Israel-Hamas Thread II

[Vanellus]

That is a true tragedy, particularly since Israel offered them fuel to power the hospital. Hamas would not allow it.

A few jerry cans don't run a large hospital. The hospital authorities asked the IDF to send them via the Red Cross - the IDF refused.

 

[Vanellus]

Should have asked Hamas, they got plenty.

Assertion without evidence.

 

[Vanellus]

Ehh, the IDK briefings are just that: briefings run by military who have first hand knowledge and experience, not politicians. They are not a question and answer period. Can you link them to me?....Here some of the one's i watch......

You can subscribe to that channel if you would like a different perspective from what seems like to usually get......

Making assertions based on fuzzy photographs without any questions is propaganda. Why don't they want to be questioned? Could it be their claims don't stand up to scrutiny such as the false IDF claim about the Qatari hospital?

 

[Vanellus]

If you have been following news and briefings you should know that is common knowledge.

I asked you what your evidence was.

We felt exactly the same way during WWII......protect your soldiers to the greatest extent possible.

The rules of war (Geneva conventions) were instituted to prevent the kinds of war crimes committed in WW2. So your comparison to WW2 is invalid.

Did you see the video on the previous thread that I posted? It was from security cameras in the attacked area and from Hamas 'fighters' cameras on Oct 7. If you haven't seen it I would be happy to re-post it here if you have the stomach to watch it. Thankfully, that's not even the worst of them; Israel won't even release those they are so brutal.

Two wrongs don't make a right but I'm surprised you are drawing a moral equivalence between the IDF and Hamas. Isn't the IDF supposed to be much better being the armed force of the beacon of democracy in the Middle East

Yeah, I saw that. Fortunately he doesn't have that kind of authority. BTW, did you raise this much fuss about such when the russian politician (forget what his position was) wanted to do the same to Ukraine?......or do you believe only Gazan's don't deserve that? Try to be consistent at least.

I don't know who you mean here but note that this thread is about Israel-Hamas. I am not a supporter of Putin or the Russian invasion of Ukraine. Can I take it you don't think the IDF should nuke Gaza? I won't be engaging any more about Ukraine-Russia on this thread as I prefer to stick to the subject of the thread.

 

[Vanellus]

Since this is a UK news channel I'm not sure whether you'll have access:

Here Peter Lerner asserted that there was "no fighting at the hospital" at 6:15 - the video evidence refutes his claim:

at 1:50

Note I'm giving you the video links and the time stamps rather than just claiming it is "common knowledge".

 

[Nithavela]

The rules of war (Geneva conventions) were instituted to prevent the kinds of war crimes committed in WW2. So your comparison to WW2 is invalid.

There were rules of war before the geneva conventions, like the hague conventions of 1899 and 1907, even before the first world war.

Even the geneva conventions started being implemented way, way before the second world war. The first one was signed in 1864.

 

[Valletta]

A few jerry cans don't run a large hospital. The hospital authorities asked the IDF to send them via the Red Cross - the IDF refused.

"Hamas, (which) is hiding in the hospitals and placing itself there, doesn't want the fuel for the hospital ... they want to get fuel that they'll take from the hospitals to their tunnels, to their war machine."
Netanyahu: Hamas refused Israeli fuel offer for Gaza's Shifa hospital

 

[essentialsaltes]

More than 100 UN staffers killed in Gaza since war began, aid agency says​

At least 102 United Nations staff members have been killed in Gaza since the war began, a UN aid agency operating in the enclave said Monday.

"This is the highest number of United Nations aid workers killed in a conflict in the history of the United Nations," UNRWA said.

 

[civilwarbuff]

I asked you what your evidence was.

Well, since I am not there I guess I have none. Can you offer personal evidence?......or do you rely on 3rd parties like the rest of us?

The rules of war (Geneva conventions) were instituted to prevent the kinds of war crimes committed in WW2. So your comparison to WW2 is invalid.

Protecting your soldiers is NEVER an invalid argument.

Two wrongs don't make a right but I'm surprised you are drawing a moral equivalence between the IDF and Hamas. Isn't the IDF supposed to be much better being the armed force of the beacon of democracy in the Middle East

No moral equivalence has been drawn. As I pointed out earlier in this thread the amount of damage done to Gaza city would indicate far higher casualties amongst civilians than reported......and please don't use the old tired argument about under reporting unless you have corroborative evidence to support your supposition.

I don't know who you mean here but note that this thread is about Israel-Hamas. I am not a supporter of Putin or the Russian invasion of Ukraine. Can I take it you don't think the IDF should nuke Gaza? I won't be engaging any more about Ukraine-Russia on this thread as I prefer to stick to the subject of the thread.

Score one for me.......

 

[civilwarbuff]

Since this is a UK news channel I'm not sure whether you'll have access:

Here Peter Lerner asserted that there was "no fighting at the hospital" at 6:15 - the video evidence refutes his claim:

at 1:50

Note I'm giving you the video links and the time stamps rather than just claiming it is "common knowledge".

For some reason I can't play those links......

 

[civilwarbuff]

More than 100 UN staffers killed in Gaza since war began, aid agency says​

At least 102 United Nations staff members have been killed in Gaza since the war began, a UN aid agency operating in the enclave said Monday.

"This is the highest number of United Nations aid workers killed in a conflict in the history of the United Nations," UNRWA said.

Not unexpected in urban terrorism where there are no clear battle lines and the terrorists hide amongst the civilians. Most aid workers stay behind the battle lines.

 

[rjs330]

Latest report is that 7 of the 36 premature babies have now died - the al Shifa hospital did not have the fuel to power them.

Yeah they did. Hamas wouldn't let them have it. Israel also offered to help and it was rejected.

 

[rjs330]

As you say if but if Israel hadn't cut power supplies to Gaza etc. etc. etc.

Irrelevant. It's Hamas' responsibility to care for their people etc etc. And Israel offered help and it was turned down etc etc.

So who's fault is it again? Oh yeah, Hamas and Hamas alone.

 

[rjs330]

I've seen these IDF guys on UK news programmes. They don't stand up to scrutiny and come across poorly verging on the unhinged when asked reasonable questions.

Right and the Hamas lovers come across as pure statesmen with stand up to all scrutiny. We know terrorists are the most reliable and trustworthy of people and filled with honesty and credibility.

Meanwhile we have people who are NOT trying to kill civilians, who are trying to get people out. Who TRIED to help the hospital out and were rejected. That are far more trustworthy than ANYONE or ANYTHING related to Hamas.

 

[Valletta]

More than 100 UN staffers killed in Gaza since war began, aid agency says​

At least 102 United Nations staff members have been killed in Gaza since the war began, a UN aid agency operating in the enclave said Monday.

"This is the highest number of United Nations aid workers killed in a conflict in the history of the United Nations," UNRWA said.

Hamas does not seem to discriminate. They killed more babies at the hospital by refusing fuel from Israel for the generators.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Irrelevant. It's Hamas' responsibility to care for their people etc etc.

Whether it is or no, Gaza is dependent on imports, and the current embargo makes proper care impossible.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Hamas does not seem to discriminate.

Airstrikes don't discriminate.

 

[Valletta]

Airstrikes don't discriminate.

Israel does, Hamas does not.

 

[Valletta]

Whether it is or no, Gaza is dependent on imports, and the current embargo makes proper care impossible.

A SUCCESSFUL Gaza depends on peace. They begged for money and it so much of the money gets used to try and kill Jews. After Hamas is gone it will take a major effort, hopefully nations of the world will assist.

 

[Valletta]

Whether it is or no, Gaza is dependent on imports, and the current embargo makes proper care impossible.

It is Hamas that makes proper care impossible.