FBI identifies Trump rally shooter as Thomas Matthew Crooks <--- Thread is about the perpetrator, the crime, and the motivation, not Trump

[Niels]

An antisocial act of this magnitude suggests to me that the shooter was a profoundly disturbed individual. Regardless of political affiliation. The only way I could see this being a primarily political issue is if he was a professional sniper employed by a foreign government or something, and that seems unlikely.

 

[ozso]

We are about 30 minutes away from a live update...

I wonder how long I'm going to watch an empty podium before giving up.

 

[ozso]

An antisocial act of this magnitude suggests to me that the shooter was a profoundly disturbed individual. Regardless of political affiliation. The only way I could see this being a primarily political issue is if he was a professional sniper employed by a foreign government or something, and that seems unlikely.

With all of these shooters the primary factor in why they did it is they were homicidal.

 

[FenderTL5]

That's why I went with probably not the same person, rather than it's not the same person. I just can't see a 20-year-old who registered as a Republican at 18, was bullied for wearing hunting attire to school, and loved guns, as the one that would have donated to Act Blue. It's possible I guess.

He would've been 17 at the time of the donation, several months prior to registering as a Republican.

 

[ozso]

I wonder how long I'm going to watch an empty podium before giving up.

Couldn't someone at least do a puppet show in the meantime?

 

[JosephZ]

He would've been 17 at the time of the donation, several months prior to registering as a Republican.

Even more of a reason to believe it wasn't him.

 

[FenderTL5]

Even more of a reason to believe it wasn't him.

Agree.
otoh, nothing has been confirmed as of yet.

 

[rockytopva]

A little activity now around the podium. I believe this update is worth the wait...

 

[JSRG]

That's why I went with probably not the same person, rather than it's not the same person. I just can't see a 20-year-old who registered as a Republican at 18, was bullied for wearing hunting attire to school, and loved guns, as the one that would have donated to Act Blue. It's possible I guess.

Registering as a Republican or Democrat doesn't necessarily say that much about your political affiliation in Pennsylvania. As I understand it, if you want to vote in a primary, you have to be a registered member of the party in question. So I expect for a lot of people, their registration is based less on their preferred party and more about which primary they want to vote on. I've voted in primaries where I had no intention to vote for any of the candidates in that primary in the general election simply on the theory that I'd want the least bad one to win the primary so if they won the general election it would be a better person.

One possible issue with this is that the area where he lived seems to have leaned considerably Democrat, so there wouldn't be much reason to for legislative races register as a Republican in his area, because the Democrats would win the general elections (making the primaries the only ones that matter). On the other hand, it might have been done with the goal of voting in statewide primaries (governor, Senator, president).

 

[rockytopva]

A little activity now around the podium. I believe this update is worth the wait...

My goodness! What horrible coverage! Somebody needs to invest in better recording equipment!

 

[Tinker Grey]

Registering as a Republican or Democrat doesn't necessarily say that much about your political affiliation in Pennsylvania. As I understand it, if you want to vote in a primary, you have to be a registered member of the party in question. So I expect for a lot of people, their registration is based less on their preferred party and more about which primary they want to vote on. I've voted in primaries where I had no intention to vote for any of the candidates in that primary in the general election simply on the theory that I'd want the least bad one to win the primary so if they won the general election it would be a better person.

One possible issue with this is that the area where he lived seems to have leaned considerably Democrat, so there wouldn't be much reason to for legislative races register as a Republican in his area, because the Democrats would win the general elections (making the primaries the only ones that matter). On the other hand, it might have been done with the goal of voting in statewide primaries (governor, Senator, president).

Also, even if it were him, a donation he made when he was 16 hardly says anything at all about the state of mind of a 20 year old him.

 

[Brihaha]

I think we've seen more families torn apart by progressives than by Trump.

It's really not a competition friend.
Until now I reckon. This is the Trump effect on America that people keep ignoring. We are supposed to be Americans on the same team. Not arguing about the amounts of blame to cast. You either accept this behavior or you don't. Many trumpers have demonstrated this political violence is acceptable and many progressives likely have to. We can never hope to stop the unnecessary political violence if we idolize those who inspire such behavior. I don't vote for progressives or Trumps. It is counterproductive to the needs of my neighbors and me.

 

[ViaCrucis]

I already hate the conspiracy theories coming out of this, both from the left and the right. Endless speculation, lots of people seem to already be making up their mind about things they can't possibly know and acting merely on political partisan impulses.

My fear is that even if we do get all the facts eventually, lots of people will have already concocted their own narrative, and the climate right now is so toxic that something else could happen.

We need sober minds and clear heads, on all sides. What we don't need is speculation, or worse, hot-tempered people who might want to act.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[loveofourlord]

I already hate the conspiracy theories coming out of this, both from the left and the right. Endless speculation, lots of people seem to already be making up their mind about things they can't possibly know and acting merely on political partisan impulses.

My fear is that even if we do get all the facts eventually, lots of people will have already concocted their own narrative, and the climate right now is so toxic that something else could happen.

We need sober minds and clear heads, on all sides. What we don't need is speculation, or worse, hot-tempered people who might want to act.

-CryptoLutheran

happens all the time, how many mass shootings or such start almost imediatly with the narrative, that it was a muslim, or some other maligned group, but when in that case it turns out to be not, the same people yelling muslim suddenly ignore it.

 

[Niels]

With all of these shooters the primary factor in why they did it is they were homicidal.

Agreed. Homicidal. That's the word I was looking for.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

Agreed. Homicidal. That's the word I was looking for.

And likely suicidal as well.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

The shooter was spotted by local law enforcement who thought he might’ve been acting suspiciously near the event magnetometers on Saturday, according to a senior law enforcement official. They put it out over their radio to keep an eye on him- and that information was passed to Secret Service as well, according to the source.

This is obviously pure speculation, but given that there was (from the sounds of it) metal detectors, and he was acting suspiciously around them...that could lead one to believe that his original plan was to get much closer, but then had to settle for a place that was further away once he realized he wasn't going to get in the actual event with a gun.

 

[wing2000]

...from a classmate:

“A quiet kid” is how Sarah D’Angelo, 20, remembered the boy she saw before 7:30 a.m. almost every school day for four years at Bethel Park High School. Organized by their last names, they sat a few chairs apart. She knew him as Tom.
He would arrive on time and spend most of the 20-minute period either finishing homework or playing video games on his computer, which was given to students by the school, she recalled. They hardly talked, D’Angelo said, mostly because it was early and everyone was tired.

“He was nice to anyone he talked to,” D’Angelo said.
Crooks occasionally wore hunting and camouflage-style clothes to class, which D’Angelo said was normal for the area; her high school had a rifle club, after all. In yearbooks from her freshman, sophomore and junior years, Crooks was not pictured as a member of that club — nor any other.

D’Angelo said Crooks did not appear to have many friends, but that he also did not strike her as particularly lonely. He was good at math, “a calculus-type person,” she said.
“There were a few people that were more violent in school,” she said. “He was not one of those kids.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2024/07/14/thomas-matthew-crooks-trump-shooting-suspect/

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Maybe the shooter has seen his family torn apart by devotion to Donald Trump.

I'll see if I can find the link, but there was a CNN piece before (or perhaps it was the NY Times one) that made mention of his Dad being a registered Libertarian, and his mom being a Democrat.

So I guess it's technically "possible", but with people who are registered libertarians, they typically don't embody the same level of "Trump following" that staunch GOP conservatives do.

 

[wing2000]

I'll see if I can find the link, but there was a CNN piece before (or perhaps it was the NY Times one) that made mention of his Dad being a registered Libertarian, and his mom being a Democrat.

Mr. Grzybek (County Councilmen) briefly met the gunman’s parents last year when he was canvassing for his run. He did not recall the exact conversation, but he remembered they seemed pleasant and were open to hear his platform.
The gunman was a registered Republican, his mother was a Democrat and his father a Libertarian, a fairly typical mix for the area, Mr. Grzybek said.

“You’ve got a large spattering of different backgrounds and ideals, and definitely have a lot of mixed households in Bethel Park,” he said.

Here’s What Is Known About the Suspect Who Tried to Assassinate Trump

Authorities identified the gunman as a 20-year-old man from Bethel Park, Pa., a town about an hour’s drive from the site of the shooting.

www.nytimes.com