Europe Is Now Alone (well, with US guarantees)

[wing2000]

None of these countries were honoring their NATO defense spending commitments

Not true.

How much do Nato members spend on defence?

Nato expects 23 of its 32 members to have met the target of spending 2% of GDP on defence in 2024.

www.bbc.com

 

[mark46]

Cite ONE time President Trump has stated he favors Putin over NATO and the EU.

Either that or please remove the error.

I will not repeat the many, many pro-Putin things that Trump has done or said, or that has been done by those who are close to him.

As president, Trump has the right to favor Putin over the EU and NATO. Y'all just can't have it both ways. Trump has zero interest in protecting Poland, Estonia or the rest. They came to our aid after 911. Does ANYONE think that Trump will send troops to defend Estonia? anyone? or Poland? Yes, Trump is willing to sell arms to European countries (and probably to anyone else that is willing to pay).

 

[mark46]

Not true.

How much do Nato members spend on defence?

Nato expects 23 of its 32 members to have met the target of spending 2% of GDP on defence in 2024.

www.bbc.com

Poland and Estonia now spend a higher percentage than the US. Germany will follow this year.

I expect that within a couple of years, the US will be in the middle in terms of percentage. And, of course, we all know hoe efficient our Pentagon is with their money.

 

[Laodicean60]

US-led coalition of 10 nations to counter Houthi attacks on vessels in Red Sea​

US defense secretary Lloyd Austin announces Operation Prosperity Guardian, in cooperation with UK, Bahrain, Canada, France, Italy, Netherlands, Norway, Seychelles and Spain. Source: https://www.timesofisrael.com/us-le...counter-houthi-attacks-on-vessels-in-red-sea/​

There are lots of other allies across the world but it I guess it depends on who will show up when you need it most.

I think India aslo.

 

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

The US military defends Europe --the Bundeswehr in Germany is a small force without nukes, or any kind of navy. The Baltic states depend on us entirely for defense. Only France and the UK have legitimate militaries.

None of these countries were honoring their NATO defense spending commitments

I didn't say the US would necessarily save money if we pulled out of NATO (we still have China to deal with). What I said was Europe needs to start defending itself.

If Europe became self-defense independent, they would no longer need the United States. In international relations, the world can be very pragmatic—when one country no longer relies on another, they often shift from being allies to adversaries. Are we prepared for the possibility of the second wealthiest region in the world, which contains multiple nuclear powers, becoming an adversary of the United States?

 

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

Tired of all the fear mongering from the MSM.

Makes me sick!

If you dislike something, do you blame the MSM? The Trump administration is consistently criticizing Europe, and it's not the MSM's fault that people are discussing NATO's future.

 

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

There is a democratic peace theory that really is predictive. Democracies do not fight against each other. I think the US and EU will be fine as long as democracy hold up. If democracy fails, then war to restore it might be a preferable option.

The US, EU, and other democracies are unlikely to engage in conventional warfare with each other. However, economic conflicts like those between Canada and the US can be detrimental. There are reports that some European countries hesitate to share intelligence with the US. Additionally, the US has ceased sharing intelligence with Ukraine because of President Trump's disagreements with Zelensky.

During the Iraq war, Germany was not part of the coalition, but Ramstein Air Base served as a crucial location for the United States. In fact, any US operation in the Middle East significantly involves Ramstein Air Base. If the US were to withdraw from the European theater or substantially reduce its presence in Europe, it would lose a significant strategic advantage.

Many NATO countries do not spend 2% of their GDP on defense, as has been reported frequently. However, these countries allocate significant resources to diplomacy and aid, which is considered a form of soft defense. This aid is often coordinated in a manner that benefits NATO countries. For instance, aid in Sub-Saharan Africa helps to eliminate potential terrorist organizations or piracy near the Horn of Africa, thereby maintaining economic flow through the Red Sea. As a result, Americans can focus on military hardware and hard targets.

There are no winners if NATO is weakened; both sides lose.

 

[Vambram]

I thought DOGE was "auditing" for 1 Trillion dollar in savings....seems like the DoD projects would be an easy target as opposed to firing thousands of VA employees...

Apparently, DOGE and also President Trump wants to reduce, by about 80,000 employees, the VA down to the number of employees before 2020. As a Soldier still serving in the military and an Iraqi war veteran, I really believe that is a very good idea.

 

[Vambram]

Poland and Estonia now spend a higher percentage than the US. Germany will follow this year.

I expect that within a couple of years, the US will be in the middle in terms of percentage. And, of course, we all know hoe efficient our Pentagon is with their money.

What they are doing now with their increases is attempting to play catch up while trying to improve their militaries.

 

[7thKeeper]

Many NATO countries do not spend 2% of their GDP on defense, as has been reported frequently.

And even that isn't really true anymore. The only countries of note when it comes to spenditure that are under 2% are Italy and Spain. The others on that list should also do it, but realistically them raising it above 2% isn't going to matter much.

 

[Always in His Presence]

I will not repeat the many, many pro-Putin things that Trump has done or said, or that has been done by those who are close to him.

That wasn't the question - why are you moving the goal posts? Where did the President say he favors Russia over Ukraine?

As president, Trump has the right to favor Putin over the EU and NATO. Y'all just can't have it both ways. Trump has zero interest in protecting Poland, Estonia or the rest.

Then why are there are approximately 20,000 U.S. troops stationed in Poland
1 This number has increased in response to regional security concerns, particularly following the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

and for Estonia -

Currently, there are approximately 600 U.S. troops stationed in Estonia
1 This increase is part of a broader effort to bolster NATO's eastern flank and enhance regional security.

They came to our aid after 911. Does ANYONE think that Trump will send troops to defend Estonia? anyone? or Poland?

They are already there -

 

[wing2000]

Apparently, DOGE and also President Trump wants to reduce, by about 80,000 employees, the VA down to the number of employees before 2020. As a Soldier still serving in the military and an Iraqi war veteran, I really believe that is a very good idea.

Reducing VA resources "is a very good idea"?
Explain your logic please.

 

[wing2000]

They are already there -

From 2024 under Secretary of Defense Austin:

The U.S. has some 600 troops in Estonia on a rotational basis, and Austin thanked Pevkur for supporting those troops.

"The United States remains committed to maintaining our persistent rotational force presence in the Baltics, and our rotation of U.S. forces through Estonia shows how serious we are about Estonia's defense," he said. "I'm also pleased that our troops in Estonia enjoy such a rich, multinational training environment. And our civil-military interaction teams have been working together to strengthen our people-to-people ties."

Austin Discusses NATO, Ukraine, Military Cooperation With Estonian Counterpart

Secretary of Defense Lloyd J. Austin III and Estonian Defense Minister Hanno Pevkur discussed strengthening NATO's deterrence and defense, and continued joint exercises between the two nations during

www.defense.gov

it remains to be seen if the Trump Administration will continue to support the Baltics....

 

[Always in His Presence]

it remains to be seen if the Trump Administration will continue to support the Baltics....

The troops are there - we sent them - zero has changed - the 20,000 troops are in Poland.

Animosity towards the President doesn't reflect the reality that there are boots on the ground right now. Alluding to the error that there are no troops there is not anymore viable than the 'remains to be seen' illustration.

 

[wing2000]

The troops are there - we sent them - zero has changed - the 20,000 troops are in Poland.

Animosity towards the President doesn't reflect the reality that there are boots on the ground right now. Alluding to the error that there are no troops there is not anymore viable than the 'remains to be seen' illustration.

With one tweet, that could all change.

Our allies and many in the US government are questioning if Trump will support NATO Article 5.....and for good reason. Historically, Trump has never answered that question directly.

 

[mark46]

That wasn't the question - why are you moving the goal posts? Where did the President say he favors Russia over Ukraine?

I have long ago learned to ignore what Trump says and pay attention to what he does.

 

[Always in His Presence]

I have long ago learned to ignore what Trump says and pay attention to what he does.

Yet, you have not provided anything other than a (IMHO) biased opinion and innuendo.

 

[mark46]

What they are doing now with their increases is attempting to play catch up while trying to improve their militaries.

Yes, indeed.

They NEED to play catchup because of Trump's actions. And many in the US celebrate that fact and the soon to be much stronger armies and defensive infrastructure in Poland and Germany. Poland has conscripted all their possible soldiers for the military.

The world has changed, no matter what WE think that Trump has in mind. Poland and Germany know what damage the withholding of intelligence and satellite information has caused.
========
CONCLUSION OF EUROPE
They cannot count on the US coming to the defense of NATO countries (and certainly not those countries not in NATO like the Ukraine). I am NOT saying that the US won't support European countries, just that we can't be counted on to do so.

AND JUST BTW
There is ONE country that used to count on the US much more than it ever will again. That country is Canada. Get very used to increased electricity prices.

 

[Always in His Presence]

With one tweet, that could all change.

Call me when it actually happens.

Our allies and many in the US government are questioning if Trump will support NATO Article 5.....and for good reason. Historically, Trump has never answered that question directly.

hogwash - just because the President is putting America first and requiring them to pay what they have already agreed to is not reason to believe the worst - but hey! It's Trump, so they can say whatever they want

 

[mark46]

Yet, you have not provided anything other than a (IMHO) biased opinion and innuendo.

There are thousands of statements of Trump actions and statements since 2025. We each can judge his attitudes and commitments to Putin, to the NATO and to Europe.