Where was the Sabbath Abolished?

[AlightSeeker]

God's mouth decreed it and his apostles affirmed it by the Spirit Of God. Its God's word. Are we hearing and obeying his word and commands?

 

[Gary K]

Have we entered His rest? If so then why are we pushing Moses law? That was a heavy burden. Can we not see this in scripture? Does this prove that we have not yet entered his rest? Jesus is where we find our rest. Only in him alone.

Acts 15 And certain men came down from Judea and taught the brethren, “Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved.” 2 Therefore, when Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and dispute with them, they determined that Paul and Barnabas and certain others of them should go up to Jerusalem, to the apostles and elders, about this question.

3 So, being sent on their way by the church, they passed through Phoenicia and Samaria, describing the conversion of the Gentiles; and they caused great joy to all the brethren. 4 And when they had come to Jerusalem, they were received by the church and the apostles and the elders; and they reported all things that God had done with them. 5 But some of the sect of the Pharisees who believed rose up, saying, “It is necessary to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.”

The Jerusalem Council

6 Now the apostles and elders came together to consider this matter. 7 And when there had been much dispute, Peter rose up and said to them: “Men and brethren, you know that a good while ago God chose among us, that by my mouth the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel and believe. 8 So God, who knows the heart, [a]acknowledged them by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He did to us, 9 and made no distinction between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith. 10 Now therefore, why do you test God by putting a yoke on the neck of the disciples which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? 11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved in the same manner as they.”

12 Then all the multitude kept silent and listened to Barnabas and Paul declaring how many miracles and wonders God had worked through them among the Gentiles. 13 And after they had [c]become silent, James answered, saying, “Men and brethren, listen to me: 14 Simon has declared how God at the first visited the Gentiles to take out of them a people for His name. 15 And with this the words of the prophets agree, just as it is written:

16 ‘After this I will return

And will rebuild the tabernacle of David, which has fallen down;

I will rebuild its ruins,

And I will set it up;

17 So that the rest of mankind may seek the Lord,

Even all the Gentiles who are called by My name,

Says the [d]Lord who does all these things.’

18 [e]“Known to God from eternity are all His works. 19 Therefore I judge that we should not trouble those from among the Gentiles who are turning to God, 20 but that we write to them to abstain from things polluted by idols, from [f]sexual immorality, from things strangled, and from blood. 21 For Moses has had throughout many generations those who preach him in every city, being read in the synagogues every Sabbath.”

The Jerusalem Decree

22 Then it pleased the apostles and elders, with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas, namely, Judas who was also named Barsabas,[g] and Silas, leading men among the brethren.

23 They wrote this letter by them:

The apostles, the elders, and the brethren,

To the brethren who are of the Gentiles in Antioch, Syria, and Cilicia:


Greetings.

24 Since we have heard that some who went out from us have troubled you with words, unsettling your souls, [h]saying, “You must be circumcised and keep the law”—to whom we gave no such commandment— 25 it seemed good to us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men to you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul, 26 men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. 27 We have therefore sent Judas and Silas, who will also report the same things by word of mouth. 28 For it seemed good to the Holy Spirit, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things: 29 that you abstain from things offered to idols, from blood, from things strangled, and from sexual[j] immorality. If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well.

Where do you get the idea the 10 commandments came from Moses? Scripture says they came directly from God.

Exodus 20: 1 And God spake all these words, saying,
2 I am the Lord thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.*n1

Exodus 31: 18 ¶And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.

 

[Soyeong]

Well this is quite long. Did you cut and paste some of that or is it all an original creation? Either way it was commendable. Keep up the good work.

I did not copy or paste, though I have used some of the same arguments elsewhere, thank you.

To answer your question, I would not say that Peter had authority to change God’s commandment against murder, nor would the Holy Spirit allow him to do so. That is an immutable moral principle that is not subject to change.

But the apostles can change things like what someone is allowed to eat. I don’t remember the exact situation off the top of my head but there was something like that with that small council that they had in the book of Acts. I view the particular day of the week (Saturday versus Sunday) as more comparable to that than murder.

God's law teaches us about the nature of who He is, so saying that God's law can change is denying that God is the same yesterday, today, and forever, which is why God prohibited adding to or subtracting from His law (Deuteronomy 4:2). Moreover, you deciding what is or is not subject to change seems arbitrary to me. So if the Apostles said that we are free to eat something that God commanded not to eat, and when God has instructed not to listen to anyone who speaks against obeying what He has commanded, then should we obey God or the Apostles? I think that you are referencing Acts 15, though the members of the Jerusalem Council were all servants of God, so I do not think that chapter should be interpreted as speaking against obeying anything that God has commanded.

 

[Gary K]

What is this saying? Are we obeying every word that comes from God's mouth? Do we actually obey all his commands?

17 So that the rest of mankind may seek the Lord,

Even all the Gentiles who are called by My name,

Says the [d]Lord who does all these things.’

Go read my thread Is sinning necessary. You'll find it isn't. John says:

1John 3: 6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

 

[la Son]

God's mouth decreed it and his apostles affirmed it by the Spirit Of God. Its God's word. Are we hearing and obeying his word and commands?

It depends on who you mean by Apostle. The word/title Apostle was obtained by Disciples who walked and worked with Jesus. You know, the real ones He Selected?? There were around 70 other Disciples that was with The Way that knew and was around the Master and dont have it.
Its a time sensitive achievement.

 

[AlightSeeker]

We must seek and find wisdom and understanding. We must found out what the will of the Lord is. That is what I see in Scripture. We are the church. Do we hate our own flesh? Or do we love and cherish it? Do we hate ourselves or do we love ourselves? ? Do we love each other as ourselves? Do we speak evil of each other who are Gods children? Do we judge another mans servant? The kingdom isnt about eating and drinking but is about righteousness, peace and joy in the spirit. These are how we serve both God and man.


Ephesians 5:1 Therefore be imitators of God, as beloved children; 2 and walk in love, just as Christ also loved [a]you and gave Himself up for us, an offering and a sacrifice to God as a fragrant aroma.

3 But sexual immorality [c]or any impurity or greed must not even be mentioned among you, as is proper among [d]saints; 4 and there must be no filthiness [e]or foolish talk, or vulgar joking, which are not fitting, but rather giving of thanks. 5 For this you know with certainty, that no sexually immoral or [f]impure or greedy person, which [g]amounts to an idolater, has an inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God.

6 See that no one deceives you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the [h]sons of disobedience. 7 Therefore do not become partners with them; 8 for you were once darkness, but now you are light in the Lord; walk as children of light 9 (for the fruit of the light consists in all goodness, righteousness, and truth), 10 as you try to learn what is pleasing to the Lord. 11 Do not participate in the useless deeds of darkness, but instead even expose them; 12 for it is disgraceful even to speak of the things which are done by them in secret. 13 But all things become visible when they are exposed by the light, for everything that becomes visible is light. 14 For this reason [j]it says,

“Awake, sleeper,

And arise from the dead,

And Christ will shine on you.”

15 So then, [k]be careful how you walk, not as unwise people but as wise, 16 [l]making the most of your time, because the days are evil. 17 Therefore do not be foolish, but understand what the will of the Lord is. 18 And do not get drunk with wine, [m]in which there is debauchery, but be filled with the Spirit, 19 speaking to [n]one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody with your hearts to the Lord; 20 always giving thanks for all things in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ to our God and Father; 21 [o]and subject yourselves to one another in the [p]fear of Christ.

Marriage like Christ and the Church

22 Wives, subject yourselves to your own husbands, as to the Lord. 23 For the husband is the head of the wife, as Christ also is the head of the church, He Himself being the Savior of the body. 24 But as the church is subject to Christ, so also the wives ought to be to their husbands in everything.

25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself up for her, 26 so that He might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, 27 that He might present to Himself the church [q]in all her glory, having no spot or wrinkle or any such thing; but that she would be holy and blameless. 28 So husbands also ought to love their own wives as their own bodies. He who loves his own wife loves himself; 29 for no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ also does the church, 30 because we are parts of His body. 31 For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh. 32 This mystery is great; but I am speaking with reference to Christ and the church. 33 Nevertheless, as for you individually, each husband is to love his own wife the same as himself, and the wife must see to it that she respects her husband.

 

[Gary K]

It depends on who you mean by Apostle. The word/title Apostle was obtained by Disciples who walked and worked with Jesus. You know, the real ones He Selected?? There were around 70 other Disciples that was with The Way that knew and was around the Master and dont have it.
Its a time sensitive achievement.

Are you a cessationist?

 

[AlightSeeker]

Go read my thread Is sinning necessary. You'll find it isn't. John says:

1John 3: 6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

If we say we have no sin then we lie. If we sin then its because we haven't abided in him. Scripture says if we have fellowship with one another we fellowship with the Lord. If we do this then we are cleansed of our sin. This is what scripture says and it can't be broken. But our we we truly abiding in him?

 

[la Son]

I did not copy or paste, though I have used some of the same arguments elsewhere, thank you.


God's law teaches us about the nature of who He is, so saying that God's law can change is denying that God is the same yesterday, today, and forever, which is why God prohibited adding to or subtracting from His law (Deuteronomy 4:2). Moreover, you deciding what is or is not subject to change seems arbitrary to me. So if the Apostles said that we are free to eat something that God commanded not to eat, and when God has instructed not to listen to anyone who speaks against obeying what He has commanded, then should we obey God or the Apostles? I think that you are referencing Acts 15, though the members of the Jerusalem Council were all servants of God, so I do not think that chapter should be interpreted as speaking against obeying anything that God has commanded. Copied and Pasted by Soyeong 11/25/23

 

[trophy33]

PSst..hes trying to catch him in something

You are 45 years old. What about participating in some more productive way?

 

[la Son]

It shows right there at the end of your response that you copied and pasted it today!!

 

[la Son]

You are 45 years old. What about participating in some more productive way?

Agreed, gonna get up and stretch a bit. Just been a while since I got a break.
You let me know if i can be of sevice as Im relaxing all day

 

[AlightSeeker]

Matthew 15:
Then the scribes and Pharisees who were from Jerusalem came to Jesus, saying, 2 “Why do Your disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat bread.”

3 He answered and said to them, “Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, saying, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 5 But you say, ‘Whoever says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is a gift to God”— 6 then he need not honor his father [a]or mother.’ Thus you have made the [b]commandment of God of no effect by your tradition. 7 Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you, saying:

8 ‘These people [c]draw near to Me with their mouth,
And honor Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
9 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’ ”
10 When He had called the multitude to Himself, He said to them, “Hear and understand: 11 Not what goes into the mouth defiles a man; but what comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man.”

12 Then His disciples came and said to Him, “Do You know that the Pharisees were offended when they heard this saying?”

13 But He answered and said, “Every plant which My heavenly Father has not planted will be uprooted. 14 Let them alone. They are blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind leads the blind, both will fall into a ditch.”

15 Then Peter answered and said to Him, “Explain this parable to us.”

16 So Jesus said, “Are you also still without understanding? 17 Do you not yet understand that whatever enters the mouth goes into the stomach and is eliminated? 18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come from the heart, and they defile a man. 19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies. 20 These are the things which defile a man, but to eat with unwashed hands does not defile a man.”

A Gentile Shows Her Faith​

 

[Gary K]

If we say we have no sin then we lie. If we sin then its because we haven't abided in him. Scripture says if we have fellowship with one another we fellowship with the Lord. If we do this then we are cleansed of our sin. This is what scripture says and it can't be broken. But our we we truly abiding in him?

I have never said what you think I have. I fully believe the text you're in essence quoting. Study the thread. It's all scripture. If I never sinned from this day forward would I still need the righteousness of Christ, i.e. justification? Absolutely. I am saying nothing that isn't scriptural. I use a lot of NT and OT scripture.

 

[AlightSeeker]

We must abide in the Lord as scripture says. Are we though? He who does not gather scatters and he fights against the Lord.

2 John 2:3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God [a]is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 6 He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.

7 [b]Brethren, I write no new commandment to you, but an old commandment which you have had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which you heard [c]from the beginning. 8 Again, a new commandment I write to you, which thing is true in Him and in you, because the darkness is passing away, and the true light is already shining.

9 He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. 10 He who loves his brother abides in the light, and there is no cause for stumbling in him. 11 But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.

Their Spiritual State​

12 I write to you, little children,
Because your sins are forgiven you for His name’s sake.
13 I write to you, fathers,
Because you have known Him who is from the beginning.
I write to you, young men,
Because you have overcome the wicked one.
I write to you, little children,
Because you have known the Father.
14 I have written to you, fathers,
Because you have known Him who is from the beginning.
I have written to you, young men,
Because you are strong, and the word of God abides in you,
And you have overcome the wicked one.

Do Not Love the World​

15 Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. 16 For all that is in the world—the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life—is not of the Father but is of the world. 17 And the world is passing away, and the lust of it; but he who does the will of God abides forever.

Deceptions of the Last Hour​

18 Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the[d] Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us.

20 But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you[e] know all things. 21 I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth.

22 Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. 23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.

Let Truth Abide in You​

24 Therefore let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father. 25 And this is the promise that He has promised us—eternal life.

26 These things I have written to you concerning those who try to [f]deceive you. 27 But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you [g]will abide in Him.

The Children of God​

28 And now, little children, abide in Him, that [h]when He appears, we may have confidence and not be ashamed before Him at His coming. 29 If you know that He is righteous, you know that everyone who practices righteousness is born of Him.

John 15: I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser. 2 Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He [a]takes away; and every branch that bears fruit He prunes, that it may bear more fruit. 3 You are already clean because of the word which I have spoken to you. 4 Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in Me.

5 “I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing. 6 If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. 7 If you abide in Me, and My words abide in you, you will ask what you desire, and it shall be done for you. 8 By this My Father is glorified, that you bear much fruit; so you will be My disciples.

Love and Joy Perfected
9 “As the Father loved Me, I also have loved you; abide in My love. 10 If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love.

11 “These things I have spoken to you, that My joy may remain in you, and that your joy may be full. 12 This is My commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you. 13 Greater love has no one than this, than to lay down one’s life for his friends. 14 You are My friends if you do whatever I command you. 15 No longer do I call you servants, for a servant does not know what his master is doing; but I have called you friends, for all things that I heard from My Father I have made known to you. 16 You did not choose Me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit, and that your fruit should remain, that whatever you ask the Father in My name He may give you. 17 These things I command you, that you love one another.

The World’s Hatred
18 “If the world hates you, you know that it hated Me before it hated you. 19 If you were of the world, the world would love its own. Yet because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you. 20 Remember the word that I said to you, ‘A servant is not greater than his master.’ If they persecuted Me, they will also persecute you. If they kept My word, they will keep yours also. 21 But all these things they will do to you for My name’s sake, because they do not know Him who sent Me. 22 If I had not come and spoken to them, they would have no sin, but now they have no excuse for their sin. 23 He who hates Me hates My Father also. 24 If I had not done among them the works which no one else did, they would have no sin; but now they have seen and also hated both Me and My Father. 25 But this happened that the word might be fulfilled which is written in their law, ‘They hated Me without a cause.’

The Coming Rejection
26 “But when the [c]Helper comes, whom I shall send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify of Me. 27 And you also will bear witness, because you have been with Me from the beginning.

 

[HIM]

They lie because you cannot find it in a lexicon, not knowing Greek language as well as they do?

Do you speak a language that is not your native?

What I know and don’t is not relevant here since it just words on a screen. But No they lie because it isn’t a good translation and they know better if they are educated. Have you looked it up yourself. In is not and no matter how why tries, regardless of any perceived context.

 

[AlightSeeker]

I believe I understand these scriptures. Sometimes things seem to contradict each other. But I assure this is all true.

 

[AlightSeeker]

I have never said what you think I have. I fully believe the text you're in essence quoting. Study the thread. It's all scripture. If I never sinned from this day forward would I still need the righteousness of Christ, i.e. justification? Absolutely. I am saying nothing that isn't scriptural. I use a lot of NT and OT scripture.

I never accused anyone brother.

 

[AlightSeeker]

Where do you get the idea the 10 commandments came from Moses? Scripture says they came directly from God.

Exodus 20: 1 And God spake all these words, saying,
2 I am the Lord thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.*n1

Exodus 31: 18 ¶And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.

My brother, the scriptures i posted come from Gods own mouth. We cannot fight against God.

 

[AlightSeeker]

It depends on who you mean by Apostle. The word/title Apostle was obtained by Disciples who walked and worked with Jesus. You know, the real ones He Selected?? There were around 70 other Disciples that was with The Way that knew and was around the Master and dont have it.
Its a time sensitive achievement.

I follow the apostles and speak their words. I have posted them here. I abide in the Lord and his word.