Average consumer now carries $6,329 in credit card debt. 'People are stretched,' expert says

[HARK!]

That section limits what states can do. It does not define what money is.

To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

Fiat currency is not money. It's an IOU.

 

[HARK!]

The argument that most of the world's gold is 5,000 years old is just ludicrous on its face

Egyptians and gold​

The first firm evidence we have of human interaction with gold occurred in ancient Egypt around 3,000 B.C. Gold played an important role in ancient Egyptian mythology and was prized by pharaohs and temple priests. It was so important, in fact, that the capstones on the Pyramids of Giza were made from solid gold.


The Egyptians also produced the first known currency exchange ratio which mandated the correct ratio of gold to silver: one piece of gold is equal to two and a half parts of silver. This is also the first recorded measurement of the lower value of silver in comparison to gold.

The History of Gold

Gold has occupied a unique social status for millennia. It has a long history as a valuable metal an...

bebusinessed.com

how on earth would prehistoric man be able to mine more gold than modern mechanized industry?

It's recorded that nuggets the size of goose eggs were laying on the surface sands of the Philippines, just a few hundred years ago; and mining is nothing new​

​

Ancient civilizations and their love of gold​

Human fascination with gold is as old as recorded history. We don’t know for sure when the first human picked up a gold nugget and thought, “Hey, this is pretty cool.” However, flakes of gold have been found in Paleolithic caves dating back as far as 40,000 B.C.

The History of Gold

Gold has occupied a unique social status for millennia. It has a long history as a valuable metal an...

bebusinessed.com

 

[HARK!]

What spiked in your chart was the price of gold, not the purchasing power of fiat currency.

I'm not talking about spikes. I'm talking about the historical average of value of fiat currency being inversely proportional to the value of gold.

Maybe representing it this way will help you:

I got a little laugh out of this one:

Gold Vs. The U.S. Dollar

Chronicles the path of the Dollar and Gold since the Dollar's closing low of March 26 2008, and makes comments about such.

www.economicgreenfield.com

You don't have to have a degree in Austrian Economics to infer that from the trends.

 

[HARK!]

I live and a house and have reliable 12 and 20 year old vehicles...that are well maintained. One does not have to buy that new crossover with the latest tech....

They do if you ever want to lay your hands on that 20 year old car. Just wait 20 years; and you'll get your hands on all the latest tech of today; if they're not all scrapped out by that time; because no one can afford a reliable car. Although the Cubans have done a pretty good job of keeping their antiques on the road.

The new car market is “crumbling” to all-time lows as drivers shun high costs and shift their attention to second-hand motors.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/why-drivers-no-longer-buying-060000705.html

 

[iluvatar5150]

To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

Fiat currency is not money. It's an IOU.

lol, again, fiat currency is no more or less money or an IOU than a gold coin. What do you do with fiat currency? You trade it for something else. What do you do with a gold coin? Unless you're going to melt it into jewelry or use it for some industrial purpose, you're going to trade it for something else.

Both are just a medium of exchange.

Egyptians and gold​

The first firm evidence we have of human interaction with gold occurred in ancient Egypt around 3,000 B.C. Gold played an important role in ancient Egyptian mythology and was prized by pharaohs and temple priests. It was so important, in fact, that the capstones on the Pyramids of Giza were made from solid gold.


The Egyptians also produced the first known currency exchange ratio which mandated the correct ratio of gold to silver: one piece of gold is equal to two and a half parts of silver. This is also the first recorded measurement of the lower value of silver in comparison to gold.

The History of Gold

Gold has occupied a unique social status for millennia. It has a long history as a valuable metal an...

bebusinessed.com

It's recorded that nuggets the size of goose eggs were laying on the surface sands of the Philippines, just a few hundred years ago; and mining is nothing new​

​

Ancient civilizations and their love of gold​

Human fascination with gold is as old as recorded history. We don’t know for sure when the first human picked up a gold nugget and thought, “Hey, this is pretty cool.” However, flakes of gold have been found in Paleolithic caves dating back as far as 40,000 B.C.

The History of Gold

Gold has occupied a unique social status for millennia. It has a long history as a valuable metal an...

bebusinessed.com

I don't know what you were trying to prove there, but the only thing in that whole piece that was even relevant to your point was this:

Mining Production: The amount of gold mined each year affects supply. Major discoveries or mining innovations can increase supply, potentially lowering prices.

...which completely undermines your claim that the world's gold supply is relatively static. It's not static at all. Production is at near-record highs.

Additionally, we don't want a static money supply, because as the population grows, there would be less money per capita, which means saved money would be worth more over time, which is deflationary. Deflationary economies are bad because they're typically recessionary.

I'd also point out that Article I, Section 8, Clause 5 that you quoted gives congress the sole authority to "regulate the value" of money, and going back to a gold standard would cede some of that control to mining firms.

I'm not talking about spikes. I'm talking about the historical average of value of fiat currency being inversely proportional to the value of gold.

Maybe representing it this way will help you:

View attachment 359610

I got a little laugh out of this one:


View attachment 359611

Gold Vs. The U.S. Dollar

Chronicles the path of the Dollar and Gold since the Dollar's closing low of March 26 2008, and makes comments about such.

www.economicgreenfield.com

and I was talking about volatility.

In your chart, the value of the dollar dropped by about 25% while over the same time frame, the value of gold increased by about 400%.

Having your currency value swing 400% in the course of 11 years would be wildly disruptive to an economy.

You don't have to have a degree in Austrian Economics to infer that from the trends.

I never argued that gold didn't go up while the dollar fell. I just don't think that's an important point when there are so many other problems with your position.

 

[HARK!]

dead in sin and trespasses. ?

I wouldn't go as far to say that it's the bondage of sin; but it it bondage.

(CLV) Pr 22:7
The rich man rules over the destitute, And the borrower is slave to the man who lends.

 

[HARK!]

lol, again, fiat currency is no more or less money or an IOU than a gold coin. What do you do with fiat currency? You trade it for something else. What do you do with a gold coin? Unless you're going to melt it into jewelry or use it for some industrial purpose, you're going to trade it for something else.

Gold has intrinsic value.

“Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value, zero.” -- Voltaire (1694-1778)

 

[HARK!]

I never argued that gold didn't go up while the dollar fell. I just don't think that's an important point when there are so many other problems with your position.

So far you have failed to elucidate them.

 

[HARK!]

Production is at near-record highs.

Nonsense.

Gold is famous for its rarity and that likely won’t change any time soon. In fact, the global demand for gold hit a decade peak in 2022 while its supply continues its nearly 7-year plateau. So gold is in high demand, but will it run out any time soon?


The Earth has a limited amount of gold in its crust and experts are estimating that it may be unsustainable to mine gold by 2050. Compared to the nearly 4,000-7,000 year history of humans mining gold, that’s barely a blink of an eye. Peak gold mining may have already been reached, though additional gold veins could push this back.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/race-world-run-gold-221413912.html

“Pieces of gold, the size of walnuts and eggs, are found by sifting the earth in the island of that king who came to our ships,” chronicled the explorer, Antonio Pigafetta, about Raja Siagu upon the Spaniards’ arrival in Butuan during the Magellan expedition. “All the dishes of that king are of gold and also some portions of his house as we were told by that king himself. He had a covering of silk on his head, and wore two large golden earrings fastened in his ears … At his side hung a dagger, the haft of which was somewhat long and all of gold, and its scabbard of carved wood. He had three spots of gold on every tooth, and his teeth appeared as if bound with gold.”


One can only imagine the awe that overcame these European explorers when they discovered such a rich and elaborate society. Even today the Philippines possesses one of the world’s largest gold deposits, and there is evidence that mining began as early as 1000 BC. By the time the Spanish conquistadors reached Philippine shores, the islands had a flourishing culture that traded in the precious metal and citizens adorned themselves in gold to display status.

Pre-Colonial Gold In The Philippines: What We Know Of Its Origins, Cultural Value, And More »

“Pieces of gold, the size of walnuts and eggs, are found by sifting the earth in the island of that king who came to our ships,” chronicled the explorer, Antonio Pigafetta, about Raja Siagu upon the Spaniards’ arrival in Butuan during the Magellan expedition. “All the dishes of that king are of...

pinoyabrod.net

The guys who are running the world's central banks aren't stupid; and they are buying up gold at record rates.

 

[HARK!]

and I was talking about volatility.

In your chart, the value of the dollar dropped by about 25% while over the same time frame, the value of gold increased by about 400%.

Having your currency value swing 400% in the course of 11 years would be wildly disruptive to an economy.

Again, gold remains a relative constant. Fiat currencies are volatile.

Regardless of what the Keynesians would prefer, BRICS is working toward a commodity backed monetary exchange.

The bankers are buying gold at record rates. 2+2=?

The dollar is done. It was inevitable. The only thing propping it up now, is that it's the cleanest shirt in the dirty laundry basket.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Gold has intrinsic value.

“Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value, zero.” -- Voltaire (1694-1778)

Gold has an intrinsic charge (+79e), its value is what ever use you have for it. I've never needed more than a gram or two for electrical contacts.

 

[iluvatar5150]

Gold has intrinsic value.

No, it doesn't. There's no such thing as "intrinsic value." It only has value because people decided it has value.

It has certain properties that make it particularly suitable to use as currency (e.g. durability, scarcity), but that doesn't mean it has any intrinsic value. Uranium is also durable and scarce, but nobody wants coins made out of it.

Again, gold remains a relative constant. Fiat currencies are volatile.

lol, wow. Whatever you say buddy. Next you're going to tell me that the sky is green.

It's amazing that this is the quality of the discourse here. I can't tell if you're trolling or if you legitimately don't understand the charts you posted.

 

[HARK!]

It has certain properties that make it particularly suitable to use as currency (e.g. durability, scarcity),

Those are factors in its' intrinsic value.

 

[HARK!]

It's amazing that this is the quality of the discourse here. I can't tell if you're trolling or if you legitimately don't understand the charts you posted.

It would seem that you don't understand the charts that I posted.

Let the reader understand that a silver dollar has more value than a $1 fiat Federal Reserve Note.

If only my father had held onto his silver money.

Maybe this will help:

"By this means government may secretly and unobserved, confiscate the wealth of the people, and not one man in a million will detect the theft." -- British Lord John Maynard Keynes (the father of 'Keynesian Economics' which our nation now endures) in his book "THE ECONOMIC CONSEQUENCES OF THE PEACE" (1920).

TLDR?

Here's the summary:

YOO BIN ROBBED!

I wouldn't take any wooden nickles.

 

[iluvatar5150]

It would seem that you don't understand the charts that I posted.

Not only did I understand them, but I explained them to you: the dollar dropped in value about 25% while gold rose in value by 400% over the same period of time. That means gold's value is significantly more volatile.

And nothing in your article about gold in Indonesia said anything about production rates today.

 

[HARK!]

Not only did I understand them, but I explained them to you: the dollar dropped in value about 25% while gold rose in value by 400% over the same period of time. That means gold's value is significantly more volatile.

Again gold remains at a relative constant; and just as fiat currency is printed with nothing to back it; so are gold stocks sold on margin with nothing to back it. Dollars are being created to play the stock market, to buy fake stocks, to prop up the dollar, to keep the whole system from crashing. When the dollar and the stock market crash; those who hold the physical commodities will hold the real wealth.

The BRICS nations understand this.

 

[wing2000]

The new car market is “crumbling” to all-time lows as drivers shun high costs and shift their attention to second-hand motors.

Good, I hope that continues. There are options without taking out a 48k loan for a new car.....

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Again gold remains at a relative constant;

Gold is a decent asset to hedge against "mild to moderately rough times".

In the case of a things really hitting the fan, gold will be almost as equally useless as paper fiat currency.

You can't eat gold, drink gold, or use gold to defend yourself if things actually turned into "Thunderdome".

In that situation, bottled water, canned food, and bullets becomes more useful lol.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Good, I hope that continues. There are options without taking out a 48k loan for a new car.....

For the majority of the consumer side, yes, people embracing the 2nd hand car market would be better.

But, that's also like saying, people embracing local credit unions and smaller banks is better than 70% of the population exclusively doing business with the mega-banks.

The challenge arises when politicians deem certain sectors/companies as "too big to fail".

Which is what happened once already with the American automotive industry.

People got fed up with the high prices of new cars in comparison to the relatively low quality and longevity, and stopped buying as many of the new cars that American car companies were making.

That negatively impacted - The Big 3 Auto makers, one of the largest unions in the country (UAW), and the big banks who finance the loans on those new cars. (all of which have some pretty deep ties to either one or both political parties)

 

[essentialsaltes]

Credit card debt is on the rise.

Americans now owe a record $1.14 trillion on their credit cards, the Federal Reserve Bank of New York reported Tuesday.

Americans' credit card debt reaches new record high: New York Federal Reserve​

Credit card balances now stand at a record-high $1.21 trillion. [as of end of 2024]