Should doctors be able to withold treatment for political affiliation or marital status?

[RDKirk]

Actually, the text says that right-wing extremists are more violent than left-wing extremists, but not more than Islamic extremists. From the actual research paper:

However, our analysis shows that right-wing actors are significantly more violent than left-wing actors,”

Globally, not in the US. And globally, "right wing" and "left wing" don't necessarily mean the same thing.

 

[The Barbarian]

Do conservatives really have better mental well-being than liberals?​

Do conservatives really have better mental well-being than liberals? - PMC

American conservatives tend to rate their mental health more positively than their liberal counterparts. One explanation for this finding is that conservatives may be more likely to justify existing inequalities in society, leading to a palliative ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Tropical Wilds]

Economic Left/Right: -5.5
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.46

Wait, is my husband the most liberal scorer so far?!

 

[Tropical Wilds]

After doing a thorough read our conversation has become more clear. I think we all know that conservatives and liberals think differently. I mean that is just obvious. I dont think we needed a study to show that.

But what also is different is how we interpret what we read.

For example:

We found that conservatives, compared to liberals and moderates, had greater psychological resilience and self-regulation capacity that were attributable to greater impulse control and causal reasoning. Stronger intrinsic connectivities between the orbitofrontal cortex (OFC) and precuneus and between the insula and frontal pole/OFC in conservatives were correlated with greater resilience and self-regulation capacity. These results suggest the neural underpinnings that may allow conservatives to manage the psychological stress and achieve greater life satisfaction. This study provides neuroscientific evidence for the different responses of liberals and conservatives to politically relevant social issues.”

Let's look at the fear thing that seems to be something. Fear is based upon. A perceived threat. Whether that threat is immediate or something in the future. It also needs to be tied to the other brain responses. Liberals are less likely to perceive the threat.

However liberals are also more likely to less impulse control and more likely to suffer psychological distress.

Collectively, when compared to Republican sympathizers, Democrat sympathizers showed greater psychological distress, more frequent histories of adverse life events such as interpersonal victimization experiences, fewer and less satisfying relationships, and lower perceptions of the trustworthiness of peers and intimate affiliates.”

So all this shows that we are both correct in some fashion. Conservatives are more likely to view and see negative things and threats which causes them to generate a fear response to that threat.

Liberals are more likely to ignore that and see the beauty or positive in things.

A lion is seen as a threat by conservatives. A lion is seen as a beautiful creature by liberals. A conservative is more likely to stay away from a wild buffalo and a liberal is more likely to want to pet it.

And yet liberals have a much higher issue with psychological responses. Less resilient than conservatives.

Hence the micro-agressions, the constant need to be a victim, of more mental health problems than conservatives.

To quote you,

Bottom line, we think and act differently. Thats why there are liberals and conservatives. And course the conservatives way of doing things is better than the liberals way. (Wink).

Tl;dr. More nonsense devoid of anything other than you repeating you don’t believe it because you don’t like it.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

No i just pointed out you didnt read my post because I provided examples of leftist fragility and fear. You either disnt read that or ignored it.

I didn’t ignore it. I pointed out all the right fragility and feat and need for safe spaces. You acknowledged it as true. Did you forget?

1. Why is it the left needed safe spaces?

They don’t?

2. Why is the left so concerned about tariffs?

Because we know how they don’t work.

3. Why is the left so against guns?

We’ve discussed this, I know you know the answer.

4. Why was the left so concerned over the bombing in Iran?

Because countries bombing each other is a cause for concern…?

5. Why is silence violence?

Wait… What? Do you not get how being quiet in the face of injustice or a crime is a problem…?

6. Why does the left consistently feel "unsafe?"

They don’t.

7. Why is the left so concerned with climate change?

They understand science…?

I could go on.

Look we ALL fear things. Its just that we fear different things.

At least you’re moving further away from being upset at the right being called fearful and landing at “well we all fear things.” In another few pages we will get you to say “well we are afraid but look at all the reasons why.”

And how we handle that is also part of our thinking process. Thats why liberals have more mental health issues than conservatives do.

You and the truth have a really tenuous relationship.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

Nope. Even the article on the research paper we've been discussing says they do.

lol, sure Jan.

So sorry, you cant argue with the research.

So then stop arguing with it…?

 

[RDKirk]

I'm a greater fan of the Pournelle matix. Its X-axis is "Attitude toward statism" and its Y-axis is "Attitude toward rationalism."

Forty or fifty years ago (back when I first discovered this matrix), I'd have been in the Welfare Liberals group. Today I think I've slipped a bit over toward the "Various Libertarians" group.

Notice that American Counter Culture--the "Hippies"--back then commonly associated with Communists wind up diameterically opposed to Communists. And that makes sense.

I think the Democratic Party has moved more dangerously into the upper right and the Republican Party has moved more dangerously into the lower right.

 

[Bradskii]

Forty or fifty years ago (back when I first discovered this matrix), I'd have been in the Welfare Liberals group. Today I think I've slipped a bit over toward the "Various Libertarians" group.

Back in that same time period I would have been a socialist. I think the years have seen me drift down and to the left as well.

 

[The Barbarian]

Tl;dr. More nonsense devoid of anything other than you repeating you don’t believe it because you don’t like it.

The thing is, neither of these responses are "wrong" or "right." They are adaptive in some situations, and maladaptive in others. The takeaway for me was that I have a slight tendency to be welcoming of things that are new or unknown, and therefore am prone to make errors in that way (in some cases, that would not be a good thing). A rational conservative would recognize that he was more likely to err in fearing new things that shouldn't be feared.

Part of this is conditioned, but research indicates that brain structure is a better predictor of these inclinations. Whether this is the brain affecting behavior, or environment modifying brains, is yet unclear.

 

[The Barbarian]

Globally, not in the US. And globally, "right wing" and "left wing" don't necessarily mean the same thing.

From the report:

They found nearly no difference between the likelihood of an Islamist extremist and a right-wing extremist committing an act of violence; the probability of a violent act of extremism in the United States being committed by a left-wing extremist was found to be 0.33, 0.61 by a right-wing extremist, and 0.62 by an Islamist extremist.

UMD-Led Study Shows Disparities in Violence Among Extremist Groups | CCJS l Criminology and Criminal Justice Department l University of Maryland

First-of-its-kind Look at Left, Right, and Islamist Extremists Explores Similarities, Differences New research co-led by University of Maryland CCJS Professor Gary LaFree finds that some political extremist groups are more likely to commit violent acts than others—a belief that’s been...

ccjs.umd.edu

So in the US, right wing extremists were a bit less than twice as likely to commit violence as left wing extremists, and a tiny bit less likely to commit violence than an Islamic extremist.

Now, there is an unspoken assumption here, that political violence indicates mental issues for the perpetrator. Could be that some of them are just flat out evil, and are perfectly rational. However, looking at the prominent cases, they do seem to be unhinged in various ways.

 

[RDKirk]

From the report:

They found nearly no difference between the likelihood of an Islamist extremist and a right-wing extremist committing an act of violence; the probability of a violent act of extremism in the United States being committed by a left-wing extremist was found to be 0.33, 0.61 by a right-wing extremist, and 0.62 by an Islamist extremist.

UMD-Led Study Shows Disparities in Violence Among Extremist Groups | CCJS l Criminology and Criminal Justice Department l University of Maryland

First-of-its-kind Look at Left, Right, and Islamist Extremists Explores Similarities, Differences New research co-led by University of Maryland CCJS Professor Gary LaFree finds that some political extremist groups are more likely to commit violent acts than others—a belief that’s been...

ccjs.umd.edu

So in the US, right wing extremists were a bit less than twice as likely to commit violence as left wing extremists, and a tiny bit less likely to commit violence than an Islamic extremist.

Now, there is an unspoken assumption here, that political violence indicates mental issues for the perpetrator. Could be that some of them are just flat out evil, and are perfectly rational. However, looking at the prominent cases, they do seem to be unhinged in various ways.

That's not from the report itself.

 

[RDKirk]

Part of this is conditioned, but research indicates that brain structure is a better predictor of these inclinations. Whether this is the brain affecting behavior, or environment modifying brains, is yet unclear.

At most, it's a "momentary" effect, which you've already admitted is changed by life experiences. And again, the weakness is that the politics is self-reported and only basically measured.

Am I a conservative or a liberal?

 

[RocksInMyHead]

Wait, is my husband the most liberal scorer so far?!

I have him beat. Honestly, I'm surprised I scored as liberal as I did, because I don't see myself as "far left".

Economic Left/Right: -7.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.82​

 

[bèlla]

Forty or fifty years ago (back when I first discovered this matrix), I'd have been in the Welfare Liberals group. Today I think I've slipped a bit over toward the "Various Libertarians" group.

We’re in similar company. But I agree with Rand on some things and she‘s popular with overachievers for a reason. A society of kindred spirits has its appeal.

~bella

 

[MotoToTheMax]

No i just pointed out you didnt read my post because I provided examples of leftist fragility and fear. You either disnt read that or ignored it.

1. Why is it the left needed safe spaces?

Posting this on a literal safe space for the right.

 

[RDKirk]

We’re in similar company. But I agree with Rand on some things and she‘s popular with overachievers for a reason. A society of kindred spirits has its appeal.

~bella

Rand is quite a bit further left and up for me, however.

 

[RDKirk]

Posting this on a literal safe space for the right.

How is this a safe space for the right when there are so many people here on the left stating their opinions?

I'm not sure you understand what "safe space" means.

 

[The Barbarian]

At most, it's a "momentary" effect, which you've already admitted is changed by life experiences.

Seems to be pretty stable. It's normal for both genetics and experience to affect brain function. This seems the opposite of IQ, where genetics and experience are factors, but experience has a greater effect. What we don't yet know, is whether experience changes AGC and amygdala.

And again, the weakness is that the politics is self-reported and only basically measured.

Am I a conservative or a liberal?

Don't know. Not even sure how to see myself. I don't like any of the labels, except maybe libertarian.

They found nearly no difference between the likelihood of an Islamist extremist and a right-wing extremist committing an act of violence; the probability of a violent act of extremism in the United States being committed by a left-wing extremist was found to be 0.33, 0.61 by a right-wing extremist, and 0.62 by an Islamist extremist.

That's not from the report itself.

The data are.

 

[rjs330]

I pointed out all the right fragility and feat and need for safe spaces. You acknowledged it as true. Did you forget?

No you didn't and neither did I.

They don’t?

Then why do they want them?

Because we know how they don’t work.

Why not? What's the concern?

We’ve discussed this, I know you know the answer.

I do, that's why I said the left is fearful.

Because countries bombing each other is a cause for concern…?

Why? What was the concern?

Wait… What? Do you not get how being quiet in the face of injustice or a crime is a problem…?

Why is a problem? Whats the concern?

They don’t.

Then why do they keep.saying so?

They understand science…?

Really? What does the science say is going to happen?

At least you’re moving further away from being upset at the right being called fearful and landing at “well we all fear things.” In another few pages we will get you to say “well we are afraid but look at all the reasons why.”

I was never upset over the fearful thing. I'm trying to point out the right isn't any more fearful than the left. I fact, due to the fact that the left has much more mental health problems and the fact that the right is more resilient, per the research, one could say that the things the left fears is more damaging to them. Their fear is bringing about more problems for them.

You and the truth have a really tenuous relationship.

Hey, its not my research. If you don't want to believe it I cant make you.

 

[MotoToTheMax]

How is this a safe space for the right when there are so many people here on the left stating their opinions?

I'm not sure you understand what "safe space" means.

We can't state all our opinions. At least 3 major ones come to mind. Don't worry, the right is safe from those. This place was once not safe, but an entire sub-forum section got taken down to make it safe once again.