Church words - are they legit or is there problems?

[Aaron112]

so God did not give us tools. he just left us hanging? and this is a false gospel?

Related: YHVH made everything simple. Man came up with many distractions.

 

[Aaron112]

I can see this, But sadly many say they do this, yet they still have different interpretations and different gospels.. so it has to go deeper than this

Do all men everywhere trust YHVH? Are all men honest ? No, not even close.
Does YHVH ever tell a man a lie ? No! YHVH is not a man that He could lie!

So, who is wrong, if a man differs from what YHVH says ?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Related: YHVH made everything simple. Man came up with many distractions.

He also is not the author of confusion.

I think man makes things more confused by adding interpretation of words or phrases that are not found..

 

[Aaron112]

I just have to study to shew myself approved

I hope you do not mean like the Scribes and Pharisees who had the Hebrew, Greek and Aramaic Scriptures totally memorized and daily went over them ?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Do all men everywhere trust YHVH? Are all men honest ? No, not even close.
Does YHVH ever tell a man a lie ? No! YHVH is not a man that He could lie!

So, who is wrong, if a man differs from what YHVH says ?

Man is wrong.

But that does not mean man can not be corrected.. God does not need me to correct another person.. and God is not going to hold another man responsible If I follow that man and he is wrong.

I will be held accountable

 

[Aaron112]

He also is not the author of confusion.

I think man makes things more confused by adding interpretation of words or phrases that are not found..

You have read many many posts or pages or even books that certainly have not stayed to only What YHVH Declares ; as He Says: Take care what?who you listen to.....

 

[d taylor]

This makes no sense.

9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame.” 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him. 13 For “whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved.”

1. The word is Sozo - it literally means to be rescued.
2. If it was physical salvation, it would not be written in future form
3. I am already physically alive. so how could this keep me alive physically?


I think it is both. I do not think physical salvation has any part of this'

I agree, Faith in God brings eternal life. But do we not also call what good is it if I have faith. yet do not ask God for his salvation? or to apply his payment for sin on my behalf?

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This makes perfect sense, that is if a person is not stuck in the church rut, that saved always means eternal life salvation.

Because if Romans 10:9 means eternal life salvation then the condition to be saved is confession and not belief.

The Gospel of John makes it very clear that the only condition God requires to receive God's free gift of Eternal Life salvation is belief in Jesus and not confessing Jesus.

Nevertheless even among the rulers many believed in Him, but because of the Pharisees they did not confess Him, lest they should be put out of the synagogue; for they loved the praise of men more than the praise of God.

 

[Aaron112]

God does not need me to correct another person.

Tangent but important: Where is the instruction to exhort (correct?) one another daily with psalms and hymns and spiritual songs ?
God may not need you nor me to correct others.
And on this forum it is rare to be able even to expose the false teachings (I've never seen it feasible let alone possible on the internet)

 

[Eternally Grateful]

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This makes perfect sense, that is if a person is not stuck in the church rut, that saved always means eternal life salvation.

well I never stated this, nor do I know anyone who thinks this

Because if Romans 10:9 means eternal life salvation then the condition to be saved is confession and not belief.

No this is not true.

I am saved because I believe.

God gives it to me when i ask.. Confession there does not mean confess like many think it is (I am not confessing my sins) I am confessing his truth based on my faith

The Gospel of John makes it very clear that the only condition God requires to receive God's free gift of Eternal Life salvation is belief in Jesus and not confessing Jesus.

your talking semantics here.

If I do not confess in my heart the gospel. and ask him to apply the gospel to my life. I have not yet done what is required of me.

Nevertheless even among the rulers many believed in Him, but because of the Pharisees they did not confess Him, lest they should be put out of the synagogue; for they loved the praise of men more than the praise of God.

I am not saying we need to confess him to men.

I mean we confess HIM..

I can do this in my mind.. I did it when I called out to him as the tax collector to show mercy on me, and apply his death to my life.

 

[Aaron112]

I am not saying we need to confess him to men.

Jesus says it is required , otherwise He will deny us before His Father.

I am saved because I believe.

Dangerous.
Even the demons believe, and are terrified !

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Tangent but important: Where is the instruction to exhort (correct?) one another daily with psalms and hymns and spiritual songs ?
God may not need you nor me to correct others.
And on this forum it is rare to be able even to expose the false teachings (I've never seen it feasible let alone possible on the internet)

exhort means to encourage, to comfort. not to correct, in col 3. the word is admonish, and it means to instruct.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Jesus says it is required , otherwise He will deny us before His Father.

No person who has faith in him would deny him

Peter denied him 3 times. god did not deny him..

Dangerous.
Even the demons believe, and are terrified !

Demons do not trust in God. nor have the repented.

 

[d taylor]

well I never stated this, nor do I know anyone who thinks this

No this is not true.

I am saved because I believe.

God gives it to me when i ask.. Confession there does not mean confess like many think it is (I am not confessing my sins) I am confessing his truth based on my faith

your talking semantics here.

If I do not confess in my heart the gospel. and ask him to apply the gospel to my life. I have not yet done what is required of me.



I am not saying we need to confess him to men.

I mean we confess HIM..

I can do this in my mind.. I did it when I called out to him as the tax collector to show mercy on me, and apply his death to my life.

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There you playing games, trying to make the word confession mean belief.

 

[timothyu]

1. Grace
2. Eternal Life
3. Church
4. Saved or rescued.

One poster gave church speak definitions, church long thriving and surviving on skimming the surface. In plain speech as an alternative...

Grace: With no expectation of gain or reason to bow to expectations. eg. God opened the door to the Kingdom, a way past the previous barrier of death. Our expectations or attempts to find a way past served no purpose. It was simply a gift, not a compromise with our will.

Eternal Life: Awareness or part of an eternal consciousness eg. the 'life' (personal awareness) expected in the new Kingdom regardless of form.

Church: Jesus made it clear at the Gates of hell that His 'church' (a word unknown in His time) would be His movement based only upon the truth from the Father, not a government nor an institution, not ritual or tradition. Those latter are human concepts. Truth from the Father is only Kingdom related with no concepts of mankind involved.

Saved or rescued: Not a get out of jail free card. Beyond this realm - Previous to Jesus, death was the end all. We were saved/rescued from this finality by the Kingdom, previously unavailable. Within this realm - We are prisoners in a world built upon the notion of self, the cause of all sin we experience here. Understanding of God's will being better than our own selfish will is the beginning of repentance and showing a willingness to reject this world in favour of the Kingdom and God's absolute rule. We are saved/rescued if we are willing to change, from the traditional ways of adversarial mankind which only lead to death.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

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There you playing games, trying to make the word confession mean belief.

No, I never made any such statement,

This is another problem I see, Making it appear as if others said something they did not say

 

[2PhiloVoid]

I disagree in the context of eternal life

The words literally mean to live forever.

I do not need some philosophy or linguistics to tell me the words mean I will live forever.

and anything I say concerning those words which means that I can die (not live forever) would mean in context. i do not have that eternal life.




but does the word not tell us what it is not?

which is my point. Grace is a word. Paul said anything relieved as a reward or wage is not of grace. but of works.

so we know right off. grace can not be earned by doing something

so any concept that grace is a channel or something earned by doing some work of merit should be done away with.. Because the only way to make it be correct. is to make grace a "church word" which has no meaning..of its own. we can make up whatever meaning we want.


but what do the words mean.


I can make any word mean whatever I want it to. Many peop0le use hermeneutics and many hours of study. and still cane not come up with a standard meaning or agree with what is being said.

so where do we go for answers

You're not paying attention to what I've said. You've also shown that you're either inconsistent in your praxis, or perhaps contradictory in your recognition of 'HOW' any of us determine the meaning of a biblical word/term.

Go back to my first few posts wherein a gave some hints on 'HOW' we can begin to understand the possibly intended meaning of a biblical word.

Thanks.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I hope you do not mean like the Scribes and Pharisees who had the Hebrew, Greek and Aramaic Scriptures totally memorized and daily went over them ?

Were they approved, rightly dividing the word of truth?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

You have read many many posts or pages or even books that certainly have not stayed to only What YHVH Declares ; as He Says: Take care what?who you listen to.....

I trust no one, I test everyone, if they say something I have not heard before. i study to see if it is founded..

I used to be Old earth. I went to a creation museum, heard some things I never heard before. And put them to the test. And changed my view.

 

[d taylor]

No, I never made any such statement,

This is another problem I see, Making it appear as if others said something they did not say

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Here is your proof you stated - If I do not confess in my heart the gospel and here also I am confessing his truth based on my faith

The word believe can go there in your sentence exactly where confess is. So you are equating confession with belief.

But that is not what Romans 10:9 states (a confessing in the heart) the verse states to confess with the mouth.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Man is wrong.

But that does not mean man can not be corrected.. God does not need me to correct another person.. and God is not going to hold another man responsible If I follow that man and he is wrong.

I will be held accountable

That’s true, he holds both the teacher and the follower accountable, so we need to be careful what we teach and who we listen to.

Mat 15:3 He answered and said to them, “Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, saying, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 5 But you say, ‘Whoever says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is a gift to God”— 6 then he need not honor his father [a]or mother.’ Thus you have made the [b]commandment of God of no effect by your tradition. 7 Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you, saying:

8 ‘These people [c]draw near to Me with their mouth,
And honor Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
9 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’ ”
10 When He had called the multitude to Himself, He said to them, “Hear and understand: 11 Not what goes into the mouth defiles a man; but what comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man.”

12 Then His disciples came and said to Him, “Do You know that the Pharisees were offended when they heard this saying?”

13 But He answered and said, “Every plant which My heavenly Father has not planted will be uprooted. 14 Let them alone. They are blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind leads the blind, both will fall into a ditch.”