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Jesus claimed He came to fulfill the Law, Did He?

Hentenza

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Sure, but not what was stated in Romans.

I addressed it yesterday



Responding to exactly what you were talking about is not "deflection"

I have addressed Galatians many times and the verse you keep quoting is out of context when applying to the Ten Commandments including the 4th commandment. The 4th commandment isn't even mentioned once in all of Galatians.

Gal 3:10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.”

The Book of the law was what was place outside/besides the ark of the covenant. The Ten Commandments was placed inside.

What Moses wrote

Deut 31:24 So it was, when Moses had completed writing the words of this law in a book, when they were finished, 25 that Moses commanded the Levites, who bore the ark of the covenant of the Lord, saying: 26 “Take this Book of the Law, and put it beside the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there as a witness against you;

The Ten Commandments is what God wrote- His covenant, His commandments, not Moses.

Until one understands the differences in these laws, chances are they will continue to both be quoted out of context.
That’s it? Just Galatians 3:10? Addressing verses in isolation again? Me thinks you fudging lol.

I did an analysis of Gal. 3 in my post 719 that you ran away from. Why don’t you address that.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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That’s it? Just Galatians 3:10? Addressing verses in isolation again? Me thinks you fudging lol.

I did an analysis of Gal. 3 in my post 719 that you ran away from. Why don’t you address that.
I was putting the context around what law Paul is speaking about, as he stated clearly stated. If we start with a faulty premise it ends with a faulty conclusion. So until you address the law Paul was referring to the conclusion is going to be wrong. I do not address posts that start off with a faulty premises. There is no point.

Paul never said the Ten Commandments ended. You used Gal 3 to try to compare it to 2 Cor 3 and its different laws with different context.

The conclusion to what Paul says has never been going away from the law of God and sinning in any of his letters. He is hard to understand why we have this warning about his writings 2 Peter 3:16 so need to do a lot of prayerful study and compare Scripture with Scripture.

For example:

Gal 5:16 I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. (sin) 17 For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another, so that you do not do the things that you wish. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.

And we can see clearly that "under the law" doesn't mean not keeping God's law,

19 Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, 21 envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

No wonder why Paul taught keeping the commandments of God is what matters 1 Cor 7:19, not that they ended.
 
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Hentenza

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I was putting the context around what Paul is speaking as he stated clearly, which you didn't. If we start with a faulty premise it ends with a faulty conclusion. So until you address the law Paul was referring to the conclusion is going to be wrong. I do not address posts that start off with a faulty premises. There is no point.
Show me how I started with a faulty premise. You can’t shift the goal posts to help your case. If you don’t want to address it I understand. Most people that preach the law want to cut Gal. 3 out of the bible. You are not the first person I’ve debated about this and am sure you won’t be the last.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Show me how I started with a faulty premise. You can’t shift the goal posts to help your case. If you don’t want to address it I understand. Most people that preach the law want to cut Gal. 3 out of the bible. You are not the first person I’ve debated about this and am sure you won’t be the last.
You compared it to 2 Cor 3:3 which is about the Ten Commandments and then used Gal 3 which is about the book of the law which is what Moses wrote in a book that was placed outside the ark of the covenant, not the Ten Commandments that God wrote not in a book but written on stone by the finger of God Exo 31:18 for its eternal nature. So it started off comparing a different law to the Ten Commandments. These are different laws that serve different purposes. Unless we understand these different laws and their purposes which the Bible reveals, Paul can be tough to understand because he will often just use the word law, but the context and understanding that the law that is holy just and good and perfect for converting the soul never turns into the law that was contrary and against.
 
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Hentenza

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I was putting the context around what law Paul is speaking about, as he stated clearly stated. If we start with a faulty premise it ends with a faulty conclusion. So until you address the law Paul was referring to the conclusion is going to be wrong. I do not address posts that start off with a faulty premises. There is no point.

Paul never said the Ten Commandments ended. You used Gal 3 to try to compare it to 2 Cor 3 and its different laws with different context.

The conclusion to what Paul says has never been going away from the law of God and sinning in any of his letters. He is hard to understand why we have this warning about his writings 2 Peter 3:16 so need to do a lot of prayerful study and compare Scripture with Scripture.

For example:

Gal 5:16 I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. (sin) 17 For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another, so that you do not do the things that you wish. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.

And we can see clearly that "under the law" doesn't mean not keeping God's law,

19 Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, 21 envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

No wonder why Paul taught keeping the commandments of God is what matters 1 Cor 7:19, not that they ended.
Since you argue different sets of laws let’s concentrate of the Sabbath laws since you advocate so much for it. Is the Christian required to keep the Sabbath laws written in the law of Moses? Here is a Jewish primer.

Shabbat Basic Rules​

Following is a brief summary of some of the Shabbat laws you are most likely to encounter.

Let's start with some basic activities from which we refrain on Shabbat:

  • writing, erasing, and tearing;
  • business transactions;
  • driving or riding in cars or other vehicles;
  • shopping;
  • using the telephone;
  • turning on or off anything which uses electricity, including lights, radios, television, computer, air-conditioners and alarm clocks;
  • cooking, baking or kindling a fire;
  • gardening and grass-mowing;
  • doing laundry;

Are Christians mandated to follow these laws?
 
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Hentenza

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You compared it to 2 Cor 3:3 which is about the Ten Commandments and then used Gal 3 which is about the book of the law which is what Moses wrote in a book that was placed outside the ark of the covenant, not the Ten Commandments that God wrote not in a book but written on stone by the finger of God Exo 31:18 for its eternal nature. So it started off comparing a different law to the Ten Commandments.
But the Book of Laws outside of the Ark defined and expanded the 10 commandments Inside of the Ark. So if we are required to follow one then we are required to follow the other. Is that not right?
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Since you argue different sets of laws let’s concentrate of the Sabbath laws since you advocate so much for it. Is the Christian required to keep the Sabbath laws written in the law of Moses? Here is a Jewish primer.

Shabbat Basic Rules​

Following is a brief summary of some of the Shabbat laws you are most likely to encounter.

Let's start with some basic activities from which we refrain on Shabbat:

  • writing, erasing, and tearing;
  • business transactions;
  • driving or riding in cars or other vehicles;
  • shopping;
  • using the telephone;
  • turning on or off anything which uses electricity, including lights, radios, television, computer, air-conditioners and alarm clocks;
  • cooking, baking or kindling a fire;
  • gardening and grass-mowing;
  • doing laundry;

Are Christians mandated to follow these laws?
You again are starting the argument on a faulty premise.

The weekly Sabbath is not the law of Moses according to God. It is part of God's commandments Deut 4:13 Exo 34:28 Exo 20:6 , His covenant Deut 4:13 , His Testimony Exo 31:18 not Moses written by the finger of God

The yearly sabbath(s) feast ordinances and 7 years sabbaths are the law of Moses and came after the fall and what was written in a book and placed outside/besides the ark of the covenant. Deut 31:24-26

You than go outside the Bible to bring in man-made laws much like the Pharisees did, to compare it to one of God's commandments.

Thanks, but no thanks.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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But the Book of Laws outside of the Ark defined and expanded the 10 commandments Inside of the Ark. So if we are required to follow one then we are required to follow the other. Is that not right?
One law defines what is sin 1 John 3:4 Rom 7:7 James 2:11-12 the other contained the OT prescription of what do when one sins until the Seed.
 
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Hentenza

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You again are starting the argument on a faulty premise.

The weekly Sabbath is not the law of Moses according to God. It is part of God's commandments, His covenant, His Testimony not Moses written by the finger of God

The yearly sabbath(s) feast ordinances and 7 years Sabbaths are the law of Moses and what was written in a book and placed outside/besides the ark of the covenant.

You than go outside the Bible to bring in man-made laws much like the Pharisees did, to compare it to one of God's commandments.

No thanks.
All of the rules from the article that I posted is how Jewish people, which are still under the law, interpret the first five books of the Bible. It’s scriptural. You advocate for the Sabbath commandment so then you have to follow the Sabbath laws listed in Exodus and Deuteronomy which are part of the law of Moses. Is that not true?
 
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SabbathBlessings

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All of the rules from the article that I posted is how Jewish people, which are still under the law, interpret the first five books of the Bible. It’s scriptural. You advocate for the Sabbath commandment so then you have to follow the Sabbath laws listed in Exodus and Deuteronomy which are part of the law of Moses. Is that not true?
The Jews and Pharisees added to God's commandments, why Jesus was constantly correcting them on how to keep the Sabbath. They were keeping their sabbath, not God's.

God separated the Ten Commandments from all other laws and claimed the unit of Ten that God numbered by design as His, not Moses. Deut 4:13 Exo 31:18 Exo 20:6 The Ten Commandments was part of the law of Moses as all of God's people keep God's commandments Rev 14:12
 
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Hentenza

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One law defines what is sin 1 John 3:4 Rom 7:7 James 2:11-12 the other contained the OT prescription of what do when one sins until the Seed.
And none of the verses you cited talk about the Sabbath and the laws that YOU need to keep in order to properly follow the 4th commandment. Do you not need to keep the law regarding proper Sabbath keeping listed in the law of Moses?
 
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SabbathBlessings

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And none of the verses you cited talk about the Sabbath and the laws that YOU need to keep in order to properly follow the 4th commandment. Do you not need to keep the law regarding proper Sabbath keeping listed in the law of Moses?
They were all quoting from the Ten Commandments. The Sabbath is part of the Ten Commandments, they came in a unit of Ten Deut 4:13 Exo 34:28, not 9 or 216 according to God. Breaking the Sabbath commandment is no different than worshipping another god or murdering our brethren James 2:11-12 its all sin coming from the same Testimony of God written by the God of the Universe, that sits under His mercy seat as the earthy temple was just a miniature of God's heavenly Temple Heb 8:1-5 where we see His ark of the covenant Rev 11:18-19 which holds the Ten Commandments Exo 40:20 revealed at the last trumpet before the Second Coming of Jesus Christ as it will be the standard all man will be Judged by regardless is we accept it or not. James 2:11-12 Mat 5:19-30 Ecc 12:13-14 Rev 22:14-15
 
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Hentenza

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The Jews and Pharisees added to God's commandments, why Jesus was constantly correcting them on how to keep the Sabbath. They were keeping their sabbath, not God's.

God separated the Ten Commandments from all other laws and claimed hem as His, not Moses. Deut 4:13 Exo 31:18 Exo 20:6 The Ten Commandments was part of the law of Moses as all of God's people keep God's commandments Rev 14:12
The Jews and Pharisees added to God's commandments, why Jesus was constantly correcting them on how to keep the Sabbath. They were keeping their sabbath, not God's.

God separated the Ten Commandments from all other laws and claimed the unit of Ten that God numbered by design as His, not Moses. Deut 4:13 Exo 31:18 Exo 20:6 The Ten Commandments was part of the law of Moses as all of God's people keep God's commandments Rev 14:12
Wait, now it’s sabbath keeping according to you? You do know that Deuteronomy and Exodus that give you instruction of how to keep the Sabbath are books outside of the Ark, right? Do you not follow these?
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Wait, now it’s sabbath keeping according to you? You do know that Deuteronomy and Exodus that give you instruction of how to keep the Sabbath are books outside of the Ark, right? Do you not follow these?
What you quoted was not from Scripture. God gave us more examples/instructions on how to keep the Sabbath day holy, outside the Ten Commandments just as He did with the other commandments and it didn't include the list you found from the Internet.

The Sabbath didn't start at Mt Sinai, it started at Creation according to God Exo 20:11 when God made everything according to His perfect plan.
 
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Hentenza

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They were all quoting from the Ten Commandments. The Sabbath is part of the Ten Commandments, they came in a unit of Ten Deut 4:13 Exo 34:28, not 9 or 216 according to God. Breaking the Sabbath commandment is no different than worshipping another god or murdering our brethren James 2:11-12 its all sin coming from the same Testimony of God written by the God of the Universe, that sits under His mercy seat as the earthy temple was just a miniature of God's heavenly Temple Heb 8:1-5 where we see His ark of the covenant Rev 11:18-19 which holds the Ten Commandments Exo 40:20 revealed at the last trumpet before the Second Coming of Jesus Christ as it will be the standard all man will be Judged by regardless is we accept it or not. James 2:11-12 Mat 5:19-30 Ecc 12:13-14 Rev 22:14-15
Once again, if you keep the 4th commandment then you have to keep the instructions on how to properly keep the sabbath in the book of law so we are back to keeping all of the law as Paul warns in Gal. 3.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Once again, if you keep the 4th commandment then you have to keep the instructions on how to properly keep the sabbath in the book of law so we are back to keeping all of the law as Paul warns in Gal. 3.
The book of the law contained the curses and blessing of what happens when we do not keep God's commandments. Had it not been for breaking God's law which is what defines sin, there would have been no need for the book of the law or law of Moses.

If you want to compare Galatians to the Sabbath, you would first need to find Sabbath in Galatians.
 
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Hentenza

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What you quoted was not from Scripture. God gave us more examples/instructions on how to keep the Sabbath day holy, outside the Ten Commandments just as He did with the other commandments and it didn't include the list you found from the Internet.

The Sabbath didn't start at Mt Sinai, it started at Creation according to God Exo 20:11 when God made everything according to His perfect plan.
I clearly stated that the list I posted was a primer on how Jewish people interpret the laws regarding Sabbath keeping. I needed you to see how ridiculous it can get. You continue to advocate for Sabbath keeping but make your own rules on how to properly keep it. Do you not cook from sunset to sundown on the Sabbath? Do you not make a fire? Do you not move burdens?
 
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Hentenza

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The book of the law contained the curses and blessing of what happens when we do not keep God's commandments. Had it not been for breaking God's law which is what defines sin, there would have been no need for the book of the law or law of Moses.

If you want to compare Galatians to the Sabbath, you would first need to find Sabbath in Galatians.
Sabbath is part of the law and you can find the law in Galatians. So you move the goal posts to justify your error. You only know sin by the law and not by the Spirit.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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I clearly stated that the list I posted was a primer on how Jewish people interpret the laws regarding Sabbath keeping. I needed you to see how ridiculous it can get. You continue to advocate for Sabbath keeping but make your own rules on how to properly keep it. Do you not cook from sunset to sundown on the Sabbath? Do you not make a fire? Do you not move burdens?
How do you know how I keep the Sabbath. Only God does and He knows how everyone else does as well.

There is a preparation day for the Sabbath but many of these things are taken out of context. I do not think you're really interested in understanding God's Sabbath, just the same one the pharisees kept.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Sabbath is part of the law and you can find the law in Galatians. So you move the goal posts to justify your error. You only know sin by the law and not by the Spirit.
In Galatians use it in context to the Sabbath commandment and lets see what that looks like. Paul was very clear about the law he was referring to which is the main theme of Galatians and if I had to guess, you don't know what law that is.
 
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