- Apr 5, 2007
- 144,404
- 27,056
- 56
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Reformed
- Marital Status
- Married
You have indicated that Jesus said what He said because He “saw” what Jesus would do. Is that not the case?
Upvote
0
-
Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
Could Peter have done otherwise?
- Thread starter Hammster
- Start date
- Apr 5, 2007
- 144,404
- 27,056
- 56
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Reformed
- Marital Status
- Married
Upvote
0
Just because Jesus stated what choice Peter did make in Peter's future (which is not really future for God), does not mean Jesus influenced Peter's choice. Peter was in trouble already (in a sinful state), before Christ rebuked him, by telling Jesus, "No you won't...". Christ could have been much more specific and ordered Peter to stay away after Christ's arrest, but the problem is not one more sin, but repentance from Peter's sinful state, which Peter keeps arguing with Christ is virtually not the state he is in. Peter did not listen to what Christ said just prior to this prophecy and he is not listening to the prophecy. After Peter further sins (with the denial) and realizes Jesus knew what he did, than Peter repents (this is what Jesus desired for him and not just to keep from one more sin without repenting).
Upvote
0
- Apr 5, 2007
- 144,404
- 27,056
- 56
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Reformed
- Marital Status
- Married
Upvote
0
- Apr 5, 2007
- 144,404
- 27,056
- 56
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Reformed
- Marital Status
- Married
But you indicated that Jesus commented on an action that Peter had already “made”. You eliminate that Jesus had any affect on Peter’s action. In other words, you make it look like Jesus saw that Peter would deny Him apart from Jesus even saying anything.
Upvote
0
Jesus would know what He said would have no impact on Peter's free will choice to deny Him. Jesus knows what Peter's free will choice was historically, by having that knowledge from God at the end of time.
If Jesus did not want Peter to do this one sin, He could have put Peter into some drugged state or ordering him to go home after He is captured. People who are sinning and not repenting, God seems to allow to sin all the more to really spiral down a pigsty. What Jesus prophesied to Peter prior to his denying, greatly helped Peter to repent after his denying.
Upvote
0
- Apr 5, 2007
- 144,404
- 27,056
- 56
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Reformed
- Marital Status
- Married
Upvote
0
fhansen
Oldbie
- Sep 3, 2011
- 15,902
- 3,973
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Catholic
- Marital Status
- Married
Sure. Why not? Peter was going to do what Peter was going to do in that moment, caught up in his fear, determined by the amount of faith, hope, and love he had at the time, or any other virtue or grace or maturity he'd need in order to overcome his fear of man over God.
It was in recalling Jesus' words that he was broken even more over his cowardliness, that voice of TRUTH resounding in his mind while demonstrating all the more just Who Jesus is.
Last edited:
Upvote
0
Derf
Well-Known Member
- Aug 8, 2021
- 1,614
- 379
- 62
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Christian
- Marital Status
- Married
- Politics
- US-Republican
Yes, I agree, but it's a prophecy, which we recognize God's superior understanding of, wait for it, the truth of the future, not just the truth of the present. So what you're saying is that the future changed, and God's knowledge of the future changed along with it.
Upvote
0
- Apr 5, 2007
- 144,404
- 27,056
- 56
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Reformed
- Marital Status
- Married
Upvote
0
- Apr 5, 2007
- 144,404
- 27,056
- 56
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Reformed
- Marital Status
- Married
Upvote
0
- Apr 5, 2007
- 144,404
- 27,056
- 56
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Reformed
- Marital Status
- Married
Upvote
0
Keep the context in your understanding:
When did Peter start sinning and when did Peter repent?
Matthew 16: 22 Peter took him aside and began to rebuke him. “Never, Lord!” he said. “This shall never happen to you!”
23Jesus turned and said to Peter, “Get behind me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to me; you do not have in mind the concerns of God, but merely human concerns.”
Jesus hits Peter in the middle of his sinning spree, with a prophesy.
What should Peter have done right then? How about fall on his face, repent and ask for forgiveness?
Look what follows: Peter is ordered by Christ three times to stand watch yet falls asleep (which in the military is punishable by death), Peter takes one of two swords, draws the sword without being ordered to and swipes an ear off without being ordered to, which in the military are all death penalties. In the end (which has also been prophesied) Peter runs away.
All of Peter's actions show he is operating on his own (sinful) carnal wisdom and Peter has not repented, yet.
Jesus just looking at Peter after Peter denied Him three time (because of Jesus' prophesy), brings Peter to his knees.
This is pretty much standard operating procedure.
Upvote
0
Similar threads
