Where is "go to heaven" in the Bible?

[Clare73]

Did or did not Jesus use the same words to describe the place of punishment? Also see 2 Timothy 3:16

Jesus used Hades and Gehinna both to describe the place of punishment.
He did not use Sheol.

 

[Clare73]

What do you think Jonah used Sheol figuratively of?

Sheol = grave, holding place of the dead (death), wherein there are two places:
1) Paradise (bosom of Abraham) - place of blessing,
2) Hades - place of punishment.

I think he was using Sheol to refer to the belly of the whale as a grave, holding place.

 

[Clare73]

Yes, the fish's belly would become his grave - Sheol.
We agree on something then?

Should we chop a notch in the door facing to mark it.

What about Hades? Do you agree that Hades is the grave also?
Acts 2:31

Hades, the place of fire, is in Sheol, the grave, holding place of the dead, and it seems they were used interchangeably.
Ac 2:31 refers to the grave, holding place of the dead, not to the place of fire.

 

[Der Alte]

Jesus used Hades and Gehinna both to describe the place of punishment.
He did not use Sheol.

And Gehenna and sheol were used in the 225 BC LXX to refer to the place of fiery eternal punishment.

 

[CoreyD]

Sheol = grave, holding place of the dead (death), wherein there are two places:
1) Paradise (bosom of Abraham) - place of blessing,
2) Hades - place of punishment.

Where did you read that Clare? Was it a religious website?
Or is that just what you believe?

I think he was using Sheol to refer to the belly of the whale as a grave, holding place.

Job was not dead. Why do you believe Job referred to the belly of the whale as his grave?
Was it not because he though he was as good as dead, and the belly of the fish would be his "burial place".

Should we chop a notch in the door facing to mark it.

We'd better. Lest I forget.

Hades, the place of fire, is in Sheol, the grave, holding place of the dead, and it seems they were used interchangeably.
Ac 2:31 refers to the grave, holding place of the dead, not to the place of fire.

There are two Hades?
One is Biblical. The other is _______ ?

 

[CoreyD]

Jesus used Hades and Gehinna both to describe the place of punishment.
He did not use Sheol.

He did.
Jesus was speaking to Greek speaking people. He used the Greek word Hades, which is equivalent to the Hebrew word Sheol.
There was no need for Jesus to use a Hebrew word, to express the term in Greek? He spoke Greek.
Hades and Sheol are not two different things.

 

[oikonomia]

Because of believing that a literal city in heaven, would actually come down on earth, many have the view that God, Jesus, and the heavenly angels leave heaven, with their heavenly bodies, to live on earth.
Is this your view, also?

I read all of it as carefully as you put it together.
And I would comment perhaps in sections.

But to your last question above -

Because Paul has told us that the church is the wife to Christ, the New Jerusalem cannot be another wife.
She must be that wife basically that we already see in Ephesians 5.

He would not change His mind from marrying the church to marrying a physical city instead calling that physical
city His bride and wife. So the New Jerusalem must be the enlargement and ultimate consummation of what the church is.

Ephesians 5:26,27 says That He might sanctify her, cleansing her by the washing of the water in the word,
That He might present the church to Himself glorious, not having spot or wrinkle or any such things, but that she would be holy and without blemish.

New Jerusalem cannot be something ELSE, ie. a physical golden mountain 1,500 miles high. Otherwise Christ would have
changed His mind to make something else His glorious wife without spot or wrinkle. New Jerusalem must be what the church is.
And every local church which is genuine and proper must contain the aspects of New Jerusalem emerging in her.

In fact the Apostle Paul already gave us ample indication that all of his discussion of human marriage was actually His speaking
of the great mystery of Christ's union with the church. Paul ends his talking about marriage this way -

For this cause a man shall leave his father and mother and shall be joined to his wife, and the two shall be one flesh.
This mystery is great, but I speak with regard to Christ and the church. (vs. 31,32)

He is saying the mystery of Eve being brought out of Adam, to make two, and then she being brought back to him
to make one, is a grand pointer to a deeper reality - the marriage of Christ to His church. The mystery of the orginal
human marriage is great. But he is really speaking with regard to Christ and the church.

The truth is not of a physical 1,500 mile high golden city coming down from heaven.
The truth is God's people brought into a state in which they MATCH Christ in life, nature, expression, but not in His non-communicable Godhead.

I would add, to the extent that we are glorified sons of God with some kind of transfigured bodies are "physical" so the New Jerusalem
in Revelation 21,22 is physical in that sense. My main point in this post is that Christ will not change His mind and something ELSE
His bride and wife besides His church.

 

[Clare73]

He did.
Jesus was speaking to Greek speaking people. He used the Greek word Hades, which is equivalent to the Hebrew word Sheol.

Jews preached to the Jews.

There was no need for Jesus to use a Hebrew word, to express the term in Greek? He spoke Greek.
Hades and Sheol are not two different things.

Hades is in Sheol.

 

[CoreyD]

Jews preached to the Jews.

The writers wrote in Greek.

Hades is in Sheol.

You are free to believe whatever you want Clare. I'm interested in the Bible, and what is taught therein.

 

[CoreyD]

I read all of it as carefully as you put it together.
And I would comment perhaps in sections.

But to your last question above -

Because Paul has told us that the church is the wife to Christ, the New Jerusalem cannot be another wife.
She must be that wife basically that we already see in Ephesians 5.

He would not change His mind from marrying the church to marrying a physical city instead calling that physical
city His bride and wife. So the New Jerusalem must be the enlargement and ultimate consummation of what the church is.

Ephesians 5:26,27 says That He might sanctify her, cleansing her by the washing of the water in the word,
That He might present the church to Himself glorious, not having spot or wrinkle or any such things, but that she would be holy and without blemish.

New Jerusalem cannot be something ELSE, ie. a physical golden mountain 1,500 miles high. Otherwise Christ would have
changed His mind to make something else His glorious wife without spot or wrinkle. New Jerusalem must be what the church is.
And every local church which is genuine and proper must contain the aspects of New Jerusalem emerging in her.

In fact the Apostle Paul already gave us ample indication that all of his discussion of human marriage was actually His speaking
of the great mystery of Christ's union with the church. Paul ends his talking about marriage this way -

For this cause a man shall leave his father and mother and shall be joined to his wife, and the two shall be one flesh.
This mystery is great, but I speak with regard to Christ and the church. (vs. 31,32)

He is saying the mystery of Eve being brought out of Adam, to make two, and then she being brought back to him
to make one, is a grand pointer to a deeper reality - the marriage of Christ to His church. The mystery of the orginal
human marriage is great. But he is really speaking with regard to Christ and the church.

The truth is not of a physical 1,500 mile high golden city coming down from heaven.
The truth is God's people brought into a state in which they MATCH Christ in life, nature, expression, but not in His non-communicable Godhead.

I would add, to the extent that we are glorified sons of God with some kind of transfigured bodies are "physical" so the New Jerusalem
in Revelation 21,22 is physical in that sense. My main point in this post is that Christ will not change His mind and something ELSE
His bride and wife besides His church.

New Jerusalem is indeed the Bride of the lamb It is indeed the body of Christ - the Church. Not the buildings people call church. The lamb has only one wife.
So, I think we are in step there.
When did this Church begin?

Also, I'm looking forward to your response to the scriptures that addressed the OP.
Thank you.

 

[Clare73]

The writers wrote in Greek.

Agreed. . .

You are free to believe whatever you want Clare. I'm interested in the Bible, and what is taught therein.

I believe Jesus used only the words Hades and Gehinna, as taught in the NT.

 

[oikonomia]

So, addressing the OP, here is what the Bible tells us.

Do righteous persons make their home in heaven?

• Philippians 3:20 But our citizenship is in heaven. And we eagerly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ,

CoreyD, you will find my responses somewhat leaning towards my burden to emphasize about God moving into
us. My comments are not to be taken as disagreement. I comment gravitating a little towards a certain concern I emphasize.

For example, I would say Phlippians 3:20, especially connected to previous verse 19, shows our citizenship has its source not in
this world but where Christ sits in heaven.

Whose end is destruction, whose god is their stomach, and whose glory is in their shame, who set their minds on earthly things. (v.19)
For our commonwealth exists in the heavens, from which also we eagerly await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, (v.20)

The contrast highlights where the mind is set. The worldly people who set their minds on earthly things
are verses the believers whose commonwealth exists in the heavens.

I would emphasize that some may read this as our citizenship or commonwealth WILL BE in heaven.
So we are going to heaven where our citizenship will be. I would rather emphasize that presently
our minds should not be on earthly and fleshly things as those in verse 19 but set on the things above where
Christ is now. A great sister passage to verse 20 is Colossians 3:1,2.

If therefore you were raised together with Christ, seek the things which are above, where Christ is, sitting at the right hand of God.

Set your mind on the things which are above, not on the things which are on the earth.
For you died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God.(Col. 3:1,2)

The cross is needed to secure our experience that we have died to the world and our minds are on
Christ who is our life. And He is in the heaven. I would emphasize that this Philippians 3:20 and Col. 3:1,2
are more about the Triune God coming to us to be our life inwardly, thoroughly, and completely than
it is about going up to heaven.

From heaven we eagerly await the Savior who indwells us as our life.

For our commonwealth exists in the heavens, from which also we eagerly await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,
Who will transfigure the body of our humiliation to be conformed to the body of His glory,
according to His operation by which He is able even to subject all things to Himself. (Phil. 3:20,21)

When Christ our life is manifested, then you also will be manifested with Him in glory. (Col. 3:4)

The Christ in heaven where our citizenship is also lives in us. He is working from the inside of our being
OUTWARD through our soul and eventially into our body. The spirit is regenerated. The soul is transformed.
And the body is transfigured. Christ appears from the heavens and we are to appear with Him in glory.

My emphasis would therefore be that these passages are more about the Triune God moving into man.
Others may read them and see them more about God moving us up to heaven.
But I think what they show is God moving into man as divine life for His glorification
in us.

• John 14:2, 3 In My Father’s house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also.

I wrote a long post or two on John 14. I would like to come back to it.

• 1 Thessalonians 4:16, 17 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.

This passage is about rapture. And it is about being with the Lord after rapture.
However, the phrase we who are living, who are left remaining in verse 15 and again
Then we who are living, who are left remaining, in verse 16 I believe may indicate the following:

The rapture here in 1 Thess, 4:16,17 is not the first rapture before the tribulation.
It is the rapture of "those who are living, who are LEFT . . . remaning".
It would have been adaquate for Paul to have written "those who are living" period.
Under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit he curiously adds something - "who are left remaining."

This could indicate that some were living and were taken previously because they were READY.
And this could mean that the rest had to wait and be raptured latter - "those who are living, who are LEFT . . . remaning".

God is dispensing His life into man. And when this dispensing causes the readiness for rapture, rapture occurs. (See Mark 4:26-28)

And He said, So is the kingdom of God: as if a man cast seed on the earth,
And sleeps and rises night and day, and the seed sprouts and lengthens — how, he does not know.
The earth bears fruit by itself: first a blade, then an ear, then full grain in the ear.
But when the fruit is ripe, immediately he sends forth the sickle, because the harvest has come.

Revelation 14 shows the FIRSTFRUITS (a minority) in heaven. Then the major events of the great tribulation are shown.
Then the HARVEST is shown. The HARVEST (the majority) rapture would therefore be the rapture at the END of the great
tribulation of we who are living, who are left remaining.

The rapture of those watching, vigilant, ready before the GT would be the FIRSTFRUITS. (Rev. 14:1-5)
The majority who were caught off guard would then pass through the great tribulation
They would be ripened under the heat of that troubled time and be rapture at its end as the HARVEST. (Rev. 14:14-16; 1 Thess. 4:16,17)
Again the rapture at the end of the great tribulation would be the rapture of "those who are living, who are left remaning".

They are not just living at that time. They are living and left remaining. The deceased in graves who were not taken pre-tribulation
also join them.

This too is about God dispensing His life and nature into His "crop" for growth, development, and maturity.
I would emphasize this more than "going to heaven."

Now according to the typology in Leviticus the firstfruits were taken into the temple.
But the harvest was taken into another holding area. The places to where the ripened crops were taken differed.
In Revelation 14 the Firstfruits are seen in heaven.
But the Harvest is taken to the air.

will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air; and thus we will be always with the Lord.

These are to be words of comfort (v.18). Therefore comfort one another with these words.

However . . . as the firstfruits were taken to the temple and the harvest was taken to another holding area,
so the early rapture is to the third heaven but the latter rapture is to the air where Christ has now
come to hover over and near the earth on a cloud before His descent. (See Leviticus 23:10-11; Exodus 23:19)

This is all the time I can give to this at the moment.
Please, please enjoy reading the verses, even if you see things differently.
That is a win / win situation.

 

[Jamdoc]

Where in the Bible do people get the concept of God wanting the saved to "go to heaven" forever?

I say the degree that people do not see what the church is is indiicated by how strong is
their belief that God wants them to "go to heaven" to be in heaven forever.

Demonstrate that "going to heaven" forever as God's desire for the saved is biblical teach

So sorry for not reading the whole thread so probably some retread ground.

But "going to heaven forever" is unbiblical as there's a new Earth and that's our eternal destination. That's Isaiah 65, that's Revelation 21 and 22, and 2 Peter 3:13.

However going to heaven at all IS biblical.
For starters, Enoch and Elijah were raptured to heaven bodily, transfigured (Genesis 5:24, Hebrews 11:5 for Enoch, 2 Kings 2:11 for Elijah and Malachi 4:5 promises to send Elijah back BEFORE the day of the Lord, and Jesus affirmed that while John was spiritually Elijah, that Elijah himself would return and restore all things)
Revelation 6:9-11, Revelation 7:9-17, Revelation 15:2-4, and Revelation 19:1 all have people in heaven.

Ultimately, heaven comes down to the New Earth though, so when people talk about going to heaven forever, sometimes what they actually mean is the New Earth and New Jerusalem and they call it "heaven" because technically the New Jerusalem is God's dwelling place, making it "heaven".

 

[oikonomia]

So sorry for not reading the whole thread so probably some retread ground.

Thanks. My responses to your verses should not be taken as any disagreement. But I will lean towards
my burden to speak of God coming to make His home in man.

But "going to heaven forever" is unbiblical as there's a new Earth and that's our eternal destination.

Yes, Peter speaks also of "we are expecting new heavens and a new earth, in which righteousness dwells." (2 Pet. 3:12b)
In order to have such a universe God must thoroughly permeate and saturate His people with His life and nature.
There is no other way that heaven and earth may be filled only with righteousness. God must make His living home in man.

And His people must cooperate to allow Him to transfuse His righteous life and nature into us. This much is evidenced
in that Peter says we not only eagerly expect this but must also hasten it.
That means cooperation which does not delay it but expedites the process. Expecting and hastening . . . the day of God.

Expecting and hastening the coming of the day of God, on account of which the heavens, being on fire, will be dissolved, and the elements, burning with intense heat, are to be melted away? (v.11)

As God would not destroy Sodom and Gamorrah until the only rightweous people were removed, so it is with the new heaven and new earth. God cannot cause the old creation to completely pass away until He has transformed His LAST child fully into the image of His Son.
So all His children need to HASTEN that execution as well as eagerly expect it.

In the same chapter Peter tells us that we should cooperate to be found by Him fully dispensed into by God arriving at a point of
"without spot and without blemish."

But according to His promise we are expecting new heavens and a new earth, in which righteousness dwells.
Therefore, beloved, since you expect these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace without spot and without blemish; (v.13,14)

There are two amazing things about this:

1.) Peter describes our final state as he describes the life and nature of our Savior Christ. This means that we have all become like Him.

. . . you were redeemed from your vain manner of life handed down from your fathers,
But with precious blood, as of a Lamb without blemish and without spot, the blood of Christ; (1 Pet. 1:18,19)

He predestinated the one without blemish and without spot before the foundation of the world to be our Redeemer.

Who was foreknown before the foundation of the world but has been manifested in the last of times for your sake, (1 Pet. 1:20)

2.) He has granted us all that we need to become finally found by Him in peace without spot and without blemish
by granting us all necessary provision - Seeing that His divine power has granted to us all things which relate to life and godliness, (2 Pet. 1:3a)

His precious promises have also granted us to become PARTAKERS of the divine nature.

Through which [precious and exceedingly great promises] He has granted to us precious and exceedingly great promises that through these you might become partakers of the divine nature,(v. 4a)

We are not merely worshippers of the divine nature. Nor are we merely admirers, spectators, observers of the divine nature.
We have become participants, partakers of the divine nature. And in that nature are granted to us
all things which relate to life and godliness, through the full knowledge of Him who has called us by His own glory and virtue, (2 Pet. 1:3)

What an astounding apostolic revelation and teaching. I emphasize God's life divine nature making HOME in us as much more
than Him merely transporting us to heaven.

That's Isaiah 65, that's Revelation 21 and 22, ad 2 Peter 3:13.

However going to heaven at all IS biblical.

Revelation 21 and 22 really show the Triune God building man into Himself and He dispensing His life, nature, glory and all His
communicable attributes into a CITY (all His redeemed, transformed, sanctified, transfigured, resurrected, and glorified people).

For starters, Enoch and Elijah were raptured to heaven bodily, transfigured (Genesis 5:24, Hebrews 11:5 for Enoch, 2 Kings 2:11 for Elijah and Malachi 4:5 promises to send Elijah back BEFORE the day of the Lord, and Jesus affirmed that while John was spiritually Elijah, that Elijah himself would return and restore all things)

My comments will lean towards my real burden - God making His home in us.

Enoch who was raptured FIRST obtained a testimony that it was possible to live godly in a corrupt world.
By faith Enoch was translated so that he should not see death; and he was not found, because God had translated him. For before his translation he obtained the testimony that he had been well pleasing to God. (Heb. 11:5)

Before his rapture Enoch testified of a certain kind of acceptable godly living in the midst of a sinful world.
This cannot be overlooked. Rapture to wherever is based on the testimony borne priorly.

One of the reasons why Enoch was compelled to get serious about walking with God was because he knew
that judgment was coming upon that world. Enoch named his son "when he dies it will come" - Methusaleh.

And Enoch lived sixty-five years and begot Methuselah.
And Enoch walked with God after he had begotten Methuselah . . . (Gen. 5:21,22a)
And Enoch walked with God, and he was not, for God took him. (v.24)

Enoch had revelation and prophesied that when his son Methuselah died, the judgment of God
would come upon the world. That judgment was the flood of Noah.
Knowing what was coming by revelation from God he determined to walk with God.
And obtaining testimony of a righteous walk, God raptured him and suddenly Enoch was not found.

The things written in the Old Testament serve as examples to us today in the new covenant age.
Some of us know what is coming. And we need to walk with God as He imparts more and more of His
Holy Spirit into our living. This dispensing of Christ into our walk will also testify to a world about to be judged.

This too is the Triune God making His home in His people. At least a remnant, a corporate Enoch must emerge
in city by city all over the earth. We all have a chance to become consituents of this collective Enoch walking
with God filled with Christ as life. This is what the normal local church life must produce.

 

[Jamdoc]

Thanks. My responses to your verses should not be taken as any disagreement. But I will lean towards
my burden to speak of God coming to make His home in man.


Yes, Peter speaks also of "we are expecting new heavens and a new earth, in which righteousness dwells." (2 Pet. 3:12b)
In order to have such a universe God must thoroughly permeate and saturate His people with His life and nature.
There is no other way that heaven and earth may be filled only with righteousness. God must make His living home in man.

And His people must cooperate to allow Him to transfuse His righteous life and nature into us. This much is evidenced
in that Peter says we not only eagerly expect this but must also hasten it.
That means cooperation which does not delay it but expedites the process. Expecting and hastening . . . the day of God.

Expecting and hastening the coming of the day of God, on account of which the heavens, being on fire, will be dissolved, and the elements, burning with intense heat, are to be melted away? (v.11)

As God would not destroy Sodom and Gamorrah until the only rightweous people were removed, so it is with the new heaven and new earth. God cannot cause the old creation to completely pass away until He has transformed His LAST child fully into the image of His Son.
So all His children need to HASTEN that execution as well as eagerly expect it.

In the same chapter Peter tells us that we should cooperate to be found by Him fully dispensed into by God arriving at a point of
"without spot and without blemish."

But according to His promise we are expecting new heavens and a new earth, in which righteousness dwells.
Therefore, beloved, since you expect these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace without spot and without blemish; (v.13,14)

There are two amazing things about this:

1.) Peter describes our final state as he describes the life and nature of our Savior Christ. This means that we have all become like Him.

. . . you were redeemed from your vain manner of life handed down from your fathers,
But with precious blood, as of a Lamb without blemish and without spot, the blood of Christ; (1 Pet. 1:18,19)

He predestinated the one without blemish and without spot before the foundation of the world to be our Redeemer.

Who was foreknown before the foundation of the world but has been manifested in the last of times for your sake, (1 Pet. 1:20)

2.) He has granted us all that we need to become finally found by Him in peace without spot and without blemish
by granting us Seeing that His divine power has granted to us all things which relate to life and godliness, (2 Pet. 1:3a)

His precious promises have also granted us to become PARTAKERS of the divine nature.

Through which [precious and exceedingly great promises] He has granted to us precious and exceedingly great promises that through these you might become partakers of the divine nature,(v. 4a)

We are not merely worshippers of the divine nature. Nor are we merely admirers, spectators, observers of the divine nature.
We have become participants, partakers of the divine nature. And in that nature are granted to us
all things which relate to life and godliness, through the full knowledge of Him who has called us by His own glory and virtue, (2 Pet. 1:3)

What an astounding apostolic revelation and teaching. I emphasize God's life divine nature making HOME in us as much more
than Him merely transporting us to heaven.


Revelation 21 and 22 really show the Triune God building man into Himself and He dispensing His life, nature, glory and all His
communicalbe attributes into a CITY (all His redeemed, transformed, sanctified, transfigured, resurrected, and glorified people).


Allow me some comments on each leaning towards my real burden - God making His home in us.

Enoch who was raptured FIRST obtained a testimony that it was possible to live godly in a corrupt world.
By faith Enoch was translated so that he should not see death; and he was not found, because God had translated him. For before his translation he obtained the testimony that he had been well pleasing to God. (Heb. 11:5)

Before his rapture Enoch testified of a certain kind of acceptable godly living in the midst of a sinful world.
This cannot be overlooked. Rapture to wherever is based on the testimony borne priorly.

One of the reasons why Enoch was compelled to get serious about walking with God was because he knew
that judgment was coming upon that world. Enoch named his son "when he dies it will come" - Methusaleh.

And Enoch lived sixty-five years and begot Methuselah.
And Enoch walked with God after he had begotten Methuselah . . . (Gen. 5:21,22a)

Enoch had revelation and prophesied that when his son Methuselah died, the judgment of God
would come upon the world. That judgment was the flood of Noah.
Knowing what was coming by revelation from God he determined to walk with God.
And obtaining testimony of a righteous walk, God raptured him and suddenly Enoch was not found.

The things written in the Old Testament serve as examples to us today in the new covenant age.
Some of us know what is coming. And we need to walk with God as He imparts more and more of His
Holy Spirit into our living. This dispensing of Christ into our walk will also testify to a world about to be judged.

This too is the Triune God making His home in His people. At least a remnant, a corporate Enoch must emerge
in city by city all over the earth. We all have a chance to become consituents of this collective Enoch walking
with God filled with Christ as life. This is what the normal local church life must produce.

While yes God the Holy Spirit dwells in people, there are also God the Father and God the Son live on the New Earth, and I'd argue that at least God the Son (Jesus) is a physical being that we will see and interact with as a person, rather than an indwelling presence.

Revelation 22

3 And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:
4 And they shall see his face; and his name shall be in their foreheads.

Job 19

25 For I know that my redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth:
26 And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God:
27 Whom I shall see for myself, and mine eyes shall behold, and not another; though my reins be consumed within me.

God the Father we know is Spirit, as is God the Holy Ghost. But God the Son is incarnate, and will dwell with us as a living, tangible person on the New Earth as our King.

 

[oikonomia]

While yes God the Holy Spirit dwells in people, there are also God the Father and God the Son live on the New Earth, and I'd argue that at least God the Son (Jesus) is a physical being that we will see and interact with as a person, rather than an indwelling presence.

God the Son is also Spirit. For "the last Adam became a life giving Spirit" (1 Cor. 15:45)
God the Son now is the Spirit indwelling the regenerated saved.
And the Lord is the Spirit; (2 Cor. 3:17a)

The Three of the Trinity coinhere one another. Each lives in the other.
The Lord Jesus is the Spirit to give divine life into us - He became "a life giving Spirit".
And "It is the Spirit that gives life." (John 6:63a)

If you are a Christian you must acknowledge that the Son lives in you.
As Paul exhorted the Corinthians to realize that Jesus Christ was living in them.
Test yourselves whether you are in the faith; prove yourselves.
Or do you not realize about yourselves that Jesus Christ is in you, (2 Cor. 13:5)

The Triune God being three-one from eternity to eternity also passed through a process
in which He could dispense His life in Christ as the Spirit into us. So the Lord in Second Corinthians is "Christ Jesus."
For we do not preach ourselves but Christ Jesus as Lord, (2 Cor. 4:5a)

God the Father we know is Spirit, as is God the Holy Ghost. But God the Son is incarnate, and will dwell with us as a living, tangible person on the New Earth as our King.

I have said a little to persuade you that Jesus Christ is the Spirit. Or we can see the Spirit is Jesus Christ in His pneumatic form.
And Romans 8 shows Christ is two locations. He is in the heavens at the right hand of God interceding for us AND He is Christ in us.

1.) Christ in the heavens - Who is he who condemns? It is Christ Jesus who died and, rather, who was raised, who is also at the right hand of God, who also intercedes for us. (Rom. 8:34)

2.) Christ is also living in us the believers - . . . Yet if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not of Him. But if Christ is in you, . . . (vs. 9,10)

Do you see this Jamdoc? The Spirit of Christ is CHRIST. Christ living in us is as "the Spirit of Christ".
Since the last Adam [Christ] became a life giving Spirit (1 Cor. 15:45) Christ lives in us to constantly give us Himself
as the divine/human life imparting Holy Spirit.

The saturation of this Spirit into our whole being - spirit and soul and body (1 Thess. 5:23) will constitute us a city which will match Him - fit to be His wife. So the life giving Spirit is working from the center of our being out to the rim of our being to SONIZE us.

From the kernel of our being He is seeking to move out into all the chambers of our personality - our heart, and eventually burst forth
into our body. We were born again that we may "grow again" and "mature again".

When we wake in the morning and proclaim that Jesus Christ lives in us, what a precedence it makes for victory for the whole day.
These truths we must stand on and proclaim. And Christ will make His home into our hearts by our faith.

Try it. Awake tomorrow morning and first proclaim "Lord Jesus, You live in me. Lord Jesus You live in me as the life giving Spirit. Christ lives in me."

 

[Jamdoc]

God the Son is also Spirit. For "the last Adam became a life giving Spirit" (1 Cor. 15:45)
God the Son now is the Spirit indwelling the regenerated saved.
And the Lord is the Spirit; (2 Cor. 3:17a)

The Three of the Trinity coinhere one another. Each lives in the other.
The Lord Jesus is the Spirit to give divine life into us - He became "a life giving Spirit".
And "It is the Spirit that gives life." (John 6:63a)

If you are a Christian you must acknowledge that the Son lives in you.
As Paul exhorted the Corinthians to realize that Jesus Christ was living in them.
Test yourselves whether you are in the faith; prove yourselves.
Or do you not realize about yourselves that Jesus Christ is in you, (2 Cor. 13:5)

The Triune God being three-one from eternity to eternity also passed through a process
in which He could dispense His life in Christ as the Spirit into us. So the Lord in Second Corinthians is "Christ Jesus."
For we do not preach ourselves but Christ Jesus as Lord, (2 Cor. 4:5a)


I have said a little to persuade you that Jesus Christ is the Spirit. Or we can see the Spirit is Jesus Christ in His pneumatic form.
And Romans 8 shows Christ is two locations. He is in the heavens at the right hand of God interceding for us AND He is Christ in us.

1.) Christ in the heavens - Who is he who condemns? It is Christ Jesus who died and, rather, who was raised, who is also at the right hand of God, who also intercedes for us. (Rom. 8:34)

2.) Christ is also living in us the believers - . . . Yet if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not of Him. But if Christ is in you, . . . (vs. 9,10)

Do you see this Jamdoc? The Spirit of Christ is CHRIST. Christ living in us is as "the Spirit of Christ".
Since the last Adam [Christ] became a life giving Spirit (1 Cor. 15:45) Christ lives in us to constantly give us Himself
as the divine/human life imparting Holy Spirit.

The saturation of this Spirit into our whole being - spirit and soul and body (1 Thess. 5:23) will constitute us a city which will match Him - fit to be His wife. So the life giving Spirit is working from the center of our being out to the rim of our being to SONIZE us.

From the kernel of our being He is seeking to move out into all the chambers of our personality - our heart, and eventually burst forth
into our body. We were born again that we may "grow again" and "mature again".

When we wake in the morning and proclaim that Jesus Christ lives in us, what a precedence it makes for victory for the whole day.
These truths we must stand on and proclaim. And Christ will make His home into our hearts by our faith.

Try it. Awake tomorrow morning and first proclaim "Lord Jesus, You live in me. Lord Jesus You live in me as the life giving Spirit. Christ lives in me."

Jesus returns to Earth bodily, and rules, bodily.

 

[oikonomia]

Jesus returns to Earth bodily, and rules, bodily.

Yes. But He must rule His own people from within before He can
come and rule the world without.

He comes to shepherd the nations with an iron rod.
As vessels of pottery they will be broken. And like sheep as the need arises He will strongly shepherd them to be in line.

Yes He will not do this alone. He has ordained that as He does, He is joined by overcoming believers to do so with Him.
And this partnership is because they have learned to live by Him in the church age,

1.) Christ reigns over the nations - And out of His mouth proceeds a sharp sword, that with it He might smite the nations; and He will shepherd them with an iron rod; (Rev. 19:15)

2.) Christ is joined in this reigning by overcomers - And he who overcomes and he who keeps My works until the end, to him I will give authority over the nations; And he will shepherd them with an iron rod, as vessels of pottery are broken in pieces, as I also have received from My Father; (Rev. 2:26,27)

So indeed we need to learn to live by the indwelling Christ who is the life giving Spirit. (1 Cor. 15:45)

 

[oikonomia]

When did this Church begin?

I believe the new testament church came into existence when Jesus in resurrection breathed into
the disciples the Holy Spirit.

When therefore it was evening on that day, the first day of the week, and while the doors were shut where the disciples were for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood in the midst and said to them, Peace be to you.

And when He had said this, He showed them His hands and His side. The disciples therefore rejoiced at seeing the Lord.
Then Jesus said to them again, Peace be to you; as the Father has sent Me, I also send you.

And when He had said this, He breathed into them and said to them, Receive the Holy Spirit. (John 20:19-22)

 

[CoreyD]

Agreed. . .

I believe Jesus used only the words Hades and Gehinna, as taught in the NT.

Agreed.