Poisoning the blood of our country

[Ana the Ist]

That's a very different subject for a separate thread.

I was responding to a similar post. Before I look and find out you didn't....did you pester that poster for writing something extremely similar yet also unrelated to the OP?

 

[KCfromNC]

I suppose that’s an attempt at humor. Keep trying you’ll get it one day

It was more a way to point out what an off topic distraction the post I was responding to was.

Perhaps nuance isn't the best approach, given the intended audience.

 

[KCfromNC]

I'm pretty sure when you paint everyone of a group e.g. right, left in such a way, then it is considered goading, or flaming.

Regardless, it is pretty telling how quickly the thread was diverted away from any serious attempts to explain the quote in the OP as anything other than pandering to a racist audience and toward "liberals bad! hulk smash!" level GOP talking points.

 

[BPPLEE]

It was more a way to point out what an off topic distraction the post I was responding to was.

Perhaps nuance isn't the best approach, given the intended audience.

Bravo

 

[AlexB23]

Here's the thing though....

Complaining about this is like the KKK showing up at your house in white robes saying they overheard you say the term "cracker" at the bar and now they're upset.

So what?

They're full blown racists.

Well, both parties have been known for racism, and both are at fault for spreading racist ideologies. During the 19th century, slave owners were more likely to align with democrats, and the Jim Crow laws were made by the democratic party. Nowadays, the racism is common in the MAGA-sphere. Racism is also prevalent in the far-right Republican party as well. Average moderates have probably had enough of both parties. So yeah, no good party here.


Democrats and slavery: The Long Shadow of Slavery: The Persistence of Slave Owners in Southern Lawmaking | The Journal of Economic History | Cambridge Core
Democrats and segregation laws: Jim Crow laws

Nationalism and racism in the MAGA-sphere article: https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/2378023121992600
Far-right Republicans and racism: It’s No Mystery Why Racists Have Fallen in Love With Trump’s Republican Party

 

[Ana the Ist]

It is a phrase used by Marxists for a long time. The end justifies the means types.

I'm familiar with the phrase....it typically gets misattributed to Lenin.

It actually refers to left wing parties of eastern bloc European nations. These nations saw Russia allied communist party candidates chasing after left wing party seats...and winning several. Not enough to enact policy....but enough to force left wing candidates to choose between working with right wing candidates or communists to enact laws. They sadly chose to side with communists who eventually pushed out all non communists from the left before taking over the country.....often by a "democratic" election where their political rivals on the right were jailed or otherwise unelectable.

The left wing liberal politicians who sided with the communists thinking they would retain a majority were the "useful idiots". It's only a matter of time before the communists controlled the party.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Well, both parties have been known for racism, and both are at fault for spreading racist ideologies. During the 19th century, slave owners were more likely to align with democrats, and the Jim Crow laws were made by the democratic party.

I tend to agree with the view that a large scale party switch in positions took place during the civil rights era....as most Democrat voters/supporters contend.

I'm simply contending another such shift has taken place....at least in regards to "identity" issues. All the things that Democrats used to believe were good things like "colorblindness" and things that were bad like "tokenism"....are now positions that the political right largely holds.

To counter this...the Democrats have adopted Jim Crow era views on race known as "race essentialism" and rejected colorblindness...while adopting tokenism but rebranding it as "representation".

That last one is why most new media stinks. It's why Disney is tanking. Gay/lesbian female minoritiesare inserted into movies for no reason....or worse, their whole identity revolves around being a gay/lesbian female minority....which is boring because it lacks conflict or meaning.

Nowadays, the racism is common in the MAGA-sphere.

How so?

I would agree that Trump has said a few questionable things...a few likely racist things. He even met with a white supremacist.

So did Justin Trudeau....he honored an actual former nazi lol.

I think in those cases, it was an accident...a mistake of not properly vetting someone. I don't think either are actually racist.

I'm curious why you think the modern right is racist?

Racism is also prevalent in the far-right Republican party as well.

Sure...if we're talking about actual neo-nazis and white supremacists...absolutely. Their numbers are small though, and they weild no real political influence.

Average moderates have probably had enough of both parties. So yeah, no good party here.

It's the hypocrisy of claiming to be concerned about racism while actively supporting a racist agenda.

Democrats and slavery: The Long Shadow of Slavery: The Persistence of Slave Owners in Southern Lawmaking | The Journal of Economic History | Cambridge Core
Democrats and segregation laws: Jim Crow laws

Nationalism and racism in the MAGA-sphere article: https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/2378023121992600
Far-right Republicans and racism: It’s No Mystery Why Racists Have Fallen in Love With Trump’s Republican Party

I don't think Trump is some dangerous racist.

 

[AlexB23]

I tend to agree with the view that a large scale party switch in positions took place during the civil rights era....as most Democrat voters/supporters contend.

I'm simply contending another such shift has taken place....at least in regards to "identity" issues. All the things that Democrats used to believe were good things like "colorblindness" and things that were bad like "tokenism"....are now positions that the political right largely holds.

To counter this...the Democrats have adopted Jim Crow era views on race known as "race essentialism" and rejected colorblindness...while adopting tokenism but rebranding it as "representation".

That last one is why most new media stinks. It's why Disney is tanking. Gay/lesbian female minoritiesare inserted into movies for no reason....or worse, their whole identity revolves around being a gay/lesbian female minority....which is boring because it lacks conflict or meaning.






How so?

I would agree that Trump has said a few questionable things...a few likely racist things. He even met with a white supremacist.

So did Justin Trudeau....he honored an actual former nazi lol.

I think in those cases, it was an accident...a mistake of not properly vetting someone. I don't think either are actually racist.

I'm curious why you think the modern right is racist?





Sure...if we're talking about actual neo-nazis and white supremacists...absolutely. Their numbers are small though, and they weild no real political influence.





It's the hypocrisy of claiming to be concerned about racism while actively supporting a racist agenda.





I don't think Trump is some dangerous racist.

We will have to see what November 2024 brings. That's all I am saying. If the US becomes a fascist dictatorship under MAGA or not, or becomes an Orwellian nation under the far-left where a person can not even say "hey guys" as a greeting without being labelled a sexist, who knows. All I know is that democracy will eventually crumble under the two party system, with one party taking away the freedoms of the other or vice versa. All empires and countries fall, including our own in the USA, so we should probably just not focus on this superficial politics stuff. If one does not like the next president, there are dozens of other countries in the world to choose from with different forms of government, some closer to a democracy, while others closer to an autocracy.

 

[Ana the Ist]

If you watch non partisan media, like CNN, MSNBC, BBC, Aljazeera, etc, you find they don't talk about the the left vs the right.

Is this a joke?

They don't say "they" vs "we". They don't characterise all people on left or right.
They talk about specifics, specific people, specific comments or actions.

That you believe this...is hilarious.

There's Don Lemon literally saying "we need to stop demonizing people and white men are the biggest threat to America".

That's an "unbiased" news network to you.

But if you go to Fox News opinion and other right wing propaganda media shows its all left vs right, all they vs we, all generic characterisations, and very little specifics.

I'll be specific if you like...but if you are opposed to my general characterization, feel free to explain how?

Do you think the left hasn't been pushing for racial discrimination in hiring in the US?

 

[Ana the Ist]

We will have to see what November 2024 brings. That's all I am saying. If the US becomes a fascist dictatorship under MAGA or not, or becomes an Orwellian nation under the far-left where a person can not even say "hey guys" as a greeting without being labelled a sexist, who knows. All I know is that democracy will eventually crumble under the two party system, with one party taking away the freedoms of the other or vice versa. All empires and countries fall, including our own in the USA, so we should probably just not focus on this superficial politics stuff. If one does not like the next president, there are dozens of other countries in the world to choose from with different forms of government, some closer to a democracy, while others closer to an autocracy.

I'd rather not abandon the nation so many have sacrificed their lives for because "oh well...authoritarianism" is the attitude of so many.

Do you really think there's some threat of a real dictatorship under Trump? He couldn't get his own party to cooperate half the time.

 

[AlexB23]

I'd rather not abandon the nation so many have sacrificed their lives for because "oh well...authoritarianism" is the attitude of so many.

Do you really think there's some threat of a real dictatorship under Trump? He couldn't get his own party to cooperate half the time.

Well, even if the threat of dictatorship under Trump is say, 10%, that threat is much greater compared to just 20 years ago when Bush stepped into office. Though, Bush made a mess out of Iraq for oil reasons, but that is another topic. Sometimes, it is good to let go of something. If a toxic relationship treats you poorly, it is sometimes better to leave. If the US becomes a dictatorship, it is perfectly okay for someone to say: "enough is enough" and leave. Even Christians are commanded to stay away from evil.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Just follow the above.
You are saying that it is true that you can't take anyone on the left seriously about this issue. Therefore you are implying that you know what all of them think on this issue.

@stevil ....I made a concession didn't I?

I agreed it's entirely possible some people on the left disagree with the left's racist policies.

If they aren't willing to speak up though...why should I take them seriously?

 

[Ana the Ist]

Well, even if the threat of dictatorship under Trump is say, 10%, that threat is much greater compared to just 20 years ago when Bush stepped into office. Though, Bush made a mess out of Iraq for oil reasons, but that is another topic. Sometimes, it is good to let go of something. If a toxic relationship treats you poorly, it is sometimes better to leave. If the US becomes a dictatorship, it is perfectly okay for someone to say: "enough is enough" and leave. Even Christians are commanded to stay away from evil.

Leave where?

I value freedom of speech. Is there some nation comparable to the US in that regard?

 

[AlexB23]

Leave where?

I value freedom of speech. Is there some nation comparable to the US in that regard?

According to a democracy index, Denmark has a greater freedom of speech compared to the US, and the US ranks 13th in a tie out of 165 countries for freedom of speech as of 2020.

GSDI (Global State of Democracy Indices) index: Countries with Freedom of Speech 2023

 

[Ana the Ist]

According to a democracy index, Denmark has a greater freedom of speech compared to the US, and the US ranks 13th in a tie out of 165 countries for freedom of speech as of 2020.

GSDI (Global State of Democracy Indices) index: Countries with Freedom of Speech 2023

Sadly, I'd disagree with Denmark.

Denmark and Sweden Are Giving Up on Free Speech

After a spate of Quran burnings, the Danish and Swedish governments are buckling to pressure and giving up on their liberal values

time.com

Now, because of Muslim immigrants, someone like me could be thrown in jail for posting on a board like this.

 

[stevil]

@stevil ....I made a concession didn't I?

I agreed it's entirely possible some people on the left disagree with the left's racist policies.

If they aren't willing to speak up though...why should I take them seriously?

Goading people into speaking up isn't the way to do it. Painting people as left vs right is also quite awkward. I suppose in USA a great many people are registered Democrats or registered Republicans. So maybe it makes sense in USA IDK. Myself, I don't self associate as left or right. I'm just me.

 

[KCfromNC]

Bravo

Thanks, can't tell you how much your approval means to me.

 

[BPPLEE]

Thanks, can't tell you how much your approval means to me.

Sure

 

[durangodawood]

I just heard for the first time the Mein Kampf quote that "poisoning the blood" is so close to in phrasing, but more importantly, in meaning.

This is rather disturbing.

 

[JustOneWay]

I just heard for the first time the Mein Kampf quote that "poisoning the blood" is so close to in phrasing, but more importantly, in meaning.

This is rather disturbing.

What is disturbing to me is the millions of Americans defending a guy who quotes from Hitler. They either deny it or just dismiss

Ironically, the creator of Godwin's law says that Godwin's Law does not apply to Trump on the comments.

‘Trump Knows What He’s Doing’: The Creator of Godwin’s Law Says the Hitler Comparison Is Apt

The internet legend explains why the Biden campaign isn’t wrong to compare Trump to Hitler.

www.politico.com

‘Trump Knows What He’s Doing’: The Creator of Godwin’s Law Says the Hitler Comparison Is Apt​