No person can come to Christ by their own freewill !

[Brightfame52]

In the "Parable of the Prodigal Son", Jesus could use any words He wanted to in order to best communicate life in the Kingdom and Christ used twice in the described of the condition of the prodigal son "dead", even when the father knew the son was physically alive. While the son was "dead" by Jesus' definition of "dead", the son could come to his senses on his own and repent (turn to the father). That is how it is in the Kingdom.
"dead" can have several different meanings, but the lost son in sin is very similar to many of us.

The son came to his senses after he was made alive. He was dead remember Lk 15:24

For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry.

Dont tell me you believe folk can make themselves alive again ?

 

[d taylor]

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Calvinism and its belief that a person is born again before they believe in Jesus. Is fraught with problems as there is no Biblical support for this belief.

 

[d taylor]

In the "Parable of the Prodigal Son", Jesus could use any words He wanted to in order to best communicate life in the Kingdom and Christ used twice in the described of the condition of the prodigal son "dead", even when the father knew the son was physically alive. While the son was "dead" by Jesus' definition of "dead", the son could come to his senses on his own and repent (turn to the father). That is how it is in the Kingdom.
"dead" can have several different meanings, but the lost son in sin is very similar to many of us.

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The son in the parable is already a born again child of God, just one who has left the family (God's) to peruse worldly pleasures.

 

[Brightfame52]

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Prove your belief and show in The Bible people are being regenerated before they believe in Jesus.

So actually God has John 3:16 wrong (along with other verses)

For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

So John 3:16 should actually read.
For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever is regenerated then believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

naturally being dead in sin causes enmity against God Rom 8:7

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

Until a person is regenerated they are carnal

 

[Brightfame52]

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Calvinism and its belief that a person is born again before they believe in Jesus. Is fraught with problems as there is no Biblical support for this belief.

There is no support fo you in the bible.

 

[Brightfame52]

@d taylor

Prove your belief and show in The Bible people are being regenerated before they believe in Jesus.

Wonder if its Gods will for you to believe lies ? 2 Thess 2:10-12

10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

How can someone prove truth to you then ?

 

[A New Dawn]

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The parable takes place in The Kingdom of heaven, the people there are born again children of God. It is not about unbelievers getting into heaven.

But you can bel;ieve what you want.

So if the parable takes place in the Kingdom of Heaven, and everyone there are born again children of God, then when the parable gets to the part where the king sends out his servants to kill the people who refused to come to the wedding, that means God is actually ordering the deaths of born again children of God?

 

[A New Dawn]

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Calvinism and its belief that a person is born again before they believe in Jesus. Is fraught with problems as there is no Biblical support for this belief.

NO, it isn’t. God, himself gave Jesus unbelieving persons to save, which Jesus did, not losing one. (John 6)

Paul says, in Romans, that ALL have sinned and therefore none seek for or know God.

What’s fraught with problems, because there is nothing to support the concept, is that fallen man can in any way choose to follow Jesus without first being drawn and changed by God.

 

[bling]

Good day,Bling

He will have mercy on who he has (choice) mercy.

I agree he is not arbitrary, but arbitrary does not require "equality" God does not act in a random manner.

Everything he does in necessary and serves His purpose / intentions and good pleasure and can not be thawed.



In Him,

Bill

If there is no deductible reason for God doing something, then it would be arbitrary. What is the reason for God showing mercy to some and not to all, if it is not arbitrary?
"Equal" in the one area which counts being accepting or rejecting God's Love, is what I am saying.
God has the power and Love to allow us to make mentally free will choices but can keep us from physically doing those choices if it is against His plans. His plans are never thawed by our free will choices, since they might not leave our head.

 

[A New Dawn]

What gets us all is the fact, you believe God does not treat everyone justly and fairly (and thus unlovingly to some), but gives only a few a loving desire.

Just out of curiosity, who is “us all”?

 

[concretecamper]

The few that are chosen are all those who accept the invitation, they are the chosen. God decided (chose) before the beginning of time to choose all those who accept the invitation.

Feel free to debate @d taylor about this who seems to think all invited are already on Heaven.

 

[d taylor]

So if the parable takes place in the Kingdom of Heaven, and everyone there are born again children of God, then when the parable gets to the part where the king sends out his servants to kill the people who refused to come to the wedding, that means God is actually ordering the deaths of born again children of God?

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You can read and listen to these if you like, but i have work to do and no time to spend on a computer.

The Parable of the Wedding Feast in Matthew 22:1-14 – Grace Evangelical Society
A Call to the Wedding Celebration: An Exposition of Matthew 22:1-14 – Grace Evangelical Society

 

[bling]

The son came to his senses after he was made alive. He was dead remember Lk 15:24

For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry.

Dont tell me you believe folk can make themselves alive again ?

No one went to the son in the pigsty, but after his bad decisions caused him to wind up in the pigsty he could look around, see where he got himself and starving to death in the pigsty was where he was heading. He could remember the Love his father showed and selfishly want that undeserved Love for himself.
The son could turn while in a dead state, but he could not throw a feast for himself, be made alive.

 

[Fervent]

Paul says, in Romans, that ALL have sinned and therefore none seek for or know God.

That's a quote from a Psalm that Paul is using to a pastoral end, namely to point out that the Jews aren't better off than gentiles for having been the recipients of the law. If we examine the Psalm Paul quotes, we find that that line is hyperbolic and that there are not only righteous individuals but an entire generation of the righteous.

Calvinism depends on proof texting verses like this and Isaiah 64:6 in order to maintain itself. Proper contextual understanding of the Bible renders the idea of total inability/depravity unsustainable and the house of cards tumbles when that cornerstone goes away.

 

[bling]

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The son in the parable is already a born again child of God, just one who has left the family (God's) to peruse worldly pleasures.

So you belief a saved child of God can go from being elect to being "dead?"

 

[bling]

Just out of curiosity, who is “us all”?

Those who believe in free will choices.

 

[BBAS 64]

Those who believe in free will choices.

Good day, Bling

Everybody believes in free-will and the ability of men to make choices:

Edwards covers it here:

"You may think that there is no great need to take trouble to define or describe the will, because the word ‘will’ is generally as well understood as any other words we might use to explain it. You would be right if it weren’t for the fact that scientists, philosophers, and polemical preachers have thrown the will into darkness by the things they have said about it. But that is the fact; so I think it may be of some use, and will increase my chances of being clear throughout this book, if I say a few things concerning it. Well, then: setting aside metaphysical subtleties, the will is that by which the mind chooses anything. The •faculty of the will is the power of, or source in, the mind by which it is capable of choosing; an •act of the will is an act of choosing or choice. If you think the will is better defined by saying that it is that by which the soul either chooses or refuses, I’ll settle for that; though I don’t think we need to add ‘or refuses’, for in every act of will the mind chooses one thing rather than another; it chooses something rather than the absence or non-existence of that thing. So in every act of •refusal the mind •chooses the absence of the thing refused, so that refusing is just a special case of choosing.... So that whatever names we give to the act of the will— ‘choosing’, ‘refusing’, ‘approving’, ‘disapproving’, ‘lik ing’, ‘disliking’, ‘embracing’, ‘rejecting’, ‘determining’, ‘directing’, ‘commanding’, ‘forbidding’, ‘inclining’, ‘be ing averse to’, ‘being pleased with’, ‘being displeased with’ —they all come down to choosing.... Locke says: ‘The will signifies nothing but a power or ability to prefer or choose."

The question is what is the cause that moves the will either positive or negative to a proposition.

In Him

Bill

 

[BBAS 64]

If there is no deductible reason for God doing something, then it would be arbitrary. What is the reason for God showing mercy to some and not to all, if it is not arbitrary?
"Equal" in the one area which counts being accepting or rejecting God's Love, is what I am saying.
God has the power and Love to allow us to make mentally free will choices but can keep us from physically doing those choices if it is against His plans. His plans are never thawed by our free will choices, since they might not leave our head.

Good day,

I did explain the reason you must of missed it...

He does it because he wills it to be so, it servers His purpose therefore they are not arbitrary.

He acts choosing ( verb) according to His good pleasure, it pleasing Him to do so.

chose us according to the good pleasure of his will

He has Mercy on some because it serves his purpose and it pleases him to do so.


In Him,

Bill

 

[A New Dawn]

That's a quote from a Psalm that Paul is using to a pastoral end, namely to point out that the Jews aren't better off than gentiles for having been the recipients of the law. If we examine the Psalm Paul quotes, we find that that line is hyperbolic and that there are not only righteous individuals but an entire generation of the righteous.

Calvinism depends on proof texting verses like this and Isaiah 64:6 in order to maintain itself. Proper contextual understanding of the Bible renders the idea of total inability/depravity unsustainable and the house of cards tumbles when that cornerstone goes away.

Ah. So we are to take your word for it that Paul meant that hyperbolically and therefore we can ignore it?

Can you point me in the direction of the whole generation of righteous individuals?

 

[A New Dawn]

Those who believe in free will choices.

Most all of us believe in free will choices. We just disagree with what that means. If we are slaves to sin, how can we make any choice except out of our nature? In which case, how can that choice be truly free if we only have limited options to choose from?