What Law is in or to be in our hearts?

[Grip Docility]

Sins are and remain counted against the devil

May I suggest one single fine point that seems small, but is a very important fine tuning of this point?

Spoiler

It's not "sin" that is on the devils head, but it is his "Accusations" of sin against us that are on his head. He Judges, to this day, when he should be Judging not. Because Jesus fulfilled the Law and bore it's very condemnation in His flesh, the Law no longer empowers the accuser of the brethren. I only suggest this one tweak, because to say "actual sin" rests on the devil's head equates him with "bearing our sins", when you and I know that it is Jesus who bore ALL sin. I think this is just a semantic and thought matter within your mind which understands all of this deeply and just saved a few words in typing, without specifying the difference due to your thorough understanding.

Also, I could just be misunderstanding you, to which I have no issue being corrected by you.

 

[Studyman]

Paul drew a simple line between himself and the tempter

Every statement he made for himself about doing evil and having sin, being the chief of sinners, were all statements in the present tense application, not "used to be." Romans 7, entire chapter, 2 Cor 12:7, 1 Tim 1:15, etc

Paul saw just as John did in 1 John 3:8, that sin is in fact "of the devil."

That's why sins are not counted against people. 2 Cor 5:19

Sins are and remain counted against the devil

If this is true, and biblically it is clearly not, then there would be no judgment against any man. They would simply tell God "The devil made me do it", and they would skate. While this is a seductive religious philosophy, and I can see how a person might gravitate towards it, it seems prudent to trust the Holy scriptures in matters of doctrine.

Perhaps you might consider all of the Scriptures in 2 Cor. 5, instead of only those you can use to justify a particular philosophy. This is demonstrated perfectly by your use of 2 cor. 5:19. Paul had already stated in the same letter;

9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. 10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that "he" hath done, whether it be good or bad. 11 Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

What does Paul persuade men of? Certainly not that there isn't a judgment against people "that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness," Paul said their reward is "indignation and wrath", The devil has no power unless you give it to him. Why would God reward men with eternal life who gives the devil power?

1 Cor. 6: 9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Considering all the verses in a chapter leads to a better understanding, than just picking a verse here and there to create or support religious philosophies.

1 John 3: 8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

10 In this "the children of God" are manifest, and "the children of the devil": whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

Paul said we choose who we "Yield ourselves" servants to obey. One leads to death, one leads to righteousness. We choose our own judgment.

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

then there would be no judgment against any man. They would simply tell God "The devil made me do it", and they would skate

Slight reading flaw above

2 Cor 5:19 says sins are not counted against people. You are welcome to dispute it and count, but then remember that perhaps your own will also be counted

Sins are counted against the devil, 1 John 3:8

So it's not a matter of the devil made anyone do it. The devil did it.

See how subtle that difference is? Mark 4:15 is real you know, presently, for everyone

So there is no "individual" in scriptures. There is the person and the tempter walking in the same pair of shoes.

And one of the parties is definitely judged and on the way to final execution

Of course the devil will certainly resist this message, in people

Paul's call was to turn people from the power of darkness/Satan, unto God. That call makes none of us sinless however. But we are obligated to speak truthfully. Again, something that the devil can't do, in people

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

Paul said we choose who we "Yield ourselves" servants to obey. One leads to death, one leads to righteousness. We choose our own judgment.

For such claims as above, it's only the reader skewering the sights to be one or the other only when clearly it's both.

Jesus can look any of us in the face and speak to Satan, the tempter, just as He did with Peter

Paul admittedly did evil, Romans 7:19, as a present tense "evil I do" claim

He didn't try to dodge the obvious facts of Mark 7:21-23 and echoed that claim exactly in Romans 7:7-13

 

[Studyman]

Slight reading flaw above

2 Cor 5:19 says sins are not counted against people. You are welcome to dispute it and count, but then remember that perhaps your own will also be counted

I am not disputing even one verse in the Bible. Your religious philosophy has been around since the beginning. God told Eve not to do something because if she does, she will die. Another voice in the Garden God placed her in, who also professed to know God, taught her the same as you are teaching here, "you shall surely not die", for God will not count your own sin against you. A very seductive religious philosophy no doubt, and Eve fell for it. Paul is not promoting this popular deception, your preaching notwithstanding. Let's examine what Paul is actually saying in 2 Cor. 5, that is, let's consider the whole lesson, and not just take one sentence out of the middle to promote ancient religious philosophy. We can do this together.

2 Cor. 5: 14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, "then were all dead":

Why are they dead? Is it not because they sinned? And what are the consequences of this practice, according to the God who Inspired this Book? The wages of sin is death, is this not also written in your Bible? So already the foundation of your religious philosophy "sins are not counted against people" is proven false in the same letter from Paul that you use to promote your religion, "Thou shall surely not die" because of sin.

And who was Paul's Savior? Who taught Paul? Was it not the Christ "of the bible"? And what did this Christ Command of "ALL" men? Here, let's hear His Words together. Luke 13: 3 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

So then, who is Paul speaking about in this exchange? Are these not men who "Repented" of their sins, and are now living into HIM who died for them, and "NO LONGER" living unto themselves "Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:"

15 And that he died for all, "that they" which live should not henceforth "live unto themselves", but unto him which died for them, and rose again. 16 Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more.

So what about men who call Jesus Lord, Lord but still walk as children of disobedience as they did in times past, AKA "didn't repent"? Those who Still "live unto themselves" and not unto Him who died for them? Their sin would still be counted against them, isn't Paul teaching this?

17 Therefore (Because of this) if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

(Eph. 4:22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts; 23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind; 24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God "is created in righteousness and true holiness". )

So there is a man whose past sin (All sins are past sins) are not counted against him.

18 And all things are of God, "who hath reconciled us to himself" by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation; 19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses (Past tense) unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

So when a man actually reads the exchange, they see that there are "Some" folks whose sins are not counted against them.

But what about those men who call Jesus Lord, Lord, but still "Work Iniquity"?

Matt. 7: 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Clearly these "Christian's" sins are still counted against them. Their sins are not forgiven and are their sins are not forgotten.

So my issue with the religion you have adopted and are now promoting to others, has nothing to do with me, or my opinions or even interpretations. The entire Bible speaks to "God's Wrath against the unrighteousness and ungodliness of men".

The Jesus of the bible teaches we are to "Live by" Every Word that proceeds from the mouth of God. It is HIS Words which bring question to this ancient religious philosophy of this world you are promoting, "Thou shall surely not die" because of sin.

Heb. 10: 26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for (our) sins, 27 But a "certain" fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

Luke 13: 27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.

28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out.

 

[Studyman]

For such claims as above, it's only the reader skewering the sights to be one or the other only when clearly it's both.

You shouldn't compare everyone to yourself, though "many" who call Jesus Lord, Lord do just that. You clearly don't agree with Paul in Romans 6:16-19 and, and that's fine, as Paul said, we choose whom we "Yield ourselves" servants to obey. You believe you choose both, but that is a deception. It's one or the other.

Jesus can look any of us in the face and speak to Satan, the tempter, just as He did with Peter

Yes, men should take heed of their emotions and be careful not to let them rule over us. And thankfully God chastises those who HE loves. In this way we learn obedience from the things we suffer.

Matt. 16: 21 From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised again the third day. 22 Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee. 23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men. 24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, "let him deny himself", and take up his cross, and follow me.

Personally, I am thankful for this teaching.

Paul admittedly did evil, Romans 7:19, as a present tense "evil I do" claim

If you knew God, as Paul did, you would understand his teaching to those who "know the law" that he was addressing in this letter.

Duet. 30:15 See, I (The Rock of Israel) have set before thee this day life and good, and death and evil;

19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that "I (The Rock of Israel) have set before you" life (Good) and death (Evil), blessing and cursing: therefore choose life (Good), that both thou and thy seed may live:

Rom. 7: 21 I find then a law, that, when I would do "good", "evil" is present with me.

22 For I delight in the law of God (Good) after the inward man: 23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin (Evil) which is (Also) in my members. 24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?

So what is Paul's answer to his dilemma?

25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind "I myself" serve the law of God"; but with the flesh the law of sin.

He simply followed the instruction given him by the Christ of the bible, before this Christ became a man, and HE "Yielded himself" a servant to obey God, not a servant to obey sin. In other words, he "chose Life".

He didn't try to dodge the obvious facts of Mark 7:21-23 and echoed that claim exactly in Romans 7:7-13

It is true that men love darkness, and man's practice of ignoring much of the Holy Scriptures in order to justify, preserve and promote their own adopted religion is perfect evidence of this. But because you don't seek God's truth, you miss the part about those men who do Seek Truth. Here is what the Jesus of the bible explains about them, for those interested in HIS Truth.

John 3: 19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. 20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, "lest his deeds" should be reproved.

This is why so many religious men cherry pick Scriptures in order to justify their sins. In this way they can protect their darkness, preserve it, cherish it so that are not chastised, humbled, broken, and they can live in their delusions because God gives them over to it. But there are others who truly believe in God and in the Jesus of the bible He sent for us. These men are sorry that they chose evil over good and are ready to fight against the evil in their minds, in the hope of something better. They are broken, humiliated, chastised by the Word God, but what remains is a soul worth preserving, a soul that no longer lives unto himself, but unto Him who died for him. A sould that is a New Man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness. A man who "press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus." These men consider Every Word" of God, and like Paul, they believe "ALL" that is written in the Law and Prophets.

21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds "may be made manifest", that they are wrought in God.

I hope others reading along will not be convinced as Eve was to listen to the "other voice" in the garden.

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

You shouldn't compare everyone to yourself, though "many" who call Jesus Lord, Lord do just that. You clearly don't agree with Paul in Romans 6:16-19 and, and that's fine, as Paul said, we choose whom we "Yield ourselves" servants to obey. You believe you choose both, but that is a deception. It's one or the other.

And that's why Paul claimed to be the chief of sinners using the present tense, "I am" in 1 Tim 1:15. Or why Paul openly said he did evil in Romans 7:19.

When we put the tempter on the table, as we should, we will get an entirely new picture. One of you and the other party, one of which the law is rightfully against at all times. And we as believers should be thankful for that

Unless of course you're going to fall full into the deception and state you're sinless?

 

[Gary K]

And that's why Paul claimed to be the chief of sinners using the present tense, "I am" in 1 Tim 1:15. Or why Paul openly said he did evil in Romans 7:19.

When we put the tempter on the table, as we should, we will get an entirely new picture. One of you and the other party, one of which the law is rightfully against at all times. And we as believers should be thankful for that

Unless of course you're going to fall full into the deception and state you're sinless?

We can't take one verse out of the surrounding context and understand it's true meaning.

Romans 7: 21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
Romans 8: 1 THERE is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

 

[Studyman]

And that's why Paul claimed to be the chief of sinners using the present tense, "I am" in 1 Tim 1:15. Or why Paul openly said he did evil in Romans 7:19.

As with before, when a man seeks God's truth instead of justification, he will read and consider all of the teaching, not just select certain texts that can be used to justify willful sin. Your religious philosophy concerning 1 Tim 1:15 is another perfect example of how deceptive one can be, cherry picking Scriptures.

12 And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry; 13 "Who was before" a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I "did" (Past tense) it ignorantly "in unbelief". 14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which "is in Christ Jesus". 15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world "to save sinners"; of whom I am chief.

Truly Paul was a blasphemer, persecutor and injurious in times past. And as he should, he didn't forget what kind of man he was. And who is HE to remove or forget his own sins. But now that he believes in God, and is no longer ignorant of who he was before, he put on a New Man described by him in the last post. He is no longer a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious:.

And there is no place in this chapter where Paul tells either you or I that he is still the same sinner that he was before. You must promote that he is, to justify your lifestyle. But clearly Paul wasn't justifying sin, his or anybody's, nor was he telling others that it's OK to sin.

He was telling us that God's Mercy was available even to him, a man who persecuted the Church of God, a Chief sinner. Your insistence that Paul remained a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious based in 1 Tim. 1 is foolishness.

When we put the tempter on the table, as we should, we will get an entirely new picture.

But that isn't what you are doing. You are selectively omitting Scriptures in order to promote to others the oldest deception in the world, and that is "Thou shall surely not die", because "sins are not counted against people".

One of you and the other party, one of which the law is rightfully against at all times. And we as believers should be thankful for that

God's Laws are not against me. False doctrines, lies about God, religious traditions of man, sins, blasphemies, they are against me. Your religious philosophy is against me. But God's Laws are Holy, Just and Good. They are for me, for my wellbeing.

Again, Jesus saw this philosophy coming. So HE asked the question this philosophy begs to be asked through Paul, and inspired Paul to answer it.

Rom. 7: 12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

13 Was then that which is good "made death unto me"? God forbid. (That means NO!) But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin "by the commandment" might become exceeding sinful.

God wants me to understand how evil and exceedingly wicked Sin is, so I will turn away from it. So bad that is causes death in those who walk in it. Read the Scriptures and see God's wrath against the unrighteousness and ungodliness of men. Read about Annanias and Saphira. Listen to Jesus tell you where HE will throw the "Workers of Iniquity" when HE comes back. It's a joke to "many" who call Jesus Lord, Lord. But it isn't to God, and it wasn't for Paul.

If a Law of God is against me, then I repent and change me, I don't erase God's Law from His Book. Nor do I turn away from God's Law to seek a religion who tells me I can continue to "work iniquity", and no evil will come to me.

Unless of course you're going to fall full into the deception and state you're sinless?

I'm not sinning right now. It's Pentecost, I am not working. I'm not breaking any of God's Laws at this moment. Are you? What would Paul tell you if you accused him of being perfect, AKA Sinless?

Jesus saw you coming on this matter as well, and inspired Paul to reply to you.

Phil. 3: 12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.

13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,

14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God "in Christ Jesus."

15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.

The Jesus of the Bible commanded me and Paul to "Be perfect, even as our Father in Heaven is perfect". While it is true that the devil and its helpers will tell me it's impossible to obey God, that I am deceived if I believe in this Jesus, or His Instruction. And that sin is OK because God doesn't hold sin against people.

Perhaps in times past, when I didn't believe and was ignorant of God's righteousness and His Wrath against the unrighteousness of men, I might have adopted your ancient religious philosophy.

But that man no longer exists, and I am Grateful to God for His Son who made it possible to have another chance to Glorify God "AS God, this time around.

I'm not ashamed of His Gospel. I'm thankful for it.

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

As with before, when a man seeks God's truth instead of justification, he will read and consider all of the teaching, not just select certain texts that can be used to justify willful sin. Your religious philosophy concerning 1 Tim 1:15 is another perfect example of how deceptive one can be, cherry picking Scriptures.

12 And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry; 13 "Who was before" a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I "did" (Past tense) it ignorantly "in unbelief". 14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which "is in Christ Jesus". 15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world "to save sinners"; of whom I am chief.

Truly Paul was a blasphemer, persecutor and injurious in times past. And as he should, he didn't forget what kind of man he was. And who is HE to remove or forget his own sins. But now that he believes in God, and is no longer ignorant of who he was before, he put on a New Man described by him in the last post. He is no longer a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious:.

And there is no place in this chapter where Paul tells either you or I that he is still the same sinner that he was before. You must promote that he is, to justify your lifestyle. But clearly Paul wasn't justifying sin, his or anybody's, nor was he telling others that it's OK to sin.

He was telling us that God's Mercy was available even to him, a man who persecuted the Church of God, a Chief sinner. Your insistence that Paul remained a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious based in 1 Tim. 1 is foolishness.




But that isn't what you are doing. You are selectively omitting Scriptures in order to promote to others the oldest deception in the world, and that is "Thou shall surely not die", because "sins are not counted against people".


God's Laws are not against me. False doctrines, lies about God, religious traditions of man, sins, blasphemies, they are against me. Your religious philosophy is against me. But God's Laws are Holy, Just and Good. They are for me, for my wellbeing.

Again, Jesus saw this philosophy coming. So HE asked the question this philosophy begs to be asked through Paul, and inspired Paul to answer it.

Rom. 7: 12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

13 Was then that which is good "made death unto me"? God forbid. (That means NO!) But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin "by the commandment" might become exceeding sinful.

God wants me to understand how evil and exceedingly wicked Sin is, so I will turn away from it. So bad that is causes death in those who walk in it. Read the Scriptures and see God's wrath against the unrighteousness and ungodliness of men. Read about Annanias and Saphira. Listen to Jesus tell you where HE will throw the "Workers of Iniquity" when HE comes back. It's a joke to "many" who call Jesus Lord, Lord. But it isn't to God, and it wasn't for Paul.

If a Law of God is against me, then I repent and change me, I don't erase God's Law from His Book. Nor do I turn away from God's Law to seek a religion who tells me I can continue to "work iniquity", and no evil will come to me.




I'm not sinning right now. It's Pentecost, I am not working. I'm not breaking any of God's Laws at this moment. Are you? What would Paul tell you if you accused him of being perfect, AKA Sinless?

Jesus saw you coming on this matter as well, and inspired Paul to reply to you.

Phil. 3: 12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.

13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,

14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God "in Christ Jesus."

15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.

The Jesus of the Bible commanded me and Paul to "Be perfect, even as our Father in Heaven is perfect". While it is true that the devil and its helpers will tell me it's impossible to obey God, that I am deceived if I believe in this Jesus, or His Instruction. And that sin is OK because God doesn't hold sin against people.

Perhaps in times past, when I didn't believe and was ignorant of God's righteousness and His Wrath against the unrighteousness of men, I might have adopted your ancient religious philosophy.

But that man no longer exists, and I am Grateful to God for His Son who made it possible to have another chance to Glorify God "AS God, this time around.

I'm not ashamed of His Gospel. I'm thankful for it.

IF the law is against our evil, then it's good, even though it is seemingly against us.

Paul never excused or covered up the fact that he did evil, post salvation.

Romans 7:19

For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.

Paul defined in vs. 7-13 the evil he did, which was every manner of concupiscence in his mind. The exact same statement that Jesus made about evil coming from withIN and defiling us.

This statement of fact isn't moving away or going away from anyone, lest you claim you can wipe Jesus' Words off the map of reality:

Mark 7:
21 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders,
22 Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness:
23 All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.

Does the above apply to you like it did with Paul, or not? Is Jesus not telling a fact in the above? Are you really exempt from the fact Jesus laid out in Mark 7:21-23? Never an evil thought? No, no no?

I will stick my tongue firmly in my cheek if you say no, it doesn't happen to you

 

[Gary K]

IF the law is against our evil, then it's good, even though it is seemingly against us.

Paul never excused or covered up the fact that he did evil, post salvation.

Romans 7:19

For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.

Paul defined in vs. 7-13 the evil he did, which was every manner of concupiscence in his mind. The exact same statement that Jesus made about evil coming from withIN and defiling us.

This statement of fact isn't moving away or going away from anyone, lest you claim you can wipe Jesus' Words off the map of reality:

Mark 7:
21 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders,
22 Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness:
23 All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.

Does the above apply to you like it did with Paul, or not? Is Jesus not telling a fact in the above? Are you really exempt from the fact Jesus laid out in Mark 7:21-23? Never an evil thought? No, no no?

I will stick my tongue firmly in my cheek if you say no, it doesn't happen to you

We can't take one verse out of the surrounding context and understand it's true meaning.

Romans 7: 21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
Romans 8: 1 THERE is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

We can't take one verse out of the surrounding context and understand it's true meaning.

Romans 7: 21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
Romans 8: 1 THERE is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

Paul is abundantly clear that the evil present within him (Romans 7:21) can not possibly be "legally obedient."

And he's spot on in that sight

 

[Gary K]

Paul is abundantly clear that the evil present within him (Romans 7:21) can not possibly be "legally obedient."

And he's spot on in that sight

Romans 8: 1 THERE is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

Not according to Paul. He said he was made free from the law of sin and death by the law of the Spirit of life in Jesus.

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

Romans 8: 1 THERE is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

Not according to Paul. He said he was made free from the law of sin and death by the law of the Spirit of life in Jesus.

The law also moves Satan to resist via theft, Mark 4:15, 1 Cor 15:56

Believers seldom consider or factor in the actions of the devil in relationship to the law and to sin, falsely thinking it's just them as individuals when it's not.

We are all tempted by the tempter with illegal lawless thoughts, and the law is thankfully against the devil

 

[Gary K]

The law also moves Satan to resist via theft, Mark 4:15, 1 Cor 15:56

Believers seldom consider or factor in the actions of the devil in relationship to the law and to sin, falsely thinking it's just them as individuals when it's not.

We are all tempted by the tempter with illegal lawless thoughts, and the law is thankfully against the devil

What does any of this have to do with the scripture I quoted? Don't you believe Paul?

 

[HIM]

I would ask respectfully though, that you reconsider your understanding of Paul's words here because this part of this great post, is Biblically inaccurate.

Paul was speaking in the aorist tense and used a participle when he said "according to righteousness; the (righteousness) in Law; being blameless"

In other words, He still was blameless in respect to the righteousness of the Law, that which is of the Book of the Law. Because the Aorist participle should be understood as having become or being. I would promote being. As still is.

But all this he counted as nothing and he gladly gave it all up. For he seen it as worthless in relation to the excellency of the knowledge which is of Christ. He whom was His goal. That is to be found IN Christ. Not having his own righteousness which is of the Law, but that which is through the Faith OF Christ. The Pharisee's traditions and rules never made anyone righteous.

I am guessing your issue is you don't think that Paul meant the Book of the Law when He said Law? If this is the case Please show with in the context of the passage. Or an example anywhere where it can be plainly seen that Paul used the word Law to mean any thing other than the Book of the Law or some Law from it.

 

[HIM]

Paul drew a simple line between himself and the tempter

Every statement he made for himself about doing evil and having sin, being the chief of sinners, were all statements in the present tense application, not "used to be." Romans 7, entire chapter, 2 Cor 12:7, 1 Tim 1:15, etc

He said the Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus Has made him free from the Law of sin and death. That the righteousness of the Law be fulfilled in us who walk after the Spirit and NOT after the flesh

Rom 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

What does any of this have to do with the scripture I quoted? Don't you believe Paul?

Paul doesn't have one sided teaching

When he said evil was present with him, he was deadly serious, Romans 7:21

So was Jesus when He said evil comes from within, Mark 7:21-23

Evil within has never followed the law, ever. It's not even possible

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

He said the Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus Has made him free from the Law of sin and death. That the righteousness of the Law be fulfilled in us who walk after the Spirit and NOT after the flesh

Paul also said that temptation was in his flesh, Gal 4:14. He never claimed to be sinless or free of evil present. In fact Paul claimed the exact opposite, as in "I am" the chief of sinners, 1 Tim 1:15. Not was. Not used to be.

Dominion over sin is one thing. Lying about being a sinner, claiming sinlessness only means evil present within has defeated the claimers and turned them that way

We disassociate from evil present within because it is from the tempter, not us

When we speak truthfully on this matter, we have received honesty. Evil present within isn't interested in honesty

 

[Gary K]

Paul doesn't have one sided teaching

When he said evil was present with him, he was deadly serious, Romans 7:21

So was Jesus when He said evil comes from within, Mark 7:21-23

Evil within has never followed the law, ever. It's not even possible

In other words, you don't actually believe Paul or Peter.

1Peter 1: 3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
5 And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
6 And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
7 And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
8 For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.

It seems you don't believe even the divine nature can overcome sin,