, fulfill all the Law, the poster threatens that unless we abide by the commands of the Law we are in a lawless state. According to him/her we have to keep the commands of the Law with emphasis on the Sabbath command in order to be saved.

So, the reason for this thread is to discuss Matt 5:17-18. Did Jesus fail to fulfill what He came to do or did He keep His word and during His stay on this Earth bring an end to the Law? We have no qualms about His fulfilling and bringing to a final end the prophecies concerning Him. Why do some hesitate to believe He did the same for the Law?

Jesus fulfilled the law perfectly.

 

[XrxrX]

Verse please

2 Cor 3:1-18
"But if the ministration (MINISTRY) of death, written and engraven in stones.." (10 Commandments) Is or is not this the 10 Commandments? Is or is not this what is called "the ministry"?
You're playing word games. It's plain as day.

You have no idea what I do or don't do, only God knows what us each do, nothing we can hide from Him Ecc 12:13-14

"For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;" Rom 3:23
"Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law?" John 7:19

The Ten Commandments is not the law of Moses. God claimed the Ten Commandments as His, not Moses. Moses is not God.

"They clave to their brethren, their nobles, and entered into a curse, and into an oath, to walk in GOD'S LAW, which was GIVEN BY MOSES the servant of God, and to observe and do ALL THE COMMANDMENTS of the LORD our Lord, and his judgments and his statutes;.." Neh 10:29

Verse please

If the Law is perfect, and you don't perfectly keep the Law, how in the world is you halfway trying to keep Law "establishing it"? Common sense shows this is ridiculous. To "uphold the law" is to hold it up for what it is, perfect. And Faith.. rather than disrespecting the Law by making it less than it was intended to be, is what respects Law.

Verse please that says we can disobey God's law and be living in His Spirit

Verse please. If everyone is walking in the Spirit who claim to be in Christ why is there so much sin?

But does someone who died with Jesus continue breaking God's law and sinning? Or are they living a new life in Christ abiding in Him, keeping His commandments?

Romans 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? 2 Certainly not! How shall we who died to sin (breaking God's law 1 John 3:4 James 2:11-12) live any longer in it? 3 Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? 4 Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

If we are living in Christ what does that look like according to Him?

John 15:10 If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love.
1 John 3:24 Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.
1 John 2: 3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God [a]is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 6 He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.

And this is the pit you guys always fall in. Why are you leveling accusations of Christians "sinning". You throw out these verses as if to claim Believers condone sin. It's slanderous.

Jesus is the Judge of us, nothign we can hide from Ecc 12:13-14 we do not judge ourselves.

I gave you the clear verse. The Church is to wield 'judgement' with each other, between each other in matters by the reed of scripture. This isn't "final judgement" its functional judgement now. And also, the clear verse Believers are not judged. How is the verse unclear to you?

Why He will say

Mat 7: 21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’ The word he used means sin and sin is lawlessness- God's version, not mans.

This verse does not apply to Believers. He verbatim cites "false teachers and wolves". He says "I never knew you", clearly Jesus knows Believers.

This is the exact opposite of what happened. The covenant was the Ten Commandments Exo 34:28 and the covenant was broken because they did not continue it. Heb 8:9 otherwise God would have never made a new one, because God's Laws was not the issue as if only worshipping God is the issue or not committing murder was the issue, the issue was sin and breaking God's laws. God in His mercy and longsuffering instead of disregarding humanity, wrote a New Covenant established on better promises Heb 8:6 it still has God's laws now written on a better surface, our hearts, with better promises on how we can keep if we do not rebel. God does not lower His righteous standards to us, He lifts those who have a willing and open heart to Him

It's exactly what happened. It's before the Cross and the Law IS the ministry at that time.

How does one beleive and not do what He asks? Such as Mat 5:19-30 Mat 15:3-14 Mark 7:7-13 Luke 4:16 Isa 56:1-6 Mat 19:17-19

Again with the accusations.

Again context, the law was not done away with, says no where in the Scriptures. Like we can now worship other gods, or covet and break the least of these commandments. Jesus said I did not come to destroy the Law and fulfill does not mean to destroy but to fill full like a wedding covenant. Why breaking the least of these commandments and teaching others to comes with a serious warning sadly many gloss over. Mat 5:19-30

"For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled." Just what it says, if anything passed from the Law before He fulfilled all, then heaven and earth would pass away. Heaven and earth didn't pass, and things Did pass from the Law, therefore All was fulfilled.

Placing the glory on the Testimony of God who wrote and spoke His commandments that I am encouraging peopel to keep the way God said is profaning it.

Isa 5:20 Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil; Who put darkness for light, and light for darkness; Who put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

Calling halfway attempts to keep a perfect Law "good" is evil. Keeping perfect Law PERFECTLY is good.

What God blesses, no man can reverse Num 23:20

You do not seem to understand the difference of the Ten Commandments and the Law of Moses

You're splitting hairs, playing word games.

despite the Testimony of God Exo 31:18 and He claiming His law the Ten Commandments as His Exo 20:6, God is not Moses.

Again...
"...GOD'S LAW, which was GIVEN BY MOSES the servant of God.."

One is the Creator of everything, the other the creation. Moses didn't even take credit for God's works Exo 32:16 - do we really know better than God's own Testimony and the testimony of Moses?

The conditions- hears My word and believes which means do. We do not judge this God does. Many believers will say Lord Lord but did not do God's will.

Mat 7: 21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’ The word he used means sin and sin is lawlessness- God's version, not mans.

Faith certainly is not breaking the commandments of God and not having the faith of Jesus Rev 14:12 Nor does this verse say so.

Again, accusations. No one says it is.

Why would I mediate on those who broke God's Sabbath and were punished for it. The wages of sin is death. Just like those in the OT who committed adultery and murder was a death sentence. In the OT they were under theocracy, in the NT, sin is still sin and punishable by God if we have not confessed and forsaken our sins Rom 6:23 Pro 28:13 Heb 10:26-30 but Judgement is the last day and not everyone who says Lord Lord will enter through the gates of heaven

You should meditate on it because it's what your doing and teaching. You're picking up sticks on the Sabbath.
The passage teaches what happens to those that refuse to enter His Rest, our Sabbath.
You are working on the Sabbath, and teaching others to.. and it's their very Eternal Life on the line.
Take it seriously.

Rev 22:14 14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city.

Again, these Millennial prophesies are not what you think, and it's a whole other discussion.

Not really, it actually tells me more about you. I am more about focusing on ways to obey Him and the beautiful promises and blessing it brings.

Aren't you glad you aren't like those 'other sinners"?

Perhaps this is something for you to consider in prayer.

Exo 20:12 Moreover I also gave them My Sabbaths, to be a sign between them and Me, that they might know that I am the Lord who sanctifies them.
Eze 20:20 hallow My Sabbaths, and they will be a sign between Me and you, that you may know that I am the Lord your God.’

Isa 56:1 Thus says the Lord:

“Keep justice, and do righteousness,
For My salvation is about to come,
And My righteousness to be revealed.
2 Blessed is the man who does this,
And the son of man who lays hold on it;
Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”

6 “Also the sons of the foreigner (Gentile)
Who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him,
And to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants—
Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And holds fast My covenant—
7 Even them I will bring to My holy mountain,
And make them joyful in My house of prayer.
Their burnt offerings and their sacrifices
Will be accepted on My altar;
For My house shall be called a house of prayer for all nations.”


Rev 22:3 And there shall be no more curse, but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it, and His servants shall serve Him.

Millennial prophesy.. that Israel rejected.

God loves us each so much He would never force someone to obey Him by force nor would He ever make someone keep one of His commandments for eternity if they were so opposed to it now. Its why God's judgment will be a judgement of Love as not everyone would be happy in heaven when the Sabbath continues for worship to our Creator for eternity.

The Law was given because man was wicked. There will no rebellion in Heaven and we are One Spirit with God. His will is our will. You have a mistaken concept of what our reality will be.

Isa 66:23 And it shall come to pass
That from one New Moon to another,
And from one Sabbath to another,
All flesh shall come to worship before Me,” says the Lord

Millennial. Again, this is a whole other deal.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Ok fair enough. I was just curious.

Under those circumstances, I am happy to share.

God is Spirit so our worship needs to be spiritual John 4:24

This is what Jesus taught on the Ten Commandments. Sin starts from the heart, if the inward part is healed through God, our outward actions would reflect this. He gave us two examples right from the Ten Commandments as principles to be applied to each of the Ten Commandments because He said not to break or teach others to break the least of these commandments Mat 5:19-30

So the Sabbath commandment is always spiritual without neglecting the physical. The Sabbath is about fostering our relationship with Christ, He set aside the seventh day blessed and sanctified the Sabbath from Creation Exo 20:11 to spend time with His creation as we were made in His image and likeness. He rested at Creation, not because He needed rest, He made the Sabbath for man Mark 2:27 to foster our relationship so He can bless Isa 56:2 and sanctify us Eze 20:12 because we can’t do this for ourselves, we need God Isa 66:17

So for Sabbath, I rest from all my work and labors and focus only on Him Isa 58:13 I do this through prayer Acts 16:13 and gathering with other Christians for church or holy convocation Lev 23:3 just as Jesus did Luke 4:16 and the apostles Acts 15:21 Acts 13:42 Acts 13:44 Acts 18:4 and will continue in the new heaven and new earth Isa 66:23. After church I spend most of my time in prayer and Bible study reading the Word of God or trying to reason with other on the Scriptures Acts 17:2 . My church also finds way to help the needy on the Sabbath and we do various activities from feeding/ministering to the homeless to going to sing to the old people in hospitals and ministering to people in need, just as Jesus Mat 12:12 did who is our example 1 John 2:6 . I personally find a huge blessing on the Sabbath and my life changed once I started keeping it.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

2 Cor 3:1-18
"But if the ministration (MINISTRY) of death, written and engraven in stones.." (10 Commandments) Is or is not this the 10 Commandments? Is or is not this what is called "the ministry"?
You're playing word games. It's plain as day.


"For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;" Rom 3:23
"Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law?" John 7:19


"They clave to their brethren, their nobles, and entered into a curse, and into an oath, to walk in GOD'S LAW, which was GIVEN BY MOSES the servant of God, and to observe and do ALL THE COMMANDMENTS of the LORD our Lord, and his judgments and his statutes;.." Neh 10:29

If the Law is perfect, and you don't perfectly keep the Law, how in the world is you halfway trying to keep Law "establishing it"? Common sense shows this is ridiculous. To "uphold the law" is to hold it up for what it is, perfect. And Faith.. rather than disrespecting the Law by making it less than it was intended to be, is what respects Law.

And this is the pit you guys always fall in. Why are you leveling accusations of Christians "sinning". You throw out these verses as if to claim Believers condone sin. It's slanderous.

I gave you the clear verse. The Church is to wield 'judgement' with each other, between each other in matters by the reed of scripture. This isn't "final judgement" its functional judgement now. And also, the clear verse Believers are not judged. How is the verse unclear to you?

This verse does not apply to Believers. He verbatim cites "false teachers and wolves". He says "I never knew you", clearly Jesus knows Believers.

It's exactly what happened. It's before the Cross and the Law IS the ministry at that time.

Again with the accusations.

"For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled." Just what it says, if anything passed from the Law before He fulfilled all, then heaven and earth would pass away. Heaven and earth didn't pass, and things Did pass from the Law, therefore All was fulfilled.

Calling halfway attempts to keep a perfect Law "good" is evil. Keeping perfect Law PERFECTLY is good.

You're splitting hairs, playing word games.

Again...
"...GOD'S LAW, which was GIVEN BY MOSES the servant of God.."

Again, accusations. No one says it is.

You should meditate on it because it's what your doing and teaching. You're picking up sticks on the Sabbath.
The passage teaches what happens to those that refuse to enter His Rest, our Sabbath.
You are working on the Sabbath, and teaching others to.. and it's their very Eternal Life on the line.
Take it seriously.

Again, these Millennial prophesies are not what you think, and it's a whole other discussion.

Aren't you glad you aren't like those 'other sinners"?

Millennial prophesy.. that Israel rejected.

The Law was given because man was wicked. There will no rebellion in Heaven and we are One Spirit with God. His will is our will. You have a mistaken concept of what our reality will be.

Millennial. Again, this is a whole other deal.

I think we did our best trying to reason together so I will just agree to disagree. Be well.

 

[Hentenza]

Under those circumstances, I am happy to share.

God is Spirit so our worship needs to be spiritual John 4:24

This is what Jesus taught on the Ten Commandments. Sin starts from the heart, if the inward part is healed through God, our outward actions would reflect this. He gave us two examples right from the Ten Commandments as principles to be applied to each of the Ten Commandments because He said not to break or teach others to break the least of these commandments Mat 5:19-30

So the Sabbath commandment is always spiritual without neglecting the physical. The Sabbath is about fostering our relationship with Christ, He set aside the seventh day blessed and sanctified the Sabbath from Creation Exo 20:11 to spend time with His creation as we were made in His image and likeness. He rested at Creation, not because He needed rest, He made the Sabbath for man Mark 2:27 to foster our relationship so He can bless Isa 56:2 and sanctify us Eze 20:12 because we can’t do this for ourselves, we need God Isa 66:17

So for Sabbath, I rest from all my work and labors and focus only on Him Isa 58:13 I do this through prayer Acts 16:13 and gathering with other Christians for church or holy convocation Lev 23:3 just as Jesus did Luke 4:16 and the apostles Acts 15:21 Acts 13:42 Acts 13:44 Acts 18:4 and will continue in the new heaven and new earth Isa 66:23. After church I spend most of my time in prayer and Bible study reading the Word of God Or trying to reason with other on the Scriptures Acts 17:2 . My church also finds way to help the needy on the Sabbath and we do various activities from feeding homeless to going to sing to the old people in hospitals and ministering to people in need, just as Jesus Mat 12:12 did who is our example 1 John 2:6 . I personally find a huge blessing on the Sabbath and my life changed once I started keeping it.

Remember about what feels like 100 posts ago I posted 2 verses that taught that keeping the Sabbath for the Christian is a matter of choice and no one should judge.

“Therefore, no one is to act as your judge in regard to food and drink, or in respect to a festival or a new moon, or a Sabbath day— things which are only a shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭2‬:‭16‬-‭17‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

Colossians 2:16-17 Therefore, no one is to act as your judge in regard to food and drink, or in respect to a festival or a new moon, or a Sabbath day— things which are only a shadow of what is to come; but the substance | New American Standard Bible

Therefore, no one is to act as your judge in regard to food and drink, or in respect to a festival or a new moon, or a Sabbath day— things which are only a shadow of what is to come; but the substance

bible.com

“One person values one day over another, another values every day the same. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and the one who eats, does so with regard to the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and the one who does not eat, it is for the Lord that he does not eat, and he gives thanks to God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭14‬:‭5‬-‭6‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

Romans 14:5-6 One person values one day over another, another values every day the same. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and the one who | New American Standard Bible - NAS

One person values one day over another, another values every day the same. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and the one who

bible.com

If keeping the Sabbath makes you feel blessed then I cannot nor will I judge you. By the same biblical principle you should not judge those that do not keep the Sabbath. My issue will always be those that try to put back on the Christian the yolk of the law.

I‘ve been around this website for a lot of years including serving as an advisor for 7 of those years. I understand the belief system of churches like yours (probably Adventist?) and the law remains prominent in more than just the Sabbath. That is the roadblock that you are going to find arguing for keeping the Sabbath here. If you keep it at just the Sabbath, without judgement, you might get a much better reception.

Be blessed

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Remember about what feels like 100 posts ago I posted 2 verses that taught that keeping the Sabbath for the Christian is a matter of choice and no one should judge.

“Therefore, no one is to act as your judge in regard to food and drink, or in respect to a festival or a new moon, or a Sabbath day— things which are only a shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭2‬:‭16‬-‭17‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

Colossians 2:16-17 Therefore, no one is to act as your judge in regard to food and drink, or in respect to a festival or a new moon, or a Sabbath day— things which are only a shadow of what is to come; but the substance | New American Standard Bible

Therefore, no one is to act as your judge in regard to food and drink, or in respect to a festival or a new moon, or a Sabbath day— things which are only a shadow of what is to come; but the substance

bible.com

“One person values one day over another, another values every day the same. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and the one who eats, does so with regard to the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and the one who does not eat, it is for the Lord that he does not eat, and he gives thanks to God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭14‬:‭5‬-‭6‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

Romans 14:5-6 One person values one day over another, another values every day the same. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and the one who | New American Standard Bible - NAS

One person values one day over another, another values every day the same. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and the one who

bible.com

These are very popular arguments against the Sabbath commandment, but is this really what Paul is teaching to disobey God and His commandments? Does it reconcile with what Jesus taught? Does it even reconcile with what Paul and the other apostles kept and taught. If looking at the deeper context its very clear to see he is not countermanding God and His Testimony. We need to remember the warning about Paul's writings 2 Peter 3:16 because getting his writings wrong, comes with some huge consequences. I am short for time and wrote about both of these verses many times, but I have some new scriptures I want to implement in my previous bible studies on these verses, so will be back soon when I have more time to respond in detail.

 

[XrxrX]

Remember about what feels like 100 posts ago I posted 2 verses that taught that keeping the Sabbath for the Christian is a matter of choice and no one should judge.

“Therefore, no one is to act as your judge in regard to food and drink, or in respect to a festival or a new moon, or a Sabbath day— things which are only a shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭2‬:‭16‬-‭17‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

Colossians 2:16-17 Therefore, no one is to act as your judge in regard to food and drink, or in respect to a festival or a new moon, or a Sabbath day— things which are only a shadow of what is to come; but the substance | New American Standard Bible

Therefore, no one is to act as your judge in regard to food and drink, or in respect to a festival or a new moon, or a Sabbath day— things which are only a shadow of what is to come; but the substance

bible.com

“One person values one day over another, another values every day the same. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and the one who eats, does so with regard to the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and the one who does not eat, it is for the Lord that he does not eat, and he gives thanks to God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭14‬:‭5‬-‭6‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

Romans 14:5-6 One person values one day over another, another values every day the same. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and the one who | New American Standard Bible - NAS

One person values one day over another, another values every day the same. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and the one who

bible.com

If keeping the Sabbath makes you feel blessed then I cannot nor will I judge you. By the same biblical principle you should not judge those that do not keep the Sabbath. My issue will always be those that try to put back on the Christian the yolk of the law.

I‘ve been around this website for a lot of years including serving as an advisor for 7 of those years. I understand the belief system of churches like yours (probably Adventist?) and the law remains prominent in more than just the Sabbath. That is the roadblock that you are going to find arguing for keeping the Sabbath here. If you keep it at just the Sabbath, without judgement, you might get a much better reception.

Be blessed

SB is going to claim that Col 2:16 is Paul telling Jewish Christians to not let Gentile Christians criticize them FOR keeping feasts/days etc not vice versa. That's their 'switch a roo'.. except Paul was clearly railing against "Jud*i*z***s" you know who, that we're not allowed to mention. So yeah, they have a whole campaign of 'alternate reality' on this issue. They aren't Adventists, they're so called "Hebrew Roots", or they'll claim "Messianic Jews", but this, although a very OLD problem, as in the Apostles themselves had to battle it, it 'new again' in that it's one of the fastest rising cults now. It's extremely insidious, because like other groups that essentially deny that they preach "another you know what" in word, in Action the logical conclusions of what they preach can only reach one conclusion... Righteousness by Works. Many of them frequent "119 Ministries" which promulgates this theology. So, just some friendly info.