Another jesus. Another gospel.

[Icyspark]

Jews were under the law after Moses, it was only given to them not the Gentiles. Abraham was found righteous by faith, he was not given the law. Jews can be released from tbe bondsge of the law under the New Covenant through Jesus Christ of Nazareth. It is a choice by repentance, changing one's mind, that one can receive His Holy Spirit which is the Key to salvation.

Hi Maria Billingsley,

So Jews who were followers of Christ were no longer under the law even though Jesus hadn't yet died and the new covenant wasn't yet implemented?

What do you mean by "bondage of the law"? Most ppl believe that certain aspects of the law came to an end, but that there are now 1040 rules to obey in the new covenant. How is this set of new rules substantively less burdensome than the previous group (which contained over 400 less rules)?

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Hi Maria Billingsley,

So Jews who were followers of Christ were no longer under the law even though Jesus hadn't yet died and the new covenant wasn't yet implemented?

What do you mean by "bondage of the law"? Most ppl believe that certain aspects of the law came to an end, but that there are now 1040 rules to obey in the new covenant. How is this set of new rules substantively less burdensome than the previous group (which contained over 400 less rules)?

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

Before we continue, may I ask your denomination? Understanding where your viewpoint is comming from is important. I have no denominational affiliation including non- denomination.
Thanks for clarifying.

 

[HARK!]

MOD HAT ON

MOD HAT OFF​

 

[Cornelius8L]

Paul said:

Gal 5:2-4 "Take notice: I, Paul, tell you that if you let yourselves be circumcised, Christ will be of no value to you at all. Again I testify to every man who gets himself circumcised that he is obligated to obey the whole law. You who are trying to be justified by the law have been severed from Christ; you have fallen away from grace."​

Is circumcision from the law? Or, is Galatians excluded from the scripture?

 

[Neogaia777]

One of the most astounding and annoying positions held by many of the anti-Sabbatarians I've talked to is that Jesus broke the Sabbath. These people present their jesus with a straight face and insist that he could transgress the law that he was born under with impunity. Their jesus, because he is god, can do as he pleases and could break the law and still be supposedly "sinless." But consider for a moment how this position—if played out to it's logical confusion—would impact on anything and everything else the Bible plainly reveals about the real Savior of the Bible. If this other jesus can break the fourth commandment, why can't he break any of the other commandments, laws, ordinances or decrees he imposed on his people? What about murder? Adultery? Theft? Worshipping other gods? Coveting? Or sexual immorality? Do you really believe in a god who says "Do as I say, don't do as I do?"

The one that I think would be the most potentiality troubling would be the command against bearing false witness. Hebrews 6:18 says that "it is impossible for God to lie," but using the rationale for allowing jesus to break the Sabbath shouldn't we also find that it is just as likely that he should also be allowed to lie? Maybe he was lying about it being impossible for him to lie? How can you trust a god who cannot abide by the rules he demands of his own creatures?

When confronted by an angry mob which was ready to kill Him, Jesus asked the rhetorical question, "Can any of you prove me guilty of sin?" The Pharisees, Sadducees and teachers of the law were constantly following Jesus looking for any reason to condemn Him. Members of the Sanhedrin were with Jesus on several occasions where they challenged Him on the question of proper Sabbath observance. If they could find Him guilty of breaking the Sabbath then they would have the legal rationale for condemning Him to death. But at His trial what do we see? Because Jesus was truly righteous, truly sinless (and not just a said sinlessness which anti-Sabbatarians attribute to Him) the Sanhedrin had to resort to producing their own false evidence.

Matthew 26:59, 60​

The chief priests and the whole Sanhedrin were looking for false evidence against Jesus so that they could put Him to death. But they did not find any, though many false witnesses came forward.​

Why look for "false evidence" and produce "many false witnesses" when the Sanhedrin had it's own members as actual witnesses of what would constitute "real" evidence worthy of their desire to impose the death penalty? But if jesus really did break the law then God's ordained representatives on this planet were directed to impose capital punishment. The Pharisees would then be the good guys for carrying out God's directives for them as shepherds of His people. Really, wouldn't noncompliance with the law be a beacon revealing any false messiah? Next!

The Jesus of the Bible is both 100% God as well as 100% man. This is the mystery of the incarnation (i.e., how God became man). But while the Bible acknowledges Jesus as being both God and man, anti-Sabbatarians routinely focus primarily on their jesus's god-ness to the near exclusion of his man-ness. This exclusionary thinking creates serious theological problems for them as they attempt to articulate their jesus. For instance, the Bible says that God doesn't get tired or weary (Isaiah 40:28). Yet while the incarnate Jesus was fully God, His human side definitely got tired and weary (John 4:6). We're also told that God doesn't get hungry (Psalm 50:12), but we also know that Jesus did get both thirsty (John 19:28) and hungry (Matthew 4:2). The Jesus of the Bible is also acknowledged as saying His Father was greater than Himself (John 14:28). In His human form Jesus also stated that only His Father knew the time of His own return to earth (Matthew 24:36), but Jesus did not know this information.

Hebrews 2:17​

For this reason He had to be made like them, fully human in every way, in order that He might become a merciful and faithful high priest in service to God, and that He might make atonement for the sins of the people.​

Was it at all possible for the human side of Jesus to succumb to temptation? Satan certainly thought so. He went at Jesus when He was humanly at His weakest and tempted Him in areas he thought He might falter. Jesus's response to the tempter was not to simply ignore the temptations, or to send the devil off to oblivion. Jesus set an example for us in His confrontation by quoting Scripture in response to each temptation (this reminds me of putting on the full armor of God and utilizing the "sword of the Spirit which is the Word of God").

Hebrews 4:15​

For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin.​

What do you think? Was Jesus tempted in all points as we are but because He didn't give in to those temptations He was really and truly "sinless"? Or, do you believe that the temptations could've all been embraced and the jesus you believe in, whom we're told "was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin," had only a said sinlessness? Is it "good news" that your jesus can and does break the laws he insists that his followers must obey? Is it "good news" that when your jesus finds out one of his creatures has broken one of his laws that he has been known to punish that individual to the full extent of the law (even though he himself cannot apparently abide by his own law)? What kind of jesus is this that you are attempting to foist on the unsuspecting? It's certainly not the One whom Paul preached.

2 Corinthians 11:4​

For if he who comes preaches another Jesus whom we have not preached, or if you receive a different spirit which you have not received, or a different gospel which you have not accepted—you may well put up with it!​

​

Galatians 1:6-9​

I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you to live in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel—which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ.But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God’s curse! As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let them be under God’s curse!​

Do you really want to be included with a group of people who are perverting who Jesus really is and His true gospel?

ALSO BY THIS AUTHOR

• Works Relation to Salvation​

• Ten Reasons I'm a Sabbatarian​

I pray this helps.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

Jesus in part came to show us that there were certain principles/values/virtues that superceded the letter of the law taken always literally and without ever making any exceptions or without ever showing any mercy, etc.

Those are the spirit of the law, or are the only true law, etc.

But if you don't discern the spirit of the law 100% truly accurately or correctly, or are just using this as an excuse to break the letter, then you will more than likely still be sinning when you do something that would be or would stand as condemned by either, etc.

But as long as you are not doing that, then you are not breaking either, etc.

God Bless.

 

[JesusFollowerForever]

He was without sin. He was above the law.

The law of LOVE is no insult. It is truth.

Think what you wish of me. We are no longer under the bondage of the law.
Thanks for sharing.

where is it written the law is bondage or that you do not have to follow the commandments, show me please.

Jesus was teaching the commandments, asked his disciples after his resurrection to do the same.

Mat 28:16 Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them.

Mat 28:17 And when they saw him, they worshipped him: but some doubted.

Mat 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

Mat 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

Mat 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

The Gospel ( repentance and the coming of the Kingdom of Heaven ) and what Jesus was teaching and did was for EVERYONE Jews first But also the rest of the world. I have proven this to you already, If someone is teaching something different from Jesus they are not from GOD.

Matthew 7:21-23: "Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." NOTE: some versions have LAWLESNESS INSTEAD OF INIQUITY!

Luke 6:46: "And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?"

John 14:15: "If ye love me, keep my commandments."

1 John 2:3-4: "And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him."

These verses from the King James Version are proof that commandments and Jesus teachings are to be obeyed and will never changes, Know that GOD does not change.

People confuse the LAW given by Moses and the Commandments, they are not the same and do not have the same purpose, I can explain the differences if you wish, just let me know.

Peace

 

[HIM]

Think what you wish of me. We are no longer under the bondage of the law.

If we are sinning we are. He that commits sin is a servant to it. And the Law was made for the sinner.

Jews were under the law after Moses, it was only given to them not the Gentiles. Abraham was found righteous by faith, he was not given the law. Jews can be released from tbe bondsge of the law under the New Covenant through Jesus Christ of Nazareth.

Because the Law, His Word is placed in the heart and mind. We are a new creature that do what we have become by our new heart through Christ.

It is a choice by repentance, changing one's mind, that one can receive His Holy Spirit which is the
Key to salvation.

The goodness of God leadeth us through His Spirit unto repentance. It is He that works in all both to WILL and do His good pleasure. As Paul said to the heathen It is certain that in Him we live, move and have our being.
And again, when He said of those since the begining of creation that the invisible things, that of righteousness and His glory are clearly seen by the things that are made so we are without excuse.
And then in relation to that he said of the gentiles, We whom Do the deeds of the Law without the outside influence of the written Word, His Law. We show the Law written in our hearts, accusing or excusing one another.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

If we are sinning we are. He that commits sin is a servant to it. And the Law was made for the sinner.

1 John 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

The law is for those who need a SAVIOR. To say we can just bypass God's law as if we can choose our own judgment, essentially making ourselves our own god, depending on our own truth and righteousness instead of God's Psa 119:172 Psa 119:151 will not put people in a good spot come Judgement Day. James 2:10-12 Pro 28:13 Rev 22:15 1John 2:4 Mat 7:23

On the other hand, scripture promises so much when we submit ourselves to God and obey Him.

The law converts our soul
Psa 19:7 The law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul;
The testimony of the Lord is sure, making wise the simple;

It brings peace
Isa 48:18 Oh, that you had heeded My commandments!
Then your peace would have been like a river,
And your righteousness like the waves of the sea.

We receive mercy
Exo 20:6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.

We know God's Truth (instead of depending on our own)
You are near, O LORD, And all Your commandments are truth.

We know God's righteousness(instead of depending on our own)
Psa 119:172 My tongue shall speak of Your word, For all Your commandments are righteousness.

He hears our prayers
Pro 28:9 One who turns away his ear from hearing the law, Even his prayer is an abomination.

Its how we know Him
1 John 2: 3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments.

It's how we love Him
John 14:15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments.

How we receive the Spirit of Truth
John 14:15 15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.

It brings Life
So He said to him, “Why do you call Me good? No one is good but One, that is, God. But if you want to enter into life, keep the commandments.”

God wrote it in our hearts and minds
Heb 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.

Its a fruit of a saved person
Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

It reconciles us
Rev 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city.

Why anyone would want to "bypass" or reject God's law is always so shocking, yet its an epidemic.

2 Thes 2:9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

13 But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth,

 

[Maria Billingsley]

where is it written the law is bondage or that you have to follow the commandments, show me please.

Jesus was teaching the commandments, asked his disciples after his resurrection to do the same.

Mat 28:16 Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them.

Mat 28:17 And when they saw him, they worshipped him: but some doubted.

Mat 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

Mat 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

Mat 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

The Gospel ( repentance and the coming of the Kingdom of Heaven ) and what Jesus was teaching and did was for EVERYONE Jews first But also the rest of the world. I have proven this to you already, If someone is teaching something different from Jesus they are not from GOD.

Matthew 7:21-23: "Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." NOTE: some versions have LAWLESNESS INSTEAD OF INIQUITY!

Luke 6:46: "And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?"

John 14:15: "If ye love me, keep my commandments."

1 John 2:3-4: "And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him."

These verses from the King James Version are proof that commandments and Jesus teachings are to be obeyed and will never changes, Know that GOD does not change.

People confuse the LAW given by Moses and the Commandments, they are not the same and do not have the same purpose, I can explain the differences if you wish, just let me know.

Peace

Galatians 5

Stand fast therefore in the liberty by which Christ has made us free, and do not be entangled again with a yoke of bondage. 2 Indeed I, Paul, say to you that if you become circumcised, Christ will profit you nothing. 3 And I testify again to every man who becomes circumcised that he is a debtor to keep the whole law. 4 You have become estranged from Christ, you who attempt to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace. 5 For we through the Spirit eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness by faith. 6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision avails anything, but faith working through love. 7 You ran well. Who hindered you from obeying the truth? 8 This persuasion does not come from Him who calls you. 9 A little leaven leavens the whole lump. 10 I have confidence in you, in the Lord, that you will have no other mind; but he who troubles you shall bear his judgment, whoever he is. 11 And I, brethren, if I still preach circumcision, why do I still suffer persecution? Then the offense of the cross has ceased. 12 I could wish that those who trouble you would even cut themselves off!

13 For you, brethren, have been called to liberty; only do not use liberty as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another. 14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this: "You shall love your neighbor as yourself." 15 But if you bite and devour one another, beware lest you be consumed by one another

16 I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. 17 For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another, so that you do not do the things that you wish. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Galatians 5

Stand fast therefore in the liberty by which Christ has made us free, and do not be entangled again with a yoke of bondage. 2 Indeed I, Paul, say to you that if you become circumcised, Christ will profit you nothing. 3 And I testify again to every man who becomes circumcised that he is a debtor to keep the whole law. 4 You have become estranged from Christ, you who attempt to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace. 5 For we through the Spirit eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness by faith. 6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision avails anything, but faith working through love. 7 You ran well. Who hindered you from obeying the truth? 8 This persuasion does not come from Him who calls you. 9 A little leaven leavens the whole lump. 10 I have confidence in you, in the Lord, that you will have no other mind; but he who troubles you shall bear his judgment, whoever he is. 11 And I, brethren, if I still preach circumcision, why do I still suffer persecution? Then the offense of the cross has ceased. 12 I could wish that those who trouble you would even cut themselves off!

13 For you, brethren, have been called to liberty; only do not use liberty as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another. 14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this: "You shall love your neighbor as yourself." 15 But if you bite and devour one another, beware lest you be consumed by one another

16 I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. 17 For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another, so that you do not do the things that you wish. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.

Paul is referring to the law of circumcision, not the Ten Commandments. They were teaching Gentiles needed to be circumcised to be saved. Paul was rebuking this teaching.

Gal 2:3 Yet not even Titus who was with me, being a Greek, was compelled to be circumcisedd. 4 And this occurred because of false brethren secretly brought in (who came in by stealth to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage), 5 to whom we did not yield submission even for an hour, that the truth of the gospel might continue with you.

Paul contrast these laws and came to this conclusion:

1 Cor 7:19 Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God is what matters.

No one is saved by the law,we are only saved by the blood of Jesus through faith, obeying Jesus and His commandments is a fruit of a saved person.

Paul does not countermand Jesus and His teachings, its why we need to be careful with his writings 2 Peter 3:16

How does someone who received God's Spirit live?

John 14:15 15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.

Compared to the Lost

Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Paul is referring to the law of circumcision, not the Ten Commandments. They were teaching one needed to be circumcised to be saved. Paul was rebuking this teaching.

Gal 2:3 Yet not even Titus who was with me, being a Greek, was compelled to be circumcisedd. 4 And this occurred because of false brethren secretly brought in (who came in by stealth to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage), 5 to whom we did not yield submission even for an hour, that the truth of the gospel might continue with you.

Paul contrast these laws and came to this conclusion:

1 Cor 7:19 Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God is what matters.

No one is saved by the law,we are only saved by the blood of Jesus through faith, obeying Jesus and His commandments is a fruit of a saved person.

Paul does not countermand Jesus and His teachings, its why we need to be careful with his writings 2 Peter 3:16

How does someone who received God's Spirit live?

John 14:15 15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.

Compared to the Lost

Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

I know that is what you have been taught. No problem. We probably should stop here as we have a chasm between our understanding. Thanks for engaging!
Be blessed.

 

[HIM]

Why anyone would want to "bypass" or reject God's law is always so shocking, yet its an epidemic.

Nice post! Thanks for the time and energy that you put into it. Happy Sabbath again!

In respect to this quote above we would add, especially considering it is a rejection of who we are now in Christ. Because through Him we now have His Word and Law in our hearts. We are a new creation in Christ Jesus. All is new and of God. We Live, move and have our being through Him. As Jesus but through Jesus. For it is He that works in us both to will and do His good pleasure.

We want to believe that we are dying rather than dead. But our God and Father states, We are dead that the body of sin be destroyed. That hence forth we do not serve sin. For he who is dead is freed from Sin. In that we live by the Faith of the son of God who gave Himself for us that righteousness of the law be fulfilled in us. Whom walk after the Spirit and not after the flesh.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I know that is what you have been taught. No problem. We probably should stop here as we have a chasm between our understanding. Thanks for engaging!
Be blessed.

It’s not what I have been taught, it’s what the clear scripture says. Plucking out a verse from Paul and never reconciling it to his other teachings or to Jesus, is not a good idea,. But we have free will.

 

[HIM]

I know that is what you have been taught. No problem. We probably should stop here as we have a chasm between our understanding. Thanks for engaging!
Be blessed.

It is our duty to show error when one professes it or any sin. After the second or third admonition then yes we should drop it. But up to that point their blood is on our hands.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

It is our duty to show error when one professes it or any sin. After the second or third admonition then yes we should drop it. But up to that point their blood is on our hands.

Thanks for sharing!

 

[Maria Billingsley]

It is our duty to show error when one professes it or any sin. After the second or third admonition then yes we should drop it. But up to that point their blood is on our hands.

Thanks for sharing!

 

[HIM]

Paul is referring to the law of circumcision, not the Ten Commandments.

Sorry friend Paul through God is referring to all the Law, including the Ten.


If the Law is in our hearts and minds and we are changed, then the written Law in the Book of the Law which has the Ten in it is not our tutor anymore bercause that which was within it is within us. This is how Galatians must be understood. Paul is clear in chapter three when he through God speaks of the Law being our schoolmaster and in that He mentions the Book of the Law OUTRIGHT in respect to this (see verse 10). And that it was only to brings us unto Christ. For we whom have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ and now therefore live by the Faith of the Son of God who gave Himself for us. Through Him the word is in our hearts and mouths. This the faith in which we preach and that we the just live by and establishes the Law that was written in the Book.

 

[HIM]

Thanks for sharing!

You thank someone for sharing something that you consider untrue and not from God? That is a sin.

And Lying is a sin also.

If you can not defend your theology through God and His Spirit that should tell you something

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Lying is a sin also.

If you can not defend your theology through God and His Spirit that should tell you something

You are harassing me. Please stop.

 

[HIM]

You are harassing me. Please stop.

Harassing you? Stop it hurts? If an untruth was shared show it.

Otherwise, Now I rejoice, not that ye were made sorry, but that ye sorrow to repentance: for ye were made sorry after a godly manner, that ye might receive damage by us in nothing.


I guess this is where you report the post and what is meant for good gets deleted or the thread gets shut down. So be it.